BA and Project Columbus
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I'm sure he'd be willing to give up anything he's paid above the benchmark level. That's irrelevant anyway as Willies not asking anyone to give things up yet, he's just saying the gravy train is full and no more will be allowed to jump on it.
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TopBunk. EU legislation limits flying hours to 900 pa, as you know. Myself and many others are around the 850 mark. Others are sat at home having reached the limit. (That is inefficient.)
Take £15k from my salary and I'd take home less than £10k pa. I guess you and others on justifiably higher salaries will just accept the additional tax burden as the state coughs up additional tax credits etc.
As for challenging the document and its facts, which ones? The document is a wish list for the future, not an appraisal of the present. It isn't even a proposal as yet, just a 'leaked' draft - one of many. No point arguing facts and figures until they are on the table. Then discussion can begin, indeed there was no BA acknowledgement of the document at the lastest NSP meeting between the TUs and BA.
Take £15k from my salary and I'd take home less than £10k pa. I guess you and others on justifiably higher salaries will just accept the additional tax burden as the state coughs up additional tax credits etc.
As for challenging the document and its facts, which ones? The document is a wish list for the future, not an appraisal of the present. It isn't even a proposal as yet, just a 'leaked' draft - one of many. No point arguing facts and figures until they are on the table. Then discussion can begin, indeed there was no BA acknowledgement of the document at the lastest NSP meeting between the TUs and BA.
Junior trash
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As for challenging the document and its facts, which ones? The document is a wish list for the future, not an appraisal of the present. It isn't even a proposal as yet, just a 'leaked' draft - one of many. No point arguing facts and figures until they are on the table. Then discussion can begin, indeed there was no BA acknowledgement of the document at the lastest NSP meeting between the TUs and BA.
Others are sat at home having reached the limit. (That is inefficient.)
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Funny how...
Everyone is an expert on BASSA policy and have nothing to do with the internal politics of IFS, and indeed the cabin crew community.
Thanks for the support.
It was a different story when the pension issue arose.
"WE have to stand together on this one". Well we did. Where did it get the cabin crew? Nowhere and now you have the gaul to applaud WW for wanting to slash our take home???
We (BASSA) supported BALPA on the OS plan knowing the "possible" effect on the FD community and the "possible" knock on effects for the cabin crew.
No-one is saying things have to change. They must. Start by taking the lounge budget, the ground staff budget from IN-FLIGHT services and a truer cost will emerge.
Thanks for the support.
It was a different story when the pension issue arose.
"WE have to stand together on this one". Well we did. Where did it get the cabin crew? Nowhere and now you have the gaul to applaud WW for wanting to slash our take home???
We (BASSA) supported BALPA on the OS plan knowing the "possible" effect on the FD community and the "possible" knock on effects for the cabin crew.
No-one is saying things have to change. They must. Start by taking the lounge budget, the ground staff budget from IN-FLIGHT services and a truer cost will emerge.
Junior trash
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Where did it get the cabin crew? Nowhere
BASSA only became interested at the last possible moment and failed to attend several meetings. Openskies is irrelevent to cabin crew as the BA aircraft being crewed on on different contracts battle got lost by BASSA years ago. But at least they keep important matters like room upgrades for CSDs and buses to central area at weekends right at the top of the agenda eh?
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Originally Posted by PC767
The document is a wish list for the future, not an appraisal of the present.
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Originally Posted by Olympus593
Everyone is an expert on BASSA policy and have nothing to do with the internal politics of IFS, and indeed the cabin crew community.
Thanks for the support.
It was a different story when the pension issue arose.
"WE have to stand together on this one". Well we did. Where did it get the cabin crew? Nowhere and now you have the gaul to applaud WW for wanting to slash our take home???
We (BASSA) supported BALPA on the OS plan knowing the "possible" effect on the FD community and the "possible" knock on effects for the cabin crew.
No-one is saying things have to change. They must. Start by taking the lounge budget, the ground staff budget from IN-FLIGHT services and a truer cost will emerge.
Thanks for the support.
It was a different story when the pension issue arose.
"WE have to stand together on this one". Well we did. Where did it get the cabin crew? Nowhere and now you have the gaul to applaud WW for wanting to slash our take home???
