Other staffs' perception of Pilot Group
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Dragon 64 1/2 (because 1/2's are so important at that age),
so let's see if you can convince me and the other non-pilots (after all this is what this thread is about perception's of the non-pilot group) what it is about seniority that is so very important to you - if it's not about the money or lifestyle?
If your response has anything to do with prestige/status or being more important etc, then I believe you might start getting close to what non-pilots observe about you.
As for your question on the mobile bill - fortunately the HK law is pretty good so one would at least have somewhere to appeal to instead of standing in the corner ranting into my shandy. If what you have a problem with, within the confines of CX City, is not covered by the law in HK then whinge on brother/comrade. Because I don't think the 9/F is hearing too well...
If you haven't worked out that CX over time tends to get what it wants by ways and means, then you really aren't using your powers of observation.
Wake up and smell the P45 that just landed on your doormat.
Regards,
N1 Vibes
so let's see if you can convince me and the other non-pilots (after all this is what this thread is about perception's of the non-pilot group) what it is about seniority that is so very important to you - if it's not about the money or lifestyle?
If your response has anything to do with prestige/status or being more important etc, then I believe you might start getting close to what non-pilots observe about you.
As for your question on the mobile bill - fortunately the HK law is pretty good so one would at least have somewhere to appeal to instead of standing in the corner ranting into my shandy. If what you have a problem with, within the confines of CX City, is not covered by the law in HK then whinge on brother/comrade. Because I don't think the 9/F is hearing too well...
If you haven't worked out that CX over time tends to get what it wants by ways and means, then you really aren't using your powers of observation.
Wake up and smell the P45 that just landed on your doormat.
Regards,
N1 Vibes
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so let's see if you can convince me and the other non-pilots (after all this is what this thread is about perception's of the non-pilot group) what it is about seniority that is so very important to you - if it's not about the money or lifestyle?
If your response has anything to do with prestige/status or being more important etc, then I believe you might start getting close to what non-pilots observe about you.
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Dragon 63,
you didn't answer the question about why seniority was so important to you:
Was my suggestion that for you personally seniority is linked to money and lifestyle touched a raw nerve? After all I am a non-pilot wishing to understand a representative of the 'pilot community'.....
I also detect the slightest hint of superiority in your comment:
Well done to you, you made it through pilot school - look at yourself now - sat in HKG wailing and gnashing your teeth. Me - fail pilot school - no. Would I want to be sat for 15hrs, at the front of a metal tube, 40,000ft off the ground, listening to your opinions? Go on have a wild guess...
Superiority is not the prettiest of characteristics that one can possess. You will note that history is littered with 'superior' people. Most of them ended up being considered idiots, or dead in useless wars.
You still haven't worked me out yet. You're asking me all the wrong questions and not answering any of mine. You could actually be an 'ambassador' for the pilot community on this very public forum and answer the questions of a 'non-pilot' so that we can understand you.
Hoping you will answer the question directly this time.
Regards,
N1 Vibes
you didn't answer the question about why seniority was so important to you:
Yeah N1 money and lifestyle are not important to you, I have heard enough BS from you!
I also detect the slightest hint of superiority in your comment:
You and your engineer buddy assbert really did fail pilot school didn't you.
Superiority is not the prettiest of characteristics that one can possess. You will note that history is littered with 'superior' people. Most of them ended up being considered idiots, or dead in useless wars.
You still haven't worked me out yet. You're asking me all the wrong questions and not answering any of mine. You could actually be an 'ambassador' for the pilot community on this very public forum and answer the questions of a 'non-pilot' so that we can understand you.
Hoping you will answer the question directly this time.
Regards,
N1 Vibes
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"We are the most difficult to replace."
Not any more. CX could have you replaced in the blink of an eye. CAD would ensure such a move would proceed easily.
"Most of us are the main breadwinners"
Market forces, that dictate your salary, do not care how much you "need". Such forces will remunerate you based on what you can provide regardless of how little your partner makes. But nice try.
"Fos and Sos are being asked to give away BPP"
Shock horror. Did you think such an absurd thing as BPP would last forever?
