1000 staff redundancies…

What is the Pilot surplus up to?? :uhoh::uhoh::uhoh::uhoh::sad::sad::sad::sad:

I am a little surprised this thread is still active, I mean it's another Q thread & they often get often removed quick smart!
Anyway AJ has a plan & I'll bet my left leg this debacle is something that Joyce will use to his benefit, employees don't come into the equation, they are 'tools' in his toolbox that are to be used for his benefit & the few hangeroners there.

Interesting times ahead indeed, the ugly business of Aviation is about as low as it can go these days.
The original idea of transporting people around the globe has gone, it's now simply a trough for the little pigs to feed from for as long as they can!!

I hope the good folk at Q has their affairs in order best they can.


Wmk2

QF is in a spin. Another $2bn of cuts. That will mean poorer service which will see customers go to VA and elsewhere which will mean less revenue and yield which will lead to more cost utting and even poorer service (if that's possible) and more pax loss to VA etc.

Can't afford new planes, can't afford maintenance so need newer planes, its hard to see any kind of happy ending here.

The Rat is finished, VA will become the new national carrier.

"Qantas has an amazing management team"………I cannot believe those words actually came out of his mouth. hahahaha…my stomach hurts from laughing. This has to be some sad sick joke. Please tell me why he is still there?

Alan Joyce has manufactured the current crisis.

In Alan's world the JQ multi boarder franchise has been an AMAZING business & an outstanding success. In Alan's eyes the Australian Jetstar operation has been financially propping up the ailing Qantas International business.

The consensus amongst those on Pprune tends to be the Jetstar business has caused the current financial predicament for the Qantas group. The Jetstar expansion has drained capital expenditure that would otherwise have gone to the Qantas mainline operation. Jetstar has utilised Qantas mainline assets & personnel. Whether it be A330 aircraft, Qantas legal, an executive team or the ports offices in Domestic bases. Not to mention Bali JQ staff reported to be on the Qantas payroll. The list of cost allocation has been well discussed and queried to QF management with nil response.

As JQ expanded its operations and was gifted routes, Qantas Mainline A330 aircraft were transferred to Jetstar. Meanwhile JQ continued to recruit new pilots, where mainline pilots lay idle or on forced leave for the last ten years.

What has happened is Jetstar has reached a critical mass, and in my opinion the Jetstar group operations have failed provide adequate returns. Or the returns that Alan forecasted.

Alan would never admit failure with the Jetstar experiment. It's been his baby for the last 10 years.

So now we have a situation where Jetstar may be sold off to save the Qantas group.

Jetstar may get sold. In fact, it wouldn't surprise me if a deal has already been done. Hence the manufacturing of this crisis where the sale of Jetstar will save the Qantas group from imploding.

I did mention some time ago, Joyce was made an offer on the Jetstar Asian businesses. But at the time, the offer wasn't high enough to get the sale across the line.

Perhaps Alan's dropped the asking price?

MC.

Yet again we're going to end up with NUMEROUS pages of posts declaring what should be done. PPRUNE is a great resource for info, but it's not going to change your lot in life, it'll just make you bitter. Get out there & do something about the problem.

For goodness sake how transparent is this "shock horror" news!

QF lobby the Government for release from maximum foreign ownership threshold and Abbott is quoted as being cool on the idea. So the little PR people go onto Plan B and release shocking news to try to create urgency in their demands.

As Peter Costello said, at the time AN collapsed, QF was adamant they should receive no government bailout, yet here QF themselves are now, a fully privatized company, trying exactly the same approach?

And if all of the savage cutbacks the genius top management imposed on Qantas were the only way to save the business and yet now after all of these cuts it can't even make a profit in the first (allegedly most profitable) business quarter, what the hell have they done? It would be the first ever such loss since privatization. How can this ineptitude continue to go rewarded?

And if JQ is as profitable as they claim, why the hell would you sell it?

Senator Xeno just called for the resignation of CEO & Board in what was an articulate and well framed statement.

The Senator also raised the issue of the accounting reporting methodology of the Group particularly the revenue masking and the cost xfer from JQ & JQ franchise operations

Worth a listen

If that offer is still on the table, throw in Joyce and Clifford as a bonus for nothing. They are either very very clever or very very inept. Guess history will show which it is.

Al E Vator.

Joyce will never admit the JQ experiment is a massive failure.

It wouldn't surprise me to find JQ sold & miraculously QF returns to profit.

Air tags.

Any link to the speech?

Mstr Caution :

Nick Xenophon calls on Alan Joyce and entire Qantas board to resign - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)

Very good points he makes, along with some fellow Senators. :ok:

The leader of the ACTU (Oliver), on the other hand seems to have no idea! :ugh:

Very good interview by David Speers with Joyce just on sky. Speers directly asked several times how much management had to share the blame for the current predicament. Joyce just couldn't bring himself to admit ANY management shortcomings. It's all the fault of someone else and he and his management are doing a very good job.:ugh:

I think if they add a few more managers to their structure that will help work towards a solution.

sell what?
Management? Knowledge? the NAME?

Certainly, the international routes from OZ can't be.

Just did a quick search at CASA Aircraft registry, there are 80 aircraft with the operator JETSTAR AIRWAYS PTY LIMITED and the Registration Holders Name that 'belong' to QANTAS show 26 aircraft.

Who's paying for the other 54? let me guess.

