Shuttleworth Displays - Feedback Required, Please
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MOTF - if you're asking about the R-R SPit, it was at the RAe do in June.
Now, back to the thread and apologies for the delay in replying.
I'd like to reiterate what I said at the beginning:
posted 7th October 2003 06:32
.......Say what you want and criticise as much as you like, but if you do, please be constructive and suggest a solution.......
So if you want to give me the name of alternate acts, then please do.....nuff said?
Duxford 3-5 Nov - since your post, I had a chat with Rod Dean. He said it was a City University event at Duxord, but I must admit, the post was the first I heard about it. Rod will be using some Shuttleworth info to illustrate his talk, but I find it rather sad that the organisers didn't contact us, either to take part, or to listen - or at least, I wasn't contacted.
Do we know who goes to Old Warden - we did a visitor sure in the mid 90's, so we had a rough idea then; maybe we need another one. Sufice to say that at that time, most of our visitors travelled over 90 mins to get there and a high percentage were first timers or only once per year attendees.
HP - thanks for the post on the freeloaders - we have to do something about it - there's a safety issue as well as a financial one.
Changing aircraft during a display - it's not as easy as you think. We plan the types for each show in advance, prepare them, pull 'em out, service 'em, fly 'em, then put 'em back. It all takes time. Aircraft cannot be generated on the day without signiicant engineering time being spent, time that is needed on the line to run the show. There would also be the inonvenience to the traders that block the hangar entrances on display days. Finally, it's not worth preparing aicraft as spares just in case - too much enginering time lost. We aim to fly all we prepare and we prepare all we need for a show.
We plan at least two Edwardian aircraft for each show, more if the weather forecast is good. If wind or rain is forecast, there's no point in planning all of them - again, too much time would be lost to aircraft that have a high probabliiy of not flying.
Canel the Spitfire - you have to be joking! Whatever your taste, it's a great crowd puller and the icing on the cake after the Edwardians have flown.
Acquisition policy - we will ontinue to acquire airaft suh as the CHipmunk, Prentice etc. In a hundred years, ours may be the only examples of the type in existance, as well as the only example flying. We can't be emotional about it now, we must look to preservation for the future. After all, if our predecessors had not done the same, we wouldn't have an Elf, Wren, Tomtit, Tutor etc, etc. The SAL Bulldog is also an important addition. Again, in a hundred years, it might be the only one around!
A final thanks to all for keeping this thread alive. I found it very useful, both as a collector of information and a way to educate on the philosophy of the Collection. I must admit, some of the posts do indicate that we haven't got our maketing right just yet.
Keep 'em coming!
A
Now, back to the thread and apologies for the delay in replying.
I'd like to reiterate what I said at the beginning:
posted 7th October 2003 06:32
.......Say what you want and criticise as much as you like, but if you do, please be constructive and suggest a solution.......
So if you want to give me the name of alternate acts, then please do.....nuff said?
Duxford 3-5 Nov - since your post, I had a chat with Rod Dean. He said it was a City University event at Duxord, but I must admit, the post was the first I heard about it. Rod will be using some Shuttleworth info to illustrate his talk, but I find it rather sad that the organisers didn't contact us, either to take part, or to listen - or at least, I wasn't contacted.
Do we know who goes to Old Warden - we did a visitor sure in the mid 90's, so we had a rough idea then; maybe we need another one. Sufice to say that at that time, most of our visitors travelled over 90 mins to get there and a high percentage were first timers or only once per year attendees.
HP - thanks for the post on the freeloaders - we have to do something about it - there's a safety issue as well as a financial one.
Changing aircraft during a display - it's not as easy as you think. We plan the types for each show in advance, prepare them, pull 'em out, service 'em, fly 'em, then put 'em back. It all takes time. Aircraft cannot be generated on the day without signiicant engineering time being spent, time that is needed on the line to run the show. There would also be the inonvenience to the traders that block the hangar entrances on display days. Finally, it's not worth preparing aicraft as spares just in case - too much enginering time lost. We aim to fly all we prepare and we prepare all we need for a show.
We plan at least two Edwardian aircraft for each show, more if the weather forecast is good. If wind or rain is forecast, there's no point in planning all of them - again, too much time would be lost to aircraft that have a high probabliiy of not flying.
Canel the Spitfire - you have to be joking! Whatever your taste, it's a great crowd puller and the icing on the cake after the Edwardians have flown.
