Air Cadet Gliding pix in the 80s (pre glass)

[Prangster]

I remember using the spoilers on a Mk 3 at Kenley in 1973. I also remember my second solo where I got rather a lot of height off the winch and deployed the spoilers as soon as I released the cable, but I was still going up rather quickly :uhoh:. It wasn't until was half way down the down wind leg that I started loosing height and I had to extend before turning crosswind, as I was still too high :mad:. Spoilers open all the way from cable release until just before touch down; Best of my three solos :)

The least said of my fist solo when I disappeared behind a line of trees on the down wind leg, the better :O .

As they say, I learnt about flying from that.
The best advice I was ever given was use your own judgement,,'if we're using the short runway and your high over the hedge what the (naughty word) do you think the spoliers are for. Use the buggers I don't like extracting gliders from the boundary hedge

[chevvron]

There's a 'resurrected' thread posted in 'Private Flying' callled 'Ring any bells with anyone?' last post 13 Jun 2023 if anyone's interested.

[621andy]

I shall investigate!

[chevvron]

I shall investigate!
I presume your '621' is from your gliding school (I was on 613) so if you haven't seen it, try 'Air Cadets Grounded' in Military Aviation too.

[621andy]

I presume your '621' is from your gliding school (I was on 613) so if you haven't seen it, try 'Air Cadets Grounded' in Military Aviation too.
I was in near the beginning on both of those threads;) And yes, I'm ex 621:hmm:

[JenniferPaulDuncombe]

I was definitely a slow learner; started at 613 on 3-10-64 and soloed on 7-11-64; 38 launches including my 3 solos, total time 2 hours dead.
Instructors:
Mike Duncombe*
Phil Plows (Chief Flying Instructor)
John (?) Chapman (can't remember first name)
Robin Miller (later became full time at CGS)
Chris Rust D'Eye
Paul Duncombe*(twin of Mike)
Dennis 'Jacko' (what's the holdup?) Jackson (CO) for solo checks.

*Their sister Judith was a teacher at my school!

Hi, My Dad was Paul Duncombe. He sadly passed in 2011 I'd love to year any stories about my Dad if you have any to share.

[Mnewton]

From my old log book had one check flight with Mike Duncombe
in the Sedburg Vx275 on 12th august 1964
https://abpic.co.uk/pictures/registration/VX275
pretty much 60 years ago I was 17 at the time.

[JEM60]

Hi, Jennifer. I was a Staff Cadet at 613, and knew Paul well, even though I was a lowly Corporal Cadet. I remember him as a very nice man with a very pleasing manner who always treated us Cadets well. Guess he is up there with Ken Bayliss etc., discussing good times. 3 of the best years of my life at 613!!. Wonderful memories!

[chevvron]

I knew not only Paul but his brother Mike and their sister Judith; she was a teacher at my school in Chesham and prior to that a classmate of my own sister.
I flew with Paul several times including when we were at Bovingdon in 1965, I did the first ever glider launch from Bovingdon with Paul in the back seat. A few months later Paul introduced his brother-in-law to be Trevor, also a teacher at my school, to a glider flight at Bovingdon.
[email protected] runs an informal meeting with the '613 retired winch drivers' group and he and the others may recall more about Paul.

[Mnewton]

613 must have loaned a mk3 to bovingdon ( or elsewhere) and we had to go pick it up.
not sure how we got there but Jacko was in the back and me in the front behind a tiger moth (or equivalent)
Released closer to Halton and always remember Jacko tell me to slow the speed down was probably still doing
60+ knots, but with Jacko's extra weight we were sinking pretty fast. Made it down ok, not sure why he picked me but perhaps he just asked for volunteer's. That is still burnt into my brain deep down
Will have to find it in my log book

[chevvron]

Paul took a Sedbergh and a Mk3 to Bovingdon by aerotow with Sqdn Ldr Maygothling in a Chipmunk in Jun '65 so I'm guessing you flew the return leg to Halton a day or so later.

[Mnewton]

I have 21st June 65 flight checks on WB971 Sedburg Bovingdon , will have to look further to find the return flight to 613

[chevvron]

Yes I logged WT871 as the first (ever) complete flight at Bovingdon after Paul was aerotowed in. I only had one flight that evening (21 Jun) but my logbook shows I had a flight with Jacko in '871 the next evening (22 Jun).
Obviously you and I were there and I think 'Wally' Wallington was there too; he 'found' a 3 tonner in MT and and also discovered where the winch had been parked in one of the hangars.
My logbook also shows '871 as back at Halton on 26 Jun so you must have flown back on 23, 24 or 25th.

