Retirement at 55, 65, 75....
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Honkers
Posts: 377
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Apple tree yard
Amazing,
May I suggest you go up to the 3rd floor and book yourself onto the next available CRM course because boy, you need it!!!!!
"...illiterate, juvenile and obnoxious lot that populate many of the right seats in this airline..."
"I sometimes am left in awed amazement at the sheer level of dysfunction inherent in many of my colleagues. Couldn't care less what they think...as I have found most of them are incapable of any reasoned thought anyway...."
"I sometimes am left in awed amazement at the sheer level of dysfunction inherent in many of my colleagues. Couldn't care less what they think...as I have found most of them are incapable of any reasoned thought anyway...."
Amazing,
May I suggest you go up to the 3rd floor and book yourself onto the next available CRM course because boy, you need it!!!!!
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Aus
Posts: 65
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Now come on guys, stop stirring up poor old Apple Tree. I mean, can't you see from his post that this man is a cut above the rest, a superior being!
I marvel at how intelligent he must be, sitting there overseeing the illiterate, juvenile, bumbling F/O, it must be horrible for him. Apple never makes a mistake, you should see him in the sim, what an ace!
Apple is great to fly with too, he's so mature, he knows everything and he's always right, even when he's wrong! F/O's have a very easy flight with Apple Tree, he never needs any help from anyone, he's just so clever.
What you F/O's need to understand is that Apple was recruited when CX recruited real men, not like these days! You see, everyone employed after Apple was an idiot, he was CX's last great find, a sort of aviation messiah. In fact, the real reason CX want RA65 is because they can't stand the thought of losing Super Capt Apple.
So when you think about writing something nasty about this modern day superhero, think again. He's probably been out all night saving the world as only he can.
Keep up the good work Super Capt Apple Tree, we all sleep well at night in the knowledge that you are out there.
I marvel at how intelligent he must be, sitting there overseeing the illiterate, juvenile, bumbling F/O, it must be horrible for him. Apple never makes a mistake, you should see him in the sim, what an ace!
Apple is great to fly with too, he's so mature, he knows everything and he's always right, even when he's wrong! F/O's have a very easy flight with Apple Tree, he never needs any help from anyone, he's just so clever.
What you F/O's need to understand is that Apple was recruited when CX recruited real men, not like these days! You see, everyone employed after Apple was an idiot, he was CX's last great find, a sort of aviation messiah. In fact, the real reason CX want RA65 is because they can't stand the thought of losing Super Capt Apple.
So when you think about writing something nasty about this modern day superhero, think again. He's probably been out all night saving the world as only he can.
Keep up the good work Super Capt Apple Tree, we all sleep well at night in the knowledge that you are out there.
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: in time anda space
Posts: 48
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
rtforu, classic!!!!!
404 titan makes a good point. All we want is CX to stick to the contract we already have. Why is there any need to negotiate or vote on bypass pay? They can extend every pilot to 65 now - nothing is stopping them!
404 titan makes a good point. All we want is CX to stick to the contract we already have. Why is there any need to negotiate or vote on bypass pay? They can extend every pilot to 65 now - nothing is stopping them!
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: australia
Posts: 13
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
acms and retread
..when the dust settles on this '65 thing' you guys will see just how 'easy' it is to actually stand up to cx without industrial action.They'll impose what they want and you two snivelling pukes will cop it anyway to save your 'ever reducing' jobs and i'll have to listen to your crap in the cockpit. ad nauseum. All about how those nasty A scale guys refused to get fired and you wound up on B scale as as result.
You really don't know who you're dealing with do you?...fact is they'll squash anybody to get what they want and all the verbal waffling is just a waste of breath..the AOA is damage control only.
The A scale have been through more,risked more,lost more and stood up for more than you guys will ever know...why? because you weren't here to see it.JUST HOW MUCH EXACTLY IN DOLLAR TERMS DID YOU FORK OUT TO SUPPORT 49 GUYS WHO WERE EXECUTED?...nil I'll bet..just some gutless anonymous limp wristed punches at your work mates.
Your day will come...no pay rises,rising costs,bypassed for commands,basings all given away to cheap crews,longer hours with less crews,84 hrs magically up to 88,lesser overtime rates,..it's all happened before and WILL CONTINUE.
Stand up NOW..and don't let ST become another MG..he represents US..tell HIM what we want not the company dictate it.
A scale PAY rates for everyone...end of story.