Acquisition policy - we will ontinue to acquire airaft suh as the CHipmunk, Prentice etc. In a hundred years, ours may be the only examples of the type in existance, as well as the only example flying. We can't be emotional about it now, we must look to preservation for the future. After all, if our predecessors had not done the same, we wouldn't have an Elf, Wren, Tomtit, Tutor etc, etc. The SAL Bulldog is also an important addition. Again, in a hundred years, it might be the only one around!
A final thanks to all for keeping this thread alive. I found it very useful, both as a collector of information and a way to educate on the philosophy of the Collection. I must admit, some of the posts do indicate that we haven't got our maketing right just yet.
Keep 'em coming!
A
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What ever you do don't change to much, maybe the odd catering technique but that is it.
I have amazing video of a yellow gnat (intrepid?), magic, 2 pitts and an exta, amazing, a boxkite, unique, pink spitfire , odd, etc. All are interwoven with a fantastic backdrop and (from the time ) interesting commentary, John Blake.
Make of that what you will.........
I have amazing video of a yellow gnat (intrepid?), magic, 2 pitts and an exta, amazing, a boxkite, unique, pink spitfire , odd, etc. All are interwoven with a fantastic backdrop and (from the time ) interesting commentary, John Blake.
Make of that what you will.........
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I've just spent the best part of the last half hour reading through this thread, can't quite believe I've missed it. Some fabulous responses there, and a hearty round of applause to Airbedane for asking for, and most importantly listening to, the views of his customers. What a breath of fresh air! 
Unfortunately I've not got a lot to add, as I've not visited Old Warden for may years. I did promise myself that I would do so at some point this summer, but it always seemed to pass me by. Perhaps that might indicate that local advertising (I'm only thirty miles up the road) hasn't been as extensive as maybe it could have been?
There have also been a couple of shows which did seem to clash with others in the area (Duxford / Little Gransden). Or maybe it's more cost effective for you to display your aircraft at OW and Duxford on the same day as opposed to seperate days?
On the Spitfire wingtip question, I've always had a particular soft spot for AR501 since I first saw her with the clipped wings, so my personal preference would be for the tips to come off. Although of course, if the cost involved would have a negative impact on the rest of the collection, I'd rather the money were used on something more important than wingtip aesthetics.
Just my 2p's worth. I really do promise I will visit soon.
Unfortunately I've not got a lot to add, as I've not visited Old Warden for may years. I did promise myself that I would do so at some point this summer, but it always seemed to pass me by. Perhaps that might indicate that local advertising (I'm only thirty miles up the road) hasn't been as extensive as maybe it could have been?
There have also been a couple of shows which did seem to clash with others in the area (Duxford / Little Gransden). Or maybe it's more cost effective for you to display your aircraft at OW and Duxford on the same day as opposed to seperate days?
On the Spitfire wingtip question, I've always had a particular soft spot for AR501 since I first saw her with the clipped wings, so my personal preference would be for the tips to come off. Although of course, if the cost involved would have a negative impact on the rest of the collection, I'd rather the money were used on something more important than wingtip aesthetics.
Just my 2p's worth. I really do promise I will visit soon.
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On one of my first visits to OW, there was a lovely little scenario performed where the Lysander picked up an agent from "France" (AKA the middle of the runway). This year I also enjoyed the participation of the "Dad's Army" group.
Is there any scope for having more of this kind of thing? I'm sure that many of your aircraft have stories to tell.
IMHO, Old Warden has some of the best shows around! I love the variety of aircraft and I believe that there is certainly room for everything from the Edwardians to Denny Dobson! Keep up the good work.
Good luck with the freeloaders too!
Is there any scope for having more of this kind of thing? I'm sure that many of your aircraft have stories to tell.
IMHO, Old Warden has some of the best shows around! I love the variety of aircraft and I believe that there is certainly room for everything from the Edwardians to Denny Dobson! Keep up the good work.
Good luck with the freeloaders too!
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Can we have the Comet flying as soon as you can.
It is such an important and famous Aircraft in British Aviation history.
I am waiting for the day that it will grace the sky over Old Warden again.
Peter.
It is such an important and famous Aircraft in British Aviation history.
I am waiting for the day that it will grace the sky over Old Warden again.
Peter.
The Lysander scenario sounds good!
But personally I'd love to see ac such as the Miles Messenger, Miles Gemini, Speed 6, Arrow Active - and, of course, the wonderful Mew Gull (just reading AH's book yet again!).
And purrleeezze let's have the DH88 airborne again soon.
