View Full Version : Air Japan (AJX) B767

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8th Oct 2006, 23:23
Just curious to talk to anyone that works for either ANA or JP Express on the 767. I recently got the letter from Parc on the Nov. screening and I have alot of questions. Thank you for any help.

10th Oct 2006, 18:23
I got the same letter. I guess that means the interview is on. No info on the interview just a very tough medical.

11th Oct 2006, 22:05
Me too. Trying to decide if to go or pass. Hate the idea of six months ATP classes and no positive space travel home on days off. They need to look at KAL's contract.

14th Oct 2006, 18:49
Also got mail from PARC today - also keen to learn more - good or bad? Living expences? Thanks.

14th Oct 2006, 19:30
If they would only improve their travel package I'd be gone in a flash. Just offer a confirmed business class ticket home for the days off. KAL is recruiting on the 737's as is Air India Express.

15th Oct 2006, 02:40
If only ANA could match KAL's T&C.

16th Oct 2006, 00:42
Check out this web site for flying in Japan:


The Dominican
16th Oct 2006, 04:26
Does anybody know the pay during training? I just sent them an E-mail asking about it, it would be pretty hard to spend six months without salary. I read somewhere that they pay you a salary from the get go. Any info on this regard?

16th Oct 2006, 13:57
For the 767 its $9192 per month in training plus $44 per day when in Tokyo.
This is on Hawaiian Aviations website.
I'm still trying to decide, the six months ATP ground school is painful:* .

The Dominican
16th Oct 2006, 18:38
For the 767 its $9192 per month in training plus $44 per day when in Tokyo.
This is on Hawaiian Aviations website.
I'm still trying to decide, the six months ATP ground school is painful:* .

Can't think of it that way. ATP is just one aspect of the whole deal, just think of the culture, the arts, the experience of thinking from a different point of view. The challenge of immerse yourself in a different language and the broader view you'll have of this world.

By the end of the 5 year contract, The ATPL and command time on the 767 will seem insignificant in relation to the large scheme of things :ok:

16th Oct 2006, 19:02
So, its easy to see how much hawaii is paying but how about Parc? Any info?

16th Oct 2006, 19:16
This is the PARC package for the cargo 767, pax is more or less the same.

Captain: A gross Salary per month pro rata of ;
Year 1 = 10,452.00 USD Including Training
Year 2 = 11,845.00 USD
Year 3 = 12,034.00 USD
Year 4 = 12,248.00 USD
Year 5 = 12,479.00 USD

A contribution into a Pension fund managed by Parc Aviation of 870.72 USD per month pro rata.
In addition to above salary a contract completion bonus of USD 30,000 will be paid plus interest at the end of the 5 year assignment period.

In addition a living allowance of USD 44 per day shall be payable to each crew member during his training period in Tokyo. After the training period a fixed per diem of 884 USD per month pro rata will be paid.

First Officer: A gross Salary per month pro rata of ;
Year 1 = 7,002.00 USD Including Training
Year 2 = 8,218.00 USD
Year 3 = 8,541.00 USD
Year 4 = 8,730.00 USD
Year 5 = 8,870.00 USD

A contribution into a Pension fund managed by Parc Aviation of 550.72 USD per month pro rata.
In addition to above salary a contract completion bonus of USD 18,000 will be paid plus interest at the end of the 5 year assignment period.

16th Oct 2006, 22:17
Ah, thanks for that info! I was lead to believe that PARC "always" paid more then other contract agencies, but looks like the Hawai contracts are quite a bit better on pay....are there other "things" to concider when compareing these companies, or are they both ok?


17th Oct 2006, 00:06
Those are the figures sent to me by PARC for the JP Express 767 contracts. I never applied for the Dash-8 job.
I'll paste the T &C for Air Japan . Hope that clears it up.

BASE (Training)
(Operations) Tokyo, Japan
Designated base
Osaka or Tokyo
REQUIREMENT Pilots to be trained on B767 by Air Japan for use by Air Japan in conducting Air Japan flights
A screening process in Tokyo to include:
(i) Interview/simulator
(ii) Medical
DURATION 5 years.
Training estimated 6/7 months and will be carried out at the ANA training centre Tokyo.
REMUNERATION PACKAGE A structured remuneration package compromising:
Captain: A gross Salary including flight pay per month pro rate of:
Training = 8,308.00 USD and then 9,192.00 USD for the remainder of year 1
Year 2 = 9,832.00 USD
Year 3 = 9,983.00 USD
Year 4 = 10,153.00 USD
Year 5 = 10,337.00 USD
A contribution into a Pension fund managed by Parc Aviation of 870.72 USD per month pro rata
In addition to above salary a contract completion bonus of USD 30,000 will be paid plus interest at the end of the 5 year assignment period.
First Officer: A gross Salary including flight pay per month pro rata of ;
Training = 6,162.00 USD and then 7,046.00 USD for the remainder of year 1
Year 2 = 8,122.00 USD
Year 3 = 8,408.00 USD
Year 4 = 8,575.00 USD
Year 5 = 8,769.00 USD
A contribution into a Pension fund managed by Parc Aviation of 550.72 USD per month pro rata.
In addition to above salary a contract completion bonus of USD 18,000 will be paid plus interest at the end of the 5 year assignment period.
BLOCK HOURS 70 hours per month - subject to a maximum of 100 hours in 30 days. Hours in excess of 70 hours per month will be paid at the rate of one seventh (1/70) of the basic monthly salary per hour or part thereof.
(2) OPERATIONS 2 days per week.
Basically 10 days granted consecutively free of duty per month.
(2) OPERATIONS Hotel accommodation in Tokyo for the full duration of the Training Period. In addition a living allowance of USD 44 per day shall be payable to each crew member during this period in Tokyo.
(i) Single room hotel accommodation at layover stations other than the designated base of operations.
(ii) At base single room hotel accommodation on specific rostered standby duties.
(iii) An accommodation allowance of
USD 500 per month at Osaka/Tokyo base. Pilots will be required to pay for accommodation at operating base. In the event of exceeding 120 nights in Japan per year (excluding standby duties) USD 50 for each additional night will be paid.

17th Oct 2006, 00:36
Just eavesdropping here but is the designated base of ops NRT indefinitely or will you be able to nominate a different base on the network?

17th Oct 2006, 07:02
Management at AJX/AJV has been implementing different salary scales over the past few years, "B" scale and maybe even "C" scale now, so newer intakes are being paid less, hence the discrepency. NG Captain is probably most correct

17th Oct 2006, 09:52
OK, but then one would be quite a bit better off (on pay at least) with Hawaii...However, Hawaii does not want to tell all the facts (see new thread on 767 contracts) on their contracts...So where to go?? Are they really getting enough people to (as ishi59 says) create new, lower scales?? As far as I can remember these contracts have been on offer for a loooong time now ie indicating that they need more/are not getting enough people....:confused:

17th Oct 2006, 11:26
Most likely the later, not getting enough. Besides the pay, which isnt bad, the travel and per diems arent that good. If they want more applicants I think they will at least make the commute easier. The two days travel shouldn't count on your off days and the travel should be positive space business class anywhere on ANA's network. To make it worth my while to go and live in a culture much different to what I'm accustomed to they should improve their packages, there are a lot of good international contracts out there.

17th Oct 2006, 11:48
I suggest you view ishi59's public profile and click on his posts. Those threads will give you a good indicator about the ANA group and different people's feelings and experiences with the different 767 operators.

The Dominican
20th Oct 2006, 22:03
Does anybody know the tax situation in Japan? Do you still pay Japan income taxes either though you do not reside in Japan?

30th Oct 2006, 20:08
It appears that some on this forum are not too happy with this contract. Can someone actually post an actual schedule for any of the past months??

3rd Nov 2006, 21:22
get the letter from parc and hawaii too but did only reply to hawaii... very intersting what I read and I think that if you are commuting from europe... after 2 years of doing this knid of thing with family you may end up single:hmm: .... very tough contract and the 2 days of commuting should be not counted as OFF... and for sure positive bookink otherwise you may some months not coming back home... I know this too much !!!!:{ . well guys the money is good... but it simply depends of what you are looking for... maybe we'll all see each other over there...:}

The Dominican
10th Nov 2006, 02:34
Any fresh info on the interview? they just called me out of the blue and want me to go to Japan this coming week:uhoh:
Interview info folks please:ugh:

10th Nov 2006, 12:07
Any fresh info on the interview? they just called me out of the blue and want me to go to Japan this coming week:uhoh:
Interview info folks please:ugh:

I'm also looking for info. Are they positive spacing you to Tokyo for the interview? I see they say there is a possible future US base. Is this all cargo or passengers also? Many thanks for any info or insight you can provide! Cheers!

10th Nov 2006, 21:15
got an interview coming

how many trips do they do to hnl each month

and how much training in japan happens before you get in the aircraft?

11th Nov 2006, 17:51
Does anybody have any insight on the interview process?

#1) Do they positive space you to Tokyo?
#2) Do they provide you a hotel while in Tokyo?
#3) Any interview gouge on what to study or prepare for?
$4) Possitlbe future US bases they are hinting about?
#5) Likelyhood of renewing the contract after 5 years?

Many thanks in advance for anybody who can shed some light on the process!!

