BELFAST INTERNATIONAL AIRPORT - BFS (Aldergrove)

[clareview]

The comparison with the Republic of Ireland needs to be based on facts. Yes the EU and its member states have given Ireland a substantial loan - its a repayable loan based on Ireland achieving certain targets and yes the UK is part of that loan arrangement and yes Ireland wants to encourage every possible visitor and yes Ireland is dropping APD but from €3 to zero whereas from Belfast to Newark its £60 and £12 each way from Northern Ireland to the rest of the UK

[ara01jbb]

There's two arguments for scrapping APD in NI, and it's important each is articulated clearly. From the statements given by airports and airlines it's clear that not everyone is singing from the same sheet.

1) NI residents depend on air travel as a necessity for domestic travel to a greater extent than people in England, Wales and Scotland.

2) NI is the only part of UK to have a land border with another EU country, and is very close to a major international airport in that country that has no APD.

Separating but articulating both points should make for a compelling argument to win folk over in Westminster.

I hope...

[TSR2]

NI residents depend on air travel as a necessity for domestic travel to a greater extent than people in England, Wales and Scotland.

I don't understand why this should be the case.

[tigger2k8]

Quote:
NI residents depend on air travel as a necessity for domestic travel to a greater extent than people in England, Wales and Scotland.

I don't understand why this should be the case.


(http://www.pprune.org/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=6560045&noquote=1)Why shouldn't it? A lot of people living here in N.Ireland have family in the mainland (myself included) the most direct way for me to visit them is by air, in a way it is the only way (yes there is a boat, but then id have 4-5 hours travelling after getting off the boat). If i lived in the mainland i could choose from driving, buses, trains and flying... not to mention the business travel which is a necessity for some.. We are an isolated country depending on air travel for links with the mainland, boardered with a country soon to offer zero tax, if thats not a disadvantage to the N.I economy and those living in N.Ireland then i dont know what is..

Time will tell ..

[eastern wiseguy]

I don't understand why this should be the case.


Try driving or taking a train..........:ugh:

[ara01jbb]

I don't understand why this should be the case.

From autumn 2011, Stena are will pull a fast one on the Port of Stranraer (so to speak) and move their Scottish terminal a couple of miles closer to the mouth of Loch Ryan. In doing so, they'll save a packet in fuel and be able to advertise "shorter" journeys (although they'll take just as long, because the HSS is being replaced with a slower conventional ferry). This is what they did a few years ago in Belfast by moving the terminal out to the very edge of the Port of Belfast, necessitating a longer bus or taxi transfer for foot passengers.

With this move, NI will lose its last remaining rail and sail connection to Great Britain. Only Stena accept rail and sail tickets, and only from the Port of Belfast (even though Larne Harbour is rail connected :ugh:).

The frankly quite comfortable (in a berth) London / Stranraer / Belfast overnight sleeper train was cut in the 1990s, the Newcastle / Carlisle / Stranraer / Belfast train was cut a few years ago, and soon you won't even be able to get a train to Glasgow.

If you still don't believe why the economy and people of NI are dependent on air travel, then I guess you think that this will appeal (http://www.translink.co.uk/Documents/Services/Ulsterbus%20Tours/CC%20Express%20Summer%20120411.pdf) (pdf) to clients, employers and family members. :}

[clareview]

look at the map - I am not aware of any cars or trains that can go on water

[TSR2]

Tigger2K8

Yes I appreciate the advantages of alternative transport on the mainland compared with NI, but I'm not so sure that a strong enough case could be made for lower ADT if based mainly on the need to visit friends and relations. I'm sure that the ADT at £12 (each way) would not stop most people from visiting relations although obviously it may be a factor if visiting many times per year.

I am no supporter of the ADT and all I am saying is that I find it difficult to understand why NI should be treated differently to the mainland with reference to Domestic flights. I do however have an open mind on this and I'm willing to be convinced otherwise.

[clareview]

There is a ferry from Belfast to Birkenhead that takes either all day or all night but then trains or buses or cars are needed. Someone living in London and needing to visit Edinburgh on business can fly, take the train, the coach or drive. Someone in Northern Ireland needing to go to Edinburgh must drive via the ferry or fly - less choice

[clareview]

There is much more to the issue than NI folk visiting friends and relatives. Inward investment and inward tourism is a big issue - per head of population Northern Ireland lags way behind the Republic in tourism numbers, partly due to the lack of a level playing field - someone from the US visiting Northern Ireland has to find an extra £60 complared to someone visiting the Republic of Ireland

[j636]

The EU are not going to let NI have no tax and the rest of UK have it. It casts as discrimination and UK gov will have a court case on there hands with EU. Other countries in EU are joined and some have tax and others don't.

I also see NI are now giving out about ROI reducing VAT of some services.

[BFS101]

The EU are not going to let NI have no tax and the rest of UK have it. It casts as discrimination and UK gov will have a court case on there hands with EU. Other countries in EU are joined and some have tax and others don't.

Quote from the HM Revenue & Customs website...
APD is not payable on flights departing from airports in the Scottish Highlands and Islands.

The following airports, capable of taking dutiable aircraft, are situated in the Highlands and Islands region for the purpose of this exemption:

Barra
Benbecula
Campbeltown
Inverness
Islay
Kirkwall
Stornoway
Sumburgh
Tiree and
Wick
Flights from other areas of the UK to airports in this region are liable to APD at the appropriate rate.

So APD tax differences already exist (albeit on a smaller scale) within the UK.

[Aaron9890]

It says they are stopping the Sharm el Sheik route on the 13 of October on wikipedia. It also says they are starting Minorca next May. Is any of this true>>??

[AOCMALL0W]

The EU are not going to let NI have no tax and the rest of UK have it. It casts as discrimination and UK gov will have a court case on there hands with EU. Other countries in EU are joined and some have tax and others don't.

I also see NI are now giving out about ROI reducing VAT of some services.

As I have said people in N.I pick and chose the parts of the UK they like and the bits they don't. They complain when the Republic makes itself more compeditive, but its fine when hundreds of thousands of people in the Republic spend their money up North, taking business away from our own. They need to realise they can't have everything their own way and get over the APD Tax, your part of the UK, you should pay just as much as someone living in Scotland to fly.

[Jamie2k9]

very good post AOCMALL0W.

It says they are stopping the Sharm el Sheik route on the 13 of October on wikipedia. It also says they are starting Minorca next May. Is any of this true>>??

All on thomson website.

[NWSRG]

AOCMALLOW,

NI politicians and business people are entitled to lobby for any economic change that brings benefit or advantage to NI plc. As already highlighted in this thread, UK Customs & Excise already exempt some Scottish airports from APD, so the precedent is there, and the EU have no power to counter it. Further, if APD is devolved to Scottish, Welsh or NI legislatures, then those bodies could apply it as they see fit.

You seem quite annoyed that "people in NI pick and chose (sic) the parts of the UK they like". I take it you mean the parts of UK legislation rather than the towns / cities / regions? Well, anyone will complain about some facets of life in their own country. It doesn't mean you don't lobby to change it.

ROI will rightly fight it's own corner...so don't try to deny NI citizens the right to call for changes that will work in our own favour either. In the context of the UK, NI has a reasonable argument for reduced APD. We don't need to justify that to Dublin...it is our governments responsibility to ensure all parts of the UK are competitive, and if lower APD in NI helps to achieve that, then we are entitled to argue for it.

[Jamie2k9]

NI has a reasonable argument for reduced APD. We don't need to justify that to Dublin

Thats true but some people on here think ROI should not have reduced travel tax just because the North does and they should be made put it back by London.

People using the bail out loan as an excuse when it has nothing to do with it. The main reason UK gave it was because the ROi supports the NI ecomney and likewise the other way round.

You seem quite annoyed that "people in NI pick and chose

They have a point. You didn't see ROI going to London to make NI have the same VAT as ROI when many people were going up North to shop. Even though they weren't happy about the VAT rate.

If the tax goes airlines are not going to add routes of reduce prices. Airlines have no problems adding sun routes and paying the tax. The only real benefit will be the airlines and not he ecomney.

I do accept the charge needs to go for CO which NI needs the route and that will be the only real benefit.

Look at it this way Easyjet have no problem adding BFS, GLA and EDI from SEN but on the other had they are saying the tax is damaging them. That is them being hypocritical. So why add routes if the tax is so damaging to domestic flights.

Can anybody justify that?

[NWSRG]

They have a point. You didn't see ROI going to London to make NI have the same VAT as ROI when many people were going up North to shop. Even though they weren't happy about the VAT rate.

The reason that the ROI government did not lobby London was because no government has any right to interfere with the internal poilitical decisions of another country...pure and simple. Let's not pretend this was some charitable decision on the part of Dail Eireann.

Time to get real here folks. NI people can rightfully lobby for betterment of our own economy, just as ROI folk can for theirs. In this case, NI is arguing for the equalising of a tax that advantages our nearest competitor...we are lobbying our own government, about an internal tax. That's exactly what our representatives are paid to do.