[Mnewton]

Looks like both went back on the Friday, must have been a whole week at Bovingdon.
I dont actually have the flight with Jacko logged ( not sure why).
Was back flying WB971 on 26th with 2413 sqdrn.
Flew the swallow on the 29th XS650.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/alanwz581/49596374976/
https://abpic.co.uk/pictures/view/1033256

[POBJOY]

[QUOTE=Mnewton;11613365]Looks like both went back on the Friday, must have been a whole week at Bovingdon.
I dont actually have the flight with Jacko logged ( not sure why).
Was back flying WB971 on 26th with 2413 sqdrn.
Flew the swallow on the 29th XS650.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/alanwz581/49596374976/
https://abpic.co.uk/pictures/view/1033256[/QUOTE

XS650 & 651 I think were a Mc Robert Trust presentation pair to the Air Cadets.
Pobjoy was sent off in one at Swanton by I Ladley after a weeks 'helping out' as a P2 staff cadet. Told 'not to spin it' (that was the brief) and then did 5 launches. A week later it arrived at Kenley so I promptly DI'd it and put it on the line early on the Sat. Was then told 'only B cat's' allowed to fly it by the duty instructor. Quick as a flash produced a log book signed by IL and stunned silence. Had said machine pushed back to the fence for more cable length and told winch not to hold back. Kenley is short but managed over 1,000 ft dropped the nose did two loops and was promptly grounded !!!, but it was worth it. Sequel to this was a week later when the paperwork from Swanton arrived and IAN had signed a log book entry chit for me confirming the Swallow (and aero's) a P2 check and aero towing. Pobjoy promptly 'ungrounded' and B cat's miffed (some had yet to fly it). Will wait for a 'Canopy T21' thread for another Swanton tale.
Of course when I flew the Swallows they were in proper training silver with yellow bands (looked much better that way) and had the presentation crest on them. PC

[chevvron]

XS650 & 651 I think were a Mc Robert Trust presentation pair to the Air Cadets.
Pobjoy was sent off in one at Swanton by I Ladley after a weeks 'helping out' as a P2 staff cadet. Told 'not to spin it' (that was the brief) and then did 5 launches. A week later it arrived at Kenley so I promptly DI'd it and put it on the line early on the Sat. Was then told 'only B cat's' allowed to fly it by the duty instructor. Quick as a flash produced a log book signed by IL and stunned silence. Had said machine pushed back to the fence for more cable length and told winch not to hold back. Kenley is short but managed over 1,000 ft dropped the nose did two loops and was promptly grounded !!!, but it was worth it. Sequel to this was a week later when the paperwork from Swanton arrived and IAN had signed a log book entry chit for me confirming the Swallow (and aero's) a P2 check and aero towing. Pobjoy promptly 'ungrounded' and B cat's miffed (some had yet to fly it). Will wait for a 'Canopy T21' thread for another Swanton tale.
Of course when I flew the Swallows they were in proper training silver with yellow bands (looked much better that way) and had the presentation crest on them. PC
Yes I remember the rule about 'B' cats and above.
We had both '650 and '651 at Halton at different times; they were both dayglo and silver not yellow and silver.
I await the 'Canopy T21' thread with great interest; we hated them and tried to avoid usng them.

[sycamore]

I was `posted` to Station Flight at Halton in Aug `62 after Apprentice Course completed,as a Jnr Tech,and before going to Sth Cerney for OASC.I had a PPL,gained at Luton FC, current on Chipmunk ,Tiger and Austers,so I would `blag` a Chipmunk ride with any of the pilots,usually `Flight Commanders`on the Apprentice Wings,keeping their `Flying Pay Ration ` current.Names in the logbook include,Dolicher (Polish),Snare,Drinkell,Roberts,Dawes(Rev`d)Morley(Revd),Woo d,`BB` Sharman,Norm Maygothling..

[chevvron]

I remember 'Dolicher' pronounced 'Dollyer' from writing his name on the authorisation sheet; Maygothling spent several years as OC Airfield and he flew the aerotows to Bovingdon; one of the station Chipmunks had a towing hook.
There was another guy called Freddy Briance who was often on the airfield but I'm not sure if he was aircrew.

[sycamore]

The 3 Chips were WP811,later -BCKN;WK551 later ZK-SAX,and WB551/-AMZL,written off in `72

[POBJOY]

Yes I remember the rule about 'B' cats and above.
We had both '650 and '651 at Halton at different times; they were both dayglo and silver not yellow and silver.
I await the 'Canopy T21' thread with great interest; we hated them and tried to avoid usng them.