Not any more. CX could have you replaced in the blink of an eye. CAD would ensure such a move would proceed easily.
"Most of us are the main breadwinners"
Market forces, that dictate your salary, do not care how much you "need". Such forces will remunerate you based on what you can provide regardless of how little your partner makes. But nice try.
"Fos and Sos are being asked to give away BPP"
Shock horror. Did you think such an absurd thing as BPP would last forever?
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Yeah I failed pilot school becase I was so bored sh1tless sitting in a darkened cupboard waiting for nothing to happen that I fell asleep.
So I decided to do something with my life rather than persue a commodity job like a pilot.
In my family business we employed truck drivers. We never employed guys that were too bright, as they would get bored. I guess same thing goes for pilots.
So I decided to do something with my life rather than persue a commodity job like a pilot.
In my family business we employed truck drivers. We never employed guys that were too bright, as they would get bored. I guess same thing goes for pilots.
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N1 Vibes,
You're starting to talk rubbish and you are arguing for arguments sake and this is my last post on this subject.
Seniority is directly linked to experience. You seem to think it is fine for a senior Captain to leave Cathay and be employed at BA as a Second Officer earning a Second Officer's salary. Because after all that is what you are suggesting are you not? Your message is, who cares about money you should get a life and go work elsewhere at the bottom of the seniority list. Never mind the experience gained over the past 20 years it shouldn't mean anything!!!
A friend who is a computer engineer has held jobs with 8 different companies in the past 13 years, with each job he received a better package. He receives this better package, not because he is such a swell fellow, but because it is commensurate with his experience level. And hooray that is one of the goals in life isn't? Get a higher education, get experience and get a better paying job. But oh no, not our beloved and noble N1, he returns most of his salary back to his employer, he is not addicted to money and lifestyle like us pilots!....Pllleeeeeaaaase spare me!
If experience to you means nothing, and since you've stated that you came to Hong Kong for the love of your job and had nothing to do with money, I am sure you will be quite content if Cathay hires a new engineer fresh out of college and is paid three times more than you. I am sure you will not even raise an eyebrow over it.
So we come back to a seniority based industry, unlike my friend, I cannot take my experience level and apply it with another airline, not saying it is wrong, cause I do believe in the system, but the point is, which you don't seem to get, is that LEAVING IS THE LEAST FAVORITE OPTION, because you are effectively throwing years of experience away to start at the bottom.
Hey Assbert,
Who has the chip on their shoulder now!!! hahaha I love it
You're starting to talk rubbish and you are arguing for arguments sake and this is my last post on this subject.
Seniority is directly linked to experience. You seem to think it is fine for a senior Captain to leave Cathay and be employed at BA as a Second Officer earning a Second Officer's salary. Because after all that is what you are suggesting are you not? Your message is, who cares about money you should get a life and go work elsewhere at the bottom of the seniority list. Never mind the experience gained over the past 20 years it shouldn't mean anything!!!
A friend who is a computer engineer has held jobs with 8 different companies in the past 13 years, with each job he received a better package. He receives this better package, not because he is such a swell fellow, but because it is commensurate with his experience level. And hooray that is one of the goals in life isn't? Get a higher education, get experience and get a better paying job. But oh no, not our beloved and noble N1, he returns most of his salary back to his employer, he is not addicted to money and lifestyle like us pilots!....Pllleeeeeaaaase spare me!
If experience to you means nothing, and since you've stated that you came to Hong Kong for the love of your job and had nothing to do with money, I am sure you will be quite content if Cathay hires a new engineer fresh out of college and is paid three times more than you. I am sure you will not even raise an eyebrow over it.
So we come back to a seniority based industry, unlike my friend, I cannot take my experience level and apply it with another airline, not saying it is wrong, cause I do believe in the system, but the point is, which you don't seem to get, is that LEAVING IS THE LEAST FAVORITE OPTION, because you are effectively throwing years of experience away to start at the bottom.