[Jamie2k9]

The reason that the ROI government did not lobby London was because no government has any right to interfere with the internal poilitical decisions of another country...pure and simple. Let's not pretend this was some charitable decision on the part of Dail Eireann.

Time to get real here folks. NI people can rightfully lobby for betterment of our own economy, just as ROI folk can for theirs. In this case, NI is arguing for the equalising of a tax that advantages our nearest competitor...we are lobbying our own government, about an internal tax. That's exactly what our representatives are paid to do.

All that is true but I'm pointing out that some people from NI think that if the ROI gets something they don't like that they want Lodon to make the ROI not have it when it can't happon. Read a few pages back.

This is the way media are writing about it. Don't want to name the paper involved.

[j636]

Look at it this way Easyjet have no problem adding BFS, GLA and EDI from SEN but on the other had they are saying the tax is damaging them. That is them being hypocritical. So why add routes if the tax is so damaging to domestic flights.

Can anybody justify that?

Thats a very good point.

[Facelookbovvered]

There is a huge question mark as to whether the ROI will be able to fund the interest payments let alone the principal give the small size of it's economy, but that is a side show to the APD issue.

In many ways the same logic of either the South or the North applies to the UK mainland which is of course an island, you could argue that APD should only apply to flights within the UK mainland in order to reduce air travel within the UK.

APD is blunt but very effective tax raising instrument wearing green clothes and it will take a lot of b*lls to scrap without a political bun fight, the same applies to the feed in tarif paid for solar panels that is driving up utility bills an bio fuels forcing up wheat prices.

Back to BFS

By how much do people think flights would increase if APD were scrapped for flights in and or out of NI? Or is this just about CO? It would be cheaper just to scrap the charge for US flights

[AOCMALL0W]

Then what the hell does it have to do with you? I only got involved because of your idiotic and unjust remarks. We will be paying back every penny we recieve, if we use the money the UK is so kindly "giving" us with interest not to mention the commitment fee we pay if we don't use it. It is not free. You also mention our small economy which is worth quite a lot to the UK including LITTLE Northern Ireland. We could chose to drag you down with us if we decide enough is enough and default. People in Northern Ireland should pay just as much as every other British citizen to fly, it wouldn't be fair to people on the island of Britain. N.I gets way more than its fair share of capital to run the place and you expect to be exempt from APD as well? Everyone in the UK, given the state of its economy, has had to make cuts and contributions why shouldn't N.I also?
If the CO service isn't viable under present conditions that it will be cut...thats business and aviation...get over it, the UK government I am sure will have a lot more important things to worry about then N.I residents using DUB to go to Spain or wherever on their holidays.

[tigger2k8]

*sigh* is this still the BFS topic?

if N.Ireland deserves to pay the same level of ADP as the mainland then does that mean those in the exempt Scottish airports also should pay?

Jobs and important business contracts could be lost (years of hard work) if CO pulls the route... even if long-haul had a tax reduction it would help.

AOCMALL0W, you can be rest assured that if things were reversed you would be kicking up believing that ROI gets a fair rate.. is it the threat of N.I being able to compete against DUB and other airports thats got you so objected?

[j636]

AOCMALL0W, you can be rest assured that if things were reversed you would be kicking up believing that ROI gets a fair rate.. is it the threat of N.I being able to compete against DUB and other airports thats got you so objected?

Not lightly as all you get from Belfast is a flight to a hoilday resort.

BFS will never compete against DUB on any route. Currently what has BFS got that DUB dosn't???????????

Jamie2k9 i also read that article and the journalist clearly done no research. If he did he would know that ROI have not taken a penny off UK yet.

The only benefit to NI if it is scrapped is that CO will stay. Until CO brought it to attention of NI gov, no other airline in NI was making a big deal out of it.

I can see the US tax going to but not the other one. Something will have to give some where if all travel tax is scrapped from NI.

Your right it is getting a little boaring now.

[AIRPORT66]

Well take CO have stated they won't give up on Bfs/newark lighly they will give the government a chance to sort out the APD issue which will be sorted if people want to go from Dub after that well let them could'nt care less Bfs get the route secured then thats good for them and then it will give them bigger chance in getting the Toronto route re-stated .The loads on the sanford have been brilliant 4oo pax each time not bad for a route that was doomedto fail even before started.Maybe the Dub supporters are afraid of Bfs getting the APD scrapped taking more business from Dub after all its around 1.7 million per annum.p.S Sorry for my grammer

[j636]

And who do they plan on getting to operate YYZ.

Air Transit and Air Canafa would not operate from BFS while at DUB.

airport66 you do need to get into the real world.

[AIRPORT66]

Well how do you know that do you work in the airline industry and at BFS.Can tell you that you are so wrong just someone that comes on here with a silly opinion








Do you work in the airline industry or at Bfs well can tell you something you are totally wrong trust me.

[j636]

Work in airline industry.

BFS needs to get more flights to Europe and if tax goes airlines have to give something in return like ROI which is working and airlines are adding rotues and increasing services.

Air Canada only to fly to major European cities. Rule them out. Also AC DUB - YYZ season is very short compared to Air Transit. Air Transit fly to major and others cities. Would be the one that would look at BFS. Although they have aircraft leaving the feet and they have no orders of new ones.

As BFS is so close to DUB and DUB is the main transport hub of the island airlines and particually US carriers would chose it and they would get a better deal.

[AIRPORT66]

Well its quite obvious you are from down south or DUB supporter you are so wrong one of the airlines mentioned have comitted to BFS if they get things sorted they will give it a go.Get rid of theses taxes and be easier for them to do business with the airlines.

[j636]

From London but its you choose weather you believe it. No odds to me.

If the taxes go BFS is still at a disadvantage.

Start US route from DUB - don't pay full airport charges until the 6 year of operation.
Start US route from BFS - pay full airport charges.

[AIRPORT66]

Of course Dub has big advantage over Bfs bigger market plus catchment surely thats going to happen an airline will go were it gets the best deal but if a flight started from BFS to say YYZ will fill the aircraft.There has been flights to YYZ before from both airports and they have been successful the problem is the airlines want money to start up they know the market is there and know the airport wants the route so they push the airport as far as they can push them .Aircanada have loads of aircraft sitting doing nothing and the right size to do the BFSoperation so i say to the 1.7million people who fly from Dub and come from the north support your own airport 600 thousand of those pax fly to the usa.

[clareview]

Level playing fields are almost impossible. Firstly there can be government intervention with the likes of APD (and the UK did have Westminister and, I think European, permission to have the Air Route Development grant a few years ago) then airport owners can do special deals to get airlines to start routes - perhaps such incentives can be broadly based (any new route) or narrowly focused - e.g routes to the US.Then comes the PSO subsidies to support routes to remote regions in the EU. Finally general taxation policy - corporation tax, tax on fuel etc. all play a part

The Irish government, and Dublin airport, have made use of most of these and, of course, APD in the Republic is being dropped to try to help reverse the disasterous drop in tourism numbers, not caused by the recession in Ireland but by the worldwide economic downturn.

the simple fact is that Northern Ireland is the only part of the UK to have a land border with another country or, to put it another way, Great Britain is one fo the very few EU countries not to have a land border

[clareview]

j636

Who or what is Air TRANSIT and Air CANFA?

Air Transat operated successfully in to BFS from Toronto for many years but withdrew a couple of years ago, probably due to intense competition from Zoom and Globespan. Air Canada has also operated over the years into BFS (with Tristars and then B747's)

Of course Air Transat has built its summer operation in Dublin to a 4 times a week (some services split between Toronto and Montreal) and Air Canada is daily.

Similarly not many years ago there was a long (March-October) season weekly from BFS to Orlando/Sanford (with 2 flights a week in the peak) this has now reduced to a couple of flights per season.

Is everyone driving to Dublin?

Would the right size aircraft, with similar APD levels as the Republic, encourage Northern Ireland business to both places?

[Jamie2k9]

Of course Air Transat has built its summer operation in Dublin to a 4 times a week (some services split between Toronto and Montreal)

TS operate a total of 5 flights per week.
YUL - direct 1 weekly
YYZ - direct 2 weekly, via SNN 2 weekly

[NWSRG]

Is everyone driving to Dublin?

Would the right size aircraft, with similar APD levels as the Republic, encourage Northern Ireland business to both places?

Correct clareview,

With competitive fares, NI people will generally favour BFS. The road to DUB is much improved, and T2 is a massive improvement over T1, but the relative ease of getting through BFS coupled with it's nearness makes it a given, if the fares are similar.

We're proving that 4 x JFK is viable (and more in summer), and we know there is a market for YYZ. Add in a very strong seasonal MCO, and there is clearly scope for long-haul at BFS. Maybe the arrival of 787s (AC/VS etc.) will offer something...

[tigger2k8]

Not lightly as all you get from Belfast is a flight to a hoilday resort.