Re. aerobatics - in a period aeroplane such as the Jungmann, Tiger Moth, Arrow Active, yes indeed. As good as DD's Extra displays are, I personally don't find it in keeping with the atmosphere of the Collection.
And let's have Airbedane back to flight status again soon!
But personally I'd love to see ac such as the Miles Messenger, Miles Gemini, Speed 6, Arrow Active - and, of course, the wonderful Mew Gull (just reading AH's book yet again!).
And purrleeezze let's have the DH88 airborne again soon.
Re. aerobatics - in a period aeroplane such as the Jungmann, Tiger Moth, Arrow Active, yes indeed. As good as DD's Extra displays are, I personally don't find it in keeping with the atmosphere of the Collection.
And let's have Airbedane back to flight status again soon!
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Thanks for the kind words, Beags, but if you carry on like that, you'll have me feeling guilty at wanting to close BZN............
BeauMan - if you look carefully, you'll find answers to all your questions within the thread - particularly the one about Duxford clashes. (But, to save you spending another hour on it: we changed our show dates a decade or so ago to deconflict with Duxford, but they changed theirs accordingly a year or so afterwards. With enough support, we can easily change the Spitfire wing tips, and I suppose it is about time she went clipped again).
Lysander and other scenarios - I agree and we'll do what we can.
Comet - we're planning for the next flight early in 2005, which is only 18 months away.
A
BeauMan - if you look carefully, you'll find answers to all your questions within the thread - particularly the one about Duxford clashes. (But, to save you spending another hour on it: we changed our show dates a decade or so ago to deconflict with Duxford, but they changed theirs accordingly a year or so afterwards. With enough support, we can easily change the Spitfire wing tips, and I suppose it is about time she went clipped again).
Lysander and other scenarios - I agree and we'll do what we can.
Comet - we're planning for the next flight early in 2005, which is only 18 months away.
A
I'm with the clipped wing team. It does return the VC to the way nature intended her to be.
I enjoyed the Lysander show as well. I've yet to make an Edwardian show but will be making every effort next season.
Airbedane there was a mention earlier in the thread that there could be room for a few aeroplanes at OW. Any space for a nice cream & green Auster which is currently residing at the former Bowker International Airport near Luton?
I enjoyed the Lysander show as well. I've yet to make an Edwardian show but will be making every effort next season.
Airbedane there was a mention earlier in the thread that there could be room for a few aeroplanes at OW. Any space for a nice cream & green Auster which is currently residing at the former Bowker International Airport near Luton?
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Airbedane,
I have only just joined this forum, but am no stranger to such goings on and am known to quite few names that I see here. I think I have deduced who you are and I wish you well and hope to see you airborne again soon.
I think that this has been a pretty constructive thread, although I don't agree with all of the suggestions from my fellow enthusiasts.
I have also read some of the critisism on other threads,and have defended OW to a degree.
Through family committments etc I was only able to get to OW once this year and that was for the last Sunday show, I (other than the LVG dissapointment) thoroughtly enjoyed the day and immediately rejoined the SVAS. My intention is to get to as many events as possible next year.
As for specifics, I personally don't think OW is the place for jets, its a special arena filled with beautiful and unique aircraft ,lets keep it that way, for the time being anyway.
Denny, well he is exceptionally skilled and exciting to watch, but perhaps not at every OW event.
Visiting and different aircraft, some nice ideas here, but again OW has a good selection of very interesting 'home grown' stuff, do we need much more. Maybe the BBMF and RNHF and some Ferte Alais stuff occasionally.
I have to say I have never really had any need to complain about catering or toilet facilities, they are not perfect sure, but they are a world better than a lot offer.
Whatever happens just keep doing what you do, I for one will continue to support SVAS and OW.
Phil
I have only just joined this forum, but am no stranger to such goings on and am known to quite few names that I see here. I think I have deduced who you are and I wish you well and hope to see you airborne again soon.
I think that this has been a pretty constructive thread, although I don't agree with all of the suggestions from my fellow enthusiasts.
I have also read some of the critisism on other threads,and have defended OW to a degree.
Through family committments etc I was only able to get to OW once this year and that was for the last Sunday show, I (other than the LVG dissapointment) thoroughtly enjoyed the day and immediately rejoined the SVAS. My intention is to get to as many events as possible next year.
As for specifics, I personally don't think OW is the place for jets, its a special arena filled with beautiful and unique aircraft ,lets keep it that way, for the time being anyway.
Denny, well he is exceptionally skilled and exciting to watch, but perhaps not at every OW event.