I must say after the T31 the Swallow was like going from a Morris Minor to a Lotus, however what really looked smart back then was a Dart, It was over 40 years before I got a chance to fly one of those and by then it was a classic, with superb handling but not the performance of the German machines of that era.
The T21 would go 'up' very well, but not very good for penetration if one was downwind of the field in sink !!!,although Piggott made an epic trip in one with a 'cold' cadet on board. As alluded in some threads before, Pobjoy actually did a few trips in the T53 at Swanton when it was there for trials. By then the ATC was heavily into AE flying in addition to the A&B training role and I was looking forward to doing some 'mini x country' triangles when the weather allowed,
plus not having to worry about the Barge getting blown over in a squall. Getting closer to the 'canopy' T21 bit, but not yet.
Of course the 53 never happened as Slingsby were better with chisels than rivets, so we lost the chance to move with the times but of course we still had the
'fretwork fighters' (mk3) the best basic training machine ever, and tens of thousands of Cadets were well served. I still remember my first ever flight in one (first ever flight), rocket like launch to 800 ft and it was like sitting in an large beer crate (elbows over the side) and nothing else.

[621andy]

So just for info 621 and 637 VGSs will very shortly cease to exist....621 was the longest serving school at one location until it was booted off the airfield at WSM in 1993, starting as 87GS in 1943. It then went to Hullavington and currently resides at Little Riss...

You'll never guess in a million years the reason they will disappearhttps://www.pprune.org/images/smilies/censored.gif unless you're in the know...

Answers on a postcardhttps://www.pprune.org/images/smilies/eek.gif

[chevvron]

Oh god what's happening now?
I did admin officer for a course at 637 in 1991; it was originally formed at Gaydon in about '66 and move to Rissy in about 1974.
Rumour at the time I was there was it would be combined with 625 from South Cerney but then there was a policy change dictating that an SLMG school and a winch launched school could not operate from the same airfield simultaneously.
I've posted a bit about the fate of some of the Vigilants in 'Military Aviation'.

[Consulman]

I became a Flight Staff Cadet with 637 at Gaydon in 1971 and stayed with them until I moved North and joined 632VGS in 1989.
637 was a 'new' School and formed at Gaydon in 1966. The field was eventually sold in 1974 but we remained until 1978, when we moved to Little Rissington.
We later converted to the Venture and I remember that I spent most of the last two weekends upside down as I was the last aerobatic qualified Instructor present.
I used to re-visit LR frequently during the Vigilant era, ferrying aircraft around to support Course weeks and other events.

[POBJOY]

On mil Av, new accommodation for 621 & 637 opened LR 10th April. !!!!!

Will finish the 'Barge Canopy' bit now as weather absolutely rubbish outside just like day I first flew 'The Canopy'
Was at Swanton in the winter doing a glider inspection/repair course with C/tech in the hangar.
However on a couple of days there was some flying for camp staff and as a P2 staff Cdt I was detailed for the task.
Barge appeared complete with multi panelled (unit made) canopy replacing the two flexi wind screens.
Damp o cast day so first victim was duly presented and we were then sealed in so to speak, cable on and away.
AS we got airborne the vis started to deteriorate to the point that it became a 'sideways' look out which being Swanton was a green airfield surrounded by more green fields hence very little vis ref points to feel one's way around the circuit. This was not helped by the 'internal vis' now being also reduced by the external vis and a greater height attained compared with my base site at Kenley. Of course this was a strictly VMC operation but in rather IMC conditions. I quickly decided that a swift180 was required to gain a 'sideways look for the camp and then get down asap. The only plus factor was I was the only machine airborne and Swanton was not festooned with ground objects to ruin the day. Anyway we proceeded to grope our way around and then the relief of seeing the caravan and setting her down alongside. A very happy passenger thanked the somewhat chastened driver for the trip, and then we were 'unsealed' into a much clearer regime. I honestly thought we were going to scrub any more ops but I Ladley seemed quite unconcerned with my camp excursion, and proceeded to find more victims to prolong my agony. Any attempt to clear the multi perspex panels was futile so having sort of come up with the sideways look system I was glad to add a few more launches to finish off my 'interesting' week, and by my 8th flight I was less terrified by the whole experience. I did learn by that, and years later it was very useful on several occasions. It was my first experience of a closed cockpit after years of being out in the open !!!

[pulse1]

I haven't looked at my gliding log books for years and decided to see if I had flown either of the Swallows above. I see that I flew XS650 several times at Old Sarum over a three year period in the early 70's. I see also that, the same day I last flew her, I also had one flight in a Skylark 4 which, in those days was pretty near the top of the range of gliders. It actually belonged to the Imperial College gliding club and it landed at Old Sarum when it ran out of lift on a cross country flight. The pilot asked if he could have a winch launch to see if he could get back to wherever he had come from. Our CO happened to be there that day and agreed to let him have a launch if he could have a quick flight in it first. When the pilot agreed, I thought that I had a lot more experience flying high performance gliders than the CO did so I asked for a flight too. Them were the good old days.