British Airways - CC Industrial Relations Mk V
My first trip to NYC was fantastic (once we got there)
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I find it laughable how MissM continually tells us the union have been very clear with their members about the reason for the new ballot.
I pointed out that BASSA have a history of lying to their members in an earlier post, and yet for some reason she thinks they have suddenly stopped misleading people. In fact, MissM, I asked you, based on the unarguable facts that I gave you, if you think it is possible that BASSA is misleading you, and you have failed to answer.
Just a reminder, the BASSA lies I pointed out are still on the UNITEBA website at the link I gave you. Perhaps you could give it a quick read and comment on it?
Sadly, it is this head in the sand approach and blind trust of the rubbish in charge that may lead to many people making an uninformed decision, and which will in all likelihood cause them to lose their jobs or end up having their contracts terminated.
I pointed out that BASSA have a history of lying to their members in an earlier post, and yet for some reason she thinks they have suddenly stopped misleading people. In fact, MissM, I asked you, based on the unarguable facts that I gave you, if you think it is possible that BASSA is misleading you, and you have failed to answer.
Just a reminder, the BASSA lies I pointed out are still on the UNITEBA website at the link I gave you. Perhaps you could give it a quick read and comment on it?
Sadly, it is this head in the sand approach and blind trust of the rubbish in charge that may lead to many people making an uninformed decision, and which will in all likelihood cause them to lose their jobs or end up having their contracts terminated.
I can completely understand the concerns of cc that they don't want to be phoned on days off, don't want to see the rapid introduction of New Fleet and don't want to see the ability to have a say in their future destroyed.
Unfortunately the current situation as created by BASSA will do nothing but hasten all of these things, so crew are blindly following a "union" which is leading them into the abyss. The company were already in a deep financial hole (BALPA's accountants reviewed the books and can attest to this, BASSA declined the offer) and that has been made much worse by the shambles of the "12 days" and the continuing threat of IA. This has left the company with no option but to recover the costs and what is the only way they can do that - to accelerate plans for introduction of New Fleet and undercut the old terms and conditions.
So we have a work-force who decided to strike on something which may have happened in the future, subject to mature negotiation (and every crew member I have spoken to did not care about imposition or one down - they were trying to threaten the company about New Fleet). Because of this the company has no alternative but to hasten the introduction of the very thing they feared.
Genius.
Unfortunately the current situation as created by BASSA will do nothing but hasten all of these things, so crew are blindly following a "union" which is leading them into the abyss. The company were already in a deep financial hole (BALPA's accountants reviewed the books and can attest to this, BASSA declined the offer) and that has been made much worse by the shambles of the "12 days" and the continuing threat of IA. This has left the company with no option but to recover the costs and what is the only way they can do that - to accelerate plans for introduction of New Fleet and undercut the old terms and conditions.
So we have a work-force who decided to strike on something which may have happened in the future, subject to mature negotiation (and every crew member I have spoken to did not care about imposition or one down - they were trying to threaten the company about New Fleet). Because of this the company has no alternative but to hasten the introduction of the very thing they feared.
Genius.
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Do they still have the ice skating rink - complete with Christmas Carols - in the Rockefeller Plaza ?
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There is currently severe disruption due snow throughout UK and europe yet Bassa send this emal to their members.........
During this period of disruption due to the heavy snow and related
transport chaos, it is paramount that all crew adhere to our respective
agreements that we normally work to, i.e. World Wide Agreement, Euro fleet
Agreement and the MOA at Gatwick.
If you are in any doubt whether you are being asked to work outside of
your agreement please call BASSA. We have 24 hour coverage.
Thank you
Just demonstrates the need for BA to change the mindset to enable the company to operate in extreme conditions.
During this period of disruption due to the heavy snow and related
transport chaos, it is paramount that all crew adhere to our respective
agreements that we normally work to, i.e. World Wide Agreement, Euro fleet
Agreement and the MOA at Gatwick.
If you are in any doubt whether you are being asked to work outside of
your agreement please call BASSA. We have 24 hour coverage.
Thank you
Just demonstrates the need for BA to change the mindset to enable the company to operate in extreme conditions.
Join Date: Jul 2005
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Sort of sums it up for those diehard BASSA tub thumpers who constantly preach that they are the best in the world!
Do they care about the product? Nope
Do they care about the customer? Nope
Do they actually give a stuff about anything except their overblown allowances and 2 days local rest after a harrowing diversion? Nope.
Extremely sad that this overly vocal minority do not in any way, shape or form, represent the majority of good BA cabin crew. It is indeed unfortunate that BASSA, through a campaign of slander, misinformation and witholding information have led so many of their members into voting for a strike they have no idea about!
Will you take strike action? YES/NO
What sort of 'professional' ballot is that?
Bye bye BASSA.
Do they care about the product? Nope
Do they care about the customer? Nope
Do they actually give a stuff about anything except their overblown allowances and 2 days local rest after a harrowing diversion? Nope.
Extremely sad that this overly vocal minority do not in any way, shape or form, represent the majority of good BA cabin crew. It is indeed unfortunate that BASSA, through a campaign of slander, misinformation and witholding information have led so many of their members into voting for a strike they have no idea about!
