Shuttleworth Displays - Feedback Required, Please
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The beauty of OW is the timeless nature of the place, so, any changes really should be subtle.The only OW display I got to this year was September's Pageant (thank you the Met Office for such a hopelessly inaccurate forecast, hope it didn't affect numbers). Overall, it was an excellent display. I only have two comments. Firstly, I found the initial part of the Gladiator's display (fully aerobatic) to be unimpressive - too high, and, frankly, I don't enjoy the Collection's aircraft being flown in such a manner. Secondly, I did not enjoy Frank Chapman's barnstorming display in the Chipmunk. It was one of the few occasions in almost 40 years of airshows that I thought I was about to witness an accident - in my view it consisted of spontaneous, aggressive manoeuvres, too close to the ground - had me looking away expecting the worst on a couple of occasions.
These are quibbles really, as OW still has a magic atmosphere that no UK venue can match. It would be nice if some of the aircraft that weren't flying on the day could be rolled out into the sunshine for photography (eg probably unreasonable to expect the Fury replica to fly, but it would have been fab to have it out on the grass parked between the Gladiator and the Hind).
My main complaint at Shuttleworth has been the sales policy. I regard the disposal of Jean Batten's Gull as a heritage crime. The Mew Gull is arguably the most significant surviving British light aircraft and I sincerely hope that one day the Collection may acquire it.
These are quibbles really, as OW still has a magic atmosphere that no UK venue can match. It would be nice if some of the aircraft that weren't flying on the day could be rolled out into the sunshine for photography (eg probably unreasonable to expect the Fury replica to fly, but it would have been fab to have it out on the grass parked between the Gladiator and the Hind).
My main complaint at Shuttleworth has been the sales policy. I regard the disposal of Jean Batten's Gull as a heritage crime. The Mew Gull is arguably the most significant surviving British light aircraft and I sincerely hope that one day the Collection may acquire it.
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I would echo the sentiments already expressed; an excellent season of flying and generally things are good with perhaps only minor points in need of addressing.
As others have observed, OW is a well kept secret if road signs are relied upon. Good signs would surely boost visitor numbers.
The pre-show commentary, when it happens, is useful and informative, particularly to first time visitors. However, it does not always happen. Why? I would also recommend that it contains a warning about prop wash. I have witnessed a couple of incidents this season where this has caused problems to unprepared visitors.
Aircraft? Well, from a purely personal viewpoint, have the Blenheim back when it flies again. It is/was beautiful and very impressive. I also much enjoyed the Nimrod that displayed during a 2002 show. Another fine example of a Hawker sea-going derivative of a land based fighter, to complement OW’s Sea Hurricane. To continue the Hawker theme, the Harrier always seems to be popular with the crowd and was sadly missing this year; unless one appeared in August when I was on holiday?
And finally, what about a replacement for the LVG? It would probably need to be a reproduction, but as the NAW contributions to OW demonstrate, these can be as good as an original. A Hanover, as per the old Airfix kit, would be just fine thank you, but a totally unrealistic dream I suspect!
As others have observed, OW is a well kept secret if road signs are relied upon. Good signs would surely boost visitor numbers.
The pre-show commentary, when it happens, is useful and informative, particularly to first time visitors. However, it does not always happen. Why? I would also recommend that it contains a warning about prop wash. I have witnessed a couple of incidents this season where this has caused problems to unprepared visitors.
Aircraft? Well, from a purely personal viewpoint, have the Blenheim back when it flies again. It is/was beautiful and very impressive. I also much enjoyed the Nimrod that displayed during a 2002 show. Another fine example of a Hawker sea-going derivative of a land based fighter, to complement OW’s Sea Hurricane. To continue the Hawker theme, the Harrier always seems to be popular with the crowd and was sadly missing this year; unless one appeared in August when I was on holiday?
And finally, what about a replacement for the LVG? It would probably need to be a reproduction, but as the NAW contributions to OW demonstrate, these can be as good as an original. A Hanover, as per the old Airfix kit, would be just fine thank you, but a totally unrealistic dream I suspect!