BFS will never compete against DUB on any route. Currently what has BFS got that DUB dosn't???????????Yes and the reasons you have posted above are soley due to Tax rates, not long ago there was a lot more long haul flights from BFS... i said "if" things had been reversed, for example of ROI had high tax and N.I didn't then the poster would no doubt be calling for a drop in tax for fairness.... The only reason people travel to DUB is because they have to or its cheaper... if it was a fair tax system up here to compete you can be assured that there would be less who travel to DUB from N.I...

i used to travel to Canada quite often, last time i went was with GSM sometime between 2004-2007.... have flown out of DUB once or twice in my life, but have vowed not to do so again the drive annoys me, especially after a long flight.. now if only BFS had a couple more direct flights during summer... oh wait, we would if APD was dropped / reduced... as far as i remember APD is why TCX had planned not to run any long haul this year, however they are performing a handful of flights, which seem to be at full capacity, if not closer... which proves the demand is there.

The tax is harmful in general, to all 3 airports in N.I, not just BFS.. there could be some real growth if something changes..

Obviously you support DUB and will type anything to dismiss N.I to get a fair tax system, i know i would more than likely be negative in my posts if N.I had no tax / cheaper tax and ROI was wanting to drop theirs

[j636]

The tax is harmful in general, to all 3 airports in N.I, not just BFS.. there could be some real growth if something changes

I agree the £60 is harmful to the whole UK and particular NI, It should be dropped but until CO started going on about it, there was no other airline in NI complaining about the real affect it is having on flights from there compared to ROI.

CO has a good case but the other carriers (EZY, EI, LS, TOM) don't and the airlines will be the only benefit in there profits, no extra passengers from Europe, UK to NI if the tax goes.

[Torque2]

Tigger: however they are performing a handful of flights, which seem to be at full capacity, if not closer... which proves the demand is there.


Not exactly, it proves the demand is there for the 12th fortnight period. You will note that there are no 'through' flights this year, only dedicated BFS passenger flights. That is because of the Border Force requirement to have transiting pax get off at the first point of entry and go through immigration complete with their belongings then reboard the same aircraft to go onwards to MAN, LGW, GLA or wherever. That had not been the case previously and so the longhaul season could be extended by combining pax from other UK airportsthrough BFS.

It is nice to see full aircraft but obviously the demand isn't there for a longer term or TCX would be providing a longer service period.

[BFS101]

On another internet forum, a poster states that he has recently got a job as EZY crew at Belfast, and that new routes in the pipeline for BFS include Manchester (confirmed), Southend (rumoured), Athens, Prague and Tenerife.

I could almost see Prague and Tenerife as potentials, but Athens??? Currently only LGW, MAN and EDI have Athens flights from EZY, unlikely I think. Anyone shed any light??

[Jamie2k9]

So does this mean EZY may base a A320 here. SEN is confirmed goes on sale sometime this month.

but Athens??? Currently only LGW, MAN and EDI have Athens flights from EZY, unlikely I think.

Have to agree. ATH is a very expensive airport to operate form and don't think there would be demand for it although other Greek routes would work.

[tigger2k8]

So does this mean EZY may base a A320 here

An A320 has been planned for about 2-3 years now, however due to the downturn in travel in the last year or 2 it was put on hold, we might see one appear next year for summer..

This may or may not be true, but apparently EZYs plans for expansion at BFS are running 1-2 years behind schedule, so wouldn't surprise me if we see some new routes next year

but Athens??? Currently only LGW, MAN and EDI have Athens flights from EZY

Why not, KRK and MLA are destinations only available direct from about 5-7 airports, so dont see why Athens couldn't be a potential.. for summer anyway..

Torque2, thanks for the info, never heard about that change

[True Blue]

Is ADB being dropped from Bfs by TCX? It does not seem to be on sale for S12. If true, a pity as it was a very good alternative to Turkey.

TB

[Torque2]

TB, haven't any info on that but summer 2012 flying prog is nowhere near ready yet. TCX group never have anything like the final program agreed until around the end of August so it could go either way.

If the loads are anything to go by it has been a good route over the past 2 years so it stands a good chance of remaining.

[delta154]

If anyone need any Easyjet Flightplans, briefing packages, positioning flights or anything else give me a shout

No disrespect david, as I dont know easyjets in house procedures, but, are you allowed to freely give this information away? Im just making sure your back is covered.
Certainly in the airline I work for, if I gave away any breifing packages, flight plans or internal info in general, to the public, Id be pulled in instantly, and most probably given the boot?

There was also a case where a cabin crew member at Virgin was sacked for putting their safety manual on ebay.

[eastern wiseguy]

If anyone need any Easyjet Flightplans, briefing packages, positioning flights or anything else give me a shout

Posts like this should be left to spotters websites.

This thread has decayed into trivia.

That's me done with it.

[BHD2BFS]

with aer aranns PSO routes finishing this month, meaning free aircraft is there a possibility they would commences services to routes lost when bmibaby moved i.e. birmingham and cardiff? also when they left belfast city their reason was due to lack of aircraft to carry on the route and promised they would be back to reinstate flights to cork when aircraft once again became available...

could we see them at the international airport soon??

[jabird]

BHD2BFS,

Surely they would be more likely to return to BHD - but competing against BE? Really don't think they have the marketing clout to take on their much bigger rivals - what advantage do they have in terms of a/c? Nowt methinks.

[BFS101]

The provisional CAA statistics are out for June. To note that with Easyjet LTN back at Aldergrove, passengers rose from 14530 at BHD to 19683 at BFS. This is in addition to a 7% rise for BFS-LGW and a 10% rise fro BFS-STN. Seems that consolidating London routes at BFS has worked well for Easyjet.

EI lost 2% on LHR, while BD lost 17% from BHD!! Seems a bit steep, had they reduced frequencies or smaller aircraft usage??

Not had a good look through the other figures just yet.

[tigger2k8]

while BD lost 17% from BHD!! Seems a bit steep, had they reduced frequencies or smaller aircraft usage??

Using RJ145's for some of the weekend flights from BHD

[Kestrel_909]

I think there were around a dozen or so EI LHR sectors that didn't operate in June, not sure whether they were never scheduled or just cancelled, but there certainly wasn't four rotations a day, everyday, all month. I was on one recently, at a guess there was around 140-150 odd on it.

[tigger2k8]

I think there were around a dozen or so EI LHR sectors that didn't operate in June, not sure whether they were never scheduled or just cancelled, but there certainly wasn't four rotations a day, everyday, all month. I was on one recently, at a guess there was around 140-150 odd on it.

Correct, there was some flights that didn't operate, mainly occured Tues, Wed, Thurs

BFS has finally added some pictures of the new catering outlets... not on their website ( a strange move), but their FB page for those interested, look below.. someone has already asked about the arrivals cafe and the viewing gallery, the response

Yes the arrivals cafe bar will be next to be refurbished. As for the viewing gallery, it is currently out of use as it is in the airside ...area of the airport. We are looking at ways as to how we can reuse the space, however not sure yet if it will become accessible to the general public because of its location airside.

New Catering outlets Summer 2011 | Facebook (http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.191278427593272.54525.149600895094359)

[skyways1452]

In case anyone was wondering, Cityjet and Titan running 3 round trips between them to Lourdes today having positioned from Dublin and Stansted respectively. They'll return to base this evening, information is on the BIA departure board.

[BHD2BFS]

if easyjet or jet2.com are not going to take up the routes lost by the bmibaby move, why doesn't the airport try to entice ryanair to launch these routes plus they could also give us flights to prestwick, and at a long shot possibly doncaster or humberside, at the end of the day if a deal is made they dont have to be a threat to easy or jet2. or is there something in the pipe work we do not know about, although i see this very unlikely as surely it shouldnt take this long to announce

also i was just wondering for anyone that knows, why didnt the bmi group move their operations to aldergrove? the airport has no restrictions at the intl, possibly allowing for a later arrival or more flights to heathrow, and also has a fellow star alliance member operating from the airport (CO).

in my opinion baby could have launched their european routes from the intl, as they still have the same amount of competition on them (even more as jet2 have also launched faro), i dont feel the airport change will give them any help as what are they going to do if a flight is delayed? cancel it or just divert the flight back to were they used to be.

[tigger2k8]

if easyjet or jet2.com are not going to take up the routes lost by the bmibaby move, why doesn't the airport try to entice ryanair to launch these routes plus they could also give us flights to prestwick, and at a long shot possibly doncaster or humberside, at the end of the day if a deal is made they dont have to be a threat to easy or jet2. or is there something in the pipe work we do not know about, although i see this very unlikely as surely it shouldnt take this long to announce

Ryanair has tried to get into BFS twice in recent years, however no agreement was reached.. (fee's) this is dispite M'OL quoting no one wants to fly into a field in the middle of nowhere..

also i was just wondering for anyone that knows, why didnt the bmi group move their operations to aldergrove? the airport has no restrictions at the intl, possibly allowing for a later arrival or more flights to heathrow, and also has a fellow star alliance member operating from the airport (CO).

