Vulcan XH 558 Threads (merged)
Join Date: Nov 2005
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Oh well, let's hope TVOC do manage to achieve something because it's clear that nobody else will. Despite my pleas on here I see that people are still only interested in venting their frustrations rather than actually doing something constructive. I posted a similar message on Fightercontrol and it generated not so much as one reply. I asked Ukar to put the same message on their site but the guy who runs the site couldn't even be bothered - evidently he'd rather just allow pages of endless babble about the subject but when it comes to having a sensible discussion about what can be done - nooo, doesn't want to know - of course.
So there we are. The radio interviews have been and gone, the TV clips have been and gone, the letters to MP's, the questions to government departments, the campaigns, the "profile raising" and all for what? Nothing! I kept saying that the only route out of this was/is the HLF but nobody (not even TVOC) seem even vaguely interested in pursuing the one good chance they have of funding the project. Evidently they'd rather continue their endless quest for some millionaire benefactor that they must imagine will suddenly appear as if by magic. I don't know who is more crazy.
I find the whole business really, really sad. Having followed and supported the project right from the start I'm saddened to see that it remains under the control of a group who have the support and confidence of virtually nobody, while the whole project has now been seized-upon why every well-meaning idiot in the land it seems, all eager to "save" the project but nobody having a clue how to actually do it. Patently there's nothing else which can be done, so we may as well leave the endless moaning to run its course and just hope that there's some miracle before TVOC pronounce the project dead and disappear with whatever money that's left.
What a complete, utter waste of time and money it's all been, and what a shame that the aircraft wasn't purchased by someone else (preferably in another country) in the first place, so this whole sad saga could have maybe been avoided. Maybe Brits should stick to restoring Spitfires.
So there we are. The radio interviews have been and gone, the TV clips have been and gone, the letters to MP's, the questions to government departments, the campaigns, the "profile raising" and all for what? Nothing! I kept saying that the only route out of this was/is the HLF but nobody (not even TVOC) seem even vaguely interested in pursuing the one good chance they have of funding the project. Evidently they'd rather continue their endless quest for some millionaire benefactor that they must imagine will suddenly appear as if by magic. I don't know who is more crazy.
I find the whole business really, really sad. Having followed and supported the project right from the start I'm saddened to see that it remains under the control of a group who have the support and confidence of virtually nobody, while the whole project has now been seized-upon why every well-meaning idiot in the land it seems, all eager to "save" the project but nobody having a clue how to actually do it. Patently there's nothing else which can be done, so we may as well leave the endless moaning to run its course and just hope that there's some miracle before TVOC pronounce the project dead and disappear with whatever money that's left.
What a complete, utter waste of time and money it's all been, and what a shame that the aircraft wasn't purchased by someone else (preferably in another country) in the first place, so this whole sad saga could have maybe been avoided. Maybe Brits should stick to restoring Spitfires.
Join Date: Oct 2007
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I am doing something constructive.
I'm sitting on my hands, hoping to hasten the day when TVOC has to throw in the towel due to not having any more money to spend.
If everybody else did the same, events would come to a head quickly. As it is, for as long as people remain optimistic and willing to donate money they can ill-afford in pursuit of an apparently unattainable dream, the project will obviously stagger on burning every last penny it can get its hands on, with the Vulcan firmly grounded but still locked in the clutches of TVOC, as the remaining keepers of the faith are bled financially and emotionally dry....
If everybody else did the same, events would come to a head quickly. As it is, for as long as people remain optimistic and willing to donate money they can ill-afford in pursuit of an apparently unattainable dream, the project will obviously stagger on burning every last penny it can get its hands on, with the Vulcan firmly grounded but still locked in the clutches of TVOC, as the remaining keepers of the faith are bled financially and emotionally dry....
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Tim
Forgive me if I'm wrong but your post on FC seems to be advising everyone to stop doing anything (including writing to MPs) as only the HLF can help. Correct?
It then appears to appeal to readers to speak to media commentators and high profile MP's etc.
Slightly contradictory surely?
Gareth
Forgive me if I'm wrong but your post on FC seems to be advising everyone to stop doing anything (including writing to MPs) as only the HLF can help. Correct?
It then appears to appeal to readers to speak to media commentators and high profile MP's etc.
Slightly contradictory surely?
Gareth
Join Date: Jul 2007
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Tim McLelland,
whilst TVOC themselves continue to do whatever it is that they do (or don't do), we club/forum members certainly have NOT ceased our efforts in the least bit. i for one am determined to broadcast OUR achievments far and wide; OUR publicity campaign really HAS been bearing fruit - the huge increase in membership is proof of that. MPs are STILL signing up and showing interest and the press campaign has NOT finished at all.
as for the HLF - i really feel that you don't quite appreciate how they operate - over the years they have given millions to charitable projects that have collapsed or failed - some that never even got going in the first place. that's the 'gamble' they take; they certainly don't chase projects around and inject more cash 'as and when'.
what i and others within the club/forum are endeavouring to do, is merely raise awareness to the wider population than TVOC (or their less than impressive PR agency) has managed so far. there are still very many people in the UK that are completely unaware of 558 - and the fact that they all own an equal share in her.
