Netjets claim to have the BEST pilots!!
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Flanker...this is a serious concern, if true. In whose eyes was the caretaker role more important?
I have been with the people that really matter in NJE and they advocate that they have a safety and professional attitude second to no-one. Is Flexjet different in their approach? Or did you work for one of the Flexjet partners instead of the scheme itself?
Whilst both aspects of the job are important, the safety aspect must override all other roles.
Finally Flanker, was that the reason you left? Too many safety concerns?
I have been with the people that really matter in NJE and they advocate that they have a safety and professional attitude second to no-one. Is Flexjet different in their approach? Or did you work for one of the Flexjet partners instead of the scheme itself?
Whilst both aspects of the job are important, the safety aspect must override all other roles.
Finally Flanker, was that the reason you left? Too many safety concerns?
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LGW Vulture
I worked for Flexjet Europe when they had their dedicated fleet and crews, I don't know what the setup is now.
And yes it was serious enough in my view to cause me to resign without a job.
It's all about backgrounds and perceptions, some people genuinely believed they were a good operation but I and others had serious concerns.
PM me if you want more info.
I worked for Flexjet Europe when they had their dedicated fleet and crews, I don't know what the setup is now.
And yes it was serious enough in my view to cause me to resign without a job.
It's all about backgrounds and perceptions, some people genuinely believed they were a good operation but I and others had serious concerns.
PM me if you want more info.
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Flanker
Thanks for that. I really hope the operators in the Flexjet scheme look to safety first and foremost.
Things have changed a lot since the scheme was revised and thrust upon the independents. I can only hope that your experiences will NOT be repeated.
Especially as the independents in the scheme will also look to safeguard other work in addition to Flexjet.
I'm not sure whether I want any insight into historical mis-focus!!
If it is still happening, then I want to hear everything.
The thoughts of the Aspen GIII incident, where the pax made vital decisions instead of the crew MUST not be repeated. Even though this was nothing to do with Flexjet!
Safe flying...
Thanks for that. I really hope the operators in the Flexjet scheme look to safety first and foremost.
Things have changed a lot since the scheme was revised and thrust upon the independents. I can only hope that your experiences will NOT be repeated.
Especially as the independents in the scheme will also look to safeguard other work in addition to Flexjet.
I'm not sure whether I want any insight into historical mis-focus!!
If it is still happening, then I want to hear everything.
The thoughts of the Aspen GIII incident, where the pax made vital decisions instead of the crew MUST not be repeated. Even though this was nothing to do with Flexjet!
Safe flying...
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flexjet/netjet
I resigned from the original flex, having been in since day -1, until we saw the light at the end of the tunnel, and NO more funding expected.
They operated as a very safe operation.
I never experienced any attempt to pressure me into any unsafe action.
I have applied to Netjet, and as over 10,000 hrs and x Flexjet, realise with hindsite that I wasted a postage stamp.
They operated as a very safe operation.
I never experienced any attempt to pressure me into any unsafe action.
I have applied to Netjet, and as over 10,000 hrs and x Flexjet, realise with hindsite that I wasted a postage stamp.
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Hello, the NJE roadshow. Whatever next?
Bit too much chaff amongst the 6000 (1st 24 hours) or so hopefuls from the last series of adverts?
Bit too much chaff amongst the 6000 (1st 24 hours) or so hopefuls from the last series of adverts?
Last edited by doubleu-anker; 24th Sep 2003 at 17:12.
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NJE do send people to flight safety twice a year which is a major contribution to making their pilots the best they can be. Whether they actually are is obviously a source of some debate. Another factor is the selection process. You can't send rubbish to flight safety and expect great pilots to come back. Yo!
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Bumzzz,
I think that you received such reply from NJE as they really do not like to have "experienced pilots", period. I here from many sources that if you have over 10.000 hrs you can forget NJE.
Maybe they think that pilots go bad like old w
s after that...
Enjoy the life!
Blues
I think that you received such reply from NJE as they really do not like to have "experienced pilots", period. I here from many sources that if you have over 10.000 hrs you can forget NJE.
Maybe they think that pilots go bad like old w
s after that...Enjoy the life!
Blues
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FSI
AWP: I agree but you can send a monkey to FSI, and get a rating........
Two trips to FSI is a very expensive loss of resources for any company, but yest it is the best flight safety enhancement that is currently available.