BMI would have been moving BHD-LHR, the route already exists at BFS..

in my opinion baby could have launched their european routes from the intl, as they still have the same amount of competition on them (even more as jet2 have also launched faro), i dont feel the airport change will give them any help as what are they going to do if a flight is delayed? cancel it or just divert the flight back to were they used to be.

They could have, but they decided to launch existing routes already served from BFS (at much higher prices though) existing airlines would have destroyed bmibaby at BFS.... moving to BHD saved money for bmibaby... they no longer have to pay rent for a restroom for the engineer (big money per year) delays due to tech issues are now minimised (as an engineer had to travel from BHD to BFS if something went wrong) landing fee deals also sealed the deal for the move

[EI-BUD]

and at a long shot possibly doncaster or humberside


BHD2BFS I would say a very long shot, Ryanair had tried these routes from Dublin and they were a complete flop especially Humberside. I draw a comparison with Dublin as it had a much bigger movement of passenger than BFS to England. So if they wont work for FR from DUB they wont work from BFS/BHD for them either.

Flybe did Humberside from City airport and it didnt last long at all. Same story there.

There is so much extreme views on FR good to bad, and I find them fine to fly with (though not my 1st choice) but I am firmly of the view that in a market with limited demand (NI very dependent on home market as tourism market not huge, relatively speaking) inviting FR into the Belfast would ultimately P*** off the existing carriers and probably lead to erosion of there share of traffic and potentially put FR into a strong bargaining position, not what BFS need.

EI-BUD

[BHD2BFS]

i suppose that is very true EI-BUD, then i think the best alternative must be aer lingus regional, if baby can make the routes work in a 737 then surely the load factors on the atr would be great, especially as i would say their aer lingus name is far more recognised that babys was, surely BFS could give them a good deal. and in that case we may even get a cork route

[EI-BUD]

Hey BHD2BFS; we can wish, I would be delighted to see a Belfast Cork route come back, though Aer Arann saw the number plumet on 2 daily ATR before going to 1 daily and I just cant see it happening, though it would be very convenient for me and my colleagues. The Manx2 accident doesnt create good vibes for people about flying between Belfast & Cork in what the ordinary man on the street would term 'small planes'. I realise that this doesnt seem to have an impact on Manx2 IOM route.

I agree Aer Lingus regional on BFS EMA, CWL and BHX would be a good match, though not sure Aer Arann would want to compete with Flybe as they would see them as a strong rival.

Does anyone remember Aer Lingus operating a charter between Kerry and Belfast on 735s in the mid 90s?? I vaguely remember but not sure how long that went on for....

EI-BUD

[airhumberside]

Flybe did Humberside from City airport and it didnt last long at all.
Didn't even start

[Arthur1975]

Booked flights to Turkey Izmir for next July.Lufthansa from Dublin via Frankfurt,Munich. 705 Pounds for 3 Adults 1 Children. Far Better than Charter Flight from Belfast in this area. APD for Blame maybe???

[Jamie2k9]

Booked flights to Turkey Izmir for next July.Lufthansa from Dublin via Frankfurt,Munich. 705 Pounds for 3 Adults 1 Children. Far Better than Charter Flight from Belfast in this area. APD for Blame maybe???


You do know EI fly direct from DUB?

APD you are paying to Germany.
DUB - FRA €32
FRA - MUC €32
MUC - ADB €32
ABR - MUC €32
MUC - FRA €32
FRA - DUB €32
Total €192 to German Gov. (not sure what amount in pounds)

You would of payed less if you flew from BFS.

[Arthur1975]

My cost was 197 Euro per person Return. Lufthansa is flying for free then??
Aer Ligus Price for August 2011 524 per person . Flight only. :ugh:
No Thanks
Told you
Cheapest flight. BFS-ADB 336 £ . BMI+Lufthansa:)
BFS-DLM 299£ Flight only. Mention Bags and other extras
Choice was simple:)

[Jamie2k9]

Aer Lingus so dear because its only a few weeks away but I don;t think you would get it that low with EI no matter how long you book in advance.

I was planning on going Turkey with them earlier this month and over €1000 for 2 adult. (before baggage). The route is doing very well and thats why they have such high fares + its only scheduled flight from Ireland.

[Kestrel_909]

Cheaper Arthur, but by how much?

For me personally it'd really have to be quite a significant amount to warrant driving to DUB, flying via FRA and MUC to get to ADB and the same upon the return. I haven't seen the TCX schedule for 2012, and admittedly if the ADB runs to the same Saturday night schedule as this year, it isn't ideal either but I think I'd still prefer that over the multiple-segments.

Not having a go, each of their own I know. My father is happy to travel via the mainland when going on holiday to save £100 or get an extra afternoon of the holiday, maybe I'm just a bad traveller!

[Arthur1975]

Cheaper far enough:). Cost of Long stay in Dublin allmost same like BFS.
As a spotter cant wait to visit Frankfurt and Munich for some pictures:)
Drive time not bad to Dublin after New Newry by-pass.
90% Poles flying home from Dublin due to Routes and Fares
Not good for BFS sadly
DUB 12-00 ADB 22-45. Can survive with drinks and Entertaiment:)

[Aaron9890]

I wonder why SSH is ending so quickly after starting, the PAX Numbers musn't be good at all.

[Jamie2k9]

I wonder why SSH is ending so quickly after starting, the PAX Numbers musn't be good at all.


85% load factor for June.

[Aaron9890]

85% load factor for June.

that's not particularly bad. Dont know why they are axing it then.

[BFS101]

More than likely based on very low pricing to get the bums on seats. Holidays to Egypt and Tunisia had to be discounted heavily across the UK simply to get the public to travel to these destinations following the civil unrest.

[tigger2k8]

if baby can make the routes work in a 737 then surely the load factors on the atr would be greatSome of the routes didn't work too well. EI Regional would be ideal, much lower fuel burn on the ATR than the likes of WWs 737..

90% Poles flying home from Dublin due to Routes and Fares With there being only 3/4 flights per week to KRK by EZY then a high percentage will fly home via DUB. When Wizz was around there was definately less than 90% flying from the south. When BFS-PRG operated quite a few used it to get to Poland.

According to the Southend thread, EZY will announce a few more routes on Tuesday, lets hope BFS is in there..

[BFS101]

In regard to foreign nationals travelling to and from Poland, obviously Gdansk was an option, but also Berlin and Prague. Now BFS has non of these destinations. Certainly with the abandonment of GDN, Berlin could be again sustainable, with access to not only the German capital, surrounding area, but also north and north-western Poland.

Berlin seemed to operate fairly sustainably for a number of years before being pulled, potentially due at that time to the introduction of Gdansk.

[Arthur1975]

True.True.I used Berlin every time. Now Destinations From BFS are SO Boring.
Everyone is flying in the same place.

[JonnyBfs]

True.True.I used Berlin every time. Now Destinations From BFS are SO Boring.
Everyone is flying in the same place.


Couldn't agree more!!

No germany (berlin, munich?)

no czech republic (prague)

no Canada (Toronto) - Capital city in uk, and no YYZ.
Transat operate Exeter not BFS? Could tax be the reason?

There are no real "out of the ordinary" routes - Spain, Spain and more Spain!

Will Sanford return for Summer '12 do you think? Currently not on the TCX Website.
:ugh:

[tigger2k8]

Couldn't agree more!!

No germany (berlin, munich?)

no czech republic (prague)

no Canada (Toronto) - Capital city in uk, and no YYZ.
Transat operate Exeter not BFS? Could tax be the reason?

There are no real "out of the ordinary" routes - Spain, Spain and more Spain!

Will Sanford return for Summer '12 do you think? Currently not on the TCX Website.

Yes APD is the main reason for long haul not working at BFS, its ok in the mainland when all airports are under the same tax, the airports in the mainland dont have an airport 2 hrs away with almost zero tax..

The routes currently served from BFS work, and thats why they will always stay / increase frequency, its just what the N.I traveller wants.. sun and cheap alcohol.

Sanford probably will return for peak season, as far as i remember it took thema while to release this years flights.

[BFS101]

Sanford probably will return for peak season
A one-off departure is currently on sale from BFS, 5 July 2012 for 14 nights, bookable on Thomas Cook website.

Rumours that EZY are to offer some news routes from Belfast were mentioned a few pages back, and PRG named as a potential. Personally I would have thought Berlin was a safer bet with business links into Germany, leisure travellers visiting the region and as a gateway to Poland for local Poles travelling back to their families. IIRC Berlin flights did last a good few years at BFS.

[jetsetterbfs]

Just out of interest, the new Thomson Summer 2012 brochure was released on 21st July and it is showing BFS-SSH as operating all summer.

[BFS101]

The decision to drop SSH must have happened after the brochure went to print. The Wednesday afternoon flights to SSH will be replaced with a Mahon rotation.

Holidays 4U have released their summer 2012 preliminary programme, Dalaman dropped and Bodrum to operate from 22 May to 31 July only with Onur. Turkey whilst still very popular, seems to have lost its edge of late.

[david1994]

Holidays 4U have released their summer 2012 preliminary programme, Dalaman dropped and Bodrum to operate from 22 May to 31 July only with Onur. Turkey whilst still very popular, seems to have lost its edge of late.

