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Old 26th Apr 2021, 11:42
  #4521 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by SOPS
I think when the politicians saw what happened OS. The ‘ curve getting flat’ was still killing a lot of people. Now, for Australia, its eradication at all costs.
Thats rubbish, the curves OS weren’t being flattened at all, they were rapidly rising.

Our politicians shat themselves at what may happen knowing that their hospital system was way below par. As usual a massive over reaction based on fear alone.
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Old 26th Apr 2021, 12:05
  #4522 (permalink)  
 
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The politicians are following the best guidance from medical professionals. Doctors aren’t telling us how to fly planes, maybe we should stick to our wheelhouses. Let’s let the people who understand the intricacies of a global viral pandemic advise our nation’s leaders. Australia is the envy of the world for a reason.
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Old 26th Apr 2021, 12:34
  #4523 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Tucknroll
Doctors aren’t telling us how to fly planes,
No, accountants and lawyers do.
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Old 26th Apr 2021, 13:00
  #4524 (permalink)  
 
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The politicians are following the best guidance from medical professionals.
If that is the case why is every state and territory doing things differently? The variation is politics, pure and simple.
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Old 26th Apr 2021, 14:07
  #4525 (permalink)  
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If that is the case why is every state and territory doing things differently? The variation is politics, pure and simple.
There is a lot of variation on the verbal advice given in interviews by the State CMOs.
Australia's failing is that the State Premiers want to keep their own little empires instead of handing all of the CMO's responsibilities to the Federal COM so we could have a country wide policy.
In Qld, at present, the CMO has more authority than the Premier.
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Old 26th Apr 2021, 21:00
  #4526 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Tucknroll
The politicians are following the best guidance from medical professionals. Doctors aren’t telling us how to fly planes, maybe we should stick to our wheelhouses. Let’s let the people who understand the intricacies of a global viral pandemic advise our nation’s leaders. Australia is the envy of the world for a reason.
And it’s people who believe this that are holding the country back.

What a load of rubbish. It’s like taking aviation advice from the “experts” you hear from in the paper.

If you had any insight into our CHOs you wouldn’t sleep at night. They’re not in the position because of great medical skills or knowledge!
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Old 26th Apr 2021, 21:21
  #4527 (permalink)  
 
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Why are we not considering this? Australia is such a 3rd world country at the moment.

Germany set to abolish quarantine for travellers

Germany will move to abolish self-isolation requirements for travellers who have been fully vaccinated or who have already contracted COVID-19.
German Chancellor Angela Merkel addresses a press conference. Picture: AFP.The government’s draft paper would allow millions of Germans to holiday in hundreds of countries over the European summer.

Currently travellers are required to undertake ten days of home quarantine after they return from “high risk” areas including France, Italy and the US.

The new freedoms would not apply to travellers returning from 11 areas with high case numbers of the new variants including India, Brazil, South Africa and the Moselle region of France, which borders Germany.

Travellers would also be required to prove they tested positive for the disease more than a month earlier and recovered.
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Old 26th Apr 2021, 22:07
  #4528 (permalink)  
 
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svhc:
Why are we not considering this? Australia is such a 3rd world country at the moment.

Germany set to abolish quarantine for travellers

Germany will move to abolish self-isolation requirements for travellers who have been fully vaccinated or who have already contracted COVID-19.
Because perfect forgeries of the vaccination and medical certificates required by BorderForce will be available in Third world countries within hours of such a rash decision.

Don't you understand that the reason ScoMo won't let Australians leave the country is to avoid the charge of hypocrisy when he prohibited foreign arrivals?

Do you really want Australia to be swamped with Covid19 refugees?

....or are you just a pilot pining for their lost career?

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Old 26th Apr 2021, 22:18
  #4529 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by dysslexicgod
svhc:

Because perfect forgeries of the vaccination and medical certificates required by BorderForce will be available in Third world countries within hours of such a rash decision.

Don't you understand that the reason ScoMo won't let Australians leave the country is to avoid the charge of hypocrisy when he prohibited foreign arrivals?

Do you really want Australia to be swamped with Covid19 refugees?

....or are you just a pilot pining for their lost career?

talking about perfect forgeries.. seems there might have been some presented by passengers on this flight. Regardless, this is exactly why ALL flights from India should have been stopped days ago. I understand federal cabinet are meeting today to decide on this matter. They better bloody do it. Because people are getting way beyond fed up with lockdowns . And the percentage of infected passengers from India is way, way beyond normal numbers. Darwin had 17 in day as did NSW. Ban the flights today.

hotel quarantine can cope, we have had around 500,000 people return to Australia and go through the system over the last year. Yes there have been outbreaks but due to incompetence or people breaking the rules. This could happen with any form of dedicated quarantine camps.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...9-landing.html

Last edited by Foxxster; 26th Apr 2021 at 22:53.
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Old 26th Apr 2021, 22:35
  #4530 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by ScepticalOptomist
And it’s people who believe this that are holding the country back.