TOTTON: Flex Jet do not employ pilots they subcontract out all the work. So there is No Flexjet salary. In FlexFet Europe, we were paid very very well, but went to FSI once per year, (some checks carried out in the aircraft), but I suspect that in its last breaths FJE sent crews to FSI twice a year. We bitched at this.
Then they closed down....no connection I am assured.
Two trips to FSI is a very expensive loss of resources for any company, but yest it is the best flight safety enhancement that is currently available.
TOTTON: Flex Jet do not employ pilots they subcontract out all the work. So there is No Flexjet salary. In FlexFet Europe, we were paid very very well, but went to FSI once per year, (some checks carried out in the aircraft), but I suspect that in its last breaths FJE sent crews to FSI twice a year. We bitched at this.
Then they closed down....no connection I am assured.
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Now why does that rumour not surprise me?
Yes just as I thought.
"NJE don't like to employ experienced pilots." The explanation is probably quite simple really. Any pilots with more than 10,000 hrs probably have more experience than the "management" pilots.
Yes just as I thought.
"NJE don't like to employ experienced pilots." The explanation is probably quite simple really. Any pilots with more than 10,000 hrs probably have more experience than the "management" pilots.
"W"-anker....why the vitriol?
Regarding experience - its all about quality not quantity.
Other than for chest beating in some bar, what value is 1 hour repeated 4000 times?
What value are 3000 poor quality hours where the safe completion of each flight is a testimony to the contribution of the ATC system, the aircraft designers and in fact to everyone involved except to the 2 guys up the front who to this day remain blisfully unaware of their very serious shortcomings.
I have see guys with 3000 hours and guys with 15,000 hours. I can assure you that hours in the log the log book are not a good predictor to performance.
The day of the mega-houred hairy chested "ace" are over. Its all about ability, clear thinking and good management skills. Sorry.
Regarding experience - its all about quality not quantity.
Other than for chest beating in some bar, what value is 1 hour repeated 4000 times?
What value are 3000 poor quality hours where the safe completion of each flight is a testimony to the contribution of the ATC system, the aircraft designers and in fact to everyone involved except to the 2 guys up the front who to this day remain blisfully unaware of their very serious shortcomings.
I have see guys with 3000 hours and guys with 15,000 hours. I can assure you that hours in the log the log book are not a good predictor to performance.
The day of the mega-houred hairy chested "ace" are over. Its all about ability, clear thinking and good management skills. Sorry.
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Lucille,
I will agree with you, up to certain extend. Please, be assured that all those hairy chested " high time" jockeys are gone through the exactly same FSI training and checks than NJE pilots today. Only difference being that they been there more often than these "manager pilots". Aren't you worried that in few years NJE pilots may also be too experienced, if they stay in business long enough.
Fact seems to be that NJE prefer to hire less experience crews and they should tell that in their adds.
Blues
I will agree with you, up to certain extend. Please, be assured that all those hairy chested " high time" jockeys are gone through the exactly same FSI training and checks than NJE pilots today. Only difference being that they been there more often than these "manager pilots". Aren't you worried that in few years NJE pilots may also be too experienced, if they stay in business long enough.
Fact seems to be that NJE prefer to hire less experience crews and they should tell that in their adds.
Blues
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lucille
I agree with you that experience alone is not the be all to end all.
However a client, or a owner I am sure, given the choice would prefer to fly with a crew, that is both competent and experienced. Rather than just competent.
I know quite a few kids and simulator maintenance engineers for example that could run rings around the average pilot with regards to piloting skills in the simulator both glass and NG. So what.
There is an old and very true saying in aviation. "There is no substitute for experience". This can only be gained in the air. Not in a classroom, not in a bar, not in a briefing room or on pprune for that matter. A good indicator of a pilot's experience is is his/her total flying time.
I agree with you that experience alone is not the be all to end all.
However a client, or a owner I am sure, given the choice would prefer to fly with a crew, that is both competent and experienced. Rather than just competent.
I know quite a few kids and simulator maintenance engineers for example that could run rings around the average pilot with regards to piloting skills in the simulator both glass and NG. So what.
There is an old and very true saying in aviation. "There is no substitute for experience". This can only be gained in the air. Not in a classroom, not in a bar, not in a briefing room or on pprune for that matter. A good indicator of a pilot's experience is is his/her total flying time.