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Virgin Australia - Phoenix Rising from the Ashes?

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Virgin Australia - Phoenix Rising from the Ashes?

Old 21st Sep 2022, 04:35
  #201 (permalink)  
 
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Inactive pilots still have 4 years before making a decision on returning or not. Most of the ones I know are off having other adventures whilst keeping the option of returning to virgin in their back pockets. A lot can happen in four years.
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Old 21st Sep 2022, 05:39
  #202 (permalink)  
 
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A lot of talk within the VA training department about the "no further courses planned" line. Widely agreed to be bulldust, and a tactic to goad inactive pilots into bidding.
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Old 22nd Sep 2022, 02:23
  #203 (permalink)  
 
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I would think the VARA pilots integration and their involvement in the VA network flying will also slow down any further recruitment for the short term. But training will take over a year.
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Old 22nd Sep 2022, 04:06
  #204 (permalink)  
 
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A friend said that his company planned 50 (from memory) external FOs prior to mid next year

Last edited by TimmyTee; 22nd Sep 2022 at 07:39.
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Old 22nd Sep 2022, 04:26
  #205 (permalink)  
 
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While there may still be 100+ left on the inactive list, I think youíll find attrition will continue to increase as people return to get current then leave. Most people that have returned are commuting and the company arenít assisting these commuters in anyway. The companyís arenít providing positions in bases people want (amongst other things such as $$), so many are voting with their feet and leaving. I think youíll find courses will continue next year and externals may get a shot mid next year depending on how the training pipeline looks.
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Old 22nd Sep 2022, 05:29
  #206 (permalink)  
 
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There is a lot of pilots where I am at heading over seas, Atlas in particular.
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Old 22nd Sep 2022, 06:13
  #207 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by SHVC
There is a lot of pilots where I am at heading over seas, Atlas in particular.
There are jobs galore out there. VA are also losing many to the likes of atlas and national. Many figure whatís the point of commuting and earning peanuts when they could fly to more interesting places in different equipment earning multiples of what they would at VA with a better lifestyle. VA will continue to hemorrhage pilots until they sort out the lifestyle and pay issues.
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Old 22nd Sep 2022, 06:23
  #208 (permalink)  
 
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All the last few comments are very very true. I am halfway on the list at VA and will not return for a FO position at a job that was boring me in the first place.
A lot of us (me included) are off overseas "trying before we are buying". Why burn the VA recall so early?. We really are in a very unique position to "have a go at something"...worst case scramble back to the ex wife and settle down..Again lol

Hopefully it works for those that want a new beginning or those want a burn on a new machine. Often it is too hard leaving a seniority list and take a punt
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Old 22nd Sep 2022, 07:08
  #209 (permalink)  
 
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The recall opportunity really is something unique for those who got let go during circus. What is amazing is the number of crew who are resigning on their own terms (therefor being removed from the seniority list permanently) to find greener pastures.

Pilots have a lot of opportunities now, so if an employer isnít meeting the market, people arenít afraid to move on. Better pay and conditions are available at many employers. Also, it canít be fun being a training or check captain right now. They must be approaching burnout. Shortly theyíll be training relatively inexperienced pilots too which will only add to the training costs/burden.
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Old 22nd Sep 2022, 17:52
  #210 (permalink)  
 
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Heard a vicious rumour that VA were looking to cancel the ‘deed’ as they need everyone back. Argument being that the company is being financially damaged because of slow return of experienced people and that the deed is not really relevant anymore as it was designed to return everyone anyway and they’re needed now. Anyone heard anything a bit more solid?????
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Old 22nd Sep 2022, 22:17
  #211 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by No Idea Either
Heard a vicious rumour that VA were looking to cancel the Ďdeedí as they need everyone back. Argument being that the company is being financially damaged because of slow return of experienced people and that the deed is not really relevant anymore as it was designed to return everyone anyway and theyíre needed now. Anyone heard anything a bit more solid?????
Seems like a pointless idea given that not all of the inactives have even been offered positions yet, the company has already started building a hold file of externals, and the training pipeline is the bottleneck rather than the supply of candidates.