of all the 40 million adults in the UK - if only 10% of those gave £1 each that's £4m already - 1%? £400,000! personally, i don't want one penny of my own money going anywhere near the pocket of those whose job we have proven we have done for them - but i (as we all do) want 558 to fly! and i want the whole nation to know about it!
sm
whilst TVOC themselves continue to do whatever it is that they do (or don't do), we club/forum members certainly have NOT ceased our efforts in the least bit. i for one am determined to broadcast OUR achievments far and wide; OUR publicity campaign really HAS been bearing fruit - the huge increase in membership is proof of that. MPs are STILL signing up and showing interest and the press campaign has NOT finished at all.
as for the HLF - i really feel that you don't quite appreciate how they operate - over the years they have given millions to charitable projects that have collapsed or failed - some that never even got going in the first place. that's the 'gamble' they take; they certainly don't chase projects around and inject more cash 'as and when'.
what i and others within the club/forum are endeavouring to do, is merely raise awareness to the wider population than TVOC (or their less than impressive PR agency) has managed so far. there are still very many people in the UK that are completely unaware of 558 - and the fact that they all own an equal share in her.
of all the 40 million adults in the UK - if only 10% of those gave £1 each that's £4m already - 1%? £400,000! personally, i don't want one penny of my own money going anywhere near the pocket of those whose job we have proven we have done for them - but i (as we all do) want 558 to fly! and i want the whole nation to know about it!
sm
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sm,
Agree entirely with you there. Well posted.
DG,
Add onto that figure of say £ 10,000 per week, the receipts from VTTS club membership (and Rusty has already intimated at a sizeable pot), then I fully expect the target is attainable.
Yes, we all have reservations of how the future looks, but short term, things are looking better than last week AND the week before.
That's got to be a positive.
Agree entirely with you there. Well posted.
DG,
Add onto that figure of say £ 10,000 per week, the receipts from VTTS club membership (and Rusty has already intimated at a sizeable pot), then I fully expect the target is attainable.
Yes, we all have reservations of how the future looks, but short term, things are looking better than last week AND the week before.
That's got to be a positive.
Join Date: May 2005
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I really hope TVOC get the cash together to get the project progressing!
I would love to have the opportunity to work on the airframe when it is scheduled to come into our place for winter maintenance! its the aircraft that got me initially interested in aviation!
I would love to have the opportunity to work on the airframe when it is scheduled to come into our place for winter maintenance! its the aircraft that got me initially interested in aviation!
Join Date: Oct 2005
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For the record ladies and gents, I sent off an email to Dr Bob with all of the points you all raised so I will advise if I hear anything back, nothing yet heard from CC or HLF on the FOI requests, I will chase them next week when I am back in the UK.
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WHAY HEY!!!
According to the tvoc website if you make a donation before 31st March you can get a free download/ ringtone of a genuine vulcan howl.
Guess that means we will be able to spot the suckers a bit more easily!
Had a rubbish morning - anyone fancy a real good argument?
According to the tvoc website if you make a donation before 31st March you can get a free download/ ringtone of a genuine vulcan howl.
Guess that means we will be able to spot the suckers a bit more easily!
Had a rubbish morning - anyone fancy a real good argument?
According to the tvoc website if you make a donation before 31st March you can get a free download/ ringtone of a genuine vulcan howl.
Woopdidoo, is there no beginning to their generosity.
VickyV - Having a crap afternoon myself, it's so bad, I can't be bothered to argue with anyone, even myself.
Woopdidoo, is there no beginning to their generosity.
VickyV - Having a crap afternoon myself, it's so bad, I can't be bothered to argue with anyone, even myself.
Join Date: Oct 2005
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Actually, it wouldn't need to be everyone in the world, a few large cities would be sufficient, although a few villages and hamlets wouldn't go a miss to help with sundry expenses I'm sure.
That's about as much as I can think of to try and start an argument.
That's about as much as I can think of to try and start an argument.
Join Date: Sep 2004
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I have no desire to simply hammer everything they do but a quick Google search reveals a downloadable "roar" from 558. I mean come on, if they want to put some incentives to donate in place it needs to be something with a value or perceived value.
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They've got the world's only flyable Vulcan bomber and they offer something that anyone (who wants it) can download for nothing on the web.
Incentives aren't always easy to get right, but experience has shown me that people won't just download or sign-up to ANYTHING in return for a donation, even if they are passionate about the subject. You really need a "money can't buy" to trigger donations this way. I learned this the hard way with 10 years experience of marketing to football fans - their support isn't as blinkered as you might think!
Surely they can come up with something original?
Calendars often seem to do well actually - did they do a 558 2008 calendar with some specially commissioned photos? I'm guessing not - but it's one thing that could have exploited the post October euphoria following the first flight and the run up to Christmas. I hope they did...........but not holding my breath!
Incentives aren't always easy to get right, but experience has shown me that people won't just download or sign-up to ANYTHING in return for a donation, even if they are passionate about the subject. You really need a "money can't buy" to trigger donations this way. I learned this the hard way with 10 years experience of marketing to football fans - their support isn't as blinkered as you might think!