I hope not :( 3 weeks ago I booked a holiday with them for next July, flights are as follws:

http://www.h4u.co.uk/Images/Search/outbound.gif
Tue 24th Jul 12: Belfast > Dalaman (OHY224 - A321-200)
09:50 Depart Belfast (BFS) - 16:05 Arrive Dalaman (DLM)

http://www.h4u.co.uk/Images/Search/inbound.gif
Tue 31st Jul 12: Dalaman > Belfast (OHY223 - A320-200)
06:00 Depart Dalaman (DLM) - 08:50 Arrive Belfast (BFS)

[tigger2k8]

Turkey will never completely lose its edge, there is a slight decrease in flights this year after goldtrail went bust, (used to be 5 flights on a mon or tues evening last summer operated by onur air and turkuaz airlines). If EZY ever base an A320 in BFS id say we will see a flight to Turkey appear, if they dont do it.. its a missed opportunity

For those interested, Superdrug is now open, located beside WHSmith...

[BFS101]

David, it would appear that Dalaman is bookable from Belfast, however only Bodrum is listed in the flight programme. Must be an oversight, and seems Dalaman flights are planned to operate.

I think Turkey will remain popular, just not at the level seen recently. Last year TOM operated Dalaman on Mondays and Thursday nights, this year they only operate on the Monday, and would seem that Izmir is not to operate for 2012 at the minute. This is in addition to the reduction in Goldtrail capacity.

[david1994]

Incase anyone didnt realise the B733 operating the DUBROVNIK flights this morning went tech, this would have caused a knock on effect for the MJV, the aircraft left 7hrs left so an Air Finland B757 (OH-AFL) was chartered in to cover the Murcia Flights.

[BHD2BFS]

southend route is announced tomorrow :)

maybe prague and berlin will come with it (long shot i know)

[BFS101]

Easyjet seats now on-sale up to the end of June 12. Southend available for booking!!

[david1994]

There has been some major changes in Easyjet over the last few weeks. Soon Easyjet will annoucne new routes from Belfast opeating to Athens, Prague and Tenerife. Also Easyjet have purchased a new name "Easyjet Atlantic"

[nef]

Why are EZY so keen to launch ATH routes? Surely given the crisis in Greece it's one of the last places that the airline should be moving into, especially on routes where there's no real history of consistent previous scheduled service like EDI and BFS-ATH.

[TSR2]

Also Easyjet have purchased a new name "Easyjet Atlantic"

Is this the old 2008 chestnut of the once proposed link-up between easyjet and Virgin Atlantic to purchase Gatwick Airport?

[BHD2BFS]

david1994 how did you find out about this news? also do you know when they will be launched?

[AIRPORT66]

Would have thought routes to Berlin,Lisbon,Warsaw, would have been better not those 3?

[david1994]

Is this the old 2008 chestnut of the once proposed link-up between easyjet and Virgin Atlantic to purchase Gatwick Airport? Nope they have only just recently purchased the name

david1994 how did you find out about this news? also do you know when they will be launched? I know someone that works for Easyjet Ops not exactly sure when they will be launched still sorting out slot times and aircraft, an A320 will make an appearence

[BHD2BFS]

i thought i heard someone say on this a while back that madrid and lisbon was coming

[Aaron9890]

still don understand why they dont do Madrid. They would make a fortune!

[EGAC is Better]

Madrid, Lisbon and Berlin would be great if they was offered from Belfast but do we have enough travellers interested in going off the usual beaten track of bucket and spade to sustain such routes?

If David is right, all I will say is, another Tenerife....... On the face of it Athens sounds silly but happy to be proved wrong. Surely year round to Turkey would be a better option in that direction to serve all those people who own property out there? I suppose EasyJet know their customers better than all of us so good luck to them on whatever 'new' routes we get.

Southend could be a really money spinner for Easy if they could sweet talk rail companies into offering a few less stops on the run into Liverpool St.

[tigger2k8]

I see EZY has decided to increase AMS frequencies after the "trail" in September.., will be as below during winter

Sun, Mon, Fri = x2
Tues, Wed,Thurs, Sat = Daily

[BFS101]

I wonder does baby BHD-AMS have anything to do with this also???

[True Blue]

Is Ltn returning to Bfs based from start of S12?

TB

[david1994]

Is Ltn returning to Bfs based from start of S12?

TB

Yes from the 26th March 2012.

[tigger2k8]

Is Ltn returning to Bfs based from start of S12?

TB

As David has said, yes, but not on all flights, first departure Mon-Fri is BFS based.

[BFS101]

Easyjet ups Dutch and Swiss flights, press release.

EasyJet ups Dutch and Swiss flights - Northern Ireland, Local & National - Belfasttelegraph.co.uk (http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/easyjet-ups-dutch-and-swiss-flights-16028714.html)

[EI-BUD]

Yes from the 26th March 2012


Let me get this right, after EZY have said that they want to consolidate all of there ops at BFS and after having seen no tangible benefits to operating from BHD and now that they are again performing better from BFS on the LTN route than it did as a BHD route LY why on earth would they move some of the flights over from March next year?
Seems most odd to me.

Unless BHD are paying them a tidy sum to operate some of the flights?
There is no listing of this either on Easyjet.com or on Staff Travel.
EI-BUD

[True Blue]

Ei-bud, i referred to Bfs, not Bhd. The first departure is operating by a Bfs based unit from start of S12.

Does this mean Ezy are increasing based units at Bfs from then?

TB

[tigger2k8]

Does this mean Ezy are increasing based units at Bfs from then?

TB

Unless new routes appear, no.. will remain 5 for Winter 2011 and 6 for Summer 2012 (arriving sometime between 26th March to 30th June), if new routes appear with depatures before 0730 and no changes to other flight times, a 7th A/C will be needed

[EI-BUD]

Sorry True Blue my mistake, misinterpreted the posts!

[Jamie2k9]

With MAN and LTN morning flights being BFS based aircraft for summer 2012, what routes that are BFS based in the mornings this year will be moved to accommodate LTN and MAN next summer?

[BFS101]

BFS based 1st wave departures (May):
ALC 06.10
STN 06.15
LGW 06.25
MAN 07.00
LTN 07.00
EDI 07.05

From other respective bases:
GLA 08.05
LPL 08.15
NCL 08.20
BRS 08.35
SEN 08.40

BCN, FAO, KRK, AGP and NCE depart between 09.40 and 10.00 on their respective days of operation, FAO and AGP daily.

[david1994]

Don't forget SEN is a BFS based departure from Monday to Friday for the first departure

[BFS101]

David, both flights to SEN are with a SEN based frame, as per website.

SEN 07.00 - 08.15 BFS 08.40 - 10.00 SEN
SEN 19.05 - 20.20 BFS 20.45 - 22.00 SEN

[david1994]

Ah yeah, sorry I got mixed up with LTN and SEN, sorry again

[tigger2k8]

There has been a rumor of a 777 coming to BFS to perform cargo flights, now FedEx has jobs advertised ( Ramp/Aircraft Handling Agents (am & pm shifts) - nijobfinder (http://www.nijobfinder.co.uk/Ramp-Aircraft-Handling-Agents-am-pm-shifts-General-Management-Job-in-Northern-Ireland/job-228941) ) from operations managers, team leaders to ramp staff, looks like a start up to me...

[Aaron9890]

TCX 767-300 in today bringing passangers in from TFS. Why such a big plane to carry left over passangers???

Sounds good Tigger

[tigger2k8]

Just to update my previous post, found out an hour or 2 after posting..

The 777 will be TNT, the current TNT a/c (is it a 767?) lease is up, originally only for 1 month but could be on-going.. due to arrive next week in TNT colours... the plan is to park it on 25/26 then tow to Delta when its day stopping

[skyways1452]

Jamie, I believe its an Icelandic registered A300 TF-ELF, ex-Etihad colors, now gray.

[EGAC is Better]

So not only will the TNT be the 1st visit of a B77L to BFS (albeit as a LRF) but it is the only (just recently delivered) B77LRF in the fleet. :ok:

Suppose it is a handy way for the crews to build up cycles on a new type before sending her on her way to fields afar.

[flying officer kite]

without getting into specific types of the aircraft, im fairly sure ive pics of a 777 in Belfast before, cant remember what it was here for, but it was ages ago.

[BELHold]

"cant remember what it was here for, but it was ages ago."

BA, Press covering Clinton visit if I remember right...:confused:

[tigger2k8]

Will be ATR's operating from BFS, not sure if its 42's or 72's.. so will be FedEx Feeder i think with the hours they are putting down for the ramp staff id say it will be based aircraft that leaves BFS and will fly all night then return in the early hours, just wondering how many a/c it will be, would they do a setup with just 1 ATR?