Why alienate a remaining source of qualified, experienced and previously trusted pilots for no benefit.
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Old 22nd Sep 2022, 22:32
  #212 (permalink)  
 
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The agreement for pilots to return was enshrined in a deed by the AFAP and company. If that agreement falls apart, itís only going to alienate and further anger previous experienced crew who intended to return at some point. Both parties will have a lot of explaining to do if it the deed is deemed no longer valid.
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Old 23rd Sep 2022, 00:30
  #213 (permalink)  
 
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The return of redundant Pilots is in the eba, all crew voted for this process. It’s not going anywhere.
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Old 23rd Sep 2022, 01:13
  #214 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by No Idea Either
Heard a vicious rumour that VA were looking to cancel the Ďdeedí as they need everyone back. Argument being that the company is being financially damaged because of slow return of experienced people and that the deed is not really relevant anymore as it was designed to return everyone anyway and theyíre needed now. Anyone heard anything a bit more solid?????
Right. So these crew are meant to shed a tear as the business is financially damaged? Really? I mean the circus has been financially damaged for the last 20 years. That attitude is even more reason to stay away.

I know three VA pilots that have applied for the Jetstar ad. Bit dumb on VAs part not investing in these good people and for once, perhaps just giving them what they are after?

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Old 23rd Sep 2022, 01:41
  #215 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Break Right
The return of redundant Pilots is in the eba, all crew voted for this process. Itís not going anywhere.
Is the 7 years time limit to return in your EBA?
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Old 23rd Sep 2022, 01:53
  #216 (permalink)  
 
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EBA states 5 years. It’s the only thing you can rely on.
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Old 27th Sep 2022, 05:35
  #217 (permalink)  
 
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As the rate of resignations start accelerating at VA itís clear that staff arenít happy and the company arenít willing to address the underlying problem. A sound piece of advice is to use VA as a stepping stone to get current or get a new rating and move on to greener pastures (as many are doing).

Career progression is limited and with a list of inactive pilots, new joiners wonít have any idea of their true seniority or future progression opportunities until 2026. Itís a stark picture compared to other operators where progression and conditions are accelerating in the right direction.
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Old 27th Sep 2022, 05:36
  #218 (permalink)  
 
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VA has been given till end of March 2023 to utilise their HND authority or to lose it.

My money is on VA letting that authority lapse. Wet-leases (by another carrier on behalf of VA) on the HND route are not permitted under the IASC determination.

Although VA could operate BNE-GUM-HND on a 738 (with no fifth freedom allowed on the GUM-HND-GUM legs), chances of that happening would be 0% to none.
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Old 27th Sep 2022, 06:05
  #219 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by DanV2
VA has been given till end of March 2023 to utilise their HND authority or to lose it.

My money is on VA letting that authority lapse. Wet-leases (by another carrier on behalf of VA) on the HND route are not permitted under the IASC determination.

Although VA could operate BNE-GUM-HND on a 738 (with no fifth freedom allowed on the GUM-HND-GUM legs), chances of that happening would be 0% to none.
If the max 8ís appear by March, they will be able to do CNS-HND fairly comfortably (although there may be some payload restrictions). It will be a long slog on a narrow body though.
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Old 27th Sep 2022, 08:55
  #220 (permalink)  
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Technically, there is nothing barring a wet-lease operation in the IASC Determination. It cannot be used to jointly operate with another carrier, with the exception of the codeshare agreement with ANA, and anything else with approval from the Commission. It may be pushing it uphill to do so, but with the right arguments, anything is possible.

What I found interesting is that it is in the public record that Virgin provided the Commission in June with a confidential "firm commercial" plan to operate HND from Northern Summer 23 in order to preserve their slot allocation. Seems more likely to be a widebody wet-lease than a Max into FNQ, but stranger things have happened.
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