What a load of rubbish. It’s like taking aviation advice from the “experts” you hear from in the paper.

If you had any insight into our CHOs you wouldn’t sleep at night. They’re not in the position because of great medical skills or knowledge!
I’ve read the bios, I’ve heard their advice. It all sounds pretty reasonable. The reason that there is variation state to state is because the resources and demographics of each state vary wildly.

So, scepticaloptimist you seem to be sharing some really great insights into the management of COVID-19. Care to give us a quick run down of your qualifications to do so? Where did you study medicine and virology? Or your MPH? Or are you one of these great people who have ‘educated themselves’ and now know more in one years’ worth of light internet reading than the world’s leading authorities on the subject?
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Old 27th Apr 2021, 00:30
  #4531 (permalink)  
 
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Building a Quarantine camp

Originally Posted by ExtraShot
We don’t need to use abandoned mining camps. Also, Military facilities are deemed unsuitable due to their dormitory style accommodation... shared bathrooms, mess facilities, plus, 14 days confined to something smaller than a modern jail cell wouldn’t last long before people had human rights lawyers up the wazoo... (asylum seekers can wander around facilities fairly freely, so it’s not the same- and no I don’t think 14 days confined to a standard hotel room is much better).

It would have to be $50-100 million for a brand new Howard Springs style facility within 100km of each capital city (or toowoomba or Avalon as previously proposed). 1 bedroom with en-suite and kitchen granny flat demountables... Space for an aeromed chopper to land on site will have people at capital city hospitals in short time.

Could be completed in 3-4 months if we’re truly on a ‘war footing’.
I doubt that very much.
You are talking about building a small township for a thousand or more transients* in quarantine, plus permanent staff.
Even assuming the Commonwealth decided to simply ignore any requirement for planning permissions, consultations with stakeholders, environmental impact statement, etc - and I think that would be political suicide - you still have to manage the infrastructure issues: roading, electricity, potable water and sewage treatment & disposal. Roading is almost trivial.
The Commonwealth will have to
  • negotiate with a lines company to add a point load of some megawatts into a network probably designed to handle a farm every kilometre or so, and then get them to design and build it.
  • find a source of potable water, negotiate a supply agreement with the owner and design & build a pipeline to your camp site, probably build an on-site reservoir to give a surge/emergency/firefighting supply too or design and build a complete water supply and treatment system.
  • conceptualise, then design and build, a sewage/wastewater treatment plant and outfall.
These are not off-the-shelf purchases, they take months and months and gobs of money to do.
And if the Commonwealth were to go through the normal planning processes, add at least another three to six months.

Sorry, this is at least a twelve to eighteen months' project.

* If you are only going to take one planeload a week - A330 size, empty middle seats, say 150 SOB - and working on a sixteen day cycle (reception day, fourteen days quarantine, cleaning day) - you are going to need four hundred to four hundred and fifty beds. A thousand beds only gets you two flights a week, occasionally three. Daily flights, you're looking at two to two and a half thousand beds.
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Old 27th Apr 2021, 03:16
  #4532 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by dysslexicgod
svhc:

Because perfect forgeries of the vaccination and medical certificates required by BorderForce will be available in Third world countries within hours of such a rash decision.

Don't you understand that the reason ScoMo won't let Australians leave the country is to avoid the charge of hypocrisy when he prohibited foreign arrivals?

Do you really want Australia to be swamped with Covid19 refugees?

....or are you just a pilot pining for their lost career?
You cannot tarnish everyone with the same brush. Evidence is becoming clearer and clearer every day:

1. The western vaccines provide strong protection against disease. They provide almost perfect protection against severe disease and death.
2. There is strong evidence that transmission is greatly reduced. And with less Covid doing the rounds, even more difficult to find someone with it.
3. They are still not accepting arrivals from high risk countries.
4. By mid Northern Hemisphere summer, the vast majority of western countries will hit herd immunity.

And to the last line, I say again: I’m amazed by the number of people on this forum who want to diminish their own industry or happy to take the money despite no one down the back paying your wages.
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Old 27th Apr 2021, 03:17
  #4533 (permalink)  
 
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* If you are only going to take one planeload a week - A330 size, empty middle seats, say 150 SOB - and working on a sixteen day cycle (reception day, fourteen days quarantine, cleaning day) - you are going to need four hundred to four hundred and fifty beds. A thousand beds only gets you two flights a week, occasionally three. Daily flights, you're looking at two to two and a half thousand beds.

