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Covid Vaccines and Pilots

Old 7th Jan 2022, 10:34
  #41 (permalink)  
 
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So you’re unvaccinated Aussie Bob?
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Old 7th Jan 2022, 11:45
  #42 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Aussie Bob View Post
…with a BMI …
"you can't polish a turd"
BMI was invented by a mathematician and is medically irrelevant. But you know that because you have a high level of medical knowledge.

Have you presented your evidence to your local medical authorities Aussie Bob? You seem sure that they’ve made obvious mistakes, that you know what the problem is. Have you gone and told them?
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Old 7th Jan 2022, 11:54
  #43 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Aussie Bob View Post
You might say it has saved us from dying but many would argue.
Who would argue? Disgraced chefs? Un-electable furniture salesmen? ‘Freedom fighters’ collecting thousands in ‘donations’ from people who have ‘woken up’?

Sorry to reply again but just noticed this gem.


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Old 7th Jan 2022, 13:48
  #44 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by TimmyTee View Post
So you’re unvaccinated Aussie Bob?
I’d say unemployed as well, plenty of time to do all his “research”.

Maybe you need more time to research your own questions Bob, and work out how stupid you really are 🤦‍♂️
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Old 7th Jan 2022, 17:45
  #45 (permalink)  
 
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Ha ha, when you have difficulty with the message, you shoot the messenger 😀

43 excluded.

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Old 7th Jan 2022, 20:51
  #46 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Aussie Bob View Post
Ha ha, when you have difficulty with the message, you shoot the messenger 😀

43 excluded.
Your message is a vaccine that slows the spread and drastically reduces deaths and hospitilizations is a 'dud".

And as you are the author OF that incredibly stupd message, taking aim is entirely appropriate.
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Old 7th Jan 2022, 23:09
  #47 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Aussie Bob View Post
Ha ha, when you have difficulty with the message, you shoot the messenger 😀

43 excluded.
I do enjoy knowing that I don’t/won’t be flying with your crackpot-self anytime soon
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Old 8th Jan 2022, 01:36
  #48 (permalink)  
 
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I'd take heed of these folk rather than anything Aussie Bob has to say.
Covid-19 patients from Sydney's Concord hospital have shared their experience of the Delta variant's symptoms and pleaded for Sydneysiders to get vaccinated. Lung specialist Lucy Morgan shared the stories of 50-year-old construction worker Fawaz, 30-year-old pharmacy worker Ramona and 35-year-old tradie Osama in a video from Sydney Local Health District. Fawaz and Osama infected family members who have also been hospitalised, while single mother Ramona says she has been unable to see her children for weeks
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Old 19th Jan 2022, 07:50
  #49 (permalink)  
 
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Angel

At the risk of 'flogging a dead horse'.....

Had my 'booster' yesterday. Previous two jabs were 'AZ'. This one was 'Pfizer'

All good. Nil after-effects. Nothing at all. Just a very small 'bruise' where the skin was punctured.
Mentally....'I Feel Better Now'......Although we are yet to feel the full effect in 'The West'.

We will see what Feb 5th (?) brings.
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Old 20th Jan 2022, 05:25
  #50 (permalink)  
 
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I had completed the 2 Astra-Zeneca shots, and then had a Pfizer booster after 4 months, but apparently I had already been infected the previous day. The symptoms were very mild, a little headachy and just fatigued, lasted for about 10 days. It felt like side effects from the booster, but was the actual disease.

Get the shots. Don't believe idiot fat slugs like Palmer and Christensen, who have their own political agenda to push.
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Old 21st Jan 2022, 09:41
  #51 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Ascend Charlie View Post
I had completed the 2 Astra-Zeneca shots, and then had a Pfizer booster after 4 months, but apparently I had already been infected the previous day. The symptoms were very mild, a little headachy and just fatigued, lasted for about 10 days. It felt like side effects from the booster, but was the actual disease.

Get the shots. Don't believe idiot fat slugs like Palmer and Christensen, who have their own political agenda to push.
Why? It doesn't work anymore. Even the manufacturers are now admitting that. You may as well wait around for the next one which should be out soon, maybe this year? Who knows... but for most people the current version is a waste of time. Maybe if you're obese or have heart issues it's worth doing and you'd be slightly better off than without it. For a little while until it wears off.

What are Clive's political agendas regarding the vaccines, Charlie? What are George's agendas? Anything you can put your finger on? Sounds a little conspiratorial.

Speaking of Clive and George, they should probably strongly consider the shot as they appear quite overweight. Just my opinion.

They sell you something which you didn't really need and which doesn't do what it's supposed to. Then when everyone finds out it doesn't work they tell you you have to buy it again (and again). Then, they blame the failure of it on the people who didn't buy it. Then they tell you if you don't buy it (even if it doesn't work) you can't go to work or to the pub. Then they get really angry at anyone who asks why it doesn't work and prevent them speaking about it by "cancelling" them. I think Aussie Bob has a point. Have the vac or don't have it, but don't judge others for their choices. Did you judge them on their choice re the flu shot?