12th Nov 2006, 17:22
#1 Yes
#2 Yes
#3 When invited for interview you get a sim package
#4 Chicago and Anchorage
#5 Depends on your performance, usually yes

If you get invited for an interview all your above questions will be answered in detail

12th Nov 2006, 19:46
#1 Yes
#2 Yes
#3 When invited for interview you get a sim package
#4 Chicago and Anchorage
#5 Depends on your performance, usually yes

If you get invited for an interview all your above questions will be answered in detail

Many thanks for the reply!! Is there anything I can start studying now? Is it pretty technical like Cathay? I can't find any interview gouge and I would like to start preparing.

12th Nov 2006, 20:08
90% of your interview score is how you fly the sim. Couple of basic ATPL questions in the interview.

If you are interested in Japan contract positions check out


The Dominican
18th Nov 2006, 02:04
The Interview experience was really good. They positive spaced me to TYO and the PARC representative that lives in TYO was very helpful, polite and informative. A six person panel (4 ANA Check Airmen and 2 HR) formed the panel. They where engaging and receptive to what I was saying, make sure that you speak clearly and that you make your point across because English evidently is not their first language. But, also by speaking slowly and clearly it is easier for them to detect "Canned" answers, so you know what? Don't use them.:= Talk about yourself, that is what they want to hear. They want to know if you are adaptable enough to rise above language and culture differences and act as a team member. In my case, there where very little technical questions,I guess they felt there wasn't the need for it, I hear that some folks get asked a bid of technical stuff but it wasn't my case.
The SIM will make it or break it for you. You have to fly the thing not like somebody that has flown 767s evidently, but like somebody who has the time and command structured personality that your resume says you should have. They want to see your interaction with an F/O that has limited English, they want to see how you are going to react in an environment that is foreign to you (The 767 cockpit that is) And still operate the exercises that are required. They don't want to see perfection, evidently you won't fly the thing perfectly in the first couple of T/O and LAN. But they want to see progression towards the end of the evaluation, they want to see what you do if you punch the wrong button and the thing started turning the wrong way (I disconnected the A/P and asked my F/O/ Check airman to show me what I engaged that was wrong, but at the same time steering the thing in the right direction)
After all, you are applying for a direct entry level position as a 767 captain, to fly across Asia and the Pacific. These individuals have being flying and instructing for a long time. They pretty much know from the moment when you enter the Flight Deck if there is command capability or not.

I was called that evening to let me know that I had passed the evaluation and interview phase so I'm going to the medical next.:ok: It will be in LAX and I'm curious as to what it involves. They told me to separate two complete days for the testing. Anyone has first hand knowledge on the medical? What to expect? This has me a little worried because I already did the part that I have control over. This part of the evaluation I don't control.
Any info on regards to LAX medical facility and what to expect would be greatly appreciated.

Good luck to all trying out for this Job, I felt that It was very straight forward and informative. They made it very clear that the rosters where tough and that at the beginning there was going to be a transitional period as more A/C's where coming into the line and gave me the choice to apply for AJX if I wanted to because it is more like what I'm used to at my current gig. I know that there have being some opinions expressed here about them not being forthcoming, but I can only judge from my own experience and they where very clear about what the job is about and had no problems answering all of my questions.

Thank you for any info on the medical.

18th Nov 2006, 03:33
The JCAB medical (in ANC) covers

- BMI (below 29)
- Pulmonary function
- Eye Testing
- Electroencephalogram (EEG)
- Exercise Electrocardiogram (treatmill)
- Blood work
- Urin work
- Alcohol & Drug test
- Cholesterol
- Blood sugar

and all the other tests of a normal Class 1 medical.

Good luck on your medical.:ok:

18th Nov 2006, 09:03
Do you guys have to do the (marching on the spot with your eyes closed) balance check? That is one I have to practise for!!:O

26th Nov 2006, 17:27
You have to close your eyes and stand on one leg with your arms spread for 60 seconds and then the same on both legs.

26th Nov 2006, 17:37
I have an interview scheduled next month. Anyone here currently work on the line??

Martin VanNostrum
29th Nov 2006, 06:00
I do. Over 5 years years here and beside the normal Japanese 'frustrations' (which you will never change, so don't try) it is a good job. Training is long (6 months) but after it's over the rosters, flights, pay, conditions are hard to beat. All F/O's get chance of Command after 3-4 years. Not bad for a contract job.

29th Nov 2006, 08:30
Is 29 the BMI limit for JCAB. Just asking because I have heard 25 as a limit.

Thanks for any info.

Haywood U. Cuddelmie
29th Nov 2006, 10:19
I may stand to be corrected here, but my understanding is that the BMI limit is imposed by the AIRLINE, and not JCAB. At least I have on very good authority (in writing from our Japanese airline) that in fact our limit is a BMI of 30-thirty. This is further supported by the fact that I am a fat bum myself at BMI 28 - and I just passed the JCAB medical a couple of months ago.:D
Cheers all - Haywood

30th Nov 2006, 02:57
There is no actual JCAB BMI limitation. It is stated that above 30, however, further tests are to be performed.
(Its all there but in Japanese)

Each airline seems to have their own limit below this. One of the contractors seems to require less than 27.

you be able to say what airline that is? Osaka? So, maybe the Dash-8?
(I lived in Osaka for 6 years and dream of moving back there one day!)

Haywood U. Cuddelmie
30th Nov 2006, 07:31

It is indeed the Q400, and the operator have specified 30 as their BMI max-limit for initial acceptance. Just no more cookies and cream for me:=

Cheers - Haywood

30th Nov 2006, 10:07
See you as soon as I figure out how to get 500 turboprop hours (and repay my dues to the company that does it for me).

May I also ask what contractor you are going through?

30th Nov 2006, 14:14
The BMI index seems very biased. I have a very athletic and toned build yet my BMI scales says I am "overweight"....NOT! At 6-2 and 195 pounds, my BMI is around 25 but says I'm "overweight" In order to get my BMI into the "Normal" range, I will have to drop about 5 pounds before my interview / medical. If they actually allow a BMI if up to 29 or 30, well that is a fairly overweight person. At 6-2 , I could weight a chubby 230 pounds and still have a BMI of under 30.

30th Nov 2006, 17:33
Biased all right. Im very solidly built and 0% bodyfat would theoretically give me a BMI of 25!! Actually, at the moment I am actually a little overweight. No worries with a class 1 at all but the airlines BMI limits are going to keep me working for it.:*

The Dominican
30th Nov 2006, 17:55
How are the Jump Seat privileges between the airlines in Japan? Can AJX/AJV pilots ride on ANA or ANC airplanes? How about JAL? Details on the commuting options and procedures please :confused:

1st Dec 2006, 00:32
In Japan, the cockpit is secured before the first pax gets on until after the last one deplanes. The jumpseat "belongs" to the company and there is no jumpseat commuting.

Commuting is all by a seat in the back - ID or full fare ticket. Good luck in the summer and around New Year.


mark one eyeball
1st Dec 2006, 11:58
How long does it take to find out if the medical was ok?

1st Dec 2006, 15:18
2 - 4 weeks usually.

mark one eyeball
9th Dec 2006, 14:22
Has anyone got news of outcome of recent interview and is there a date for March course?

9th Dec 2006, 17:33
They are still interviewing until the middle of next week. 50% failure rate in the sim eval. Contracts will be offered as soon as the interview process is complete next week and medical results are in. Course starts beginning of March with 16 open spots, however they might not be able to fill all the spots due to the high failure rate.

mark one eyeball
13th Dec 2006, 17:33
I had an interview over 4 weeks ago.
I have heard some folks have been told that they have failed the medical.
So can one be optimistic that they have passed and just waiting on the end of the interview process..........but I hear this has been extended so when will we know.....this month?

13th Dec 2006, 19:38
Just heard to expect contract offers in the beginning of the new year.

22nd Dec 2006, 14:49
I interviewed on 11 December and I had some questions that I didnít have answered and I was hopeful someone here could help out.

- What are typical schedules for a commuter and someone based in Japan? (number of days in Japan / in hotels on overnights)

- Are parents eligible for reduced fare ZED tickets on other airlines?

- Is there a pay difference from AJX compared with AJV?

30th Dec 2006, 15:15
Anyone hear anything yet about contract offers?

18th Jan 2007, 00:54
Anybody attending the Mid-February interviews in Tokyo? I just received my package and it sounds like there are quite a few guys going over for the Feb 07 screening session. For the guys who have already gone through....how long was it from interview to job offer to classdate? What kind of class date can we reasonably expect if we are successfull in the Feb 07 interview?

Thanks in advance for any insight!

18th Jan 2007, 03:38
My interview was mid december and the start date would be March. They said they try to give you 3 months notice....Of course I am still waiting to see if I get the job or not......

The Dominican
18th Jan 2007, 15:36
There is a thread on "Flightinfo" about ANA having a contract with ABX in the USA to supply pilots for AJV. If this is true, All of us that are waiting to hear back from them.I'm afraid the answer will be "Thanks for playing":(
I hope I'm wrong

18th Jan 2007, 19:33
That's been a rumour at ABX for a couple of months. We know that the company has been negotiating for some large international contract or charter. The union has been involved negotiating work rules with the company. No names have been mentioned. ABX and ANA have had a good relationship, with ABX buying several 767's from them. ABX was also in line to purchase the -300's, but ANA decided to start their own cargo operation, instead.