Visiting and different aircraft, some nice ideas here, but again OW has a good selection of very interesting 'home grown' stuff, do we need much more. Maybe the BBMF and RNHF and some Ferte Alais stuff occasionally.
I have to say I have never really had any need to complain about catering or toilet facilities, they are not perfect sure, but they are a world better than a lot offer.
Whatever happens just keep doing what you do, I for one will continue to support SVAS and OW.
Phil
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MOTF - the dates are available - maybe on the Colection's web-site - but if not I'll send 'em to you.
Moderator - am I allowed to post 'em on this thread?
Philo - thanks for the good wishes and I hope to be back up and running by next season. Regarding the content, as I've said before, we can't plese all the people all of the time, but we can try.... Come and say hello when you get to see us next year and you can give me your thoughts face-to-face,
A
Moderator - am I allowed to post 'em on this thread?
Philo - thanks for the good wishes and I hope to be back up and running by next season. Regarding the content, as I've said before, we can't plese all the people all of the time, but we can try.... Come and say hello when you get to see us next year and you can give me your thoughts face-to-face,
A
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Airbedane
Thanks for the offer re the dates, I have giot some details via our friendly ATCO however I wouldnt have any objection to them being posted here. Its all in a good cause after all.
Thanks for the offer re the dates, I have giot some details via our friendly ATCO however I wouldnt have any objection to them being posted here. Its all in a good cause after all.
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I have only just come onto this thread, but would like to say as a regular visitor to Old Warden for the past 10 years I have always enjoyed the displays. What makes a good airshow is the variety and I suggest you (Old Warden) just keep up the good work. I do like the really old and slow with fast and furious thrown in between a very good balance. All the US airshows have this mix it means you are catering for a bigger crowd and if there is a particular item you are not interested in why not use the time to get a coffee, sandwich or visit the loo.
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Airbedane
An idea for producing funds for Shuttleworth: So many visitors enjoy the Edwardians and the film 'Those Magnificent Men'. Unfortunately the film doesn't seem to be available on DVD. Could Shuttleworth arrange, being the guardian of the only airworthy aeroplanes from the film, to have a DVD produced for sale at OW? If you could arrange to add some film shot from onboard the OW aeroplanes it would be a special DVD that I think lots of regulars and PPruners would enjoy. Add some good photos from DB and MOTF that all PPruners seem to like, some behind the scenes film of preparing the OW aeroplanes for a display day, the maintenance involved in keeping them airworthy etc.
Perhaps others may wish to say if they would be interested in such a DVD to give you a feel of whether its a goer or not.
An idea for producing funds for Shuttleworth: So many visitors enjoy the Edwardians and the film 'Those Magnificent Men'. Unfortunately the film doesn't seem to be available on DVD. Could Shuttleworth arrange, being the guardian of the only airworthy aeroplanes from the film, to have a DVD produced for sale at OW? If you could arrange to add some film shot from onboard the OW aeroplanes it would be a special DVD that I think lots of regulars and PPruners would enjoy. Add some good photos from DB and MOTF that all PPruners seem to like, some behind the scenes film of preparing the OW aeroplanes for a display day, the maintenance involved in keeping them airworthy etc.
Perhaps others may wish to say if they would be interested in such a DVD to give you a feel of whether its a goer or not.
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Interesting idea TD&H.
My feeling is a DVD of the Mag Men film wouldn't get great sales - the video is / was avaliable and most fans would have it.
BUT if produced as a limited edn WITH Shuttleworth content, as a fund raser for OW; then it might just work. Shiuttleworth might be able to get the rights for that limited version, while no company would be likely to release the full region 1 / 2 version on the open market (though I might be wrong.) And yes, I'd buy one!
Cheers
James K
My feeling is a DVD of the Mag Men film wouldn't get great sales - the video is / was avaliable and most fans would have it.
BUT if produced as a limited edn WITH Shuttleworth content, as a fund raser for OW; then it might just work. Shiuttleworth might be able to get the rights for that limited version, while no company would be likely to release the full region 1 / 2 version on the open market (though I might be wrong.) And yes, I'd buy one!
Cheers
James K
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Airbedane
In my loft I have two seats from an Anson, that my father rescued
before the aircraft was broken up. Would they be of any use to you (museum)?
Please send me a PM.
FEBA
In my loft I have two seats from an Anson, that my father rescued
before the aircraft was broken up. Would they be of any use to you (museum)?Please send me a PM.
FEBA