[ards_boy]

Agree with above comments about Madrid, If easy think ATH can work then MAD definitely can, not so sure about Lisbon though.
Shame BFS cannot attract some major European/ North American airlines. All seem to do well from DUB AA/AC/CO.UA/DL/LH/MALEV/SAS/US all seem to be doing well at least in the summer, also Ethiad 2xdaily some days out of Dublin, is BFS missing out on even a small portion of this traffic due to APD? UK govt needs to realise Northern Ireland is different and in the grand scale of things within in the UK is close to being and isolated community with a very clever neighbor next door just 100 miles down the road.

[j636]

BFS had none of those carriers (except CO) before the APD was introduced so No is the answer. Then people on here will disagree with the statement.

EZY would be better doing MAD over ATH.

[Straightahead]

Belhold
yes it was a BA B777 diverted to BFS with a medical emergency about 7-8 years ago

[BHD2BFS]

is the 777 only temporary at belfast or permanent, if it is permanent things must be looking up in the cargo area of the airport then, because we have not seen in grow in years

[tigger2k8]

is the 777 only temporary at belfast or permanent, if it is permanent things must be looking up in the cargo area of the airport then, because we have not seen in grow in years

Originally for 1 month, is now "on-going" so might float around until after Christmas, i honestly cant see the first B777 for TNT being based in BFS.. Unless Maersk pulls out, that was rumored awhile ago but have not heard anything since then..

[irishannie]

I heard the Iron Maiden liveried Astraeus 757 is due in Belfast on wed 2nd Aigust - anyone any idea which airport - must be BFS surely due to size and weight?

[david1994]

I heard the Iron Maiden liveried Astraeus 757 is due in Belfast on wed 2nd Aigust - anyone any idea which airport - must be BFS surely due to size and weight?

BHD can handle the 757-200, TCX was going to operate it this year for the Reus flights but changed it to the A321 due to their not being enough space on the ramp at BHD at their allocated slot times.

[loughrey1]

but would BHD have the loading/unloading facilities they may require? Do Iron Maiden not carry all of their equipment etc

[tigger2k8]

but would BHD have the loading/unloading facilities they may require? Do Iron Maiden not carry all of their equipment etc

Yes, servisair should have the relevant equipment as their steps should reach and their belts, however they are travelling via road

[Aaron9890]

i see they have gone bust.... what airline/s do we now lose????

[Jamie2k9]

Think they mainly use Onur Air.

[TSR2]

Onur Air exclusively according to the press release.

[vectors]

I have heard within the last 2 hours that iron maiden were at bfs int.
dont know if they came in on their 757 though. :cool:

[david1994]

Iron M, flew in on a Private Jet, the AEU 757 did not bring them.

[tigger2k8]

So what would you do to change the airport to your liking? Reduce security?Security at all UK airports is dictated by the Government / DFT / CAA. If your main gripe is the drop off zone or smoking charge and that makes BFS the worst, then what about those airports who have £5-10 airport development charge.

Most airports have some form of extra income as airline's demands to have lower fee's and the downturn reduce the income of an airport, welcome to the world of making money and with airports I would get used to it.

If you think security is over the top at BFS now, then you obviously never travelled from BFS when the police checkpoint was on the road, the antrim/dublin road was closed for access to the airport and when you got searched entering the check-in hall

[AIRPORT66]

Only one answer to that go train somewhere else then.

[NWSRG]

Arrived into BFS tonight with EZY from Paris, having been web-free for the past week.

Surprised to see a TNT 777F (OO-TSA) on stand 25...assumed it was a special, but delighted to read here that we might get to keep her!

Very impressive machine in the flesh...as we used the rear exit from our flight on stand 24, I got a good look at her.

Performance off 25 ought to be impressive...IIRC the 777F has the 115lbs GE90 (rather than the 110klbs of the 77L).

[JonnyBfs]

I see Jet2 have increased flights on Alicante S12.
Alicante 3x Weekly

[BHD2BFS]

Great that's all we need, I'm sure there is plenty of routes that would be successful from belfast, I mean we now have baby, easy, jet2 and aer lingus aswell as thomas cook operating to Alicante, I don't mean to sound negative but with this amount of frequency to one destination the aircrafts can't be full I'm sure a schedule flight to Cyprus turkey or Greece would be maintainable, Has anyone heard anything more about the 3 news routes someone mentioned on here a few weeks ago?

[JonnyBfs]

Couldnt agree more! Cyprus or Greece or Turkey would be great! Or Toronto..but that doesnt seem too likely!

[Jamie2k9]

Alicante 3x Weekly

Comes at the loss of 2 weekly to Murcia.

[tigger2k8]

With Goldtrail and now holidays 4 U going bust in the last few years (among a few others) who flew to Turkey, i would say now is the time for EZY to decide to fly to Turkey for Summer 2012, perfect opportunity before another holiday company looks to step in

[david1994]

Easyjet to Dalaman would make a fourtune! Now with only TOM and TCX flying to DLM I was pricing flights next year and TOM is looking £300+ and TCX even wants £559 :eek:

[Jamie2k9]

As LPA is un lightly to return with EI next year wouldn't be suprised to see ADB appear.

[globetrotter79]

Jamie - I suspect you'll find that as a non-UK carrier, EI will not be able to secure traffic permits to operate between BFS and Turkey

[DannyKelly22]

Though doesnt EI at BFS trade under Aer Lingus UK? thus meaning the staff are on UK contracts and not entitled to the same terms as DUB based crew. Also was there not something a while back about EI having acquired a UK operating AOC, would this not entitle them to the rights to fly to Turkey?

[tigger2k8]

Though doesnt EI at BFS trade under Aer Lingus UK? thus meaning the staff are on UK contracts and not entitled to the same terms as DUB based crew. Also was there not something a while back about EI having acquired a UK operating AOC

Something was done last year or the year before.. as it was Astraeus staff who flew flights from BFS for a couple of months using EI a/c.. as far as i can remember anyway

[Shamrock350]

That was all part of the big expansion plans at LGW under Dermot Mannion and Enda Corneille but was quickly put a stop to when Mueller took over. Aer Lingus still doesn't have any rights for Turkey or Egypt from BFS.

[airhumberside]

The EU and Turkey have signed a deal which removes nationality restrictions in individual bilaterals. So assuming there are frequencies under the UK-Turkey bilateral (and I guess there are) Aer Lingus could use them
EUROPA - Press Releases - EU and Turkey initial civil aviation agreement (http://europa.eu/rapid/pressReleasesAction.do?reference=IP/10/369&type=HTML)

[NWSRG]

Any update on our newly resident 777F? Is it going to be staying with us, or is the plan just for the one month as originally suggested?

[True Blue]

I see in July Ei carried about 3k less pax to Lhr than Bd from Bhd. Could Ei in time become the largest carrier to Lhr from Belfast?

True Blue

[EI-BUD]

I see in July Ei carried about 3k less pax to Lhr than Bd from Bhd. Could Ei in time become the largest carrier to Lhr from Belfast?




Hey True Blue, I noticed this too. While they had a good share of LHR passengers to Belfast the figure is down on same month last year, it seems the BD had a huge drop (15%) in numbers. Alot to do with more flights on smaller aircraft. Though with Ryanair now departed from City, Luton back at BFS and WW not doing overly great it surprised me that BD didnt at least manage to keep figures close to last year.

BE had another strong month, continuously growing the route even when FR were in town. Probably down to increase in connectivity at LGW with BA, VS
WW had slight growth over last month
EI had a respectable 30k of pax despite a strong performance by EZY on STN & LGW and the return of LTN which I expected would hit EI service (if you consider the section of London NW between LHR and LTN)
LTN I expected would be much strong than last year given that it was 3 daily this year v 2 daily from BHD last year.
There was a good swing in share of London traffic back to BFS to approx 60% v 40% at BHD, last year with FR in town, a stronger BD and LTN at BHD it was more like 50/50!
Elsewhere, interesting to see that EMA numbers for combined BE & WW within striking distance of FR x 3 daily last year!!
Birmingham BHD this month surpassed total Belfast Birmingham figures for last year same month
Manchester overall market saw a decline.

EI-BUD

[j636]

Looks like Jet2 are to drop BFS - Leeds. All flights for summer 2012 have being removed form the website. Anybody have info on it? Had seats booked for end of March next year. Waiting for e-mail from Jet 2.

[BHD2BFS]

another route from bfs or from leeds?

[david1994]

another route from bfs or from leeds?

She said BFS as the first LBA a day is operated by a BFS based aircraft

[BHD2BFS]

sounds good, but im sure it will be the same old routes in competition with easy and lingus
hope im wrong

will another airline take up the route from bfs? or is it being dropped due to decreasing numbers?

[NWSRG]

Guys,

Any word of any interesting visitors passing through BFS this weekend? Particularly the Vulcan? Any of our ATC colleagues have any info on what we might see from Killead?

[clareview]

Presumable limited numbers, littel chance to really grow the route plus competion from the BHD-LBA route. No doubt a lot of thought went into this as it was a good opportunity to rotate aircraft between the main base at LBA and an out station and also to increase the number of aircraft available at BFS at times

[jonnyc]

As far as I know the F-16s are going into Derry. The Reds would have probably stayed at BFS as usual but they won't make it sadly.