It's possible that this might be a charter for ABX instead of a crew contract. We have several -200's coming this year and they are not committed to anyone yet. DHL will obviously be competing for those aircraft as they have quite a few old airplanes in the U.S. fleet. Anyway, ABX has not been in the business of contracting crews before, so a charter makes more sense in many ways. That would mean that ANA/JPE still needs to crew their -300's.

I'd say it's pretty likely that ANA and ABX have had conversations, but there's no indication that any agreement has been made. It's all just rumours and conjecture so far.

25th Jan 2007, 21:22
I got offered a position and I have tons of questions. Anyone currently in Japan care to contact me by PM and help out?

28th Jan 2007, 09:18
Hey guys.. I too was hired, but do not have a ton on info.. From the experience I have had with the interview and since, and talking to as many folks as I can over there, seems to be a great place to be. I had a look at a schedule, and it too looks pretty good. (This is the cargo side).

I have heard that not very many guys made it through, and some that did were offered FO instead of the desired Capt. That's about all I know.. If I or anyone else gets more intel, please post it..



28th Jan 2007, 09:25
I was one that interviewed for CA and was offered an FO position. That made an easy decision difficult and I have been trying to decide whether to take it or not.

28th Jan 2007, 10:31
Well man, not sure what to say.. I guess if it were me, it would depend on a few things: Where are you now, and are you needing / wanting to leave, and how badly; Does ANA offer upgrades? (I am not sure); Is this the kind of flying that you want to do and will help you in the long run if you are still looking to further your career..?

The money for FOs is still better then any regional Captain as far as I know, and descent on the global scale. The company has the oppertunity for a growth explosion if / when the postal service goes private, which is happening. Ultimatly, they will need Captains, and I would assume they would take a "Known" (previous FO) verses an unknown... Again, this is all new to me too, so I could be speaking out of turn on some of the company specifics, but the other advice applies to any job.. Hope it helps..


PS: I sent you a PM with my personal email.. I am brand new here, so it might not have worked...

31st Jan 2007, 21:27
Hi guys/gals,
Anyone have any info on Air Japan,routes etc.Also,has anyone worked for hawaii,any recomendations about them.I am looking at this closely and think it will be a good longterm opportunity.
Thanks for the info,

1st Feb 2007, 03:17
Check out this site: http://www.ana.co.jp/eng/int/others/codeshare/nq.html

That should answer your question.
Good Luck,

The Dominican
2nd Feb 2007, 00:12
Is the class for March finally filled up? :confused: I'm still waiting to hear, got a message from the contract company that results are coming "slowly" Are both interview periods going to overlap? There are interviews scheduled for February already. Has everyone that was waiting to hear for the March class been called already? I'm starting to think that my application was lost:ugh:

2nd Feb 2007, 05:02
I'm in the March Class for AJV. 12 March is the start date. For those that have no word, hang in there. GLTYA!!! Bonzai!!!:ok:

2nd Feb 2007, 17:00
Bonzai, I appreciate your link on the other site about living in Japan. Congrats on the class date!

May I ask if you are you planning to live there, or commute?

2nd Feb 2007, 17:47
Hi Robie,
Thank you. I'm planning on the commute once on line. During training though, there is no commute.
Cheers, Bonzai!!!:ok:

9th Feb 2007, 09:58
Hi all!

Any idea of a typical roster line? Any extra info much appreciated.


14th Feb 2007, 08:44
Can anyone confirm if there are upgrade opportunities with AirJapan before the first 5 year is up?
Also what are the air law and radio law exam like?
Overnight allowanes/per diems down route?
Can anyone give us an overview of what it was like when they went through it,any thoughts,recommendations.

15th Feb 2007, 10:02
Took the law and radio exams in 98. It was pure hell and lots of memorizing. But don't let my opinion discourage you. After it was done, I had no doubt I could do anything I put my mind to. Good Luck!:ok:

15th Feb 2007, 14:14
Whats the cost of living like? $500 per month accom? What can you rent for that type of money? Is anyone planning to bring their families ?


The Dominican
15th Feb 2007, 14:26
Whats the cost of living like? $500 per month accom? What can you rent for that type of money?

Tokyo and Osaka have just been named the two most expensive cities on the planet (Again) $ 500 is not going to rent you very much. I'm going to commute at the beginning, training is six to seven months and the company pays for accommodation during training, after that I'll probably get a crash pad with 20 or 30 other guys to keep it at the $500

16th Feb 2007, 05:14
Just somewhat intrigued.
Did the agencies discuss Alien Registration with you??
It used to be (maybe still is) that you cannot rent an apartment in Japan ie take a lease unless you have Alien Registration, nor can you pay Japanese tax (which at 15-20% is far less than many countries.)
Of course if you reckon you can avoid paying any tax anywhere in the world that's fine - just hope you've done your homework!
IF you can rent then be prepared for higher initial costs than in the west (bond, key money, "thank you money", maybe others.)

Rent wise everything is based on square metres: per month look at (USD):
20m, 5 min walk from Shinagawa, fully furnished single room 2200;
50m, 15 min walk from Shinagawa, part furnished 1500;
70m, 10 min train from Shinagawa, unfurnished 1500.
Just a rough starting point.

16th Feb 2007, 05:25
Thanks for the heads-up on the tax situation.. I have just sent an email asking for further clarification..

I am planning to commute (Have UAL benefits too) and have heard that a hotel / motel is the way to go, over a small aptartment with 65 guys in it!!
True? Not True? Not a fan of large crash pads here...

Any stronger or more recent rumors about opening ORD as a base? Was talked about in my interview..

Any word on the ABEX 767s that were just leased? Flown by us or ABEX folks??

Thanks for the intel..


16th Feb 2007, 07:34
Was rumoured that as the years went on the constant packing/unpacking, lack of places to leave stuff, staying in hotels which did not have english TV and (of course) no cable TV was a factor in deciding some Air Japan guys to say "sayonara."
Quality of Life type of concept.
Only a (very strong) rumour, more than happy to be corrected if I am mistaken.

16th Feb 2007, 16:23
The ABX aircraft will be flown by ABX pilots. ANA and ABX have applied for JCAB approval for the agreement. I would assume that with ANA's backing the agreement has a good chance of approval, but have not heard how long it might take before JCAB reaches a decision.

ABX has talked to the pilot group about a Japan domicile but there are many hurdles to that arrangement. Expectation in the group is that we will probably end up with LAX and commercial deadheads to/from our trips. Our current schedules are week-on/week-off, but we've discussed 2-on/2-off and month-on/month-off for this contract.

We only operate and have on order -200's, so we won't be involved with long-haul trips (transpac) in the foreseeable future.

I've been watching developments closely, as I do intend to bid for a position. I came to ABX 9 years ago with hopes of flying the 767 internationally. We've had no growth since the DHL buyout of Airborne Express and our subsequent spinoff, so I've had no real opportunity to bid out of DC-9 FO.
I'd be happy to answer any other questions.

16th Feb 2007, 17:04
I'm interesting in the rostering as well.

Once at check in at NRT, are you used continuously through the 20 days and stay at the outstations, or is there periods of down time in Japan? All duty hotels paid for? Possiblity to upgrade during FO 767 contract or do you have to wait until the end? Are there big rostering differences between Air Japan and ANA since AJ only covers a few cities?

Thanks for any help you can supply.

17th Feb 2007, 03:22
RobieM.. Thanks for the reply, and the intel.. Hope to see some of your guys out in the system..; that is after I complete my 8 months of training!! You have some talented guys over there I used to work with from the Lcl 1224..

Please post if you hear of any more developments..



17th Feb 2007, 03:39
Hey Bob,

I didn't see you at the company meeting thursday night. It was strange they served sushi and egg-rolls and then told us they were planning on establishing a domicile in Japan. I dont know if they were posturing or what! I am still hoping for the month on month off schedule. Maybe we can get on the same schedule if so.


17th Feb 2007, 05:17
Kougarok, I thought I was flying under the radar over here! I don't want them to make it too good a deal, I might be too junior to get it! Too bad I missed out on the sushi, but maybe I'll find some at Manhatten Beach tonight.

21st Feb 2007, 02:06
I thought I would revive this thread in hopes that someone can post info on AJV roster/schedule? Per Redflyin's earlier post:

How many work days per month?

Work days all in one block?

Do work days include rest days/down time at base?

21st Feb 2007, 08:01
About the skeds:

I have to say sorry man because I used to have an AJV schedule on my computer, but I must have erased it.. I got it from PARC, and I am sure you can do the same through your crew company.

For what it is worth, I am told they have set up a scheduling "Committee" and PARC has someone on it.. I have one buddy already there, and he says the schedules or fine, and the company is very flexible.. (AJV)

As I do not start until May, I can only speak based on what I have heard, and not first hand.. I don't know anything about the AirJapan contract..

Hope it helps..


22nd Feb 2007, 12:36
Thanks for the info guys. I was wondering about how much a crashpad would run in Tokyo if I'm commuting from the US. I would be taking the contract for a better paycheck, but I'm not sure if I would net more after having to drop some of that money on a crashpad.