Point is, what could they sell?

There 'investments' in the Asian enterprises would be a good start.

I'm with lamen on this one, why have one Chief Pilot when you can have
three !

Amazing, really.

One way ticket to Dublin.

What a whinging, whining, national embarrassment this outfit has become. Destruction of a once proud national icon, now a pathetic, whinging joke :yuk:

Get some perspective !!
 

The new "campus" looks amaaaaazing........

Here we are less than 4 weeks before the end of the year and QF announce they have been losing an average of $10M + per week since 1 July 2013. So
much for continual disclosure and keeping the market informed.

Guess what; the evidence points to the smart money or insiders sold their shares in QF to 'suckers' during the second and third week of October.

So.....

They get handed a full-service, domestic and international operation, debt free and capitalised, which they use to drive their main competition broke.

Twenty years on, they've driven it into the ground.

Poor dears......

I DO feel very sorry for the loyal staff who have watched in horror as the place collapses in slow motion.

...Or two tickets halfway to Dublin? Let him take a friend, too!

Joyce and co. will not go quietly. Lots of spin and blame on others. No responsibility for this situation is being accepted by these tossers and it will be a minor miracle if they go before this company collapses.
There may even be a last ditch appeal to the government to jump in before that happens.

Let's hope that the key stakeholders put enough pressure on the board before the shareholders flee.

Why haven't they done that before now, though? This has been brewing for some time.

What has happened to all the Cash Qantas had? And all the Flyer Point Credits????

Haven't been really paying attention as I have been studying English political history.

Came across this really interesting quote from Oliver Cromwell:

"You have sat too long for any good you have been doing lately... Depart, I say; and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go!"
Address to the Rump Parliament (20 April 1653)

I'm sure this must be relevant to something.........

A nice little summation of the last 2 years activities, courtesy of Australian Aviation.

Interesting comment by Joyce

FY13 QF domestic made $365m ($218m 1H13). To say domestic is now in a loss means a big big hit. Surely that cannot all be attributed to Virgin capacity response.

A little cost assignment to prop up Jetstar for sale perhaps?

Why aren't the various Qantas Unions, in particular AIPA, getting behind Senator Xenphone's call for Joyce and Clifford to accept responsibility for the Roo's demise and resign?
Surely a huge vote of no confidence in Joyce and the board, given the current media releases might at least start some serious questions being asked in financial circles?

From the SMH 5 Dec 2013: "The airline industry is a tough game but Joyce hasn't made it easy for himself. Qantas is far bigger than Virgin but he has allowed the airline to outwit him every step of the way. If this latest demonstration of the pain Qantas is suffering doesn't work, his next card might be to threaten to close international and the many thousands of staff."

Fact is, it's been all about slash and burn and hitching wagons to Emirates. When did you hear about anything in the way of improvements to customer service from QF? One gets a sense of quiet desperation from the staff when flying as SLF, and the domestic fleet and facilities look worn down.

Appointing AJ and letting JB go to Virgin will go down as one of the most expensive mistakes they've ever made. Whose head needs to roll over that one?

Now here's an idea!

Final words in Virgin's Fact Check, in answer to The Irish Gits' tantrum on capital raising:

Now Branson has jumped on the band wagon. That's all QF need!

Branson hits out at 'badly managed' Qantas - www.travelweekly.co.uk

I think the SMH may have hit it on the head. I'm betting he will say he has no choice other than to close International. That will be he last card, what ever happens this will be nasty.

What I can't believe is how fast it has happened. A few weeks ago, all was quiet (in relative terms), the suddenly Joyce is asking for something (although no one still really seems to know just what that is), now we have million dollar losses, more staff cuts, route reductions, who knows what. The next few weeks will be extremely interesting.

Whip up a frenzy kids......
 

Senator Xenophon - Go you good thing!!!
What is now needed is a new Qantas choir, made up of 30 000 staff singing for executive management and the boards heads on a silver platter!!! A massive vote of no confidence by all. Time to rid this company and this country of AJ and Co.
My eyes are closed, I can hear the sounds of 30 000 employees and tens of thousands of Aussies calling 'HEADS HEADS HEADS HEADS'!!

makes me wonder if that stunt he pulled a couple of years ago
was actually just a practice run......."fasten your seat belts" indeed.

Disgraceful!!

Maybe if we had an ounce of decent advertising of the Ozzie brand then Australians and the Government may feel more passionate about helping this cause.

Why should any member of the Australian public feel passionate about saving an icon that was once all about Australia but now is not?

What happened to "I still call Australia Home"? JB might as well pick up that line and run with it as it seems it has been abandoned long ago.

If this brand trashing was not deliberate then it has been a massive shot in the foot by a bunch of misguided fools.

Why does AJ want Virgin's international rights removed?

Is it because he is worried that VAI will expand more to the US and take more market share?

Or does he want its rights removed so when he shuts down international, Emirates can step in to fill the void on the Pacific?

Let's start a proper petition. Time for an EGM.

CORPORATIONS ACT 2001 - SECT 249D Calling of general meeting by directors when requested by members

As BGA tries to sell the furniture perhaps we'll finally see exactly which parts of the company are making money. Surely he'll have to hang on to anything that's profitable and sell the dogs. I notice he only spoke of jetstar when selling operational assets. I suspect he will be being told by the board to ditch anything he can thats's not generating cash.