Will you take strike action? YES/NO
What sort of 'professional' ballot is that?
Bye bye BASSA.
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We would like to take this opportunity to update you on the current state of play with regard to the dispute. We are firmly resolved to conduct the re-ballot of the membership in response to the imposition by British Airways.
In the meantime The Joint General Secretaries were approached by British Airways and asked to attend a meeting to discuss the situation.
The initial meetings have seen a desire by British Airways to meet and negotiate a resolution to the current situation. It has been accepted that these talks will be held under the auspices of the TUC.
We remain resolute that the current impositions need to be removed.
However, we shall remain open to consider the company’s proposals moving forward. At the time of writing, the company has offered some concessionary ideas, which are under consideration.
We need to reiterate that until the situation is resolved to the satisfaction of the union and its members, Unite will continue to pursue the industrial ballot.
We shall be meeting again tomorrow with the Joint General Secretaries in order to further discuss the issue.
We shall update you over the coming days with our progress
(from the union web site.)
In the meantime The Joint General Secretaries were approached by British Airways and asked to attend a meeting to discuss the situation.
The initial meetings have seen a desire by British Airways to meet and negotiate a resolution to the current situation. It has been accepted that these talks will be held under the auspices of the TUC.
We remain resolute that the current impositions need to be removed.
However, we shall remain open to consider the company’s proposals moving forward. At the time of writing, the company has offered some concessionary ideas, which are under consideration.
We need to reiterate that until the situation is resolved to the satisfaction of the union and its members, Unite will continue to pursue the industrial ballot.
We shall be meeting again tomorrow with the Joint General Secretaries in order to further discuss the issue.
We shall update you over the coming days with our progress
(from the union web site.)
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As a reply to people suggesting that pilots are leaving BALPA to join BASSA, and so BASSA members may get to see the advantages of a policy of negotiation and engagement with the company, consider this.
A new tax regime is shortly to be imposed on allowances earned when flying. The two unions were presented with a pretty identical problem (although due to outdated pay arrangement with the CC their variable pay is a bigger % of their take home).
Two different solutions have been found, you will find the CC are significantly disadvantaged compared to the pilots.
A vast majority of CC are being let down by the leadership at BASSA. Please drop your automatic distrust of information given from outside BASSA and do some research and reach your own conclusions.
A new tax regime is shortly to be imposed on allowances earned when flying. The two unions were presented with a pretty identical problem (although due to outdated pay arrangement with the CC their variable pay is a bigger % of their take home).
Two different solutions have been found, you will find the CC are significantly disadvantaged compared to the pilots.
A vast majority of CC are being let down by the leadership at BASSA. Please drop your automatic distrust of information given from outside BASSA and do some research and reach your own conclusions.
Join Date: Feb 2006
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I must admit that all this whingeing about having to work a little bit harder is really starting to hack me off and makes me wonder about the professionalism of some people.
I'm saying this as an ATCO just off night shift from a very busy ATC centre in Hampshire who drove into work last night, had to abandon car due to conditions and continued the last 3 miles on foot in horrendous weather to ensure that airspace could stay open so flights could happen and customers would get to destination, even if a little late.
I'm not unique in this; many of my colleagues did the same - some managed to drive all the way in because their route was clear, some left home and ended up getting in 5 hours early because they over compensated in their desire to get on with the job. Others walked several miles in the dark, in snow blizzards. Then after this feat, they had to take over from the afternoon shift that had stayed late (over legal working hours) to ensure that continuity of service was maintained. This is in a job that has a hell of a lot more safety implications than CC.
We got free coffee as a thank you.
Talk on here of losing one crew member per flight and the extra 'work' that involves is laughable.
Get a life, and look at what goes on in the real world.
I'm saying this as an ATCO just off night shift from a very busy ATC centre in Hampshire who drove into work last night, had to abandon car due to conditions and continued the last 3 miles on foot in horrendous weather to ensure that airspace could stay open so flights could happen and customers would get to destination, even if a little late.
I'm not unique in this; many of my colleagues did the same - some managed to drive all the way in because their route was clear, some left home and ended up getting in 5 hours early because they over compensated in their desire to get on with the job. Others walked several miles in the dark, in snow blizzards. Then after this feat, they had to take over from the afternoon shift that had stayed late (over legal working hours) to ensure that continuity of service was maintained. This is in a job that has a hell of a lot more safety implications than CC.
We got free coffee as a thank you.
Talk on here of losing one crew member per flight and the extra 'work' that involves is laughable.
Get a life, and look at what goes on in the real world.
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We remain resolute that the current impositions need to be removed.
Strange that the left hand of the Union doesn't seem to know/understand what the right hand are doing/saying.
Who would trust a Union like that?
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We remain resolute that the current impositions need to be removed.
Besides, with the new reduced service, I don't see the necessity to re-instate the previous crewing levels. Furthermore wouldn't this affect costs savings in relations to VR that has been offered? A lot of crew hoping to take up Part Time working would also have to be refused to make up for the crew who have taken VR.