Say of 20/21 in NRT, how many nights would you be on your own dime? 4-5? I was wondering more on the JP Express side.

22nd Feb 2007, 13:03

Sent you a PM..

Any info you guys have on commuting, living etc.. is helpful!



25th Feb 2007, 03:51
The word from management and union is 2 ABX 767 flying for ANA this summer and one more in the Fall. I dont know if there are going to be dedicated crews for Japan or it's going to be bid every month. It does't sound like we will have a domicile in Japan. Are there any other ABX pilots on this forum beside robiemartin and I?

25th Feb 2007, 22:22
Thanks for the info guys. I'd like to keep this thread going. Any guys actually flying the ANA/AJ contacts now? Info on QOL?

12th Mar 2007, 08:26
Hey all.. This thread seems to be crapping out which is a shame...

Are there any other people starting class on May 21st?? If so, please drop a line on here..!



12th Mar 2007, 08:30
Also, any of you boys that started in March have feeback on how things are going?? How is the "New" hotel? Any company news (AJV or AJX)?


James T. Kirk
19th Mar 2007, 13:30
I'd like to know more too. I rushed through the assesment and got through OK but now everyone's gone silent. Standing by to expedite but would like to know more about schedules and commuting too.

21st Mar 2007, 00:15
I started class last week (12 March) and I would be happy to answer some questions. I am here through PARC on the AJX contract. I am not sure if we are in a new hotel or not, but it is the New Takanawa Prince hotel. About a 5 minute walk to the Shinagawa Station.

Things are actually pretty good here. We did the Air Law class last week and while it was not exciting (it is air law) it was not that bad either. Or JCAB exam is monday so hopefully all will go well...

I dont know anything about the AJV schedules, but with AJX, you fly to three cities... NRT - CAN (departs about 8am, then returns back to NRT same day), NRT - HNL (departs sometime in the afternoon and arriven in HNL about 0930 the next day, then comes back 0900 the following day to NRT), and NRT-HKG (leave about 1830 arrive about 2330, off the whole next day in HKG then back to NRT about 0830 the next day).

It appears that you are always back in NRT about 1400 - 1500 on your last day.. Typically 4 to 5 overnight trips per month, averaging about 70 hours of time a month (they said AJV averages about 40 hours a month)

Commuting is either paid ticket or you can use ZED tickets. It seems that most guys are commuting to Australia, with a few to Europe, US and Thailand.

Not sure about crashpad's yet. I hear that there are some but I am planning on staying at the holiday inn, narita for the time being. It averages about 50$ a night, and is only about 10 minutes from the airport. If you have a crash pad in the city, its a long way to work every day. (and pretty expensive)

Only been here a week but so far I am enjoying it a lot. Any other questions, fire away...

21st Mar 2007, 12:22
Thanks for posting.. I was hoping someone who was in that class would get on here.. That's great.. I do have a few questions if you dont mind.. PM me if you prefer..

That is the same hotel as before, but I heard it was going into some sort of construction / updating, and that we would move.. Glad we are still there, as there seems to be a lot around..

Have you been given a training schedule yet?? How "intense" is the 8 months?? Stuff all the time, or lots of time off...?

Are you enjoying your classmates? Is it a Capt. or FO class? Both AJX and AJV?

I think your idea about staying neat NRT is probably the best one. I just flew with a guy that used to overnight there with ANZ and he said there are some great places to go out.. (Barge Inn, Flyers etc..) Lots of crews and good prices on food and beer..

I will be starting AJV Captain class May 21st, so any and all info is very much appreciated!! Thanks again for taking the time.. Others on here will appreciate it too!!


21st Mar 2007, 23:42
The hotel is undergoing some renovation. Its only on floors 12-14 right not. Not too much of a problem but you can hear them when they start with the jackhammer about 10 am each day. There are some rooms that have internet, but you have to ask for them. Its 1000 yen per day, but if you join their prince club, i am told that it is free. I also went out and bought a wireless router, so more people can share the connection....

The only "off" days are on weekends...However, there are lots of "blank days" throught your training period. We did the class on Air Law last week, and this whole week has been blank days...ie off. Its not near as intense and I first suspected, but I am studying on my own...Our law exam is monday...

Its a mixed class of AJX / AJV. There are 8 AJX and 4 AJV in the class. I am not sure of the AJV makeup but AJX is 7 Captains, 1 FO (me). We also have 2 guys that are already typed, and they run on an accelerated schedule..

At some point we are told that some current guys flying the line will come to meet us and talk to us about commuting and living arrangements. Hopefully we will get a clearer picture then.

22nd Mar 2007, 21:44
I have just logged on for the first time in about 2 years . Yeah , this website is still blooming with useful information .
I am currently at AJV . I will try to help you with your questions .
About training , it is very slow indeed .
When your sim starts , you can expect one 4hr session every 2 days...
So lots of time to study and relax . You will sometimes get a few unscheduled days off , because of holidays in Japan . Soon coming is what they call " Golden Week " . It goes from april 28th to may 6th . Our class was given off for that entire period and most of the guys enjoyed a trip back home on company's expenses ... You might be lucky again this year !
All of us are based in Narita , wheter you are AJX or AJV . I have been staying in hotels so far and it's working great . We have special deals at the Narita Excel and the Garden Hotel for about $50 , and they allow us to check out as late as 19:00 at no extra charge . Some guys share an appartment in Narita , and they are quite happy with it too.
About AJV schedule , yes it is quite relax for now . There are only 3 flights a week on the Japan - Anchorage - Chicago run , so we take 10 days to do it , with an extended stop in either place for 4 days . The rest is China turns and starting this summer 5 weekly Seoul . So a typical month includes a North American turn and 3 or 4 flights to China , the rest being STBY days or days off. We will be getting 5 more freighters starting december 2007 . So it may be quiet now , but that won't last forever .

Cheers and good luck on your training :ok:

23rd Mar 2007, 01:04
I did forget one thing about the hotel.... AJX guys are in the New Takanawa, but the AJV guys are located somewhere else. I am not sure what the name of it is, but its about 3 or 4 stops away on the subway.

25th Mar 2007, 15:35
Thanks Guys!! Great info.. I look forward to meeting y'all when I get there in May!!

Please continue to post things you feel we "New Joiners" should know...


12th Apr 2007, 22:41
Hi Folks.
I have an interview coming up this month.
Is there any questions in the interview that were surprising or unusual:confused:



13th Apr 2007, 00:11
Its all about the sim. There are very few technical questions in the interview. Most of the questions are to find out if you know what you are getting into with the commute and to make sure you will fit in well with the culture. Fly the sim exactly the way the tell you to and then just keep your fingers crossed for the medical.... Thats the worst part of it all and there is nothing you can do to prepare for it.

14th Apr 2007, 21:49
Thanks for the heads up. Haven't been behind the controls in awhile. I'll be boning up for that.

The Dominican
15th Apr 2007, 01:52
If you haven't flown in a while, my recommendation would be to do a Sim prep on the 76. The sim ride is the interview, they understand that you are not flying the 76 and they will help you with automation and so on.
But you have to steer the aluminum tube as your resume indicates you should. You dig?

19th Apr 2007, 02:08
Heard that only 75% passed the last simcourse.
Looong course, no guarantees . . . . :(

19th Apr 2007, 05:06
Failure rate is more like 10%, probably less, averaged over the past 6 years. Some issues recently with a change in instructors but they were resolved and the crew involved are still around.

Show me anything in life with a guarantee, apart from DEATH!!!!!

19th Apr 2007, 08:05
I know that in the last airlines I have worked for (both considered "Majors") the failure rates have been 5-15%.. While you hope everyone passes, sometimes it just cannot work out that way..:8

Looking forward to class in one month!


19th Apr 2007, 08:51
"Show me anything in life with a guarantee, apart from DEATH!!!!!"

US Taxes

19th Apr 2007, 13:54
Amen brother...

"Death and Taxes"

20th Apr 2007, 11:38
Anyone who has relocated to Japan with small kid, please PM me.

Thank you in advance.

28th Apr 2007, 02:48
Interview the 25th of May, any one now what to expect for someone applying for an FO position? Do they care if you smoke or is it more if you get thru the medical it's all good. And what is the BMI set at for intials at AJ?


28th Apr 2007, 02:57
You are not going to see anything different being an FO until IOE (OE, OJT, whatever u want to call it). Your interview / training will be exactly the same and you will get a P1 type rating as an FO. There is a lot of interview info on this thread...

I believe the BMI is under 30....might be 28. I cant remember for sure. As far as smoking, I dont think there is anyone in our class that smokes, however, it seems that everyone else in Japan does smoke. There might have been 1 or 2 of the Dash or 737 guys that smoked, but I cant remember. Part of the medical is testing your lung capacity so I would imagine that would be more difficult if you are a smoker. If you pass the medical though, I can't imagine it being a problem.

Good Luck

Capt. John Doe
30th Apr 2007, 05:05
Can anyone tell me why everyone stress the BMI during the medical? Is it a Japanese thing? 'Cause I don't think many places look at your BMI during a regular flight physical? As for the smoking thing, I know someone who just interviewed with ANA and he smokes like a train and still passed the medical. So I guess it's really not that big deal, since a lot of Japanese pilots smoke as well.