So Howard Springs!
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Old 27th Apr 2021, 03:20
  #4534 (permalink)  
Keg

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Originally Posted by Foxxster
Because people are getting way beyond fed up with lockdowns .
Lockdown? What’s that? Haven’t had a city wide one let a state wide one in NSW since April/ May last year. 230K people on the northern beaches for a couple of weeks due a super spreader event just prior to Christmas is the extent of it. For those outside the northern beaches, life has been pretty normal since May last year.

I always found it interesting when talking to the staff at the hotel in Perth in early December who were under the impression that Sydney/ NSW/ ‘over east’ was in permanent form of lockdowns and harsh restrictions. They got a shock when I told them life was as normal for us as it was for them.... we just didn’t have an idiot Premier slamming the gate shut every time someone had a sniffle.
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Old 27th Apr 2021, 03:33
  #4535 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Global Aviator
* If you are only going to take one planeload a week - A330 size, empty middle seats, say 150 SOB - and working on a sixteen day cycle (reception day, fourteen days quarantine, cleaning day) - you are going to need four hundred to four hundred and fifty beds. A thousand beds only gets you two flights a week, occasionally three. Daily flights, you're looking at two to two and a half thousand beds.

So Howard Springs!
Nof to berate scientists at all, but no scientist in any other country that I know of is talking about military camp quarantine rather than hotel quarantine. People are actually allowed to disagree with scientists - heck, disagreeing with each other is like a sport for them. They are going to go with the most conservative option because otherwise they are perceived to be liable.
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Old 27th Apr 2021, 04:05
  #4536 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Global Aviator
* If you are only going to take one planeload a week - A330 size, empty middle seats, say 150 SOB - and working on a sixteen day cycle (reception day, fourteen days quarantine, cleaning day) - you are going to need four hundred to four hundred and fifty beds. A thousand beds only gets you two flights a week, occasionally three. Daily flights, you're looking at two to two and a half thousand beds.

So Howard Springs!
Two and a half thousand beds is what Perth alone would need.
Plus some (??) accomodation for staff.
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Old 27th Apr 2021, 04:07
  #4537 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Keg
Lockdown? What’s that? Haven’t had a city wide one let a state wide one in NSW since April/ May last year. 230K people on the northern beaches for a couple of weeks due a super spreader event just prior to Christmas is the extent of it. For those outside the northern beaches, life has been pretty normal since May last year.

I always found it interesting when talking to the staff at the hotel in Perth in early December who were under the impression that Sydney/ NSW/ ‘over east’ was in permanent form of lockdowns and harsh restrictions. They got a shock when I told them life was as normal for us as it was for them.... we just didn’t have an idiot Premier slamming the gate shut every time someone had a sniffle.
https://www.nsw.gov.au/media-release...-for-christmas well that all sounds pretty normal and just like things were in WA at the time....
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Old 27th Apr 2021, 04:10
  #4538 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Keg
Lockdown? What’s that? Haven’t had a city wide one let a state wide one in NSW since April/ May last year. 230K people on the northern beaches for a couple of weeks due a super spreader event just prior to Christmas is the extent of it. For those outside the northern beaches, life has been pretty normal since May last year.

I always found it interesting when talking to the staff at the hotel in Perth in early December who were under the impression that Sydney/ NSW/ ‘over east’ was in permanent form of lockdowns and harsh restrictions. They got a shock when I told them life was as normal for us as it was for them.... we just didn’t have an idiot Premier slamming the gate shut every time someone had a sniffle.
And yet NSW businesses are complaining vehemently about the year-long and continuing impact on their turn-over.
And every TV newsclip shows Sydney siders walking around masked.

Why is that then? Something doesn't add up.
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Old 27th Apr 2021, 04:19
  #4539 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Keg
Lockdown? What’s that? Haven’t had a city wide one let a state wide one in NSW since April/ May last year. 230K people on the northern beaches for a couple of weeks due a super spreader event just prior to Christmas is the extent of it. For those outside the northern beaches, life has been pretty normal since May last year.

I always found it interesting when talking to the staff at the hotel in Perth in early December who were under the impression that Sydney/ NSW/ ‘over east’ was in permanent form of lockdowns and harsh restrictions. They got a shock when I told them life was as normal for us as it was for them.... we just didn’t have an idiot Premier slamming the gate shut every time someone had a sniffle.
just had one in WA. Have been many in Queensland. Victoria had god knows how many last year especially. They affect not only people in those states but the whole country. People can’t make holiday plans or have their plans ruined at the last minute. Plus the economic cost.
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Old 27th Apr 2021, 04:22
  #4540 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Foxxster
just had one in WA. Have been many in Queensland. Victoria had god knows how many last year especially. They affect not only people in those states but the whole country. People can’t make holiday plans or have their plans ruined at the last minute. Plus the economic cost.
So, since NSW has weathered the storm so well why has Beryl got her hand out for WA's GST share?
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