Qantas Engineering redundances - Advice required!!!
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Romulus, no one denies improved fuel burn and even maintenance on an improved, upgraded engine. And you'd get them whenever your old donk's require more expensive overhaul than replacement, even earlier since an upgraded package delivers extra incentives.
BUT the way i understood the video it's not about an upgraded engine package that delivers extra savings and you'd take up whenever your engines are due for replacement but rather the motto "no more overhaul, but engine replacements instead". And i highly doubt that it's cheaper to put a brand spanking new engine any time an overhaul is due than doing the overhaul.
Unless the video meant to convey that in fact they are getting upgraded engines once off which it then miserably failed to get across. Either way the video was/is an embarrassment and complete and utter failure, like any other communication the company has produced in the last 10 years. It's embarrassing. I am embarrassed to work under those clowns, because they have no f***ing clue on so many levels it's beyond a joke.
BUT the way i understood the video it's not about an upgraded engine package that delivers extra savings and you'd take up whenever your engines are due for replacement but rather the motto "no more overhaul, but engine replacements instead". And i highly doubt that it's cheaper to put a brand spanking new engine any time an overhaul is due than doing the overhaul.
Unless the video meant to convey that in fact they are getting upgraded engines once off which it then miserably failed to get across. Either way the video was/is an embarrassment and complete and utter failure, like any other communication the company has produced in the last 10 years. It's embarrassing. I am embarrassed to work under those clowns, because they have no f***ing clue on so many levels it's beyond a joke.
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It is all to do with budgets. In this age short term budgets are all that matters. Lets make this quarters budget at all cost. Consequences can be dealt with in a future quarters budget. As a long term employee it is very hard to think along those terms.
Not saying it is correct but most senior management have a short term contract and they have to achieve those goals. They are different to the average employee who looks long term.
Years ago at Ansett the business as a whole operated under different ideals. For example the business realised that they had a need for many motor vehicles. They took the long term view and bought a car dealership to cater for that demand. i.e. keep the profits within the group.
The new age is not allowed to think long term like that as they have a different agenda.
Unfortunately as an employee under the new age rationale you are supposed to have the short term business strategy without the bonuses involved for the senior members of the team.
GB
Not saying it is correct but most senior management have a short term contract and they have to achieve those goals. They are different to the average employee who looks long term.
Years ago at Ansett the business as a whole operated under different ideals. For example the business realised that they had a need for many motor vehicles. They took the long term view and bought a car dealership to cater for that demand. i.e. keep the profits within the group.
The new age is not allowed to think long term like that as they have a different agenda.
Unfortunately as an employee under the new age rationale you are supposed to have the short term business strategy without the bonuses involved for the senior members of the team.
GB
Last edited by Gas Bags; 4th Mar 2013 at 11:34.
Given the state of the U.S. and European economies, my guess would be that there is some very, very attactive finance and prices attached to new engines, so it may well make sense financially in the current environment.
The question then leads on to "life cycle cost" calculations. This is where it can get tricky because you have to make assumptions about future exchange rates. Being a control freak, I don't like the idea of not maintaining and overhauling everything in Australia.
If China vs. Japan hots up or China vs. The Phillippines, then sending stuff to Asia for maintenance is not going to appear wise.
To put that another way, unless there are scores of MRO's all over the world touting for your business all the time, then it is not going to be a competitive market and your supplier is going to have his hands around your trusting little throat pretty quick.
The question then leads on to "life cycle cost" calculations. This is where it can get tricky because you have to make assumptions about future exchange rates. Being a control freak, I don't like the idea of not maintaining and overhauling everything in Australia.
If China vs. Japan hots up or China vs. The Phillippines, then sending stuff to Asia for maintenance is not going to appear wise.
To put that another way, unless there are scores of MRO's all over the world touting for your business all the time, then it is not going to be a competitive market and your supplier is going to have his hands around your trusting little throat pretty quick.
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Is AJ on a 457?
Who knows, management is full of unaustralian people.
Even Gillard has 457 visa holders working in her government. Take John McTernan,
Gillards communications director, ABC news confirmed he is here on one.
Who knows, management is full of unaustralian people.
Even Gillard has 457 visa holders working in her government. Take John McTernan,
Gillards communications director, ABC news confirmed he is here on one.
Last edited by buttmonkey1; 5th Mar 2013 at 11:35.
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cvurass, Poor form to just put that general statement out there with no info. Most people are feeling a little uncomfortable these days without some random comment. Can you divulge any other info like where you heard this? Which area? Numbers? mmmm
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AJ 457
Last time I checked, Australians don't need a visa to work in Australia.
Getting off track. Sure AJ's a naturalised Australian of 9 years, heck I've been in Qantas longer than he's been in Australia.