And CRJ705, are you really 26?!? That's pretty damn young to have been qualified to interview as Capt. for ANA group's AJX or AJV or whatever they call their 76 operation.

30th Apr 2007, 06:27
I think most people stress the BMI on here because it is the one thing that you can check yourself before you go. It would be a waste of time and a little embarassing to go to the medical then get sent home for being over the BMI. As to why the Japanese care about it? I have no idea. It is what it is and as I have learned, dont ask or try to understand. I wouldnt worry about the smoking at all as long as you are in good health.

Yes, i am 26. I got lucky and everything fell together when I was younger. I wont bore you with the details...

The Dominican
30th Apr 2007, 06:40
Can anyone tell me why everyone stress the BMI during the medical? Is it a Japanese thing? 'Cause I don't think many places look at your BMI during a regular flight physical?

It is their requirement and that is it. There in nothing regular about this physical, unless you are talking about NASA:ugh:

60 to 70% of folks fail the medical and about 60% fail the sim ride. Another note, the recurrent medicals are just like the pre employment medical, so the fitness level has to be maintained for the duration of the contract.

30th Apr 2007, 15:28
Are you thru with training? Any pointers for those attempting or things to think about if selected?


The Dominican
30th Apr 2007, 22:54
Are you thru with training? Any pointers for those attempting or things to think about if selected?


Just started actually, about a month and a half into it. I'll give some pointers later on when I get a little further on the course. But so far It has been a good experience:ok:

1st May 2007, 01:15
One question the IAC stuff didn't address:

I understand the monthly rosters include 10 consecutive days off (8 guaranteed), which includes commute time... but what about the WEEKLY rosters?

Do you fly each and every single day during the 20 days before your guaranteed "off" time?

Do you have a 1 in 7 or some other type of arrangement where you won't burn out in very short order? (I can't imagine working 7 days a week for 3 weeks straight before you get a day off).

Just trying to figure out how the daily life works in a typical monthly rotation...


The Dominican
1st May 2007, 02:54
Do you have a 1 in 7 or some other type of arrangement where you won't burn out in very short order? (I can't imagine working 7 days a week for 3 weeks straight before you get a day off).

Zup Lear

Of course not dude, they have regulations this part of the world:)
Just messing with ya, you get days off and reserve days here and there. One leg days, hotel for 16-20 hours and back. A day off and there you go again, that is pretty much the way it goes. Heard from one of the line guys that they are doing about 60-70 hours at AJX and about 50 at AJV but the AJV flying is going up in the next few months

1st May 2007, 03:36
We met with a training captain a few weeks back and he provided some insight into the monthly schedules. You wont ever see a day off on any of your rosters. What you will see is a "blank day" or as he refered to them, "balcony days". These are days that the company has not assigned you any duties, but in the event a standby pilot is used, they can change your blank day to a standby day. With only 3 flights leaving NRT a day, you can imagine that the above case does not happen too often.
Your "days off" can be blank days, or for example when you are in Hong Kong, you have a 27 hour overnight and that can be considered your day off too for legality reasons.
That specific captain that we talked to flew over 90 hours last month. But as previously stated, the average is a little above 70.
Being that there is not seniority here, you do not bid for your schedules. You are able to request your specific days off, and the company complies as much as possible. They attempt to be fair to everyone, so if one year you request Christmas off, then next year, you might not get it again. As the contract states, you can be taken down to 8 days off, but that captain specifically stated that he cannot recall that ever happening since he had been here. Schedules here are still done by hand and the company is small. The seem to try to make everyone happy...as much as they can...

2nd May 2007, 00:37
Iv'e been in AJX/AJV for over 5 years now. Just trying to find out what's happening with your wet lease contract for AJV.

For the guys worried about BMI. If you are out of the green band you can still pass the medical but I think you will have to do a stress ECG every medical there after.

2nd May 2007, 04:11
Green band?

2nd May 2007, 04:26
Out of the green band = Out of normal parameters!

2nd May 2007, 10:48
For all those out there wanting some info on the AJX/AJV contract. Well here it is as I have worked there for a few years now.

The Pay: For those that where hired before 2005 they are on the so called "A" scale and those after are on the so called "B" scale. The only difference is that those FO's that joined before 2005 and are now upgraded you only get the Captains "B" pay. So once the few remaining (only about 15-20 guys) "A" scales guys leave there is only one pay scale, not the many pay scales apparently there.

Yes if you go to the frieghter you are on more money but it is the same the pax plus $1500 for a captain and $1000 for the FO's. Everything else is the same.

Parc and Hacs pay exactly the same amount of money except Hacs give a little more in the pension, but basically the same.

Contract is for 70 hours per month then overtime above that. AJV guys are on about 40 -50 hours a month at the moment. AJX guys are on about 70 hrs a month although since the frieghter and pax were seperated they have been doing a bit of overtime until more pilots arrive. Other than a few winges that get in the ear of the rosterer every month and build there own roster overtime is not the norm other than the few f***ing a*****es that take the piss at everyone elses expense. Capt KK.

As for the training you get the basic pay minus the commute and housing and plus the $44 perday.

Both are based in Narita but AJX only fly out of and AJV have no flights out of, so frieghter boys spend the whole month living out of a suit case and many many many dead heading between flights. The AJX boys either live in the Hotels around Narita or many now have apartments which the housing allowance covers.

The training, well guys its no harder than anywhere else in the world, its only an aeroplane, just do it there way like it or not and you will get through.

The medical is fairly involved but believe me there are many fat c***s that work there and its not that big of a deal, we are all alco's and its pretty hard to fail once you are there. In many years I dont think any body has failed once you get through the initial crap.

For those that say its a long time for the training, well 6 months is 6 months but Tokyo is a great place heaps of fun times to be had, especially if you have yellow fever, which if you dont whenb you get there, I bet you will have after. To many people stress about how hard it is and shouldnt. Yes people get scubbed every course but believe me they probably deserve it, attitude has a HUGE part in how they look at you, you could be Chuck Yaeger but if you dont get along with them then say good bye.

Now days you get an english speaking intructor which is a huge benifit, unlike the five yrs where evrything was done through a translater. Sorry for those that have been on recent course and complaned about how hard it was, but remember everyone has to do it so DEAL with it as those that are here have been there done that.

AS for me its the easiest job in the world once you jump all the hoops. They leave you alone and its getting better as time goes on. The commute is proberly the only downer on it but there is talk that things may change, but I wouldn't count on it.

The tax situation is as Parc and Hacs say in the initial contact with them that it is up to each and everyones responsibility.

Well there you have it take it not that is how it is, I should know as I work there and plan on staying for a while.

PS. if you are a ****** then please apply some where else as you won't fit in.

2nd May 2007, 11:00
Mate, that is without doubt the best pissey reply I have ever read on this dick of a site. Good luck and keep up the good work, seriously:D

4th May 2007, 23:07
Slight thread hijack...

What does it mean on the application when they say "Application must be in Type Written form"?

Does that mean they want it "written" in English block letters (mixed case or all caps) or does that mean they want it typed out as if you were to "Type" it on the computer?

Don't want to go to all the trouble to fill it out just to find out it needs to be done a different way.

Also, what did everyone put in the Autobiographical and other relevant information block?


5th May 2007, 00:44
I cant remember what I did with mine. Was the app. sent to you in PDF form or was it sent in the mail? If it was sent to you electronically, then I would fill it in on the computer. If it was mailed to you, I would write it in very neat and clear block letters. Do typewriters even exist anymore??

In the autobiographical section I wrote my short autobiography. Flying history, job history, and added in some recent family history (marriage). If I remember correctly, they want you to indicate if you are planning to commute or not. In my opinion, this is a little bit of a trick question. You are applying for a job that is a commuting contract. I would be leary of saying you are not planning to commute. A lot of questions they ask you will come from what you write there so make sure its accurate.

5th May 2007, 04:30

Actually, yeah. I have an IBM Selectric II in my closet. But then again, I'm kind of a pack rat. :)

Thanks for the info, anyone else had a comment on the type/handwritten/computerized?

5th May 2007, 05:21
Did mine on the computer, worked out good. I was asked a lot of questions about commuting such as, are you familiar with commuting, from where will you be commuting, you know it can be very stressfull etc. Also you might want to make notice of the date columm under flying experience, it's
DD/MM/YR and not the way you would normally write it in the US, caught that one myself right before I hit the send key,

Best of luck,

The Dominican
5th May 2007, 05:58
I sent mine on the PDF format and filled it out right out of the computer. just make sure that you don't round hours and that sort of thing, be accurate. The autobiographical is very important, make sure that you write about you and give them a sence of who you are and how you will cope with the commute and the support that you are getting from your family. Remember, you are NOT going to impress this folks with your "flight times" since they have apps from folks all over the world and folks that have flown heavy frames on long hauls. Most of the folks in our class now came down from the 747's and MD-11's and the other bunch where 737 captains. IMO the autobiographical section is very important:ok:

5th May 2007, 13:33
Thanks, guys. Good stuff.

FD2, the same guy on FI? You've gone over there, too?

With all the U.S. guys leaving the market, who's going to be left flying in the U.S.? :E

5th May 2007, 15:18
I'm also a PPWer & APCer as well as Lear70 nice to see guys reaching out for all available resources.