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Tiramisu I know how ridiculous!! Imagine doing a Band 3 on the 319 with really low load with say 2 pax in Club and 60 down the back with a minimum BASSA requirement of 4 again!! lol.... I don't know what the levels are like on longhaul and how they are working but here on shorthaul there are just a few minor teething problems with some feeback to the company may be ironed out.
See it shows the company are willing to seek a solution, but the union are only doing it conditionally. Unite - please talk regardless of whether the crew complements are restored or not, otherwise New Fleet will be sooner than you think! I wonder though, if Unite come with a proposal will it be to the benefit of longhaul CSDs again or will it benefit everyone?
See it shows the company are willing to seek a solution, but the union are only doing it conditionally. Unite - please talk regardless of whether the crew complements are restored or not, otherwise New Fleet will be sooner than you think! I wonder though, if Unite come with a proposal will it be to the benefit of longhaul CSDs again or will it benefit everyone?
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There is currently severe disruption due snow throughout UK and europe yet Bassa send this emal to their members.........
I will respect my agreement no matter what the situation is.
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Wouldn't it have been better if both sides could have resolved this dispute around a nice big table with cups of tea. Instead we have this mess anyway i read in the Daily Express finance pages that the betting on Keif Villiams to take over from Villie is hotting up time to say Bye Bye Villie could be nearer than you think. Disruption agreement well wouldn't that be handy during the next few days alas things are not quite how the company would like it. Heard on the radio the company and Bassa plan to meet for talks 
about time i hear you all say. I hope you all made it into work today from your mansions from deep in the countryside.
about time i hear you all say. I hope you all made it into work today from your mansions from deep in the countryside.
Last edited by Watersidewonker; 6th Jan 2010 at 13:15. Reason: Bing Bong
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Anotherthing.
How brave of you.Believe it or not ,I and many of my fellow CC have similar stories getting into work today.Left the house at 5 am this morning to drive the 60 miles to work to check in at 10.50,battling the same blizzards as you to ensure that I would be there to take our passengers on holiday.
AND I didnt get any free coffee.AND the flight was cancelled.AND I will loose 1/8 of my monthly pay because of it.
Hey life stinks dosnt it
How brave of you.Believe it or not ,I and many of my fellow CC have similar stories getting into work today.Left the house at 5 am this morning to drive the 60 miles to work to check in at 10.50,battling the same blizzards as you to ensure that I would be there to take our passengers on holiday.
AND I didnt get any free coffee.AND the flight was cancelled.AND I will loose 1/8 of my monthly pay because of it.
Hey life stinks dosnt it
Junior trash
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So none of the BASSA camp are concerned that its the Unite gen secs meeting BA, and they also havent authorised ballot 2. I'm getting the feeling of deja vu here.
Climb down approaching rapidly.
Climb down approaching rapidly.
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"We have said all along that this dispute could only be resolved through negotiation, rather than imposition or litigation, so we are delighted to be joining BA management in talks at the TUC," said Unite joint general secretaries Derek Simpson and Tony Woodley.
Hmmmmm, sensible?
Hmmmmm, sensible?
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Both parties have recourse in the case of a disagreement
Apologies for stating the obvious but could I recap.
It is accepted that changes to British Airways Cabin Crew working practices should be agreed between the employer and employee representatives and in this case there is clearly no agreement.
The British Airways Cabin Crew have the option to withdraw their labour by way of strike action subject to a legal ballot. On the grounds that turkeys do not vote for Christmas, it is understandable that the new working practices have been rejected by the union.
Perhaps a BASSA representative would like to confirm that British Airways also has an option in a situation where there is no agreement. After due consultation and statutory notification, a new contract can be implemented and the workforce has two choices:
·Accept the terms of the new contract and return to work
·Reject the new contract, accept contract termination and seek possible compensation at an industrial tribunal
The full text is available at:
“Redundancy consultation and notification: guidance”
www.berr.gov.uk/whatwedo/employment/employment-legislation/employment-guidance/page13852.html
It is my contention that a significant proportion of the BASSA “Yes” vote are not aware that their jobs are on the line here.
Simples…compare the jobs meerkat!
It is accepted that changes to British Airways Cabin Crew working practices should be agreed between the employer and employee representatives and in this case there is clearly no agreement.
The British Airways Cabin Crew have the option to withdraw their labour by way of strike action subject to a legal ballot. On the grounds that turkeys do not vote for Christmas, it is understandable that the new working practices have been rejected by the union.
Perhaps a BASSA representative would like to confirm that British Airways also has an option in a situation where there is no agreement. After due consultation and statutory notification, a new contract can be implemented and the workforce has two choices:
·Accept the terms of the new contract and return to work
·Reject the new contract, accept contract termination and seek possible compensation at an industrial tribunal
The full text is available at:
“Redundancy consultation and notification: guidance”
www.berr.gov.uk/whatwedo/employment/employment-legislation/employment-guidance/page13852.html
It is my contention that a significant proportion of the BASSA “Yes” vote are not aware that their jobs are on the line here.
Simples…compare the jobs meerkat!