Come on you blokes, surely you are being unreasonable, the top blokes are going to give away their bonuses and live on their flat pay. How could you overpaid engineers and pilots live on.....what.. a measley $2mill a year, you people are just plain unreasonable.:=

And how many more engineers did you say Virgin has employed, and where was it again that you said Virgin heavy maint was done.:confused:

Has anyone wondered about the timing? The lead up to Xmas ... It's all designed for maximum pressure. Surely everyone is sick of being manipulated.

I was thinking the same thing Insername, about a week before Christmas announce the closure of Inernational. How would that go for ramping up the pressure?

Indeed, regarding his paycut, which is obviously coming towards all of us like a steamtrain. Where on this planet would this man be able to earn $500K? let alone $2 million plus. Due to his personal life choices he won’t work in the Middle East or Asia so where is left for him.

He knows this and that’s why he is clinging on for his dear life.

The whole management of the company seems haphazard & confusing.

In mid September the troops were being told the International Turnaround strategy was on track to return international profitability by 2016. Furthermore they were looking at five new international destinations.

Domestic was also trucking along nicely.

So what's happened in the last ten weeks?

Over the last few years employees have been told to watch every dollar. And think of spending money as if its their own.

But in 2009, the board decides to hold a two day board meeting in New York.

Not only has the management been poor, but leadership non existent.

^^^^^^^^^^

The sooner the Qantas sycophants realise that this has got NOTHING to do with Virgin and everything to do with QF management, the better off we will all be.. The Orange Fungus has screwed you Qantas folk.. Pure and simple..

Between Jetstar decimating yields and QF management throwing aeroplanes into the market at twice VA levels you mob have stood no chance..

QF employees and shareholders should be demanding the resignation of the QF board...:ugh:

Alan's not happy......
 

When the Company has had most of the fat cut out of it, and the strategy is still not working, it is time for a leadership change. Good try Alan, but it is time to move on and give someone else a go before it is too late.

Aviation Expert
 

The 'Aviation Expert' will tell you who's fault it is :*

ABC iview

1:00 in to the video.

:=

According to the nightly news, last year three million dollars of Qantas money went to this snivelling, weak excuse of a CEO. Lord knows how many more millions went to other members of the executive 'team', the team that according to Joyce has made nothing but awesome decisions. :ugh::ugh:

Sure, Qantas has a problem. You can watch the company's problem on telly right now in full HD. :mad: Virgin (and Emirates) must be laughing their collective arsses off.

As SLF I'm reconsidering my forward bookings with QF due to the unpredictability of the CEO and board.
If I was a QF employee I'd be making sure that all of my superannuation payments by the company are as up to date as possible and be working towards carrying as small an outstanding leave component as possible, lest the CEO and board have hidden the unthinkable or pull another unpredictable stunt.

Heard from someone senior in flight ops that the undelivered JQ HKG A320s are costing $20,000 a day. Some back of the envelope maths would make this figure seem reasonable.

If this is accurate, four aircraft, $520,000 per week.

Anyone care to guess which part of the group is wearing this cost?

not sure about the undelivered ones, but there are 3 that have been against the fence originally for hk.

lawyers at 10 paces for the aoc until mid '14

and in japan, apparently 6 of the 10 up there are parked up too.

About once a month I check this particular thread.
And time and time again - all I read is whinging.
Whining and complaining about how no-one's given us a fair deal.
About Emirates being bastards.
Alan being overpaid.
Olivia being a witch.
Things not being the way they used to be.
You know what?
You guys are an utter, bleating disgrace.
You have no-one to blame but yourselves for your national carrier being driven into the ground.
You're not entitled to anything.
You don't need a thousand jobs gone - you actually need three times that gone - a huge helping of humble pie and a wake up.
The world has left you behind.
Get a life - and accept commercial reality.

How much are the idle Jetstar Japan airframes costing ?

On top of the $60million that was just pumped into that operation, on top of its reported $100million loss for last year.

The numbers are AMAZING

Tartare... are you aware this thread hasn't even been going for a month yet? But hey, don't let the facts get in the way of a story...

Comment from Strambi..

They followed comments in March by the boss of Qantas' domestic business, Lyell Strambi who warned he would add two planes for each one added by Virgin. ''We've made it very clear we'll be sensible in terms of capacity. But if a competitor puts one [plane] in, we'll put two in as a group. We're very clear, we're not making any apologies for it. That's the game and people need to understand the game.''

Read more: Qantas saga to get more bloody and brutal

Well Strambi... This is the game now champ.. You've been outfoxed by VA every step of the the way..you've been outfoxed by Borghetti who has 37 years of airline experience and knows the game better than your mob..The arrogance and the contempt you have had for Australian travellers after the Ansett collapse and the arrogance you've displayed towards Borghetti has bitten you right on bitten you right on the arse..:yuk::mad:

So how long will QF INT last ?
 

sounds like QF INT is stuffed big time.


So how long does everyone think it will stay alive ?


Will JQ take over many of QF routes, eg. JQ using 787's operating BNE-SYD-MEL/LAX.

would KimJong Al accept a government bailout if it contained the condition of being supervised by external specialist forensic accountants with results to be made public (it is tax payer money) to ensure that not 1cent ends up in the orange accounts.

once and for ever would their shady accounting be brought to light and we can see if the great jetart can stand alone.

...and a requirement to divulge the beneficiaries of the aircraft leases set up in Delaware and Ireland...