I went thru CReW as the pay seemed a little higher even though they don't have the retirement account now. I filled out the app. online and missed the autobio. section at the end, so Alan asked me to redo it and then they went thru and made doubley sure all the i's were dotted and t's crossed. Recieved a phone call a couple days ago asking if I had any questions about the sim profile and Mike Lee from CReW really took the time to explain EXACTLY what they wanted to see.

Luck to all including those already in class.


8th May 2007, 13:18
Great Info Guys, especially those of you already over there.. I agree with all that has been written about the interview and sim process.. I think it is important to stress a good attitude. I was in a good situation when I interviewed because I already have a good job for a major carrier, just looking to leave the Middle East. I was honest with them about my situation, and found the enviroment to be very warm, and a lot of smiles. Same with the sim.. Obviously they are looking for an impressive performance (you should get the gouge from PARC well before the interview) but try to have fun with it.. I had them laughing a few times, and found myself just rolling with the punches.. Sometimes things would move a bit slower then you may want in the sim, but relax, take your time and again, try to have fun and show a bit of personality... (there are already soo many nerds doing what we do.. don't be one of them!!:8 )

See everyone soon...


AJV Capt. Class May 21st

13th May 2007, 11:31
Hey Birdcage,

I don't totally disagree with what you are saying but to any new guys trying for interviews don't show too much "personality", just be yourself! I've been with this lot for over 5 years now and anyone showing too much "personality" is like a raised nail waiting to be hammered!! The Japanese system runs on "not standing out from the crowd"!!

Just some more advice!

14th May 2007, 13:38
My friend, that is why I said "A bit of personality"...


I am off to the golf couse to pick up my white gloves!

TAC inop.
17th May 2007, 06:39
I'm arriving Sat evening, to start on course NQT6-15 on Monday.
Where will you fellows be? ....TGI's?
Shall we at least say 17.00 Sunday in the bar?

Oh...and what's with the gloves and headset thing?


17th May 2007, 09:44
I believe we no longer frequent TGI's since they stiffed some of our guys pretty bad. Aparently a few weeks ago, the manager came up and said that one of the group left without paying for some beers. When the manager was asked what date this occurred, he said about 3 weeks prior. Having returned to the place many times since that date, he was questioned as to why he waited so long. No answer....

Also, aparently one of the bartenders made a pretty nasty comment about our group too. He didnt know one of the japanese persons at the bar was with the group when he said it and they overherd it.

Service there sucks, beer is way too expensive, and there are many better options around. Just FYI

17th May 2007, 15:39
Count me in! I think the PARC people are taking a few of us out on Sun, but would still ike to meet up.. Anyone out on Sat night?? assuming I can still stand after that long flight!! What about Outback?


19th May 2007, 18:19
I have my flight info and will arrive the 23rd is the Tokyo Inn anywhere near where everyone else is? Keeping them crossed for the medical and chair flying for the sim....

Any idea on how long after interview invite to training is extended?

20th May 2007, 02:59
I am not sure where the Tokyo Inn is. We are mostly in the Shinagawa area. AJV guys around the Kamata area.

I dont recall exactly how long it took from interview to offer, but I do remember that it was agonizingly slow. I think it was about a month or so.. maybe a bit more.

Good luck

The Dominican
20th May 2007, 05:46
Any idea on how long after interview invite to training is extended?

For me it came after almost two months :ugh:

Worth the wait IMO:ok:

21st May 2007, 06:42
Do you guys happen to have any info on the 737 ops in Japan or can you get it for me via pm please? I'd appreciate it.:ugh:

TAC inop.
21st May 2007, 13:40
Hi bud
yup, no worries, get in touch with IAC...they have the best contracts in this part of the world.
Talk to Sam
[email protected]

James T. Kirk
23rd May 2007, 11:15
Hi All,

Just wondering, are AJV still taking on Captains or is the break in captain recruitment as explained on the HACS website still in force? I passed everything in the selection procedure back in February but have heard nothing since. It seems unlike the ANA group to just leave someone hanging like this judging from what little I've seen of them that is.

Any info gratefully received.

Kirk out.....

The Dominican
24th May 2007, 02:52
They do take a while to get back to you, but they will. Hang in there:ok:

I think that the captain slots are filled for a while, but it will start again by the fall I think:D

Drop a line to your contract agency and ask them about your status

24th May 2007, 08:28
Toyoko Inn I found is right next to Haneda Airport, nice city and everyone so far has been great did the medical today. I have no idea how I did as almost no one spoke enlish and my Japanese is VERY limited; any idea if they let you know right away on a bust item for the medical? Sim on the morrow and I found out I am the only one being tested right now so the spotlight shinith on Jobear....

man I need a beer.

Blue skies to all

James T. Kirk
24th May 2007, 08:56
Thanks for the info Dominican, I'll hang on a while longer and see what happens.

The Dominican
25th May 2007, 03:58
any idea if they let you know right away on a bust item for the medical?

No bro! It takes three weeks for them to get the results back for the medical.:ugh:

25th May 2007, 13:49
Any one know what to expect from the tax man? If paid abroad? If you take all money into Japan? After deductions % you end paying, (not tax brakets pls. ) Any other valuable info...
Take care

25th May 2007, 14:17
Depends on which country will be your residence. You will not have residence in Japan on this contract so you will not have the option to pay Japan taxes. You will have to comply with whatever tax regulations apply to your home country. Your salary is paid tax free so this is your responsibility and in the contract, you agree to release your employer from any tax liabilities. In the US, there are ways to get out of the first 85,000 (somewhere around there), but it is not easy to do. Right now I put aside 30% for taxes and that should cover me until I figure out how it will work.

25th May 2007, 14:33
...thanks. And if you reside in Japan... ?There are some jobs that you cannot comute , domestic operation.

25th May 2007, 14:38
I am here on a commuting contract so I will have to defer to someone else about japanese taxes, however, this link seemed to have a pretty good bit of info.


25th May 2007, 15:15
The problem deducting that $85,000 for US taxes is that if you fly to Hawaii (which they do almost every week on the AJX contract), you're technically back in the U.S.

You have to be gone from the U.S. for 330 days out of the calendar year, INCLUDING returns temporarily for vacation or even a flight into Hawaii.

That means you can't, more than likely, use the deduction based on that rule alone.

Someone said they purchased a home in Thailand or somewhere similar and are using that as their "home" and still get to claim the $85,000 tax deduction, regardless of how much you return to the U.S. I have not checked with an accountant to see if this meets the IRS guidelines or not.

More than likely, you'll have to pay U.S. income taxes on almost all of it.

25th May 2007, 15:36
Lear is correct on the 330 days. At AJX or AJV, that will be impossible. In order to qualify for the foreign earned income exclusion you must:
1. have a foreign earned income
2. tax home must be in a foreign country
3. one of the following
a. bona fide foreign residence
b. pay foreign tax in a country with a tax treaty with the US
c. out of the US 330 days
The specifics of each are located on the IRS website.
I am buying a house in Thailand (technically my wife since I cannot own it)but merly owning a house there will not quailfy me. I will have to have that as my actual residence (which we are doing). There are no set guidelines as to what the IRS uses, but I assume they are pretty picky. The info is on the website for those who are interested, but its too long to try to explain here.

25th May 2007, 15:59
III. Japanese income taxes on Expatriates' Compensation
III-1. Expatriates in Japan
Foreign enterprises have various interests in Japan through their branches,joint ventures with Japanese enterprises,liaison offices,and other forms of business arrangements in Japan. Usually the expatriates' assignment in Japan is for more than one year,and,under the Tax Law of Japan,they are liable for Japanese income taxes as resident taxpayers.
The expatriates no doubt have no intention to reside in Japan permanently,and they are treated as non-permanent resident taxpayers for the first five years of their residence in Japan and as permanent resident taxpayers thereafter.
The scope of taxable income in respect of non-permanent resident taxpayers is different from that of permanent resident taxpayers with respect to income from sources abroad which ,if not paid in Japan or remitted to Japan,is not taxable,while a permanent resident taxpayer is liable for income taxes on his/her entire income.
.... and CREW from HACS is a....
TOKYO August 17, 2006 In a tripartite joint venture designed to address the increasing pilot needs of the ANA Group and other airlines around the world, the Honolulu based crew leasing company Hawaii Aviation Contract Services (HACS), Japanese airline ANA (All Nippon Airways) and Japanese trading corporation Sojitz today established a new flight crew leasing company....
...cross your fingers, if this aply we all we be happy contract pilots.
Other agents, I have no clue what would be the deal.
After this promo HACS should give me some comision :)

28th May 2007, 15:55
Interview went well as did the simulator evaluation, on the 25th of May. Just awaiting the medical results. Do they get a prelim from the medical before they say yeah or ney from the interview/sim.

There was talk during my interview of a possibility of visa's for pilots...

30th May 2007, 10:04
I was readng IAC's contract with AJN/AJX and ANK. It says that you get an economy class seat to and from work and at all other times. Is this true? Whom has the best deal for the ANA flying now? I am interested but not flying in economy commuting to Japan. Thanks.

30th May 2007, 11:10
Did they say a confirmed economy class seat?? Right now, you are on your own getting to and from Japan. You get a commuting allowance and access to ZED fares to commute, but I dont think any of the agencies offer confirmed travel to and from work (unless you pay for it).