We (BASSA) supported BALPA on the OS plan knowing the "possible" effect on the FD community and the "possible" knock on effects for the cabin crew.
No-one is saying things have to change. They must. Start by taking the lounge budget, the ground staff budget from IN-FLIGHT services and a truer cost will emerge.
It's highly commendable that "we stood together" when it came to the pensions dispute and OS. Now, if only we'd all "stood together" a little while before that. Around the time that BA were trying out all their cost cutting ideas on the BA Lab Rats, otherwise known as LGW. Maybe if we had had some support back then, we wouldn't all be in the uncertain situation of today!
Unfortunately, not all but definitely a large majority at LHR didn't give a damn about what was happening down the road. After all, it was only LGW and LGW wasn't even really mainline...was it? Those crew were so shortsighted and arrogant that they never thought it could happen at the Golden Runways. Well guess what? They discovered it could work and now it looks like it's coming to an airport near you soon!
Please don't insult us by spouting on about how you've all stood by everyone else, because it's absolute rubbish and you know it!
As for your comment about starting with cutbacks to the ground staff in IFS, I think you'll find they have. Very recently, in fact. Such a short memory!
newbagr,
Oh, that's very constructive and I'm sure will make a world of difference to the plans of the management!
Jsl
Last edited by jetset lady; 30th Dec 2008 at 13:40.
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Jetset,
Just want to clear a couple of things up regarding your post.
Firstly I am certainly NOT advocating jobcuts. My memory is fine, thanks. 100 groundstaff are going at LGW. (Lets see if AVIANCE worm their way in in the future, but thats another topic).
I was referring to the fact that ground services, ie groundstaff and the lounges fall under the IN-FLIGHT budget. In Touch days include these costs as part of the "You cost too much" Brainwashing.
I never intended my post to be seen as ANOTHER LGW v LHR thread, far from it.
Do you really think that LHR crew never seen this comming? LGW has always been the testbed, mainline or otherwise, for any implimentations that BA have wanted or desired.
HotelMode,
The point of the central area bus and CSD room upgrades were in the settlement document as points of principle. The bus was negotiated in the early 80s. BA wanted to remove it without consultation. It was seen that, just trashing an agreement would be the thin end of the wedge. Ditto the room upgrades.
Happy Landings.
Olympus.
Just want to clear a couple of things up regarding your post.
Firstly I am certainly NOT advocating jobcuts. My memory is fine, thanks. 100 groundstaff are going at LGW. (Lets see if AVIANCE worm their way in in the future, but thats another topic).
I was referring to the fact that ground services, ie groundstaff and the lounges fall under the IN-FLIGHT budget. In Touch days include these costs as part of the "You cost too much" Brainwashing.
I never intended my post to be seen as ANOTHER LGW v LHR thread, far from it.
Do you really think that LHR crew never seen this comming? LGW has always been the testbed, mainline or otherwise, for any implimentations that BA have wanted or desired.
HotelMode,
The point of the central area bus and CSD room upgrades were in the settlement document as points of principle. The bus was negotiated in the early 80s. BA wanted to remove it without consultation. It was seen that, just trashing an agreement would be the thin end of the wedge. Ditto the room upgrades.
Happy Landings.
Olympus.
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Olympus,
I'm not talking about the job cuts involving the LGW groundstaff. I'm referring to the recent cull of managers from IFS.
I'm also not particularly interested in a tit for tat argument either, but I have to ask, if LHR say this coming, why didn't they attempt to stop it before BA could get the chance to discover whether it would work or not?
Jsl
I'm not talking about the job cuts involving the LGW groundstaff. I'm referring to the recent cull of managers from IFS.
I'm also not particularly interested in a tit for tat argument either, but I have to ask, if LHR say this coming, why didn't they attempt to stop it before BA could get the chance to discover whether it would work or not?
Jsl
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JetSet,
Hi, for your information I am LGW crew. I strongly believe that we have to fight all as one as this WILL affect us all! If we think at LGW that BA is done with us, then trust me WE ARE WRONG!Next thing, they will remove incraments, will remove other little payments, they will remove breakfast allowances as simply they will know we are just easy trargets! I agree with you that LHR should have had taken a more active approach when BA was creating LGW but now this is done. We cant go back to change it! We can try to change whats in store for ALL of us!
