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BA CC industrial relations (current airline staff only)

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BA CC industrial relations (current airline staff only)

Old 8th Apr 2011, 20:40
  #3821 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Tunbridge Wells
Posts: 148
If Bassa don't produce accounts, is it a criminal or a civil matter?
From Tunbridge Wells is offline  
Old 10th Apr 2011, 00:22
  #3822 (permalink)  
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: The Shadows
Posts: 202

I like to think I see both sides, but your hearsay settlement just isn't going to happen.

"Agreements reinstated and strengthened"

This one I can promise you will never happen. BA has what it wants, and has got rid of a lot of what I doesn't.

It all comes down to money, and saving lots of it. The operation stays the same, there's just more money in the bank.

No business would reverse THAT situation.

Also I don't think this is the biggest struggle since the Suffrogettes for the working classes or anyone else. I'm also pretty sure no one else sees it that way either.

Anyway it all made me smile and chuckle too. A late April fool maybe?
WeLieInTheShadows is offline  
Old 10th Apr 2011, 05:11
  #3823 (permalink)  
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Planet Moo Moo
Posts: 1,237
What I like is that the hard core written/political element of the BASSA militancy seems to stem from the SWP.

Has no-one pointed out to the SWP that the major reason we are in the current mess was gross mis management and poor handling of the economy by the socialist party?

What makes them think that another 4/8/12 years of social mobility management, excessive equality, diversity and PC tinkering is going to lead Britain into a panacea of Socialist heaven.

The only ones who benefitted from the excesses of the Labour Government were the champagne socialists who ran it. Doesn't seem to follow the Marxist way does it?

So, stop the SWP 'rent-a-crowd' rhetoric and fight the reasoned BASSA arguments based on the terms of the dispute. BA will NEVER re-employ DH. 2 independent industrial tribunals have upheld his dismissal. BA could never re-instate in full the BASSA agreements, ALL other departments within BA would oppose it as, I'm afraid, BASSA just aren't that important.

Nice April Fools though, gave me a chuckle!
Wirbelsturm is online now  
Old 10th Apr 2011, 06:50
  #3824 (permalink)  
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: UK
Posts: 103
And finally.. the men in white coats arrive..

BA turns to psychologist to heal rift with union
Consultancy specialises in issues relating to 'fragility of trust'


Dan Milmo
The Observer, Sunday 10 April 2011
Article history

BA hopes engaging a 'relationship builder' will help the airline to resolve its conflict with cabin crew. Photograph: Andy Rain/EPA
British Airways has turned to a clinical psychologist in a bid to solve its long-running industrial dispute with cabin crew represented by the Unite trade union.

Mark Hamlin, whose company specialises in dealing with "fragility of trust", is understood to have met senior figures at BA and Unite in a bid to improve a fractious relationship. Sources close to the process said Hamlin is acting as a "long-term relationship builder" as BA and Unite continue to thrash out a basis for peace talks amid the looming threat of renewed strike action.

The clock is ticking on BA and Unite's attempts to head off another round of industrial action because the union must declare strike dates at the end of this week if it wants to stage walkouts. Last month, cabin crew affiliated with Unite voted for strike action for the fourth time in less than 18 months. Under trade union law, Unite has until next weekend to give BA seven days' notice of industrial action, which could expose BA to strikes over the Easter weekend. However, both sides are focused on reaching a settlement.

Sources close to the dispute believe there is a stronger chance of a breakthrough because two former protagonists have left the negotiating table. Willie Walsh, former chief executive of BA, has been replaced by his former finance director Keith Williams, while Tony Woodley, former general secretary of Unite, has been replaced by Len McCluskey.

Hamlin has been drafted in to foster a new relationship after 22 days of walkouts last year. The website for Hamlin's company, Organisation Resource, states that it deals with issues such as "complex interpersonal issues resting on simple human emotions".

Hamlin, a former drama teacher, said: "I am involved with helping British Airways, Unite and its cabin crew representatives to find ways to develop a better working relationship as part of wider discussions on finding a resolution to the current cabin crew dispute." Hamlin adds on his website that his aim is to make business clients "better parents". A BA spokesman said: "To give those talks the best possible chance, we have appointed an independent facilitator. The focus of the facilitator will be the development of a better working relationship between BA and the local cabin crew representatives."