This war is about Joyce and Borghetti ,and Qf employees pay the price,virgin has sack no one yet.:D:D:D.

And Joyce says the challenges Qantas now face are immense. Have they only become immense in the last 3 weeks? Surely it's the job of a CEO to see things building up, and take action before they become immense. The trouble is, if you are constantly looking at Japan, Hong Kong, Singapore and some imaginary airline called Red Q, ISO of watching the main game, things can get quickly out of hand it seems.

ASX price sensitive release : "As we take these urgent actions, we will continue to take the fight to the competition and strengthen our leading position in the domestic market, and we will continue the turnaround of Qantas International.”

QF International is NOT going to disappear.

This is just all part of the very long gameplan to get what they want from the government.

Tartare

The commercial reality is QF have pumped money into entities that aren't returning on their investment.

Nov 11 - $10M JQ Pacific then;

Feb 12 - $7.5M JQ Pacific

$150M into JQ Asian Franchises followed by $60M initial investment into JQ Japan then a further $60M announced in Oct 13.

May 13 - $66M over 3 years into JQ HKG.

Aug 13 - $100M into 787 fleet support.

At least we can breathe easy Red Q never launched. AJ proposed pumping $500M into it in 2011.

All the above spending 3 minutes browsing over a google search.

ramius315 is on the money. I reckon that they've had the idea of these job cuts for quite a while and were waiting for the right time to announce them. Sure, things are tough but this announcement, today, is about keeping the pressure on the government and creating the narrative.

Heck, remember a couple of years back and the interview with Olivia Wirth? She talked about this exact thing. She talked about the importance of the 'story that they are selling' or similar words. She talked about how poorly Dixon did with the engineers in 2008 and she war gamed how they could do it better in 2011. I think the interview was in the weekend Australian or similar?

Anyway, things aren't great but this is about more than today and tomorrow and next month. This is about next year and the year after and getting better depreciation on aeroplanes and all those other things that will make AJ look like a genius in a few years time.

You can blame the unions for most of this mess .....

You are damn right - the union of Dixon, Joyce and Clifford.

Victor 2……………..NO there are ACCOUNTABLE MANAGERS………………. Say the unions are part of a bigger problem yes, but at the end of the day its the CEO. Just like the Captain of the aircraft.

Please tell me you're not that simply.

I think we should spare a thought for all Qantas employees fronting up for work over the next few days/weeks. They are the proud workers who have to "keep on keeping on" while all this media hype and devastation is going on. I don't care who you work for, but when you have a twit as a CEO it must take all of your courage to smile in front of customers.

The big question is who would you trust to run the airline? The best candidates have left.

Wrong way, I can remember someone writing exactly the same thing a couple of years ago, just before the airline was shut down.

I wonder where we are heading this time.

So what this fool and his board are saying is, you can not run an airline in Australia unless it is owned by overseas investors? Bull**** I say!


If he spent more time running Qantas and less time gifting the business to the opposition, we would not be in this self (Joyce) inflicted situation!


Off with his head!!


I think we should all be contacting Nick Xenophon and lending our support to his statements today.

Boys, don't engage with Victor Two, he is the president of the 'Steve Purvinas Hate Club' and is just a disgruntled non union affiliated union hater.

Anyway there is one thing I wonder about. What is going through Borghetti's mind about now? I can picture him relaxing on his Italian sofa, a glass of red, giggling endlessly as he watches AJ and his lieutenants becoming part of history as they become known as the men who killed Qantas.
I know, little comfort to QF's workforce, but let's face it, what AJ is doing to all of QF's staff he did to JB also. But let's never forget who laid the foundation for what is happening today, one G. Dixon, around 10 years ago in fact, around 2003. That was the beginning of the end.

Fella's gidday, I have come out of retirement temporarily from being the old Teresa Green, as I am somewhat annoyed at the problems of QF and the incompetent management and board. I will not stay long. Three names worry me. Dixon, Singleton and Carnagie. They are hanging around like a dead dingo, and the smell does not go away. Dixon started the rot, in my eyes anyway, and I would not be surprised to see him at the carcase for a final chew. Along with his mates. Your thoughts?

Interesting to read the last 5 pages to catch up with the news of the day. My twee t yesterday sums up my feelings -


John Borghetti versus Alan Joyce - the story of a perfectionist with a deep love for Qantas - and an idiot from Ireland.

Qantas was also "forced to ground the airline". How much did that cost?

The "right to manage the business in any way that the board sees fit" has been bastardised by this lot.

...That AJ is a genius.

If you can't muscle a competitor out of the industry, then get government to do it for you with tax payers money.

If QANTAS can gain government backing after the conclusion of their xenophobic media campaign against the evil, "foreign," bully, Virgin Australia, then there won't be any competition.

Then again Geoffrey Thomas is in the media saying that it's all the QANTAS pilot's fault; He must be right, after all he is the "aviation expert". :ugh:

And who is one particular board member that I am appalled with? Cosgrove.
Oh yes, the 'great Australian', head of the armed services, decorated for his love of his country and fellow man! Yeah right. Where did all those morals go, he has backed AJ with grounding the airline, inconveniencing thousands, he has backed decisions to put Australians out of work and on to the street in some cases when mass sackings have occurred, all the while he has sat back, done nothing but wallow in an excessive salary and bonus structure, oh yes what a great Australian....