Qantas must break unions: Ryanair co-founder

[HANOI]

Originally Posted by Sunfish

.Furthermore the entire Australian economy, with the exception of Telstra and Qantas, has had to go through the process of coping with international competition and its about time it was your turn- its only fair.

Why won't you acknowledge that Qantas competes with some 38 other international airlines out of Australia.
Hope you found someone to sign you into the yacht club

[lowerlobe]

There is nothing academic or theoretical about Sunfish's delusional theory .

It is just about wanting revenge for Ansett....Pure and Simple

Gilligan did not need to have someone sign him in ,he is cleaning the boats and re fueling them.I hope you got some tips on the weekend Gilligan especially about economy and employment.

The other part I'm curious about is how many marinas are there in Melbourne.I mean comparing Sydney harbour or our other water ways to Port Phillip Bay is like comparing a pool to a water treatment plant.Why would you want to go out on Port phillip bay unless you had to....and I'm trying hard to think of a good reason.

[Whiskey Oscar Golf]

Mr. Sunfish, am I stupid for buying the $600 generator that was built in Australia and has quality and after sales service? I can also be safe in the knowledge that it kept an AUSTRALIAN in a job. Your idea that people will always go for the cheapest is the type of thinking that doesn't give credit to your customers, price is not always the guiding factor.
Competition works great in theory but it is never that simple. Industries will simply use other more subtle means to protect themselves, as has already been pointed out in this thread. I too studied economics at Uni and one of the first things I noticed was it's relevance to real world was a very distant blip.
As to the thread, unions can play a crucial role in the productivity and profitability of a company. Managers should realise that by working with unions they can achieve some very good outcomes. It doesn't help anyone to move into an adversorial situation. The aged stereotype of the red ragged union is gone and the sooner the bias and small mindedness dissappears the better off we'll all be. Unions don't want companies to go under, they employ their members. They just want a fair go.

[DirtyPierre]

would I pay $30.00 for a pizza when I can go to a shop a few blocks away and pay $6.00 for the same pizza,

I do buy the more expensive pizza quite often from the real Pizzeria around the corner because they taste better.

Do I see you guys turn down the $99.00 Chinese generator at Bunnings in favour of buying the $600.00 Australian equivalent?

Actually, I do buy the more expensive brand and not the chinese copy at about 1/6th the price because I know it will last longer than 24 months (usually it is when the bloody waranty expires that the f$#king thing stops working).

[Elroy Jettson]

Have to agree Guys, the world does have another alternative to full service airlines, but that does not mean that there is no longer a place for full service airlines in the market. Otherwise, we would be arguing that a release of the 2007 Hyundai wil surely put Mercedes out of business. Of course it wont, completely separate markets. Qantas would be better advised to separate itself in the consumers minds as a superior product, like the mercedes, and not seek convergence with a company that is not even in the same market.

The management of course know this, they have watched full service airlines fail by trying to compete in a low cost market with full service overheads. It doesnt work. Qantas has a reasonable product. But its delivery of that product, ie its service is its downfall. The planes are old, the staff are pissed off, and their service is rubbish. This is where Qantas fails, charging for a product that they continually fail to deliver. They are not failing purely because there is a cheaper option. They will fail because they are in the full service market, and there are better options.

The analogy is Jaguar goes broke because you can buy a merc or a BMW for the same or cheaper. The Jag owners didnt all go out and start buying a Hyundai Getz.

[Chronic Snoozer]

Two things that struck me – firstly is that $600 generator you bought at Bunnings actually ‘made in Australia’ or ‘designed in Australia’? If it’s the latter, then you’ll probably find its manufactured in SE Asia and you’re getting ripped off buddy. Chasing a ‘brand’ is not always a solution because when you dig deeper they’ve moved their manufacturing base outside their home country eg Bosch. (beginning to sound like our QANTAS)

Secondly, the car industry – why do we still put a tariff on luxury cars? When that’s removed we can move onto airlines. Can someone explain why I must pay a premium to buy the best engineered cars in the world i.e. Mercedes, BMW et al?

Having said that I do like the idea of an Australian flag carrier providing full service – and if I can have that a marginally higher cost than a ‘no brand, no frills’ carrier I will pick it every time. I’ve had my taste of Jetstar and will never again travel with them. Unfortunately it seems QANTAS is too focussed on shareholders and not on stakeholders.

……and can I just say the apparent disparity between management remuneration and the workforce appears obscene and un-Australian…..

[Sunfish]

Why won't you acknowledge that Qantas competes with some 38 other international airlines out of Australia.
Hope you found someone to sign you into the yacht club

Well you twist the facts to suit your theory hanoi. The reality is that capacity is "managed", and that Qantas has the lions share, and that no one else is allowed to increase capacity.

As for your second comment, I would assume you have never seen the inside of any club, yachting or otherwise. Nor are you likely to in future.

So sorry, I forget that you are a card carrying member of the "Sydney" club, that advances the fortunes of that fair city while claiming at the same time to be "Australias' airline.

May you choke on your traffic, you deserve it.

[Eastwest Loco]

One of the most erudite, informative and intelligent posts I have ever read in here numskull.

Thank you for that.