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MOTF - sorry if my comment on concessions appeared a bit rude, you have a good point and I'll pass it on.
Again, thanks to all who have replied, here’s a few answers for day 2:
Gladiator – the Scandinavians sponsored a recover and repaint of the Glad for a film back in the mid 90’s. We always had, and we still have, the intention of repainting it in RAF colours. The problem is engineering time. This winter should see the recovered Tutor back on the line, followed by the Tomtit. Next year we have to re-cover the Pup. In the meantime, the PO2 has to be brought onto the British register, and we have to get the Desoutter, Comper and ANEC on to permits to fly. Add to that the problem of annual permits and winter servicing nearly forty aircraft and you’ll see that the Glad will have to wait a few more years yet to go into Brit colours – on the other hand, you could always sponsor a change in scheme, if you feel that strongly about it……
Spitfire – she came out of the factory with rounded tips, so the present config is authentic. However, I don’t have a problem with changing back to clipped wings, what’s the consensus? Anyone care to start a poll?
BBMF round the Tower – why not ask ‘em.
Other aircraft – I take the point on the Avenger and Scout, and the foreign historics, but as said before, we do have a limited budget. Prices are set to go up again next year, but they’ll still be a lot cheaper than Duxford. Would you be prepared to pay double this years entrance fee, say, for the promise of a more varied show?
Barnstorming – an interesting comment Peter, but the barnstorming has proved to be a very popular addition to our shows. I don’t think we’ve ‘sold’ it to people such as yourself as well as we could, but barnstorming was a major event of the between the wars years and as a significant proportion of our aircraft are from that era, we decided to give it a try. We’re trying to re-create the atmosphere of 30’s acts, such as the Cobham Flying Circus, that were so popular at the time. The CAA were heavily involved in our work up and a risk assessment provided a satisfactory safety analysis. The art of display flying is to make it ‘spectacular, but safe’ and I believe we’ve achieved that in the way we present the Barnstorming.
Catering – OK you’ve made the point!
Harrier – we book it every year, but it’s down to the RAF Participation Committee as to whether it attends or not. Last year, it crashed at a display two days before it was due to attend OW, this year, we couldn’t get a booking. Keep your fingers crossed for next year.
LVG – the cross-wind was too strong last Sunday; the engine run was all we could do as a substitute. We’ve been really fortunate to have had the pleasure of seeing the LVG in the air; lets be thankful for what we’ve had, not sorry for what we’ve lost! She’s going back to her owners after a long loan, a good home in fact, that will ensure her static preservation for the future.
LVG replacement –I’d love to see a replica German WW1 machine in the Collection, but it must have an authentic engine. We already have a replica Sopwith Triplane and Bristol Monoplane, built by the Northern Aeroplane Workshops, a volunteer group who are currently building a Sopwith Camel, again for the Collection. I have the plans for a Fokker Triplane and a Collection colleague has those for a Fokker DVIII – any volunteers to start a ‘Southern Aeroplane Workshop’ to create the enemy? I’m afraid commissioning a replica is out of the question – the cost would be too prohibitive.
Aircraft policy – the current policy, if we ever need to have one, is ‘the First Hundred Years of Flight’. Recent decisions have been made mainly on financial ground in respect of acquisitions and sales – we have to stay solvent. I believe the trainer theme is a good one. It starts with the Boxkite and currently ends with a private owners aircraft, the Bulldog. I know some of the intermediate trainers are not as ‘sexy’ as some would like, but such so-called boring aircraft from early last century form the heart of the Collection now.
Walrus – what a good idea!
Pilots – the philosophy of the Collection is to show the sight and sound of the aircraft in the air, not the pilots. It’s best they remain, for the most part, anonymous. On the other hand, I do believe a Propswing from early this year did show a rather aged group of grey-haired gentlemen……….