30th May 2007, 13:01
Traditionally the 767 flying has been a bulked up salary - you do not live in Japan therefore tax, accommodation, commute travel and all else is YOUR responsibility and ANA do not want to know anything of any of your perceived problems.
Domestic flying obviously has slightly different considerations but the aim of ANA to minimise exposure and play hardball would be unchanged.

Yes as things are changing around the world regarding a lack of experienced Captains so may the attitude of ANA (and/or JAL) change in regards T&C's. Maybe happening already, maybe not.

It may well be the best (only??) example of ANA moving beyond operating aircraft as they were operated in the 1970's (well maybe 1980's if very generous!); set up subsidiarys (spelling??) and try to divide and conquer the pilot market even if it means leaving aircraft sitting uncrewed on the tarmac.
Loss of face and all that more-than-interesting concept.

As always - make sure you do your homework so you don't bitch later!!
Simple really!:ok:

30th May 2007, 13:32
Your confirmed economy seating for commuting is only for a couple of events:

Travel to Japan from the U.S. for the beginning of training and afterwards back to the U.S.

Travel to Japan from the U.S. to start your contract.

Travel from Japan back to the U.S. to start your vacation, then back again when vacation is over.

Travel from Japan back to the U.S. at completion of your contract.

Anything on your off days each month is YOUR responsibility to buy ZED fares for. Business class ZED to/from Japan runs around $1,000 and is space available. Easier to go up through Alaska or something than straight to L.A., loads are pretty high these days, and business class (and first) are usually pretty booked and difficult to get on.

This was a bit of a surprise for me, as well. Most of the other contracts offer business class positive-space travel for those events.

Martin VanNostrum
31st May 2007, 03:49
You will find you can only buy economy ZED tickets through ANA staff travel; there are no business class ZED tickets available. If you want to fly business class you will have to buy full fare tickets.

31st May 2007, 11:43
Oh, that BITES!

Here in the U.S. you can buy ZED tickets for any class of travel you are willing to pay for...

That takes some of the interest out of it for me. I don't fly coach class Internationally more than 4 hours... can't take being packed in like a Sardine.

31st May 2007, 18:49
That's correct Lear70. You can NOT buy a Business Class ZED ticket on any ANA contract job.
Also you do NOT get confirmed tickets to and from your Vacation, as you mentioned earlier. Going on Vacation is your problem as per normal commuting.

31st May 2007, 20:02
The problem deducting that $85,000 for US taxes is that if you fly to Hawaii (which they do almost every week on the AJX contract), you're technically back in the U.S.

A bit of a gray area here. If you come and go on the Gen. Dec. then are you really in the USA for the purposes of this ruling? Just don't use credit cards or leave any other trace of your overnight in Hawaii and it's a non-issue.

That said, both the commuting contract and fact you are being paid by a U.S. Company are problematic. With a commuting contract one possibility is to use the daily per diem rates ( food and lodging ) for your days in Japan. Narita is presently $262/day. Multiple that by roughly 255 days in Japan/working and you still get $66,810 tax deduction. Either that or, as done by the guy in Thailand, spend most of your time off outside of the USA. Then you still qualify for the foreign earned income exclusion based on the 330 days in a foreign country clause.

The best deals come with a resident visa and pay from a foreign company. If it's a commuting contract it is also preferable for the commute to be to an "exteneded layover" in your home base. Again, coming and going on the Gen. Dec.


Capt. John Doe
1st Jun 2007, 01:32
Then, as typoonpilot mentioned, would it be more prudent for guys over at the States to go through Parc or IAC vs. HACS? I'm currently debating whether or not to make the move and send my app. in. I understand that all 3 pay pretty similarly. I'll definitely need to consult with my CPA on the taxes though.

So far, except for the commuting on your own, it actually seems like a great place to work. And if you can minimize the taxes, that would even be a bigger frosting on the cake.

1st Jun 2007, 03:10
I, as an american, went with PARC for that reason. However, there are some other differences that we previously discussed. Mainly insurance for yourself and dependents. The PARC insurance is not very "american friendly". PARC also does not have a 401k like HACS does...

1st Jun 2007, 03:12
Absolutely, a question for you about vacation. If you get 24 days a year and take them in two separate blocks, will you have 2 months where you have 22 days off? (10 days off per contract + 12 days of vacation)

1st Jun 2007, 05:45
That's correct CRJ, they are pretty flexible with how you use your vacation days. Some guys take 2 days Vacation every month on top of their 10 days (11 days with AJV) to make at least 12 or 13 days off every month. Generally the leave is taken in 2 blocks of 12 though, and as you said, added to your days off but within reason you can request what you want.

1st Jun 2007, 13:01
How is ground school going for those just finished up with the air law course? Anyone else here of visa's may be forthcoming?

1st Jun 2007, 13:22
I remember them asking me if I planned on commuting or living in Japan in my interview, as well as mentioning something about visa. I believe that visa is in the same category of the possible space positive travel for commuting. Would be great and I am sure they are looking into it, but probably will not happen anytime soon.

The contract specifically requires that you commute. I would not make any decision based on anything other than that if it were me.

13th Jun 2007, 13:50
Any upcoming classes at AJX/V? Still waiting on word from the medical but I did talk to the psycologist and I stayed at a Holiday Inn express last night. Anyone using Slingbox to get their TV fix while in training, just wondering if it was worth the effort?

by now a nail bitin' freak

13th Jun 2007, 13:57
Don't know for sure about upcoming classes, but they were doing another round of interviews last night as I was finishing up my sim session.

I have the slingbox connected to my TV back home and has sure made it nice. The only english TV in the hotel is CNN and BBC. So unless you are a news junkie or understand japanese, I would highly recommend it. The internet connection in the hotel is plenty fast enough for it to work smoothly.

16th Jun 2007, 01:59
Nail biting over I start the 23rd of July!!!

16th Jun 2007, 02:18
Congratulations. Did you get AJX or AJV?

16th Jun 2007, 02:57
Pax side, so I guess that is AJX? I have no idea which is which.

16th Jun 2007, 03:15
Classic... "I don't care, I'm just happy to be here!" :D

Seriously, congrats! I know you're gonna love the airplane. Did you ever figure out how you were going to handle the taxes & such?

16th Jun 2007, 13:53
Congrats Jobear.. I think you will really like it here.. My class and I are loving it so far..! See you around the training center!


AJV Capt (that's the cargo side :)

16th Jun 2007, 14:43
[Did you ever figure out how you were going to handle the taxes & such?]

That is what my money manager (er wife)does, no we looked at some of the stuff and EK and others were spot on go thru a non-american company to TRY and avoid taxes.

16th Jun 2007, 15:47
Which begs the question - try and avoid taxes, couldn't agree more, go for it!

What happens when your friendly IRS tax man decides to look at YOUR tax situation and realises you have paid NO tax ANYWHERE for the last XX years??

IF you reckon your bullet-proof (ie you've done your homework) you wouldn't be even giving this post another thought, if you've based all your in-depth-opinions and beliefs on bar talk and what other people pontificate on open internt forums, well - life could get interesting.

On a different note - great to see the positive outlook of the new arrivals to Japan, maybe the ANA group have moderated their way of doing business to everyone's benefit. Long may the positive vibes remain. :ok:

17th Jun 2007, 01:23
I fully expect to have to pay taxes, unless there is a country I can move to and hold a dual citizenship. :-)

17th Jun 2007, 08:06
How is the training in ANA ? is it compatable to western ways or is it more Eastern ways?

The Dominican
17th Jun 2007, 13:03
Congrats Joebear:ok: Will see you around the clubhouse since we are not taking the last checkride until August.

The Dominican
17th Jun 2007, 13:30
How is the training in ANA ? is it compatable to western ways or is it more Eastern ways?

If you are already typed on another certificate and have time on the airframe, there is a shorter course in the training program that last about three months.
No time on the airframe or type (my case) it is six months with the first week or so of the ground school dedicated to the Japanese license (Air Law, Radio Law and engineering)
The ground school for systems is mostly computer based and self study with exams every week and discussion with the instructors and a final writen exam. After that you go to Fix Base Simulator for procedures training(two hour sessions) and Full flight Sim after that(four hour sessions). This period does not include OJT (IOE in the States) There are two checkrides, one for the type and another about a week later for the ATPL with more sims between the two.
After that you go home for three to four weeks and then you come back for a refresher sim and back to ground school for route training a few days (Airport diagrams, Release and operations paperwork, you know line oriented stuff) then you start OJT for a period of about two months and you do route training to all the airports you will operate on and you also get observed by a couple of the head guys and after you get the blessing from these folks then you get released to get your observation ride with JCAB. In a nutshell, that is how it goes.

17th Jun 2007, 14:26
Bonas dias Signor Domenican

Thanks for your information, where does candidates gets washed more in SIM or in OJT?

Mucho grazes!:rolleyes:

The Dominican
17th Jun 2007, 15:16
Bonas dias Signor Domenican

Thanks for your information, where does candidates gets washed more in SIM or in OJT?

