I have never heard that from any QF pilot.

It’s ok, you’ll get into a proper airline one day Ragnor. Chin up son.

God I hope that's an attempt at humour...

Don’t know anything about aircraft movements between JQ and QF, but have heard from someone who would know that the cost to reconfigure / service the JQ jets vs obtaining new ones configured the way QF want them isn’t much at all.

ROH111:

Quote:

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I have never heard that from any QF pilot.
It’s ok, you’ll get into a proper airline one day Ragnor. Chin up son

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Rumours about the Jetstar B787 going back to QF are all over the QF threads here on PPRuNe, possibly written by other QF pilots.

Son, here are some quotes from some of QF threads.

Quote:

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but those 787s are rumoured to be earmarked for mainline with the NEOs coming and heavy checks due

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Do you need me to find more posts for you from the QF threads ?

Chin up son. You won't be getting the Jetstar B787's or the new A320/21 NEO's either. You might get some new toys with project Sunrise to make you feel like working for a proper airline with a modern fleet.

What if?
 

A hypothetical question:
What if these three airframes are disposed of. What will become of the (presumably) surplus flight crew (one imagines about 8.5 crew per airframe)?
What provisions, if any, are in the employment contract for type reversion/down-training/ re-allocation of flight crew?
Just asking.

With LRs coming there will be a net increase in airframes (around 6-7 I think has been quoted?). So one would presume Boeing crew would be slowly filtered to the Bus

I would hazard a guess and say the three aircraft going will be CNS and OOL based.

There is nothing in any agreement (same with Virgin LH) about company forced aircraft downgrades. There is some interesting wording around bonds and conversions.

Many FO's are long eligible for narrow body commands. I know some are irked that Cadets, even 787 SO's who joined in what 11/12 will get a narrow body command over FOs who have been wide body since day dot and still a FO chasing that upgrade. They will now be sent back to the Airbus and that skipper next to them will be that 787 SO they use to fly with. Well that was the debate we had the other day.

Will they get sent back to the Airbus? They're able to apply for advertised vacancies by FSO but if there aren't any, they may literally be made redundant. Hopefully not of course, but it's a possibility.

My understanding was that it was due to the HNL routes being dropped, so the aircraft would come from Mel/Syd.

The last paragraph of your post doesn’t make much sense to me. There aren’t any former 787 SOs who are captains. We’ve only had SOs since 2016ish

SOs from the 787 who have now moved to the Airbus FO are not far off upgrading. By the time the whole 787 fleet goes many will have a narrow body command.

Oh, I see what you’re getting at now!

Well if the wide Body FOs don’t like that then they should take NB commands. Bit like getting on a life raft off the Titanic, better to get off the sinking ship sooner rather than later.

Missed the window of opportunity because some were too greedy.

not far off...... that would be years off and many don’t have an ATPL anyway

Also the 4000 hr requirement for command and 2000hr as a JQ FO

My reading of the EBA is that the company can do what ever they want according the the effected ranks and bases I.e if the aircraft comes out of MEL then they could force the appropriate amount of CAPT, FO and SO’s back to the Bus where ever there are vacancies (could be a different base) or give the choice of redundancy if that isn’t acceptable to the effected pilots. So you will have 787 pilots in other bases who are more junior but will stay on the 787, obviously they will all end up back on the bus at some stage. It could involve downgrades as well, just depends how management choose to go about it, it could all be done in a respectful and co-operative way or they may ‘make an example and sound song and dance’ about it as per their threats.

More than a possibility, it’s most likely.

I’m not sure if redundancies would be offered whilst you’re still recruiting and they are running courses ATM.

Our labour laws are an utter joke and don’t really provide much protection against the above paragraph, but if that were to happen the payout would be very high to those people. Many years of service, plus the 787 guys haven’t been able to take leave for some time. I’d have to read it again, but there is a clause they have to be re-employed if a position came up within 5 years. Whether that’s a 787 position or just a pilot position I don’t know.