Hi, for your information I am LGW crew. I strongly believe that we have to fight all as one as this WILL affect us all! If we think at LGW that BA is done with us, then trust me WE ARE WRONG!Next thing, they will remove incraments, will remove other little payments, they will remove breakfast allowances as simply they will know we are just easy trargets! I agree with you that LHR should have had taken a more active approach when BA was creating LGW but now this is done. We cant go back to change it! We can try to change whats in store for ALL of us!
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newbagr,
I never made any assumptions as to which base you were from. As it happens, I am perfectly aware that you are crew at LGW from your previous posts, but in this instance, that had no relevance to my comment.
I would also be interested to know how you have come to the conclusion that I think Colombus will not affect LGW if it does come to fruition? I don't think I have said as such so far and I will make up my own mind when a final proposal is finally put onto the table. Until then, I will not be sent into a frenzy of panic by the overly emotive BASSA "news" letters.
Jsl
I never made any assumptions as to which base you were from. As it happens, I am perfectly aware that you are crew at LGW from your previous posts, but in this instance, that had no relevance to my comment.
I would also be interested to know how you have come to the conclusion that I think Colombus will not affect LGW if it does come to fruition? I don't think I have said as such so far and I will make up my own mind when a final proposal is finally put onto the table. Until then, I will not be sent into a frenzy of panic by the overly emotive BASSA "news" letters.
Jsl
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JSL,
The management cull doesn't just apply to IFS management, it is companywide.
Just goes to show what every one knew. Too many Cheifs etc.
FWIW, if you think LGW are above further cuts then think again.
No-one is immune.
BA want to remove the "extra" PSR from the 777. Are you going to let them smash that hard fought agreement? Where will it end? Imposition of £1.20 per hour?
Olympus.
The management cull doesn't just apply to IFS management, it is companywide.
Just goes to show what every one knew. Too many Cheifs etc.
FWIW, if you think LGW are above further cuts then think again.
No-one is immune.
BA want to remove the "extra" PSR from the 777. Are you going to let them smash that hard fought agreement? Where will it end? Imposition of £1.20 per hour?
Olympus.
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WW is offering severance to the upper enchelons of the management structure. The same people will, undoubtebley ,return on over -inflated rates as consultants, therefore costing BA more in the long term.
History has a habit of repeating at BA, despite lessons "learnt".
Its all number crunching, targets met bonus and back patting on the so called results.
Olympus.
History has a habit of repeating at BA, despite lessons "learnt".
Its all number crunching, targets met bonus and back patting on the so called results.
Olympus.
Last edited by Olympus593; 30th Dec 2008 at 19:58.
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Olympus,
What are you on about? Please re read my last post, paying particular attention to:
Jsl
What are you on about? Please re read my last post, paying particular attention to:
I would also be interested to know how you have come to the conclusion that I think Colombus will not affect LGW if it does come to fruition?
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Originally Posted by Olympus593
The bus was negotiated in the early 80s. BA wanted to remove it without consultation. It was seen that, just trashing an agreement would be the thin end of the wedge. Ditto the room upgrades.
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JSL,
Since the question was posed to newbagr and not myself, I feel it is inappropriate to comment.
However, I will not cast aspersions but hope that the threat is headed off by the BASSA members at LHR with a positive outcome for us all.
The BASSA newsletter may have been emotive and alarmist to some but, there are so many crewmembers out there who have no idea of the implications of BAs plans, I feel it was timely and appropriate to make BASSA members, and all for that matter, wake up and realise the extent of the "Wish list".
Any word from CC89 yet?
Olympus.
Since the question was posed to newbagr and not myself, I feel it is inappropriate to comment.
However, I will not cast aspersions but hope that the threat is headed off by the BASSA members at LHR with a positive outcome for us all.
The BASSA newsletter may have been emotive and alarmist to some but, there are so many crewmembers out there who have no idea of the implications of BAs plans, I feel it was timely and appropriate to make BASSA members, and all for that matter, wake up and realise the extent of the "Wish list".
Any word from CC89 yet?
Olympus.