Aibedane
(Moondance & SPT- I wrote this before I saw your post, I'll try to reply to it next time, apologies)
Again, thanks to all who have replied, here’s a few answers for day 2:
Gladiator – the Scandinavians sponsored a recover and repaint of the Glad for a film back in the mid 90’s. We always had, and we still have, the intention of repainting it in RAF colours. The problem is engineering time. This winter should see the recovered Tutor back on the line, followed by the Tomtit. Next year we have to re-cover the Pup. In the meantime, the PO2 has to be brought onto the British register, and we have to get the Desoutter, Comper and ANEC on to permits to fly. Add to that the problem of annual permits and winter servicing nearly forty aircraft and you’ll see that the Glad will have to wait a few more years yet to go into Brit colours – on the other hand, you could always sponsor a change in scheme, if you feel that strongly about it……
Spitfire – she came out of the factory with rounded tips, so the present config is authentic. However, I don’t have a problem with changing back to clipped wings, what’s the consensus? Anyone care to start a poll?
BBMF round the Tower – why not ask ‘em.
Other aircraft – I take the point on the Avenger and Scout, and the foreign historics, but as said before, we do have a limited budget. Prices are set to go up again next year, but they’ll still be a lot cheaper than Duxford. Would you be prepared to pay double this years entrance fee, say, for the promise of a more varied show?
Barnstorming – an interesting comment Peter, but the barnstorming has proved to be a very popular addition to our shows. I don’t think we’ve ‘sold’ it to people such as yourself as well as we could, but barnstorming was a major event of the between the wars years and as a significant proportion of our aircraft are from that era, we decided to give it a try. We’re trying to re-create the atmosphere of 30’s acts, such as the Cobham Flying Circus, that were so popular at the time. The CAA were heavily involved in our work up and a risk assessment provided a satisfactory safety analysis. The art of display flying is to make it ‘spectacular, but safe’ and I believe we’ve achieved that in the way we present the Barnstorming.
Catering – OK you’ve made the point!
Harrier – we book it every year, but it’s down to the RAF Participation Committee as to whether it attends or not. Last year, it crashed at a display two days before it was due to attend OW, this year, we couldn’t get a booking. Keep your fingers crossed for next year.
LVG – the cross-wind was too strong last Sunday; the engine run was all we could do as a substitute. We’ve been really fortunate to have had the pleasure of seeing the LVG in the air; lets be thankful for what we’ve had, not sorry for what we’ve lost! She’s going back to her owners after a long loan, a good home in fact, that will ensure her static preservation for the future.
LVG replacement –I’d love to see a replica German WW1 machine in the Collection, but it must have an authentic engine. We already have a replica Sopwith Triplane and Bristol Monoplane, built by the Northern Aeroplane Workshops, a volunteer group who are currently building a Sopwith Camel, again for the Collection. I have the plans for a Fokker Triplane and a Collection colleague has those for a Fokker DVIII – any volunteers to start a ‘Southern Aeroplane Workshop’ to create the enemy? I’m afraid commissioning a replica is out of the question – the cost would be too prohibitive.
Aircraft policy – the current policy, if we ever need to have one, is ‘the First Hundred Years of Flight’. Recent decisions have been made mainly on financial ground in respect of acquisitions and sales – we have to stay solvent. I believe the trainer theme is a good one. It starts with the Boxkite and currently ends with a private owners aircraft, the Bulldog. I know some of the intermediate trainers are not as ‘sexy’ as some would like, but such so-called boring aircraft from early last century form the heart of the Collection now.
Walrus – what a good idea!
Pilots – the philosophy of the Collection is to show the sight and sound of the aircraft in the air, not the pilots. It’s best they remain, for the most part, anonymous. On the other hand, I do believe a Propswing from early this year did show a rather aged group of grey-haired gentlemen……….
Aibedane
(Moondance & SPT- I wrote this before I saw your post, I'll try to reply to it next time, apologies)
When you know what Alex Henshaw achieved in the Mew, it seems almost criminal that it is no longer with the Collection.
There are lots of Spitfires around - and more than one Hurricane. But only one G-AEXF! I was lucky enough to see her fly - and even though I've encountered a Lysander, the DH88 and even a Fokker DR1 in flight, nothing was as brilliant as the Mew....