You really don't know who you're dealing with do you?...fact is they'll squash anybody to get what they want and all the verbal waffling is just a waste of breath..the AOA is damage control only.
The A scale have been through more,risked more,lost more and stood up for more than you guys will ever know...why? because you weren't here to see it.JUST HOW MUCH EXACTLY IN DOLLAR TERMS DID YOU FORK OUT TO SUPPORT 49 GUYS WHO WERE EXECUTED?...nil I'll bet..just some gutless anonymous limp wristed punches at your work mates.
Your day will come...no pay rises,rising costs,bypassed for commands,basings all given away to cheap crews,longer hours with less crews,84 hrs magically up to 88,lesser overtime rates,..it's all happened before and WILL CONTINUE.
Stand up NOW..and don't let ST become another MG..he represents US..tell HIM what we want not the company dictate it.
A scale PAY rates for everyone...end of story.
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: hkg
Posts: 165
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
It's hardly surprising that the 'professional' status associated with pilots is being eroded when one reads some of the immature comments made here for all to see. How embarrassing to see the 'chav' mentality displayed by so many of my colleagues!
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: www
Posts: 518
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
....which is the usual reaction I have when flying with the recent generation of FO's. Most of you believe you are smarter than the majority of us 'old guys'. Perhaps, through the superior application of your superior intellect you can explain why you are working under the lowest pay and the worst conditions of most of the western worlds major airlines? The difference between you and I is that I joined CX knowing my value, as was reflected in the conditions and pay prevalent at the time. You of course joined knowing your value also.... Of course, we can continue to debate this on a 'friendly' level for the next 10 years....until I reach 65...! 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: The Heart of Asia
Posts: 124
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
A Cathay Pacific spokeswoman said the airline has been actively engaging the union and members of the crew community to discuss subjects of common interest, including retirement age.
"All staff were fully informed of the employment conditions, including the retirement age, when they accepted the company's employment," she said.
"All staff were fully informed of the employment conditions, including the retirement age, when they accepted the company's employment," she said.
Seems like the company is quite eager to refer to the contractual employment conditions when dealing with cabin crew...
So why are we discussing this with the company exactly?
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: www
Posts: 518
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
...you may not like the tone...but the sentiment is based on years of exposure to the very type of individual that I describe. As for what you or others think of me....I couldn't care less....
ps. the problems I describe are thankfully not as prevelant flying from the LHR base. More the case when it is an antipodean or canuck....
ps. the problems I describe are thankfully not as prevelant flying from the LHR base. More the case when it is an antipodean or canuck....
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: somewhere between Bieber and Ke$ha
Posts: 13
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
options for extension beyond RA 55
A point of thought I have noticed not being mentioned much is the location of extendee's within our basing network.
Those of us nearing 55 are starting to realise they can take a base now, after all those years in HKG. I firmly believe they feel they have the right to remain on the base post 55 if the NRA debarcle is sorted out prior to their retirement.
Well that sucks!
How fair is it to expect that our most senior crew can now have their cake and eat it too.
Any change/adjustment to our COS is going to hurt some and help others, obviously it will hurt those who are not left seat and not based to name a few.....
The help for the others will come in the form as previously mentioned. In the form of another possible 10 years at the stick to top up any expected capital required for the quality of life post CX they had dreamed of once their pay was frozen and the pay cuts were made. ( i understand that the share offer was not enough for these folks, as nothing seems to be enough for them these days anyway).
If our careers are to be extended with this airline without 100% support then that just shows that we can not all be pleased (whats good for the goose, is not always good for the gander)
I would like to see that any pilot flying beyond 55 should be repat'ed back to HKG so that at least the rest of us can enjoy the concept of life out of HKG.
cheers L.E.D
Those of us nearing 55 are starting to realise they can take a base now, after all those years in HKG. I firmly believe they feel they have the right to remain on the base post 55 if the NRA debarcle is sorted out prior to their retirement.
Well that sucks!
How fair is it to expect that our most senior crew can now have their cake and eat it too.
Any change/adjustment to our COS is going to hurt some and help others, obviously it will hurt those who are not left seat and not based to name a few.....
The help for the others will come in the form as previously mentioned. In the form of another possible 10 years at the stick to top up any expected capital required for the quality of life post CX they had dreamed of once their pay was frozen and the pay cuts were made. ( i understand that the share offer was not enough for these folks, as nothing seems to be enough for them these days anyway).