My wife is an expert in human behaviours (no really ), and ever since I started reading Mr Holley's missives to her she has said she could easily bring about change. She would love to do Motivational Interviewing (MI) workshops with the cabin crew who are still dogmatically following the BASSA line despite the weight of evidence and fact surrounding this dispute.

BlueUpGood is offline  
Old 11th Apr 2011, 08:37
  #3825 (permalink)  
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: france
Age: 58
Posts: 59
Cui bono

Hmm, interesting BlueUpGood.

Dan Milmo of The Observer has penned dozens of stories about this dispute, mostly exclusives.

Only two parties are privy to this psychologist being bought in, BA and BASSA/Unite. I assume BA wouldn't want to publicise how they are trying to resolve the dispute (why would they?) so that puts the spotlight on the other side.

Now, who would react adversely to a psychologist analysing their "psychology"? Who would want to belittle and ridicule this initiative so as to keep the war going and to not reveal their own mental frailties? Who may not have even been invited to the "relationship building" sessions where participants are trying to rebuild "fragility of trust"?

Originally Posted by Branch Secretary, BASSA
I get the Guardian and am starting to be unimpressed. I used to talk to Dan Milmo a lot but once he accompanied Walsh on his junket to Barbados and then insisted on calling us flight attendants (despite me telling him crew find that description slightlly offensive) I don't bother to return his calls.
Dusted off that contacts book again? You decide.

BASSAwitch is offline  
Old 12th Apr 2011, 12:14
  #3826 (permalink)  
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: UK
Posts: 8
A past tale of a Bassa Rep and accounts.........

Hi all,
I have just come across this article from 1997.

Sacked BA union man to appeal - News - The Independent

An interesting read, especially regarding the Union financial affairs. Has much changed for the better since then I wonder? Sadly I somehow doubt it!
160til4 is offline  
Old 12th Apr 2011, 15:53
  #3827 (permalink)  
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 1,442
Bookings over Easter holding up well so it doesn't look like the threat of strike action has deterred many potential customers.
Megaton is offline  
Old 12th Apr 2011, 19:01
  #3828 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 164
Saw someone today who I haven't seen in ages. They are still engaged in the industrial relations side of Cabin services in BA. They told me that BA have been happily getting on with the business of running the airline, despite some Bassa reps asking to be included in talks on various aspects of the business. Apparently one rep asked recently about when the talks about the 787 and A380 would start. They were informed thats its all been sorted already. Yes without those ENDLESS meetings about meetings, it was all concluded successfully with help with selected crew who KNEW far more than ever the Bassa reps would have known. Why? Because they fly all the time and UNDERSTAND what is going on, on a day to day basis.
My colleague also told me that they couldn't believe the moment when Bassa handed them a letter in Nov 2009 telling them they would not be negotiating in any further meetings with BA. They were literally stunned. Big mistake Bassa, big big mistake.

Fully aware that a lot of people on here know this already, but always good to hear from the horses mouth so to speak.
JUAN TRIPP is offline  
Old 12th Apr 2011, 22:22
  #3829 (permalink)  
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: LAM/BIG/BNN hold
Posts: 153
Colonel White - I hope and think you could be spot on with you future predictions.

However, my question - how long will it take to get over all of this and get back to normal ?

I have seen men (or boys if you like), still this week who have a list of all the non strikers and VCC on them at work. Why do these idiots still work for BA, leave now please

License to Fly is offline  
Old 13th Apr 2011, 11:42
  #3830 (permalink)  
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Nice
Posts: 40
Juan you are correct. BA have been engaging alot of CSD's in discussions about latest initiatives. BA is moving the business forward; it has to. the union branches had their opportunity to be involved but without a facilities agreement and a prevailing IA situation they did not. BA is now managing and using its CSDs to manage and be involved in development.
prism is offline  
Old 13th Apr 2011, 18:04
  #3831 (permalink)  
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: London
Posts: 17
Just wondered if anybody knew what the outcome of DH tribunal was. I remember it was a few months ago but never heard what happened.
VCC is offline  
Old 13th Apr 2011, 18:23
  #3832 (permalink)  
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: St. John's Wood
Posts: 295
I have seen men (or boys if you like), still this week who have a list of all the non strikers and VCC on them at work.
Such lists can only be intended for nefarious purposes - do us all a favour and report the culprits. Such people need removing from the company, quickly!