Surely they can come up with something original?
Calendars often seem to do well actually - did they do a 558 2008 calendar with some specially commissioned photos? I'm guessing not - but it's one thing that could have exploited the post October euphoria following the first flight and the run up to Christmas. I hope they did...........but not holding my breath!
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honestly, what is it with some of you!
the ringtone/mp3 was a considered proposal by a few of the club members; it cost nothing to do, has all the correct authority and is actually constructive!
whilst we all got irritated by the 'crazy frog' if one person overhears that 'vulcan howl' in someones pocket and asks "what the hell is that?!?!", then that might just be one more person that gets to hear about the aeroplane that THEY PART OWN!!!!
in the absence of any credible PR in recent months, ANY idea that simply makes Britain aware of 558 is, in my opinion, a good idea!
at the very least, it shows that some people are trying to do something constructive with their spare time, rather than posting comments deriding such efforts!
the score line currently stands at TVOC 'Nil' - Club Members 'Several'
sm
the ringtone/mp3 was a considered proposal by a few of the club members; it cost nothing to do, has all the correct authority and is actually constructive!
whilst we all got irritated by the 'crazy frog' if one person overhears that 'vulcan howl' in someones pocket and asks "what the hell is that?!?!", then that might just be one more person that gets to hear about the aeroplane that THEY PART OWN!!!!
in the absence of any credible PR in recent months, ANY idea that simply makes Britain aware of 558 is, in my opinion, a good idea!
at the very least, it shows that some people are trying to do something constructive with their spare time, rather than posting comments deriding such efforts!
the score line currently stands at TVOC 'Nil' - Club Members 'Several'
sm
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I take it that there have been no further developments? I note that the subject seems to have run its course on the enthusiast sites (having gone absolutely nowhere of course) now so I guess that's the end of it unless anything emerges from the TVOC "black hole" !
Just to clear-up the points raised, Gareth, yes my comments might seem contradictory but I was hoping that encouraging people to make a fuss might achieve something. But after that, it became pretty clear that all the fuss was resulting merely in people either going-off and doing their own one-man campaigns, or simply issuing endless moans about TVOC, so it became pretty obvious that all the energy and enthusiasm was never going to be centred on a proper action plan. Sadly, as the days have progressed, it's become clear that my hunch was right.
Saracen, I do know how HLF operate - I spent quite a while communicating directly with them last year, trying to convince them to put more funds into the project (seen as nobody else bothered approaching them). We went round in circles of course, but their predicable claim that they are "powerless" to do more was patently nonsense, as they can of course treat every case on its merits. Ultimately, they seemed to accept this fact but (as predicted) they finally said that they would naturally be obliged to deal directly with TVOC to establish where the project went from there onwards. So it's anybody's guess what discussions took place after that, seen as TVOC never tell us. But it convinced me that there was certainly good reason to think that out of all the rather unrealistic hoping and praying, they did (and do) represent the best (if not only) chance of saving the project. Pity that nobody else seems to think likewise.
Just to clear-up the points raised, Gareth, yes my comments might seem contradictory but I was hoping that encouraging people to make a fuss might achieve something. But after that, it became pretty clear that all the fuss was resulting merely in people either going-off and doing their own one-man campaigns, or simply issuing endless moans about TVOC, so it became pretty obvious that all the energy and enthusiasm was never going to be centred on a proper action plan. Sadly, as the days have progressed, it's become clear that my hunch was right.
Saracen, I do know how HLF operate - I spent quite a while communicating directly with them last year, trying to convince them to put more funds into the project (seen as nobody else bothered approaching them). We went round in circles of course, but their predicable claim that they are "powerless" to do more was patently nonsense, as they can of course treat every case on its merits. Ultimately, they seemed to accept this fact but (as predicted) they finally said that they would naturally be obliged to deal directly with TVOC to establish where the project went from there onwards. So it's anybody's guess what discussions took place after that, seen as TVOC never tell us. But it convinced me that there was certainly good reason to think that out of all the rather unrealistic hoping and praying, they did (and do) represent the best (if not only) chance of saving the project. Pity that nobody else seems to think likewise.
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SM
I'm not knocking any PR efforts, although how this will generate column inches I'm not sure, but as an incentive to increase donations there must be something more original - or is TVOC so awful that they won't assist in coming up with anything that might help?
Gareth
I'm not knocking any PR efforts, although how this will generate column inches I'm not sure, but as an incentive to increase donations there must be something more original - or is TVOC so awful that they won't assist in coming up with anything that might help?
Gareth
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OOOH!
Loaded lads mag a good idea.We could have the tvoc themselves staging various poses against the aircraft wearing nothing but their usual vacant expressions.
Second thoughts, it might actually reduce column inches!
Oh Saracenman, lighten up please.
Evanelpus.....bless.
Loaded lads mag a good idea.We could have the tvoc themselves staging various poses against the aircraft wearing nothing but their usual vacant expressions.
Second thoughts, it might actually reduce column inches!
Oh Saracenman, lighten up please.
Evanelpus.....bless.