Hey Assbert,
Who has the chip on their shoulder now!!! hahaha I love it
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Dragon 62,
so there we have it - you don't want the 'shame' of going back down the pole? And excuse my ignorance - didn't CX employ Direct Entry Captains and Direct Entry First Officers - are you saying that no other airline in the world has ever thought of this?
Google returned quite a few results for other airlines looking for DEFO and DEC's - so your argument of 'losing seniority' doesn't really stand up - does it? I.e. opportunities do exist in other airlines and in other countries - at the same 'level of seniority'.
Now this is progress - your goal in life (as I now understand it) is to try and emulate a computer software engineer - or was that my goal (I'm not sure).
And finally something that I sincerely hope you have already got a grasp of. If the above situation were to come about - there would be one thing at the forefront of my mind.
At the front of my mind - This engineer fresh out of college will be working in an airline for the first time - I would be very concerned that I gave him as much advice and support as possible - because the safety of an a/c could depend on it.
This reflects the attitude of the airline engineering community - what would the attitude of you be to this situation?
Would you sit there on the flight deck while the 'higher paid' lower ranking colleague just operated the radio and think nothing - or would you sit their and ignore him, festering, because he got a better deal and therefore should have a hard time from you the underpaid pilot?
This is CRM at it's best....
Regards,
N1 Vibes
so there we have it - you don't want the 'shame' of going back down the pole? And excuse my ignorance - didn't CX employ Direct Entry Captains and Direct Entry First Officers - are you saying that no other airline in the world has ever thought of this?
Google returned quite a few results for other airlines looking for DEFO and DEC's - so your argument of 'losing seniority' doesn't really stand up - does it? I.e. opportunities do exist in other airlines and in other countries - at the same 'level of seniority'.
And hooray that is one of the goals in life isn't? Get a higher education, get experience and get a better paying job.
I am sure you will be quite content if Cathay hires a new engineer fresh out of college and is paid three times more than you. I am sure you will not even raise an eyebrow over it.
At the front of my mind - This engineer fresh out of college will be working in an airline for the first time - I would be very concerned that I gave him as much advice and support as possible - because the safety of an a/c could depend on it.
This reflects the attitude of the airline engineering community - what would the attitude of you be to this situation?
Would you sit there on the flight deck while the 'higher paid' lower ranking colleague just operated the radio and think nothing - or would you sit their and ignore him, festering, because he got a better deal and therefore should have a hard time from you the underpaid pilot?
This is CRM at it's best....
Regards,
N1 Vibes
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When does 13 years experience equate to one year of experience 13 times over...?
I guess when you are a pilot.
Groundhog day. No wonder you guys are so bitter and twisted.
I guess when you are a pilot.
Groundhog day. No wonder you guys are so bitter and twisted.
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Dragon 61,
going back to the original question posed by this thread by Bushcat - whether the 'pilot community' should be worried about the perception of themselves. And whether this worry should be as a result of perception within or outside the company.
Your comment of drinking hydraulic fluid - reminded me that your every whim is served by members of the FAU at 40,000ft - Optrex anyone?
Pilots bitter and twisted - well I guess that you in particular are - as your example to me of how you feel about seniority and money - was how would I feel if a less qualified engineer came in at more money. Thinking that like you I would be bitter and twisted.
And my answer to you - is when I am at work my colleagues wages are of no concern - the job comes 1st.
Do you know - I think this could be a real useful test - for CRM. Sit one crabby captain in the simulator, with one straight of flight school pilot newbie, and tell the crabby captain he's just been hired at 3x his pay. The test is then to see how long before the crabby captain breaks into tears, screaming "It's so unfair!".... how long would you last? Not long judging by your continuing desire to erupt on Pprune
As for the opinion outside the company of the pilot community - just get in a taxi and tell the driver you are a Cathay pilot, then get in another taxi and tell him you are a Cathay engineer. I think you will be pleasantly surprised at the difference in attitude.
Regards,
N1 Vibes
going back to the original question posed by this thread by Bushcat - whether the 'pilot community' should be worried about the perception of themselves. And whether this worry should be as a result of perception within or outside the company.