It would be nice to see the Tornado role demo stop over - I'd imagine that is fairly likely but only a guess.

Two Pumas arrived in last night and are here for the week.

[tigger2k8]

Presumable limited numbers, littel chance to really grow the route plus competion from the BHD-LBA route. No doubt a lot of thought went into this as it was a good opportunity to rotate aircraft between the main base at LBA and an out station and also to increase the number of aircraft available at BFS at times The main question is, will it return for winter 2012? As far as i can remember last winter the BFS-LBA flight was Jet2's only proper scheduled flight that ran the duration of the winter schedule, apart from the GVA flight, this year its only GVA and LBA running

edit - someone is claiming the route is not on sale yet, and not cancelled..

[JonnyBfs]

Toulouse Summer 2012? as far as I know it operates this summer, but will it return for next year? - Not yet bookable.

[Jamie2k9]

Yesterday Aer Lingus said about BFS base:

Aer Lingus added that it remains committed to its Belfast operation but said there were no plans to start an American route should Continental pull out of its Belfast International to Newark service.

"We don't really comment on the profitability of how our particular bases perform but the Belfast base is efficient, it's got a good base and although the demand conditions are very challenging at the moment, we are actually very pleased with how it is going," Andrew Macfarlane from Aer Lingus said.

[BHD2BFS]

does anybody know if any progress has been made about the ADP?

also is there going to be a route to replace Gran Canaria next summer?

[tigger2k8]

Any update on our newly resident 777F? Is it going to be staying with us, or is the plan just for the one month as originally suggested?

Think Friday was the last day of the 777F, TF-ELF now sitting in cargo

[AIRPORT66]

Its away to Saudia Arabia.

[BHD2BFS]

Just thought I'd bring the forum back up to the top and was wondering if anyone has heard anything about new routes for next summer as easy and jet2 etc have been starting announcements for next year, also is there any movement on any new airlines coming? I know a while back are lingus regional was mentioned but nothing has came from it. I say this because I see someone complained recently on the bfs Facebook page about why have they spent so much money on the departure lounge with no real expansions plans by airlines ( apart from Southend and Manchester by easy )

[DannyKelly22]

I see Ei have had a slight drop in pax using LHR this month.


July 2011 BFS: 30721 - July 2010 BFS: 32013 -4%

[EI-BUD]

Hi Danny,

Yeah Aer Lingus had drop in Pax but nonetheless a great result, given that Bmi had 15% drop and the gap is closing significantly between the traffic levels of both carriers between LHR and Belfast. Some days bmi has had less seats over the summer than EI with 145s operating. In addition, it seems to me that 6 daily each way is the BHD LHR frequency, seems to be airbus equipment in the main...

EI-BUD

[DannyKelly22]

Im not knocking the fact EI had a drop in pax. I think they are a great company and are doing really well at Belfast and have given BD a run for their money on the LHR market. I used to work for them at JFK and would never knock them, was simply pointing out the figures. I know I will fly with them any day over BD even on price, just because I am loyal to them even though BD offer free luggage etc but with my EI flights i can collect my BA miles and still use them towards EI flights.

[Jamie2k9]

LHR - 3 daily (4 daily this summer)
ALC - 2 weekly (3 weekly this summer)
AGP - 6 weekly (daily this summer)
FAO - 4 weekly (5 weekly this summer)
ACE - 2 weekly (3 weekly this summer)
TFS - 2 weekly (no change)
FCO - Not on Sale yet
BCN - Not on Sale yet

Aircraft 1:
FAO - 07.00 - 13.40 (Mon, Thur, Fri, Sun)
ALC - 06.00 - 12.45 (Tue, Sat)

AGP - 15.30 - 22.30 (Mon, Wed, Thur, Fri, Sun)
ACE - 14.30 - 00.00 (Tues)
TFS - 14.30 - 00.10 (Sat)

(Wednesday morning free until 15.30)

Aircraft 2:
LHR - 07.15 - 10.45 (daily)
LHR - 13.20 - 16.45 (daily)
LHR - 17.20 - 20.35 (daily)

Aircraft 3:
AGP - 07.20 - 14.25 (Sat)
ACE - 15.40 - 01.10 (Sat)

TFS - 14.30 - 00.10 (Wed)

Bmibaby and Jet 2 increasing ALC seem to be having an effect and EI dropping LHR back to 3 daily. 4 daily was on sale until recently. EI have not added LHR from DUB, ORK or SNN.

There will need to be a new route if LPA is axed.

[BFS101]

Some news in todays Belfast Telegraph regarding APD and the Newark route.

US airline urged to save Northern Ireland service - Northern Ireland, Local & National - Belfasttelegraph.co.uk (http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/us-airline-urged-to-save-northern-ireland-service-16049129.html)

APD is putting Northern Ireland airports at risk - Northern Ireland, Local & National - Belfasttelegraph.co.uk (http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/apd-is-putting-northern-ireland-airports-at-risk-16049015.html)

[frg7700]

Notice that on the COA website the last bookable date ex BFS is 31/10/11.

End of the line?

[skyways1452]

Should have looked a little harder ;)

Daily ex Tu and We starting 1st Nov.

[j636]

easyJet announce summer schedule from Belfast - Lifestyle - Banbridge Leader (http://www.banbridgeleader.co.uk/lifestyle/easyjet_announce_summer_schedule_from_belfast_1_3059158)

[BFS101]

Big delay at BFS. Got a special mention on the news section of the website.

Delay on flight to and from Larnaca, Cyprus

Due to operational reasons this evening's Viking Airlines flight from Larnaca, VIK 1351, is delayed until 19:35 on Saturday 24th September. As a result this evening's flight to Larnaca VIK 1352, due to depart at 20:35, will now depart at 20:40 on Saturday 24th September.

Passengers due to travel on this flight should not come to the airport tonight but arrive for check in from 18:00 on Saturday 24th September.

[OltonPete]

BFS101

It didn't really get any better for the pax as the flight was picked up by
Sky Wings and should have just arrived in BFS now.

Sometimes driving, coach or walking is just the better option even if it
takes a week or two :ugh:

I am sure it was a nice surprise for the LCA-BHX pax due back at 20.00
tonight to know that their airline fancied making a quick buck by adding
an extra flight to their schedule thus delaying their arrival back in the UK
until 10am tomorrow morning.

I suppose you could look on the bright side and that there are worse
places to be delayed as long as it is not in the airport!

Pete

[tigger2k8]

Some positive news for once?

BBC News - Belfast to New York air passenger tax may be scrapped (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-15057800)

The Chancellor George Osborne has personally intervened to try and save NI's only direct air link to the United States.
A deal on Air Passenger Duty that would exempt the transatlantic route could be announced this week.

[ILS25]

Nice one. About time too !

[CabinCrewe]

There will be lots of legal issues to clear up before a very exclusive deal on a single route from a single departure point could be pushed through. There will be lots of squeals of unfair play I would suspect.

[Facelookbovvered]

The important point is that the treasury are taking on board how negative this tax for business, even more so in NI where air links are essential

[DannyKelly22]

anyone know weither rihanna landed here or at the city in her private jet. i know she flew from Rio De Janerio straight to here to record her video today and for her concerts this week and next.

[david1994]

Flew into the City Yesterday with 35 cases, and lots of entourage

[BFS101]

Abolition / reduction of APD on long-haul to be announced today??

A formal announcement on the decision to abolish — or greatly reduce — contentious aviation tax in Northern Ireland will be revealed today.



Deal unveiled that could save Northern Ireland's air link to US - Northern Ireland, Local & National - Belfasttelegraph.co.uk (http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/deal-unveiled-that-could-save-northern-irelands-air-link-to-us-16055580.html)

Abolition of duty will bring vital investment boost, say leading firms - Northern Ireland, Local & National - Belfasttelegraph.co.uk (http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/abolition-of-duty-will-bring-vital-investment-boost-say-leading-firms-16055579.html)

Excellent news if true. Anything that keeps passengers at the 3 Northern Ireland airports has to be good news for the NI economy and for residents alike.

[stab3.5up]

Not entirly sure that the APD reduction/removal is a cast iron promise that CO will actually stay in BFS as have they made it clear that the entire Ireland operation, BFS/SNN and DUB is under review. 738 a/c had been mentioned previuosly as operating the second flight from DUB so maybe this maybe a solution from BFS as has a EWR-BFS-DUB-EWR or EWR-BFS-SNN-EWR operation been mentioned as it would mean CBP clearance for BFS passengers. We will wait and see but bottom line if no bums on seats CO wont hang around so guys n galls we better start actually using the service.

[BFS101]

Industry sources said Continental was poised to announce last week the end of the route from January next year but held off due to the ongoing work at the Treasury to reach a solution.

The Chancellor George Osborne, urged on by Secretary of State Owen Paterson and executive ministers, has personally overseen negotiations on a deal that should save the route.
Based on the above report, I would imagine that Continental / United, will have given some form of guarantee to keep operating the route, following these talks and a hopefully successful outcome. Continental have continually stated that the route is popular and would be profitable once again should the tax be removed. Interesting to note that according to CAA data, the CO BFS route carried more passengers in August than either BHX or GLA to EWR.