There are lots of Spitfires around - and more than one Hurricane. But only one G-AEXF! I was lucky enough to see her fly - and even though I've encountered a Lysander, the DH88 and even a Fokker DR1 in flight, nothing was as brilliant as the Mew....
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One of THE most impressive displays I've seen at OW (about 10 years ago), was the Comet, Mew Gull and Hawk Speed Six in formation, as the opening sequence to the Pageant......Hawk Speed Six, there's another one that really belongs permanently at OW (and thanks for booking it for this year's Pageant)
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Beagle & Moondance,
Sorry if I appear to be a swot, but the Mew Gull was never owned by the Shuttleworth Collection, but operated by one of their pilots...I suppose they could always pay the present owner to bring it back for a couple of displays.
Zlin
Sorry if I appear to be a swot, but the Mew Gull was never owned by the Shuttleworth Collection, but operated by one of their pilots...I suppose they could always pay the present owner to bring it back for a couple of displays.
Zlin
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Fully appreciate that, but I thought that Des Penrose gave Shuttleworth first refusal on the Mew Gull and the Active when he sold them - just a great shame they didn't take up the offer (or more likely couldn't afford them)
Yes - that's why I said 'no longer with the Collection' rather than ' no longer owned by the Collection'......
Lucky chap, the current owner. And the Mew looks just right in the 'Cape' configuration.
Shall settle down now with a glass of malt and read Alex's 'Flight of the Mew Gull' for the umpteenth time......and keep my fingers crossed that perhaps one day she'll once again come racing round the tower at Old Warden!
Lucky chap, the current owner. And the Mew looks just right in the 'Cape' configuration.
Shall settle down now with a glass of malt and read Alex's 'Flight of the Mew Gull' for the umpteenth time......and keep my fingers crossed that perhaps one day she'll once again come racing round the tower at Old Warden!
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Thanks for the prompt reply Airbedane- It is so refreshing to be able to contribute ones thoughts and opinions about air shows and have someone take note!!!!
If a significant hike in price for (say) one show a year means a RAF Gladiator and some tasty,rare visitors, I'm up for that!
spt- Almost forgot about the Nimrods appearance - a worthy OW visitor if ever there was one!! Book again next year please. It gets kinda lost at Duxford.
thanks again for the opportunity to express our feelings- any more airshow organisers out there willing to throw down the gauntlet so to speak ??? (A Gauntlet - yes, if only!!.................)
If a significant hike in price for (say) one show a year means a RAF Gladiator and some tasty,rare visitors, I'm up for that!
spt- Almost forgot about the Nimrods appearance - a worthy OW visitor if ever there was one!! Book again next year please. It gets kinda lost at Duxford.
thanks again for the opportunity to express our feelings- any more airshow organisers out there willing to throw down the gauntlet so to speak ??? (A Gauntlet - yes, if only!!.................)
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SAS,
Duxford on 3 - 5 Nov: I hadn't planned to be there. Why, what's happening?
Dear All,
Again, thanks to all for posting – we appreciate your comment.
Aerobatics – It’s an emotional subject. We try to display the aircraft in the middle of the envelope, showing the sight and sound in the air. However, to do this effectively, some aircraft need to be turned upside down – I remember as a kid being disappointed with any Spitfire display that didn’t victory roll at the end. The Glad is another that benefits from some lazy aeros, but the characteristics of the engine demand a high minimum height. If the height that we display the aircraft detracts that much from what we try to achieve, then we’ll take the aeros off the menu – let me know what you think.
Barnstorming – I’ve put the main view in an above post. We’ve had good feedback and most who have seen it want it to stay. However, we are reviewing the content over the winter, so there may be some changes for next year.
Acquisition and disposal policy – I too was disappointed when I discovered that the Batten Gull had left, and more so when the Mew Gull and Active departed for Breighton. However, acquisitions in recent years have far outweighed disposals – Lysander, Comper Swift, Provost, Chipmunk, Prentice, PO2 – and on the limited budget we have, I don’t think we’ve done too badly.