VCC, the published Employment Appeal Tribunal judgements are only up to a hearing date of 18 March 2011, so it will be a couple of weeks, at a guess, before we hear about DH's failed fracas.
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Old 13th Apr 2011, 18:54
  #3833 (permalink)  
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Gatwick
Posts: 1,964
Abbey Road

Was he at the EAT?
Litebulbs is online now  
Old 13th Apr 2011, 19:43
  #3834 (permalink)  
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: St. John's Wood
Posts: 295
Sorry, I don't know that.
Abbey Road is offline  
Old 13th Apr 2011, 20:10
  #3835 (permalink)  
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Gatwick
Posts: 1,964
I may be wrong, but to get to the EAT, we would be able to see the ET decision. The website British and Irish Legal Information Institute does not show anything about BA vs DH.
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Old 13th Apr 2011, 21:38
  #3836 (permalink)  
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Heathrow
Posts: 250
Others may correct me, but it was my belief that Duncan Holley's case was to the Employment Tribunal, not the Employment Appeals Tribunal. Hence BAILII is unlikely to contain the judgement. The basis of this belief is founded on the fact that he applied for an injunction to be returned to work pending his case coming up to tribunal. It was at that hearing that the court refused his application in the grounds that in all probability his case would fail at tribunal.
Colonel White is offline  
Old 13th Apr 2011, 22:00
  #3837 (permalink)  
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Gatwick
Posts: 1,964
I was wrong! Well pointed out Colonel!
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Old 13th Apr 2011, 23:10
  #3838 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 164

Juan you are correct. BA have been engaging alot of CSD's in discussions about latest initiatives. BA is moving the business forward; it has to. the union branches had their opportunity to be involved but without a facilities agreement and a prevailing IA situation they did not. BA is now managing and using its CSDs to manage and be involved in development.

Yes thats correct. I myself am involved in a 5-6 weekly meeting to discuss all the product/catering issues we have on shorthaul. It includes all ranks including importantly main crew. Same on longhaul. Five meetings on, we have started to move things on already, but the real benefit will be seen in 6-12 months time. Ironically crew have said for years " Why have the company not asked us the crew on how to do this and that" Thats now happening. Before it was the Bassa reps who inputted ideas/issues. I'll leave it to the rest of you to work out why things generally never moved forward. Hot towel in W/T plus anyone?

As an aside a crew member asked me the other week when I was asking for feedback about a particular issue we have at the moment, whether Bassa knew about this!! It was their opinion that they should be included. My answer was NO!! and hopefully never again. Their face was a picture!
JUAN TRIPP is offline  
Old 14th Apr 2011, 16:37
  #3839 (permalink)  
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: UK
Posts: 280
BA agree to 28 day extension to ballot:

Joint statement by Unite the union and British Airways

14 April 2011

The new general secretary of Unite, Len McCluskey, and the new CEO of British Airways, Keith Williams, have had exploratory talks over the last few weeks and are committed to seeking an honourable and fair settlement to the long running dispute.

Both men accept that a lasting peace is essential for the well-being of all cabin crew and for the benefit of British Airways’ customers.

To achieve such a peace, it is understood by British Airways that cabin crew must feel that their concerns are being fairly dealt with, and it is recognised by the union that that the management and acceptance of change is the key to lasting peace.

A lasting settlement will require resolution on matters important to cabin crew:

* Restoration of staff travel with seniority on implementation of the settlement including a new working relationship with the local representatives;
* A binding independent review of disciplinaries to ensure fairness; and
* Measures to address concerns on earnings and lifestyle associated with the established changes in onboard crew numbers and the introduction of Mixed Fleet.

British Airways and the union have embarked already on a process of co-operation building, assisted by a highly-regarded external company. It is hoped that this continuing process will help develop and strengthen trust.

The current strike ballot mandate given by cabin crew means industrial action must be announced by 15 April. Both parties accept that this would severely undermine any attempt at a genuine settlement. Accordingly, British Airways is prepared to grant an extension of 28 days to the Union.

A variety of meetings will now take place in the belief that the optimism of recent weeks can be turned into a reality that will allow British Airways to focus on delivering the high-quality service its customers expect and to take all its staff confidently into the future.

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Old 14th Apr 2011, 17:11
  #3840 (permalink)  
Join Date: May 2010
Location: maidenhead
Posts: 942

Well this is very welcome news.

I just wish that KW had been in-charge two years ago!

What a difference a man makes!
Betty girl is offline  

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