I just don't want anyone getting a tap on the should while we have any 457's working in the aviation industry in Australia. That's the point here. If you know of any organisation tell the immigration department, tell a politician, tell a industry representative.
Last edited by The Black Panther; 5th Mar 2013 at 20:39.
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Employee rights
Anna Ford, associate at Sydney law firm Coleman Greig, says there are three basic elements to a genuine redundancy.
First, under all modern awards and enterprise bargaining agreements, the employer must explain why each employee is being made redundant. They have to explain their weakened financial position, even at the risk of compromising their business.
Second, an employer cannot refill a position that has been made redundant. If a redundant employee discovered a replacement was doing their job, the decision could be challenged.
The third component is redeployment. If no genuine attempt is made to redeploy staff, the redundancy decision is likely to be contested.
“When employers ask me to handle redundancy cases, I always go through these three points with them,” Ford says. “If they can’t satisfy them, then the redundancies are not legitimate.”
While many employees regard redundancies as callous, they are usually a last resort for an employer. In announcing redundancies it is virtually certifying its own business failures.
Pacific Brands is a case in point. The company has shed an estimated 3000 jobs since it announced a controversial restructuring plan in early 2009, as part of a shift to manufacturing from China. The company, which markets more than 30 popular apparel brands, including Berlei and Bonds, became a lightning rod for community fury about Australian businesses shifting jobs offshore. In 2009, among Pacific Brand’s one-off expenses was almost A$82 million in redundancy payments.
Anna Ford, associate at Sydney law firm Coleman Greig, says there are three basic elements to a genuine redundancy.
First, under all modern awards and enterprise bargaining agreements, the employer must explain why each employee is being made redundant. They have to explain their weakened financial position, even at the risk of compromising their business.
Second, an employer cannot refill a position that has been made redundant. If a redundant employee discovered a replacement was doing their job, the decision could be challenged.
The third component is redeployment. If no genuine attempt is made to redeploy staff, the redundancy decision is likely to be contested.
“When employers ask me to handle redundancy cases, I always go through these three points with them,” Ford says. “If they can’t satisfy them, then the redundancies are not legitimate.”
While many employees regard redundancies as callous, they are usually a last resort for an employer. In announcing redundancies it is virtually certifying its own business failures.
Pacific Brands is a case in point. The company has shed an estimated 3000 jobs since it announced a controversial restructuring plan in early 2009, as part of a shift to manufacturing from China. The company, which markets more than 30 popular apparel brands, including Berlei and Bonds, became a lightning rod for community fury about Australian businesses shifting jobs offshore. In 2009, among Pacific Brand’s one-off expenses was almost A$82 million in redundancy payments.
I just don't want anyone getting a tap on the should while we have any 457's working in the aviation industry in Australia. That's the point here. If you know of any organisation tell the immigration department, tell a politician, tell a industry representative.
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Imp Shift,
What are you basing the diploma info on? When you say full B1 I assume you mean an unrestricted B1 LWTR? Are you saying that to hold an unrestricted B1 LWTR you must also hold a diploma?
Thanks.
What are you basing the diploma info on? When you say full B1 I assume you mean an unrestricted B1 LWTR? Are you saying that to hold an unrestricted B1 LWTR you must also hold a diploma?
Thanks.
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Imperial Shifter,
This moment will come and go. As difficult as it is right now, the irony is that "the powers that be" will start re-hiring in a couple of years.
"The needs of business" dictate everything, and even if managers can't see what strategy is best, it always ends up that they make too many staff redundant and realize their mistake too late.
I have said before in my posts that I have seen this many times before in this and other industries and each time I scratch my head to try to understand what it is the managers are doing.
The simple answer is "the cost of doing business must come down".
The argument is HOW this should be done and that has been discussed at length in this forum.
The way to deal with this is to understand that this is a cycle, and if it is a given that Qantas will get through this and remain intact as the national carrier, then it's just a matter of time.
In the meantime, those that lose their jobs find something else to earn a dollar to get by, and invariably, will find themselves back in the industry when things turn around.
I truly wish that things could be different, but it won't be as I have said.
But will it be horrific? Probably not, if history repeats itself.
There will be opportunities when re-hiring starts, and with the right credentials, you can find yourself in line for re-training in aircraft types.
Not all bad.
Maybe I have my head up my backside but I believe the industry will come full circle and Heavy Maint. will have a future in Aus. But I'm not holding my breath....and the scenario that drives that change could be horrific!
"The needs of business" dictate everything, and even if managers can't see what strategy is best, it always ends up that they make too many staff redundant and realize their mistake too late.
I have said before in my posts that I have seen this many times before in this and other industries and each time I scratch my head to try to understand what it is the managers are doing.