Best regards

EWL

[Sunfish]

And furthermore, every other international airline is struggling to make a profit and Qantas gets flowers and chocolates for making $1.0 billion profit? What does that tell you absent the fact that QF management are not nobel prize winners?

It tells you that Qantas have an unfare (deliberate error) advantage.

I hope that your new owners rip your guts out and then provide an equal service to EACH AND EVERY State capital.

[Chimbu chuckles]

And furthermore, every other international airline is struggling to make a profit

Every other international airline except for BA,KLM, SQ, EK, KA, CX, NZ, Korean, Oceana, Eva...I could go on

[noip]

Sunfish,

Your anger diminishes your argument. Like others you have accused of being selective in their facts, so have you. Restricting the argument to Australia makes it of no useful value.

In this distorted world aviation market, with bilateral agreements etc, Qantas enjoys no more advantage on its home turf than does any other international carrier on theirs. In fact, I would suggest that the home advantage of airlines such as Sing Air, Thai or Malaysian far exceeds that of QF... And let's not get started on protectionism in the land of the free.

You are correct in that things aren't perfect, but I would suggest other strategies to correct the inequities.

Rgds

N

[roamingwolf]

Boys and Girls I think we finally have a pic of Sunfish.I think he is the tosser who tried to board a QF aircraft in Mel which was flying to LHR wearing that t-shirt.

Notice the ****** is in melbourne and Both are tossers …I have an MBA…I’m going to the yacht club.

Sunfish.mate I reckon the only yacht club you spend time in is your bath tub where the only member is you playing with yourself.

[woftam]

Originally Posted by Sunfish

I hope that your new owners rip your guts out and then provide an equal service to EACH AND EVERY State capital.

What a sad vindictive little person you are Sunfish.
We have had the displeasure of you slowly but surely revealing your true self on these forums.
Build a bridge and get over it mate.

[HANOI]

Originally Posted by Sunfish

As for your second comment, I would assume you have never seen the inside of any club, yachting or otherwise. Nor are you likely to in future.

As a member for some 20 years of the Royal Papua Yacht Club , amongst others , next week I shall ask my fellow members to join me in a toast to this hilarious failed social climber but less fortunate individual.
Give it up Sunfish , you are losing on all counts.

[cart_elevator]

Now Sunfish, have I got this right? You are upset that QF has the majority of it's international flights operating out of or via SYD?

I am from Melbourne myself, and cant wait to get back on a tram, however dont you realise that every major international carrier has a 'Base' city where the majority of their operations depart from or through?

Do you think BA has as many direct flights from Manchester as it has from London? That Thai Airways has as many direct international flights from Phuket as it does from Bangkok? [insert every other major airline into analogy]

Although I am no fan of Sydney as a city myself (sorry guys!), it seems entirely logical that Qantas would have more direct flights out of there than Melbourne. Asides from that being where the airline is based, Sydney has a larger population, and is much more of a '1st step' for tourists than Melbourne (and lets face it they generally go North after Sydney rather, than South!).

More services direct to Melbounre isnt going to change that fact.

Qantas is not a government-owned public transport system, it is a company that has to make a profit or it will close. If Qantas put as many direct flights out of Melbourne as Sydney, it would go bankrupt! We all know how ruthless QF management are, if they could make more $ flying to more destinations from other cities in Australia, don’t you think they would? Or do you honestly believe there is a conspiracy amongst QF management to knowlingly limit their bonus-earning-potential by ignoring a 'secret market' of 'melbourne to everywhere' services?

Now I may be a lowly air-hostess (gingerly treading in pilot territory by posting here) but even I can see why Melbourne doesn’t have the same number of direct flights and destinations as Sydney has.
I hope I aren’t pointing out something that others have already pointed out to Sunfish ( it is kinda obvious!)

I am all for the Melbourne-Sydney rivalry, but to suggest you hope that our new employer ‘rips our guts out’ just because the company we work for bases itself in Sydney is… well … taking that friendly rivalry between the two cities to a new and kinda scary level.

I suggest a bex and a good lie down ! (oh and whilst lying down, think of all the great sporting events Melbourne has that Sydney doesnt, it will help!)

[max autobrakes]

You are more than welcome to post to your hearts content Cart_elevator.
Never bite the hand that feeds you I always say!

[amos2]

So, you're a lowly air hostess, Cart?

Would you like to tell us what that is?

[frangatang]

Isnt this mr ryan the same prick that started ryanair with BAC111 swith romanian pilots that didnt eer..have a proper licence,and couldnt speak english to boot.The current oleary,chief of ryanair seems to have ample time to follow his geegees whilst flogging the staff.the earlier comment about BA cabincrew sickness.It was destined for them as their social sickness was appalling..to be seen at wimbledon etc on TV.funny how they dont like the interviews to put put the skids under them.About ferking time.

[Centaurus]

The aged stereotype of the red ragged union is gone

You obviously haven't tried to pick up a labouring or brickies job at a CFMEU building site in Melbourne. Regardless of new legislation it is still no ticket - no start and that won't change, believe me..

[podbreak]

Cost base? Market!

Far from labelling Mr Ryan foolish;

It would be naive of me to suggest that a new backpacker hostel would put the local Hilton out of business