Photography – it all comes down to manpower and money. On display days we have the manpower to push out ‘x’ aircraft. We’ve increased the number for each display over the past two years. Pushing out a few more for static photography was tried for a few seasons, but the effort involved far outweighed the revenue – after all, we do have to make money to survive, and when the Chief Engineer says: ’NO, NO MORE!’, who am I to argue!
Commentary – At next season’s work-up, I’ll ask the commentators to put in a prop-wash warning and also a pre-show brief.
LVG replacement and airshow content – please see my previous posts.
Speed Six – you can see my comments on Hairyplane’s Mmmmmmmmiles thread – to save you looking, it was a great machine to display at Old Warden and a sad loss when it left. I would like it back as soon as possible.
Cost of repainting the Glad – I’ll ask and let you know, MOTF
If people are really serious that they would be willing to pay more to see more, then let me know.
Keep 'em coming,
Airbedane
Duxford on 3 - 5 Nov: I hadn't planned to be there. Why, what's happening?
Dear All,
Again, thanks to all for posting – we appreciate your comment.
Aerobatics – It’s an emotional subject. We try to display the aircraft in the middle of the envelope, showing the sight and sound in the air. However, to do this effectively, some aircraft need to be turned upside down – I remember as a kid being disappointed with any Spitfire display that didn’t victory roll at the end. The Glad is another that benefits from some lazy aeros, but the characteristics of the engine demand a high minimum height. If the height that we display the aircraft detracts that much from what we try to achieve, then we’ll take the aeros off the menu – let me know what you think.
Barnstorming – I’ve put the main view in an above post. We’ve had good feedback and most who have seen it want it to stay. However, we are reviewing the content over the winter, so there may be some changes for next year.
Acquisition and disposal policy – I too was disappointed when I discovered that the Batten Gull had left, and more so when the Mew Gull and Active departed for Breighton. However, acquisitions in recent years have far outweighed disposals – Lysander, Comper Swift, Provost, Chipmunk, Prentice, PO2 – and on the limited budget we have, I don’t think we’ve done too badly.
Photography – it all comes down to manpower and money. On display days we have the manpower to push out ‘x’ aircraft. We’ve increased the number for each display over the past two years. Pushing out a few more for static photography was tried for a few seasons, but the effort involved far outweighed the revenue – after all, we do have to make money to survive, and when the Chief Engineer says: ’NO, NO MORE!’, who am I to argue!
Commentary – At next season’s work-up, I’ll ask the commentators to put in a prop-wash warning and also a pre-show brief.
LVG replacement and airshow content – please see my previous posts.
Speed Six – you can see my comments on Hairyplane’s Mmmmmmmmiles thread – to save you looking, it was a great machine to display at Old Warden and a sad loss when it left. I would like it back as soon as possible.
Cost of repainting the Glad – I’ll ask and let you know, MOTF
If people are really serious that they would be willing to pay more to see more, then let me know.
Keep 'em coming,
Airbedane
Last edited by Airbedane; 11th Oct 2003 at 21:24.
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There is a course on "safety management of historic aircraft" All the usual crowd will be there OFC, Rod Dean etc. I was just wondering if Shuttleworth were being represented. You guy's do know a bit about it!
I'm going as it forms one module for the M.Sc I'm taking at the moment.
I'm going as it forms one module for the M.Sc I'm taking at the moment.
Last edited by Say again s l o w l y; 13th Oct 2003 at 05:42.
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Airbedane, thanks very much for your comprehensive replies (and thanks very much for asking the question in the first place).
As regards the Gladiator aeros, maybe I'm being a bit over-sensitive after the Firefly tragedy (which I didn't witness) & Hoof Proudfoot's demise (which I did, and will never forget), but I just feel that sort of flying is out of place for Shuttleworth machines. As far as the Chippie barnstorming routine, the ribbon cutting was entertaining enough, but the ribbon pick up really made me feel uneasy, and what is the point? - sitting several rows back in the car park, the actual pick-up is so low as to be invisible.