If our careers are to be extended with this airline without 100% support then that just shows that we can not all be pleased (whats good for the goose, is not always good for the gander)
I would like to see that any pilot flying beyond 55 should be repat'ed back to HKG so that at least the rest of us can enjoy the concept of life out of HKG.
cheers L.E.D
Apple Tree Yard
The way you are carrying on I get the impression you could be a management mole. You seem to be doing their work for them after all, i.e. driving huge wedges in the pilot body with your antipodean and canuck comments. I’m one of the former and haven’t heard anyone carry on as you claim. We are well aware of what is in our contract and all we want is if the company extend you or any other pilot past 55 we get paid what our contract says we should get paid. Nothing more nothing less. To denigrate us the way you have doesn’t do your cause any good what so ever. I suggest you please think about that before you post here again.
The way you are carrying on I get the impression you could be a management mole. You seem to be doing their work for them after all, i.e. driving huge wedges in the pilot body with your antipodean and canuck comments. I’m one of the former and haven’t heard anyone carry on as you claim. We are well aware of what is in our contract and all we want is if the company extend you or any other pilot past 55 we get paid what our contract says we should get paid. Nothing more nothing less. To denigrate us the way you have doesn’t do your cause any good what so ever. I suggest you please think about that before you post here again.
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: somewhere between Bieber and Ke$ha
Posts: 13
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
As usual, another misunderstood post.....
Titan.
Fistly I can only say you are roughly 6500nm from guessing where i come from.
I am no where near 55 nor do I want to be as that would mean I would have missed seeing the kids grow up and watch their young dad become an even more synical bastard than he is now!
My DOJ puts me just ahead of the middle of the pack and the reality of a command basing in OZ is rapidly deminishing owing to the fact that CX are only dribbling out the vacancies, unlike the freighter spots they seem to have just filled for Man744F.
If another STC tells me he needs to get back to a base before the company goes onshore so he can stay there until 65, i will puke!
Try this on for size... I have had the chance to grace myself with the presence of some very senior drivers lately that have confessed to asking PW for another temp base or perm base on the 744F in syd, on B Scale!
The comments were that they don't need A scale anymore, they have enough money, all they want now is to get home without having to scrounge for spare jumpseats on the numerous overloaded flights home.
Does it not bother you or anyone else that we are yet again being stabbed in the back by the same guys we thank for the sector.
A growing numer of these guys are getting hungrier for the chance to take a base just before the system locks them out so they can hopefully sit out their last years on that base.
When do you forsee the rest of us getting one then hey.
Fistly I can only say you are roughly 6500nm from guessing where i come from.
I am no where near 55 nor do I want to be as that would mean I would have missed seeing the kids grow up and watch their young dad become an even more synical bastard than he is now!
My DOJ puts me just ahead of the middle of the pack and the reality of a command basing in OZ is rapidly deminishing owing to the fact that CX are only dribbling out the vacancies, unlike the freighter spots they seem to have just filled for Man744F.
If another STC tells me he needs to get back to a base before the company goes onshore so he can stay there until 65, i will puke!
Try this on for size... I have had the chance to grace myself with the presence of some very senior drivers lately that have confessed to asking PW for another temp base or perm base on the 744F in syd, on B Scale!
The comments were that they don't need A scale anymore, they have enough money, all they want now is to get home without having to scrounge for spare jumpseats on the numerous overloaded flights home.
Does it not bother you or anyone else that we are yet again being stabbed in the back by the same guys we thank for the sector.
A growing numer of these guys are getting hungrier for the chance to take a base just before the system locks them out so they can hopefully sit out their last years on that base.
When do you forsee the rest of us getting one then hey.
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: hk
Age: 67
Posts: 149
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
To denigrate us the way you have doesn’t do your cause any good what so ever.
Maybe you should be aiming this statement at a few of your B scale mates who post anti A Scale stuff all the time. But what you say about RA 65 and your contract is correct. I would like to continue my career past 55 but in doing so the company must honour your contract with by-pass pay. We should all unite against the company for this to happen and stop this senseless A vs B scale thing. As things go now we are going to lose this battle and we will still be here on pprune blaming each other.
Maybe you should be aiming this statement at a few of your B scale mates who post anti A Scale stuff all the time. But what you say about RA 65 and your contract is correct. I would like to continue my career past 55 but in doing so the company must honour your contract with by-pass pay. We should all unite against the company for this to happen and stop this senseless A vs B scale thing. As things go now we are going to lose this battle and we will still be here on pprune blaming each other.