[stab3.5up]

I think the key pharse you use is "some form of guarentee". Its the some form thats the issue.

[Alan45ni]

anyone know weither rihanna landed here or at the city in her private jet. i know she flew from Rio De Janerio straight to here to record her video today and for her concerts this week and next.


Apparently she flew in by BMI Diamond Class according to one of our local politicians. Apparently she was fully clothed:O

[tigger2k8]

BBC News - George Osborne confirms NI air passenger duty cut (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-15072772)

Chancellor George Osborne has announced air passenger duty (APD) will be cut for direct long-haul routes from Northern Ireland airports.
The direct long-haul rate of APD will fall to the lower short-haul rate - £12 per passenger in economy and £24 for business and first class passengers.


Will we see the return of some long-haul operations next year i wonder?

[Belboy]

a very positive message. Could have a very significant impact on the number of passengers interlining over other airports at a time when the airlines operating these routes can ill afford a further reduction in passenger numbers.

[stab3.5up]

We shall await the CO/UA verdict on this one then, as for other longhaul routes well lets no run before we can walk. Lets see if the BFS-EWR lasts but im guessing that this reduction would apply to sesional services too maybe eg BFS-YYZ and what constitues LONG HAUL. Would just for example, BFS-AUY be long haul or even BFS-SSH?

[BHD2BFS]

just wondering if ADP affects european routes? and if so have they reduced this from belfast, could this mean some expansion into europe for maybe next summer?
or a longer season for orlando?

[stab3.5up]

Infact what is the governments definition of long haul for APD?

[tigger2k8]

CO is the one who pushed through for this cut, they've got that cut so i doubt we will see them exit. If for some reason CO does pull out, BFS is now more attractive for other carriers to consider long haul. Time will tell i guess

[irishannie]

This is very positive devlopemnt for NI aviation. :)

I believe the reduction in APD relates to Band B which covers destinations between 2001 - 4000 miles (calculated from London)

[nef]

The treasury statement says that the discount is for "direct long-haul", so I would guess routings via other UK airports will not attract discounted APD -interesting what other airlines will say about that, would seem to give CO a big advantage.

I'm not sure what happens for CO connecting pax though? Does a pax travelling for example BFS-EWR-ORD get the APD discount, after all, that's not a direct flight to BOS.

[sarcon]

All traffic on the CO flight will only pay the new lower rate tax, regardless of the final destination. The second leg of any journey was never subject to taxation anyway. The potential advantage over flying to another UK airport, £12 APD and then to the States, £60 APD is obvious. Well done all involved, I'm sure it wasn't easy but for CO, Passengers and NIPLC it is a great result.

[justmaybe]

The APD question is only one of many considerations in the contemplation of CO (United) about this route, but has certainly been a headline grabber for some of NI politicians. The question which has not been answered by Jeff Smisek is simply this "Was APD the only factor influencing the retention of this route?" I suspect the strategic rationlisation that is currently being undertaken includes a number of other factors which will result in this route having a very short lifespan.

[ara01jbb]

The potential advantage over flying to another UK airport, £12 APD and then to the States, £60 APD is obvious. Well done all involved, I'm sure it wasn't easy but for CO, Passengers and NIPLC it is a great result.

It will be interest to see whether BFS sees an increase in "connecting" passengers from GB: first flight in on a cheapie U2, LS, EI flight and then onwards with CO. An 11:15 int'l departure shouldn't be too tight for many domestic arrivals.

[EGAC is Better]

It will be interest to see whether BFS sees an increase in "connecting" passengers from GB: first flight in on a cheapie U2, LS, EI flight and then onwards with CO. An 11:15 int'l departure shouldn't be too tight for many domestic arrivals.I doubt there will be any.

CO/UA recently stated they were paying the APD to prevent price increases from Belfast, making it cheaper to go from Dublin as a result. All this reduced APD will do is help CO/UA reduce the loses and hopefully encourage them to keep the BFS-EWR route open.

[BFS101]

After a quick look on the continental website, would appear that the flights are daily, rather than 4/5 per week as last year. Now I only checked November and January, but did show flights operating daily. A change in frequency due to the tax reduction????

As EGAC is Better stated, I think the average passenger will not notice any difference to price on the route. This will just allow CO to get an extra £48 per passenger, that CO had been absorbing, and so hopefully making the route sustainable in the longer term.

[tigger2k8]

I see there is a swift air plane sitting down in cargo, could this be the Fedex aircraft?

[The Sham]

Any idea why the route map on BIA website shows that there is a direct flight to Tampa??

[BFS101]

Cruise charter maybe??

[BFS101]

Atlantic Holidays have Madeira on sale for summer 2012. Not sure of the dates, season long, peak season or just sporadic departures.

Magnificent Madeira on sale for 2012 - Belfast International Airport (http://www.belfastairport.com/en/news/3/87/magnificent-madeira-on-sale-for-2012.html)

[david1994]

tlantic Holidays have Madeira on sale for summer 2012. Not sure of the dates, season long, peak season or just sporadic departures.

Magnificent Madeira on sale for 2012 - Belfast International Airport

03-31st October 2012 departures will be every Wednesday.

Monarch Airlines again: MON5844/5845

[BHD2BFS]

just wondering if all the development with the dept area is now complete? has o'briens and boots been renovated? and has anything happened to the intl dept pier? last time i was down thetr it looked very tired.
i only ask because i have not used the airport in almost a year as i travel more from the city now as a find it an easier airport to use and i have had to follow bmi baby down to fly on their routes which makes me wonder why all of the routes lots by them hasnt been taken over by a different airline (i know easyjet has took on manchester)

[tigger2k8]

just wondering if all the development with the dept area is now complete? has o'briens and boots been renovated? and has anything happened to the intl dept pier? last time i was down thetr it looked very tired.
i only ask because i have not used the airport in almost a year as i travel more from the city now as a find it an easier airport to use and i have had to follow bmi baby down to fly on their routes which makes me wonder why all of the routes lots by them hasnt been taken over by a different airline (i know easyjet has took on manchester) I think the Cafe in arrivals is next. O'Briens moved out back when they reconfigured the security area. Boots was made to leave and Superdrug moved in located beside WHSmith.

Only thing thats changed in the intl pier is the old soft fabric seats are now metal.. but that probably happened more than a year ago.

Quite a few repairs happening to 17/35 and the taxiways. Apron + runways repainted. Work on the apron drainage is supposed to continue soon. Most of the money being spent is now in areas passengers wont see or even think about

edit - quite difficult to attract new airlines on domestic routes from here. EZY picked what i believe is the most popular route lost when WW moved. BHX, EMA and CWL, i believe the demand is covered enough by whats already available.

[BHD2BFS]

if obriens is gone aswell as boots, what is now in their place?
does anybody have photos of how it all now looks? i know there is some on facebook, but i cant actually work out where they are taken from apart from the food court with burger king in it

[tigger2k8]

if obriens is gone aswell as boots, what is now in their place?
does anybody have photos of how it all now looks? i know there is some on FacePPRuNe, but i cant actually work out where they are taken from apart from the food court with burger king in it O'Briens is now the new central search area, Boots is currently an empty shell as they moved out not too long ago.

Don't have any pictures myself, but on the album on FB called "New catering outlets Summer 2011"

Pictures 1-4 used to be Rankin's
Pictures 5 and 6 is the Bar towards where clockwork orange used to be
Picture 7 - Burger King
Picture 8 - Is the Cafe in the check in hall (i think?)
Pictures 9-11 Is the food village

All are located in the same area as before, just renovated.

Hope this helps

[PPRuNeUser0176]

Reports on another site that Estonian Air to open a connection between Belfast - Tallinn. Anyone got any info on it?

[CARNMANORLAD]

Estonian Air arrival into BFS at 1915 as OV8077. So either someone has known about this arrival and started a rumour or this is a spokesperson flying in to make the announcement? Would Estonian Air really choose Belfast as there next UK destination, I ask because they currently only serve LGW? I hope it is true!

[smythonthehill]

This is just the Estonian Football team flying in for the match Friday night. Someone is just trying to get the rumour mill going in my opinion.

[Jamie2k9]

After a quick look on the continental website, would appear that the flights are daily, rather than 4/5 per week as last year. Now I only checked November and January, but did show flights operating daily. A change in frequency due to the tax reduction????


Its 5 weekly now and will stay at that for winter season. No Tues, Wed flights.

[BHD2BFS]

i see fedex are advertising alot at the minute, announcing they have opened a new centre in northern ireland, just wondering if they have facilities at BFS now and if they have aircraft based here? and if so what type,
many thanks

[DannyKelly22]

supposidly they do, they were advertising for staff a few months back, i applied but never heard anything back.

[PPRuNe Pop]

This thread is closing but feel free to start another, but remove the word INTERNATIONAL from the title.