Routines I have enjoyed in recent years have been the racing senarios (multiples displayed in an interesting & safe form) and the WW1 scenario (with extras in uniform & pyrotechnics - kids loved that one).
Please book the Nimrod again (Sea Hurri, Hind & Nimrod formation......), and how about the pprune/SVAS "Buy the Mew Gull" Fund (that's assuming it is available, which I would doubt)
As regards the Gladiator aeros, maybe I'm being a bit over-sensitive after the Firefly tragedy (which I didn't witness) & Hoof Proudfoot's demise (which I did, and will never forget), but I just feel that sort of flying is out of place for Shuttleworth machines. As far as the Chippie barnstorming routine, the ribbon cutting was entertaining enough, but the ribbon pick up really made me feel uneasy, and what is the point? - sitting several rows back in the car park, the actual pick-up is so low as to be invisible.
Routines I have enjoyed in recent years have been the racing senarios (multiples displayed in an interesting & safe form) and the WW1 scenario (with extras in uniform & pyrotechnics - kids loved that one).
Please book the Nimrod again (Sea Hurri, Hind & Nimrod formation......), and how about the pprune/SVAS "Buy the Mew Gull" Fund (that's assuming it is available, which I would doubt)
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I'm a bit late on this one, but I thought I would stick my twopence worth in!
How about a "Commentator Free Zone"
You could remove some of the tannoys at the far end on the main runway, giving people the option to watch the show without the PA.
Generally the commentators at OW get it just right, keeping quiet as the aircraft pass, but it would be nice to have the option to not hear them.
Also how about flying the Hind at the beginning, in the middle and at the end of every show - I just can't see and hear too much of that beauty.
Apart from that, there is no other airfield around the world ( and I've been to a few!) that I would rather watch an air display at.
How about a "Commentator Free Zone"
You could remove some of the tannoys at the far end on the main runway, giving people the option to watch the show without the PA.
Generally the commentators at OW get it just right, keeping quiet as the aircraft pass, but it would be nice to have the option to not hear them.
Also how about flying the Hind at the beginning, in the middle and at the end of every show - I just can't see and hear too much of that beauty.
Apart from that, there is no other airfield around the world ( and I've been to a few!) that I would rather watch an air display at.
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Don't worry about the late call, Cameraone, the thread will be open for as long as it takes. That goes for anyone else, too, who has a point to make. I don't really care what you say, but whatever it is, I like to hear it....................if we don't know, we can't do anything about it!
Commentator free zone - I agree; personally, I just like to watch and hear, but the commentator is there for a safety reason too and it's important that all present can hear him or her. I asked the commentators this year to not talk as aircraft are flying past - maybe we need to have longer periods of silence on one or two acts. On the other hand, we do get a lot of visitors who need the comentary to understand what's going on - we'll have a think over the winter PLease comment again next year if you have anything to say.
Moondance - I do take the point about the ribbon pick up and we will be reviewing the Barnstorming over the winter. Thanks also for the comments on the scenarios - WW1 and racing, I'm not sure why, but we missed the later out this year.
No more time at the moment, be back later......
Please keep 'em coming in.
A
Commentator free zone - I agree; personally, I just like to watch and hear, but the commentator is there for a safety reason too and it's important that all present can hear him or her. I asked the commentators this year to not talk as aircraft are flying past - maybe we need to have longer periods of silence on one or two acts. On the other hand, we do get a lot of visitors who need the comentary to understand what's going on - we'll have a think over the winter PLease comment again next year if you have anything to say.
Moondance - I do take the point about the ribbon pick up and we will be reviewing the Barnstorming over the winter. Thanks also for the comments on the scenarios - WW1 and racing, I'm not sure why, but we missed the later out this year.
No more time at the moment, be back later......
Please keep 'em coming in.