Your comment of drinking hydraulic fluid - reminded me that your every whim is served by members of the FAU at 40,000ft - Optrex anyone?
Pilots bitter and twisted - well I guess that you in particular are - as your example to me of how you feel about seniority and money - was how would I feel if a less qualified engineer came in at more money. Thinking that like you I would be bitter and twisted.
And my answer to you - is when I am at work my colleagues wages are of no concern - the job comes 1st.
Do you know - I think this could be a real useful test - for CRM. Sit one crabby captain in the simulator, with one straight of flight school pilot newbie, and tell the crabby captain he's just been hired at 3x his pay. The test is then to see how long before the crabby captain breaks into tears, screaming "It's so unfair!".... how long would you last? Not long judging by your continuing desire to erupt on Pprune
As for the opinion outside the company of the pilot community - just get in a taxi and tell the driver you are a Cathay pilot, then get in another taxi and tell him you are a Cathay engineer. I think you will be pleasantly surprised at the difference in attitude.
Regards,
N1 Vibes
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N1. This last post of yours is the one that will officially certify that you are indeed an obnoxious, arrogant imbecile. It frightens me to think that you possibly have something to do with keeping our aircraft airworthy. You obviously have an inferiority complex in respect of pilots, and your rather increasingly desperate posts are becoming an embarrassment to you.
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'round midnight, ATY,
why don't you actually join in the debate. Since the thread wished to know "other staff's perception of the pilot group" - you are getting the answers you want - from other staff.
Asking pilots on a pilots (only) thread about what non-pilots think of their behaviour, is like God asking the Pope his thoughts on mass debating...
Discuss.
Regards,
N1 Vibes
why don't you actually join in the debate. Since the thread wished to know "other staff's perception of the pilot group" - you are getting the answers you want - from other staff.
Asking pilots on a pilots (only) thread about what non-pilots think of their behaviour, is like God asking the Pope his thoughts on mass debating...
Discuss.
Regards,
N1 Vibes
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inferiority complex in respect of pilots
The monkey was trained to dumbly follow orders and twiddle a few buttons at the correct time, with a cast of thousands working in the background making the mission a success.
Monkeys in space - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
To my knowledge, monkeys have yet to design their own spacecraft.
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N1Vibes,
I don't need to look up the word in the dictionary when there are two fine examples on this forum, yourself and Busbert!!!!!!
Now get lost and empty the waste tank!
Over and Out!
I don't need to look up the word in the dictionary when there are two fine examples on this forum, yourself and Busbert!!!!!!
Now get lost and empty the waste tank!
Over and Out!
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Flaps,
what you will find is that the word 'moron' describes those with an intellectual age of between 8 and 12 years old.
Your reasoning ability reminds me of children in the playground. And it also serves to illustrate your true age, how old are you?
Regards,
N1 Vibes
what you will find is that the word 'moron' describes those with an intellectual age of between 8 and 12 years old.
Your reasoning ability reminds me of children in the playground. And it also serves to illustrate your true age, how old are you?
Regards,
N1 Vibes
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you really are a glorified grease monkey!
That really hurts
Now p1ss back into your darkened cupboards, or hang out with your pilot (rhymes with pillock) mates and tell each other how great you all are.
How the grease monkies are cleaning your toilets,
how the 'ball boys' are dealing with the little people back in the SLF area, (that front up their own money to cover your absolutely insufficient wages that go no where near to covering your basic living expenses, alimony, barfines, child support).
Not to forget the herberts and doris's in Hello Kitty City that push paper between eating dimsum to sell seats to the little people down the back.
Or the management pilot sell out pukes that somehow keep the operation going,
or the tin pushers in IOC,
or the funny little men in HAECO that put orange ADD stickers on YOUR aircraft.
And of course your good friend TT who spends his time coming up with dastardly plans to rip you off from your RIGHTEOUS entitlement (of course between champagne brunches and lazy afternoons playing golf with the spineless dweebs at the AOA and DPU who are as we are told TT's lapdogs).