The simple answer is "the cost of doing business must come down".
The argument is HOW this should be done and that has been discussed at length in this forum.
The way to deal with this is to understand that this is a cycle, and if it is a given that Qantas will get through this and remain intact as the national carrier, then it's just a matter of time.
In the meantime, those that lose their jobs find something else to earn a dollar to get by, and invariably, will find themselves back in the industry when things turn around.
I truly wish that things could be different, but it won't be as I have said.
But will it be horrific? Probably not, if history repeats itself.
There will be opportunities when re-hiring starts, and with the right credentials, you can find yourself in line for re-training in aircraft types.
Not all bad.
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The diff between now and then aeromedic, is the systems of maint are being changed or challenged.
A new era of maint is beginning and it doesn't involve you nor I. Ideally it would involve someone cheaper who carries only the necessary skills.
Not someone trained to the eyeballs on planes we operate or no longer operate, or never operated - earning considerably more than their equivalents at rivals.
There is a mass of dead weight that needs to get cut from RMS Qantas - true. Throwing people overboard will address the issues head on - false.
Ps. Stop f$&king hiring apprentices!!! We don't even have jobs for them now. I don't see how things are gonna change in four years. I'm not sure that they'll be thanking you for giving them a skill that can't be used on anything other than planes - the yield for their hard yards is equivalent to peanuts outside qf. It's hardly a living. Their time is better spent on training on things more mainline like mechanic, sparky, carpenter etc.
A new era of maint is beginning and it doesn't involve you nor I. Ideally it would involve someone cheaper who carries only the necessary skills.
Not someone trained to the eyeballs on planes we operate or no longer operate, or never operated - earning considerably more than their equivalents at rivals.
There is a mass of dead weight that needs to get cut from RMS Qantas - true. Throwing people overboard will address the issues head on - false.
Ps. Stop f$&king hiring apprentices!!! We don't even have jobs for them now. I don't see how things are gonna change in four years. I'm not sure that they'll be thanking you for giving them a skill that can't be used on anything other than planes - the yield for their hard yards is equivalent to peanuts outside qf. It's hardly a living. Their time is better spent on training on things more mainline like mechanic, sparky, carpenter etc.
Last edited by eshlon; 6th Mar 2013 at 08:20.
Gas Bags said:
I have just completed the theory and practical part of this process and I am currently waiting for the paperwork to be completed. My understanding of the system is CASA will only remove the restrictions from your old CAR30 license, now restricted B1, once you have completed the Diploma. The cheapest place by far I have found to do this is through Kangan TAFE in MEL.
What are you basing the diploma info on? When you say full B1 I assume you mean an unrestricted B1 LWTR? Are you saying that to hold an unrestricted B1 LWTR you must also hold a diploma?
Last edited by mightyauster; 6th Mar 2013 at 09:06.
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I was probably a bit OTT. But all this self regulation stuff is a bit of a worry. The self regulated "just trust us it's gunna be great" 787 demonstrates where the industry is at at the moment.
This is the new system now. You meet a required level of competence which the training organisation determines, so long as they're satisfied - have a licence.
It's not the old days anymore, no more SOE's, no more CASA surveyors, nothing. Basic Licence -> Course -> PCT -> OJT -> Type Licence.
It's not the old days anymore, no more SOE's, no more CASA surveyors, nothing. Basic Licence -> Course -> PCT -> OJT -> Type Licence.
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Part 66 was designed by the bean counters to eliminate man power costs. I full B1 guy can effectively operate on their own. How many Line maintenance task require specialised test equipment? Bye bye Avionic guy. They have been doing it in Europe for years. I know personally, B2 guys who now have a full B1 and don't know jack about mech stuff, same the other way. Fact is that now there is a shortage of licensed guys in Europe, and soon it will be in Aus. Until then we will be screwed over.
As for foreigners coming to Aus, whilst I totally disagree with the 457 Visa for aviation, a lot of Singapore LAE's paid out of their own pocket, took leave etc. Far more did it them selves than people I know from QF who were expecting the company to do it. Go do it yourselves if you are worried about your job, its happened, its crap and no amount of whinging will change it.
So when I come up to a job against you with my full CASA and EASA B1/B2 licenses you can only blame yourself.
As for foreigners coming to Aus, whilst I totally disagree with the 457 Visa for aviation, a lot of Singapore LAE's paid out of their own pocket, took leave etc. Far more did it them selves than people I know from QF who were expecting the company to do it. Go do it yourselves if you are worried about your job, its happened, its crap and no amount of whinging will change it.
So when I come up to a job against you with my full CASA and EASA B1/B2 licenses you can only blame yourself.