Mr Evans was quoted two days ago that 'he is prepared to ground the airline', and this from Alan at the HY results @ https://www.news.com.au/travel/trave...88572be342f4e3 based in the current TWU strikes.

One thing is for certain, dreams of an EBA matching Tiger are out the window now. Corona virus is the perfect ‘crisis’ for the company to push through a bit of cost cutting.

We’ll be lucky to get 3% at this rate

He said in his speech that 3% is the offer & nothing will change that including any amount of industrial action.
Why are u doubting the spoken facts🙄

Gee, I wonder. Must you comment on things you're clearly ignorant of?

We'd all have loved for the EBA to be done and dusted within a few weeks of the commencement of negotiations, over a year ago. However one party is incentivised to drag out the process for as long as possible.

Can you guess which?

Haha, better sign any EA now hey? You come across as a glass half empty person.

It was always going to take time, and the company bis doing everything it can you see a stage and build a case to pay even more below industry standard.

Settle down and call the union.

Impossible to negotiate with people who are always right & happy to tell you that fact.
These people forget where they came from,have no idea of what the real world consists of & when the bubble bursts cry poor.
They love to tell you how good they are & expect to be believed,unfortunately besides themselves there are some that listen.

Telfer86 - give yourself an uppercut. You clearly need it!

Humble pie Paddleboat and Sunfish?

3% is now looking very generous.

​​​​​​
Haha! What an incredibly naive statement.

Camel, it will be lucky if the airline survives. Both sides will need to compromise. Your comment is utterly irrelevant in view of Coronavirus.

All that money wasted through the pointless PIA could have gone toward keeping a few more people in jobs...........

Is this twit for real? Are you accusing the pilots of causing coronavirus now?

I know they hate pilots in head office, but this clown takes the cake.

Post two above you are talking about the "stand down" clause in all of the pilot agreements , contracts , arrangements etc

They don't even need to talk about redundancy at this point in time (& all the potential cost & complication there ie: fleet or DOJ etc) , just activate the stand down for however long they see fit

Stand downs will have to occur with the Qantas Group if the reports of an 80% reduction in flying are true. This will also affect most of JQ's international operation.

I would imagine this would mean leave with pay until all accrued leave is exhausted, then leave without pay until a return to a more normal flying schedule. This could be a nightmare with simulator and aircraft currency issues as operations are ramped up again. I would not envisage any upside action for at least 2 - 3 months (China seems to be emerging on the other side of COVID19 and that is almost 3 months from the first reports).

Not a happy time.

We be f#$ked, is my assessment. There will not be a return to any sort of normality within 6 months and then it will take months if not years for the airline industry to recover back to its former size. An economist on the radio this morning said the airline and tourism industry was like an oven, once it cools you can’t just have instant heat back, even if the demand is there it takes time to be able to cook again.

"There will not be a return to any sort of normality within 6 months and then it will take months if not years for the airline industry to recover back to its former size."

This black swan is the event that will see a drastic decrease in the debt bubble lifestyle we have been used to.

The industry will return at some point, but it will be a fraction of its former self for a very long time.

Well Well Well.. AFAP. Surely you jest.

Would have saved everyone time if they just sent an email saying "vote no".

Surely that's a joke yes?
Am I missing something.. no lower EFA threshold?
Qantas duty travel in business confirmed?
rostering practices and open time system?
Plus many many other thing's that show crew are actually respected for their role within the group.
Those pay amount should be for some one doing 60 hours not 75.
That proposal must be one of the most embarrassing and underwhelming agreements I've ever seen. Who cares about back pay in 2021 when half the crew hardly worked anyway.

It’s a petty ordinary offer over all and AFAP are endorsing it before nutting out the company demands of increased flexibility. QF club, what is up with that also surely no one would care about that.

Its a BIG NO from the majority already.

This deal is simply rubbish and shouldn't even be put to the already weary and very angry pilot group.

Start again AFAP. you should be ashamed of yourselves.

This is going to be ULTRA messy.

MCD

I will retire before this gets over the line at this rate. Morons.