A
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Perhaps this is rather a naive question but have you ever checked who actually goes to the Old Warden events. We know the enthusiasts will go to all the shows but what proportion are they? The reason I ask is that having watched airshows since the 50's I find as a Hertfordshire resident that there are too many shows to be able to afford them all i.e. 4 at Duxford, all the Old Warden events, Little Gransden, Woburn and Coventry all being within reach. I therefore select the ones with the "wow" factor and this year that has been Coventry and Duxford for the 747 and the geese! Perhaps some market research might be in order to see who the Old Warden public are and what they want.
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Commentators are always controversial, but over the years, I've always felt the OW commentators to be far superior to the Duxford 'Love the sound of my own voice, laugh a lot at my own jokes' approach. Particulary approved of the bloke at the Pageant this year who had the taste to say a magnificent nothing during the Spitfire display - well done that man.
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Freeloaders etc.
Hi everybody, Hi Airbedane - just back from a weeks sailing in Turkey (MMMmmm!!)
What an excellent idea of yours Ab to 'ask the punters' via PPrune - a very useful thread so far that will undoubtedly result in improvements.
OW has a huge potential - so few people I speak to have ever heard of the place or indeed have any idea what they are missing.
Freeloaders - Isn't it galling for a Charitable Trust to be ripped off in such a way? I regularly cycle down to 'chat' with them.
The majority line the public footpath and are unaware of the fact that they are trespassing simply by stopping to watch. A footpath is just that. It is provided for A-B access. Stop and you are a trespasser.
We plan to install signs to this effect next season.
Others congregate at the road/ footpath in the vicinity of the 21 threshold. Not the most sensible place to be. Warning signs are simply ripped down. It is a fairly busy road at weekends. Damage to the fence by cars is indicative of the road dangers yet people would rather risk their lives (and those of their families) to save a few bob.
There is a further plan to install a taller fence from the road to the windsock.
We then get to the 'I know my rights' hard core freeloaders who line the road.
These are downright sad, scummy people who are rude, abusive and threatening. I cannot print what has been said to me in the past. However, as an ex-cop, I have been insulted by experts in the past so it doesn't phase me.
THere is of course nothing to stop people standing on the verge of the highway. In the case of the adjoining fields (owned by the Trust but leased I believe) the deliniation between verge and field is impossible to determine.
Tenant cooperation, supported by proper fences and signs, will leave those freeloaders a much narrower strip alongside the highway. Very unpleasant but free all the same.
We can only reduce the problem. We can never eradicate it.
Any input from lawyers here will be appreciated.
HP
What an excellent idea of yours Ab to 'ask the punters' via PPrune - a very useful thread so far that will undoubtedly result in improvements.
OW has a huge potential - so few people I speak to have ever heard of the place or indeed have any idea what they are missing.
Freeloaders - Isn't it galling for a Charitable Trust to be ripped off in such a way? I regularly cycle down to 'chat' with them.
The majority line the public footpath and are unaware of the fact that they are trespassing simply by stopping to watch. A footpath is just that. It is provided for A-B access. Stop and you are a trespasser.
We plan to install signs to this effect next season.
Others congregate at the road/ footpath in the vicinity of the 21 threshold. Not the most sensible place to be. Warning signs are simply ripped down. It is a fairly busy road at weekends. Damage to the fence by cars is indicative of the road dangers yet people would rather risk their lives (and those of their families) to save a few bob.
There is a further plan to install a taller fence from the road to the windsock.
We then get to the 'I know my rights' hard core freeloaders who line the road.
These are downright sad, scummy people who are rude, abusive and threatening. I cannot print what has been said to me in the past. However, as an ex-cop, I have been insulted by experts in the past so it doesn't phase me.
THere is of course nothing to stop people standing on the verge of the highway. In the case of the adjoining fields (owned by the Trust but leased I believe) the deliniation between verge and field is impossible to determine.
Tenant cooperation, supported by proper fences and signs, will leave those freeloaders a much narrower strip alongside the highway. Very unpleasant but free all the same.
We can only reduce the problem. We can never eradicate it.
Any input from lawyers here will be appreciated.
HP