As for how society treats it's old and infirm, this line has been trotted out a bit lately but long before covid-19 we already had an abysmal record on this: nursing home scandals, old people being ripped off, abused, not given proper care. Indifferent and absent relatives. Offspring more interested in inheritance than caring for their folks. Robberies and beatings of vulnerable old people in home-invasions, rapes even. The "pandemic" treatment saw even worse with old folks in homes deprived of visits by loved ones, isolated from their only friends in the homes, denied human touch by the people in spacesuits "caring" for them, denied decent funerals, you get the idea. That line doesn't really work.
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Old 21st Jan 2022, 11:04
  #52 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Eclan View Post
Why? It doesn't work anymore. Even the manufacturers are now admitting that. You may as well wait around for the next one which should be out soon, maybe this year? Who knows... but for most people the current version is a waste of time. Maybe if you're obese or have heart issues it's worth doing and you'd be slightly better off than without it. For a little while until it wears off.
Why would you say this when it is factually wrong? It's not a debate or a matter of opinion or preference. Here's how it's looking in Switzerland at the moment. Pretty clear that, yes, fully vaccinated people, including ones that have had boosters, can contract covid and die, however it is at a vastly lower rate, as the existing vaccines provide a very significant level of protection. Deaths per 100,000 people are 48 times higher in the unvaccinated group than the vaccinated and boosted group.




As to the political motivations of Clive Palmer, being able to split off an angry set of both left and right leaning voters, and then direct preferences as best suits his political goals or be a kingmaker holding a couple of seats in a closely balanced parliament, is a fairly obvious one, and getting $2.91 for every first preference vote received is also a decent incentive for most political parties, although probably less so for one being bankrolled by someone of Palmer's wealth. George Christensen is retiring at the next election to start up his "pro-freedom news website" and youtube channel, so again he has a keen financial interest in keeping a high profile and keep the views and clicks coming in.
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Old 21st Jan 2022, 11:11
  #53 (permalink)  
 
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As for how society treats it's old and infirm, this line has been trotted out a bit lately but long before covid-19 we already had an abysmal record on this: nursing home scandals, old people being ripped off, abused, not given proper care. Indifferent and absent relatives. Offspring more interested in inheritance than caring for their folks. Robberies and beatings of vulnerable old people in home-invasions, rapes even. The "pandemic" treatment saw even worse with old folks in homes deprived of visits by loved ones, isolated from their only friends in the homes, denied human touch by the people in spacesuits "caring" for them, denied decent funerals, you get the idea. That line doesn't really work.
If you believe in conspiracies then the next step is Soylent Green, you will have been conditioned to fear old age, you will get sick and die, you will get beaten, it's not worth living, so why not just die, and be turned into nutritious biscuits. If you think being mandated to have a vaccination is bad, just wait until you are mandated to die by a certain age, that is what you are alluding to. Old people cost too much, they are a drain on society, they don't work, are unproductive and cost lots in health cover and services. The record you mention with treatment of the old is not because we chose that route, it was reached by negligence, allowing a virus free reign to just kill the old and infirm is the same as consciously mandating an age limit by which we stop caring and let nature take its course. That is the difference between what happened during the pandemic and what happens in general, choice as to make a difference. I would much rather be mandated to live than mandated to die.

covid-19-surveillance-report-20220120.pdf (nsw.gov.au)

That is the latest from NSW health, quite definitive data, for those that don't want to bother reading the statistics are as follows;

If you contract covid;

1. You are 9 times more likely to be hospitalised if unvaccinated. (the hospitalisation rate of unvaccinated was almost 10% of cases)
2. You are 15 times more likely to end up in ICU if unvaccinated.
3. You are at least 30 times more likely to die if unvaccinated.

That is including current strains and so on, so yes the vaccines are still very effective and yes the majority of deaths are still in the 70+ bracket with surprisingly still many unvaccinated dying.

Last edited by 43Inches; 21st Jan 2022 at 11:35.
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Old 21st Jan 2022, 20:32
  #54 (permalink)  
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Just to let you know Bob, legitimate Doctors and Epidemiologists tend to publish their research in academic journals NOT on You Tube or Dr Google.
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Old 21st Jan 2022, 21:24
  #55 (permalink)  
 
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Omicron is a variant. More contagious but less lethal, I believe. Most of the vaccinated elderly deaths at the moment are waning AstraZeneca vaccines who have not been boosted, contracting Delta which is more lethal (delta is still around) But what if…..and we’re all pilots here very much engaged in the ‘what if’ line of thinking……what if the next variant is more lethal to say children. Will that change the antivaxers logic. The only way to avoid mutations is to beat the virus down and not allow it to spread right throughout the population. More chances for variants to pop up. So get vaccinated, then soldier on and live your life. Oh and pleeeaaassseee spare me the 5G, Bill Gates, Lizard people crap.