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: somewhere between Bieber and Ke$ha
Posts: 13
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Yes my point is not to bash any employee group.
If we are to move forward on this matter without the knowledge of a better pay deal we are left like this, constantly fighting about the what if's and maybe's!
If an A scale pilot is to be extended then extend them on their current conditions, likewise if the B &F scales are to be forced to accept a new retirement age then there should be full compensation for the change to career.
I would not expect any pilot from CX to have to accept a crappier deal just because of a critical mass of votes on this whenever it comes around.
For the A scale'ers it must be tough praying for a pay rise when some of your bretheren are happy to keep going beyond NRA55 on less than what they were paid before.
Hey call me a sceptic, but this ****e has been ops normal for so long now it seems to be the norm, lets face it we are all lining our nests and don't care if some guy lays his/her head on block for their own cause. All we do is take the piss out of them once they crash and burn in their new ventures or we constanly harp on the idea that there is nothing else out there as good as this?
I have heard the idea of a career change in the past, but if all we do is run away from our problems they will never get fixed
If we are to move forward on this matter without the knowledge of a better pay deal we are left like this, constantly fighting about the what if's and maybe's!
If an A scale pilot is to be extended then extend them on their current conditions, likewise if the B &F scales are to be forced to accept a new retirement age then there should be full compensation for the change to career.
I would not expect any pilot from CX to have to accept a crappier deal just because of a critical mass of votes on this whenever it comes around.
For the A scale'ers it must be tough praying for a pay rise when some of your bretheren are happy to keep going beyond NRA55 on less than what they were paid before.
Hey call me a sceptic, but this ****e has been ops normal for so long now it seems to be the norm, lets face it we are all lining our nests and don't care if some guy lays his/her head on block for their own cause. All we do is take the piss out of them once they crash and burn in their new ventures or we constanly harp on the idea that there is nothing else out there as good as this?
I have heard the idea of a career change in the past, but if all we do is run away from our problems they will never get fixed
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Honkers
Posts: 377
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Apple tree yard,
You have made my mind up, I will now join the AOA and vote NO for RA65 so we can get people like yourself out of here. Your attitude stinks.......
Now run along and tell yourself how good you are............
You have made my mind up, I will now join the AOA and vote NO for RA65 so we can get people like yourself out of here. Your attitude stinks.......
Now run along and tell yourself how good you are............
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: hkg
Posts: 165
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Why is it that we accept direct entry commands (ASL,Dragonair and shortly Oasis) with barely a whimper yet the possibility of our current colleagues extending their contracts creates such bitterness?
leading_edge_device
Where did this come from? My post was directed at ATY not you. For the record I agree with you regarding bases. It was an underhanded thing the company did to simply fill the bases and get those “pesky A scalers” (company’s term) out of HK.
My personal opinion is that the company should either offer 65 to everyone or no one at all. In saying that it shouldn’t in any way compromise my contractual rights to bypass pay. Of course the company doesn’t want that hence the negotiations taking place with the AOA as we speak. Make no mistake, these negotiations aren’t about RA65 but about bypass pay. We can’t stop RA65 being offered but we can make the company pay for it by making them honour our contract if we all “A & B scales” stick together.
PanZa-Lead
That’s why I have said in #83:
The company quite clearly require RA65 to drive their expansion plans. We should all require them though to honour our contract and pay bypass pay when extending any pilot past 55. We have the upper hand here guys. Let’s use it.
Where did this come from? My post was directed at ATY not you. For the record I agree with you regarding bases. It was an underhanded thing the company did to simply fill the bases and get those “pesky A scalers” (company’s term) out of HK.
My personal opinion is that the company should either offer 65 to everyone or no one at all. In saying that it shouldn’t in any way compromise my contractual rights to bypass pay. Of course the company doesn’t want that hence the negotiations taking place with the AOA as we speak. Make no mistake, these negotiations aren’t about RA65 but about bypass pay. We can’t stop RA65 being offered but we can make the company pay for it by making them honour our contract if we all “A & B scales” stick together.
PanZa-Lead
Maybe you should be aiming this statement at a few of your B scale mates who post anti A Scale stuff all the time.
This bickering makes me sick. I couldn't care less if you are "A" or "B" scale, or a LHS or RHS driver, (I'm the second in both cases).