Incoming………Tin foil aka hard hat………ON
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Old 21st Jan 2022, 21:51
  #56 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by No Idea Either View Post
Omicron is a variant. More contagious but less lethal, I believe. Most of the vaccinated elderly deaths at the moment are waning AstraZeneca vaccines who have not been boosted, contracting Delta which is more lethal (delta is still around) But what if…..and we’re all pilots here very much engaged in the ‘what if’ line of thinking……what if the next variant is more lethal to say children. Will that change the antivaxers logic. The only way to avoid mutations is to beat the virus down and not allow it to spread right throughout the population. More chances for variants to pop up. So get vaccinated, then soldier on and live your life. Oh and pleeeaaassseee spare me the 5G, Bill Gates, Lizard people crap.

Incoming………Tin foil aka hard hat………ON
The progrssive variations have been interesting but predictable. There is no actual evolutionary advantage to killing the host. Producing a condition where the host spreads the virus- such as sneezing or coughing- IS an advantage.

Therefore a varient that is more transmissable, but sickens the host without killing them, is going to become dominant- we've seen this with Dela and now Omicron.

It's probably in the sweet-spot where it speads like wildfire while keeping hosts alive- HOPEFULLY it's the peak varient.
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Old 22nd Jan 2022, 00:17
  #57 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by 3 Holer View Post
Just to let you know Bob, legitimate Doctors and Epidemiologists tend to publish their research in academic journals NOT on You Tube or Dr Google.
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Old 22nd Jan 2022, 04:08
  #58 (permalink)  
 
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Thank you, Flieger, points noted.

Re the NSW Health doc, leaving the unqualified to interpret raw data is not ideal when people don’t understand the difference between relative and absolute risk.

43 inches said:
If you contract covid;

1. You are 9 times more likely to be hospitalised if unvaccinated.

WRONG. From your document, at 13.5% the no-dose people are only 5.1% more likely to be hospitalised than those with 2 doses (8.4%). Hardly a damning figure.
2. You are 15 times more likely to end up in ICU if unvaccinated.

WRONG. From your document, unvaxed are 1.9% more likely.
3. You are at least 30 times more likely to die if unvaccinated.

Wow! Quite an alarming statistic. Fortunately, that myth is also busted. WRONG again. Your document says unvaxed are 0.2% less likely to die than two-dosed people. If that wild claim was true we’d be seeing hundreds of deaths per day given the admissions we are now seeing on how many deaths were of vaccinated people.

Using that system, if one unvaxed person was infected and died you’d tell everyone they are 100% likely to die of covid if they catch it without a jab. That’s the problem with people playing with stats they don’t understand. You have to be exposed to be infected and this is unrelated to vaccination status except to say that if you lock up all the unvaxed, only the vaxed are left to spread it amongst themselves.

The lack of impartiality of NSW Health toward the interpretation of their stats by the unqualified public is evident in their helpful note on P30:
Originally Posted by NSW Health
The percentage of cases who died is slightly higher for those with two effective doses compared to those with no effective dose because elderly people were more likely to have received two doses before or during this period.”
They don’t want anyone getting the “wrong idea” about an inconvenient stat which doesn’t suit the narrative. By default though they’ve illustrated where the greatest risk is.


Of course the stats above are almost entirely related to Delta and not the current strain so the numbers for the current times will be even more balanced.

Some condensed definitions from your document to help illustrate the misinformation:
Originally Posted by NSW Health
“People with COVID-19 can be hospitalised because of the disease but may also be hospitalised for other reasons not related to their COVID-19 diagnosis. …reported hospitalisation counts include all people who were admitted to any hospital ward … around the time of their COVID-19 diagnosis. This does not mean that all … are due to a worsening of COVID-19 symptoms.”
People who have bad covid experiences usually have other conditions, which often means hospitalisation. That should be obvious by now.

Originally Posted by NSW Health
“A COVID-19 death is defined … as a death in a confirmed COVID-19 case, unless there is a clear alternative cause of death that cannot be related to COVID-19 (e.g., trauma).”
They are still allowing the unqualified and the wilfully pigheaded to incorrectly presume covid caused each reported death.

On the elderly, the comments on treatment of the aged are confused and aimless. You said anyone unvaccinated isn’t doing the right thing by our aged and should be judged, I said people have already done not-well by our aged and should already have been judged, you attempted to twist things with something bizarre about Soylent Green and eating people and lost the point.


The bottom line is, most people are vaccinated and the case numbers are still going through the roof. Aussie Bob pointed this out and everyone jumped on him.

Just get vaxed.
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Old 22nd Jan 2022, 04:09
  #59 (permalink)  
 
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Damn, you been owned, 3 Holer!
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Old 22nd Jan 2022, 05:43
  #60 (permalink)  
 
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WRONG. From your document, at 13.5% the no-dose people are only 5.1% more likely to be hospitalised than those with 2 doses (8.4%).
Well, no. If one thing has a probability of 2% and a second thing has a probability of 4%, that second thing is 100% more likely than the first. Not 2%.


That’s the problem with people playing with stats they don’t understand.
Agreed.
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