Mucho grazes!:rolleyes:

I have to give you an "A" for effort man:D

The candidates that have had problems strangely enough have been the folks that are already typed and have time on the airframe. Why? mostly because they haven't been able to de program old calls and procedures and ANA doesn't want to hear anything but their standard phraseology and procedures.
There is also a lot of enphasis on hand flying approaches prior to the IAF and visual patterns that have to be done to perfection for the type ride.
What is happening is that some of these folks have worked for outfits that rely too much on automation and they don't really fly the A/C and like I said before, their course is a lot shorter (half the time) combined with the fact that probably the 76 wasn't the last A/C they where flying and voila, a recipe for problems even for experienced drivers. You dig?

I was telling my partner that we where lucky upto a point for not having flown the contraption before because we are learning it their way from the get go

I think that if you get released for OJT you are pretty much good to go:ok:

17th Jun 2007, 15:37
Is a Japanese Visa required prior to arrival in Tyo for Groundschool or is it issued on arrival?

Does Crew or Parc handle help with you attaining it?

17th Jun 2007, 16:31
The crew leasing companies and ANA will arrange for you to be sent a Certificate of Eligability. You will forward that, along with your passport, to the Japanese Embassy or Consulate for them to issue you a trainee visa. If for some reason this does not happen, you will have to enter the country as a tourist and comply with the time restrictions of whatever your nationality may be. Assuming you are from Antigua (from your profile) you will require a visa either way since there is no visa waiver program between Antigua and Japan.

You will enter the country on your trainee visa until the completion of OJT. After that point, you will enter and depart the county on a crew-member's shore pass.

17th Jun 2007, 16:59
Thanks Crj 705 I guess i gotta get cracking on that visa then. Thanks for the info very very helpful

18th Jun 2007, 15:03
Hellow all.
Can any current AJV/Express Capt. or FO post or PM me the "actual" current schedule you guys have out of the 3 different airports in Tokyo? Anyone living in the states that is commuting right now care to share the Good,Bad and the Ugly? Thanks in advance.....

19th Jun 2007, 08:52
Signor Domenican

Boenas dias, comes tas?

when did you complete your OJT was that long ago or recent one? just to dig more info.
mucho grazes!!!:)

The Dominican
19th Jun 2007, 09:16
when did you complete your OJT was that long ago or recent one? just to dig more info

No, no. We just did lesson four of Full Flight Sim today. I'm about 4 months into it:)

29th Jun 2007, 21:46
Is there any difference in the way your application is processed if you apply through Parc, IAC, or Hawaii? Are your qualifications funnelled to Japan for them to decide who to invite for the interview, or does the screening take place at the contract company?

Lastly - what are competitive minimums to get an interview?

Thanks in advance,


1st Jul 2007, 01:13
No difference in who you use as far as I know, I used Crew/HACS. The contracting agency will(should) screen your resume/application before they kick it over to AJX/V. I would say they decide based on your application if they want to see you, but then again I may(probably are) be wrong. I see the mins for an interview posted on all the contractors websites so I will say the 3,000tt is hard as is the requirement for a command type rating.

Good luck

The Dominican
1st Jul 2007, 04:26
I see the mins for an interview posted on all the contractors websites so I will say the 3,000tt is hard as is the requirement for a command type rating.

This is correct. In Japan there is no SIC rating. Even as a F/O you will get a command type rating and then will recieve additional training on the right seat.
Judging by our class and the one following us, I would say that F/O competitive numbers are about 4 to 6 thousand and captain numbers are 8 thousand and up.
Having said that just APPLY if you are interested, It is difficult to know what they are looking for really and like I have said before, make sure you give them a good sence of who you are and why would you like to work here on the AutoBio. Don't leave this part unfilled, very important.

Good luck

6th Jul 2007, 09:26
Hi Domenican
How is training going? Any difference in instruction method adopted by contract instructors and Japanese. Is it true that pass rate is better if trained by Japanese.

7th Jul 2007, 08:55
Hi Domenican

usually you are prompt with response, you must be busy with SIM.

The Dominican
8th Jul 2007, 04:47
Sorry it took me a while but my partner and I are getting close to our first check so it has been busy.

Any difference in instruction method adopted by contract instructors and Japs. Is it true that pass rate is better if trained by Japs.

The company is pretty standard and the training is superviced by the ANA group but it really depends on who you get, a good instructor makes all the difference.
We have a very good Japanese instructor and are very happy with the results so far, some other guys are happy with the Alteon guys and others not so much.
As to In House vs. contract instructors? Well, I've read some comments here about how hard it was to have a Japanese instructor with a translator vs. a contract instructor, but our experience has been totally different.
Flying one of these contraptions in a company like ANA is as much about adopting and conforming to policies and procedures as it is about flying the thing so It begs the question. Who would you rather have? A fellow that was shown the policies and procedures and is identified by the Visitor's badge? Or one with an ANA badge with a low employee number on it, that helped shape the policies and procedures?

So many questions, so little time:hmm:

8th Jul 2007, 21:57
Nicely said Dom, I'll be at the duplex on the 21st. Anything you want me to bring from home drop me an e-mail, wifes and girl-friends won't fit in my kit. ;-)


10th Jul 2007, 08:13
Hi 777

By no means intended to offend anyone, language error edited for better sounding.Rightly so,it is better to please them if you want to work for them.

Thanks for the offer in Europe, still enjoying Tokyo for now. Hoping to enjoy DXB by end of this year.

10th Jul 2007, 16:40
OK birdcage I'll bite!

What exactly did you find so extraordinary that you have such a desire to pull out the racist card on middlepath??
Yes in his first post he mentioned "japs", I have heard when people have said I am flying with a "jap cap" today, not uncommon language.
There is no question anybody BUT japanese are gaijin in Japan. I believe (but more than happy to be eddified by superior intelligence as always) that this can be imparted anywhere from an observation to an acknowledgement to a stain on your parentage.
Offended as I could be I if I heard such i would not have the time to be wasted on crap like that, if you're a foreigner in Japan you ARE indeed a gaijin.

The concept works in reverse just as well regardind labelling - judicious use preferred.

Glad to know that there is SOMEONE out there who can accurately judge whether people will succeed or fail in their endevours - you obviously can (seeing as you're "out here" and apparently well entreanched as part of the ruling class/elite in Japanese aviation) as opposed to middlepath who isn't (whoops! sorry about that, sounds like he IS actually around Japan - but is he really???)

And to consign him to EUROPE?? - pleeeease, some mercy, at least send him to the antipodes where he would learn that Budwiser is CRAP (sorry if you missed that, CRAP beer) and at least have some relief from the pain of exile imposed by yourself by finding out what beer's all about!

Finally IF we ever cross paths and IF it was in TGIF's at SOME location I hope you would be a part of an aviation conversation - not preaching from the pulpit from the Good Book of "the thoughts of BC777!"

PS: what was with your smilie: :8 WTF did THAT mean???

Small secret - the smilies are confusing but reckon a few of these :ok: allows you a lot of latitude is your discourse (you know, those lines that are like vertical but go in a different direction ??)
Cheers :ok::ok::ok::ok::ok:

11th Jul 2007, 04:35
Well "Mate" maybe I need a few more beers to understand your response, and maybe you need to get out more and write / judge less..

As our friend changed his post thus making it not racist, I have removed mine..

As far as preaching from my book, "Mate" I gave that up a long time ago when my first instructor from the land down under explained how y'all are genetically surperior in the aviation field.. It is your book from which we all can learn right?? After all, even the mighty QANTAS has never had a hull-loss..! As far as meeting for an "aviation conversation", dude, when I go to a bar, I do not talk about airplanes...

Gotta go, time to crack open another BUD!



11th Jul 2007, 13:33

WOW - when you go fishing you're always hoping to catch a big one..... but you never really expect to! ;)

Hope you're enjoying the AJV/X experience. :ok:

(Still reckon Bud's a pretty average beer; now if you were talking about Alaskan Amber that would be a whole different ballgame.)

11th Jul 2007, 22:56
Great experience so far...! Truth be told, Bud is AWEFUL... I would prefer a James Boag myself..


13th Jul 2007, 11:26
A quick question to those in the program... are there any corporate drivers getting in, or are most people from 121 type carriers?

13th Jul 2007, 12:01
If your username is an indication of your success with a/c serviceability please stay away!!:}

Seriously, before anyone shoots me.

So far, I would say all the pilots are from airline backgrounds, though, I would say corporate experience shouldn't be a problem.

Suggets you give the employment companies, PARC,HACS (CREW) or IAC. Not necessarily listed in any specific order.

Good luck

13th Jul 2007, 13:11
Been contacted by both PARC in Dublin and IAC in Australia. For a U.S. citizen, which company is better in terms of tax issues, total compensation, and ease of paperwork/application process, if any?


The Dominican
18th Jul 2007, 12:15
Been contacted by both PARC in Dublin and IAC in Australia. For a U.S. citizen, which company is better in terms of tax issues, total compensation, and ease of paperwork/application process, if any?



Sorry it took this long man, my partner and I where in checkride mode for the past few days and today we took our type ride.
I figure that any of those companies would be better than HACS for a US citizen because HACS being an American company will go at you with W-2's and the likes.

Don't have a lot of experience with IAC but PARC have been pretty good to me so far. It seems that IAC is a pretty small outfit when compared to PARC though!.

The paperwork will be large in any contractor you go to because it is ANA paperwork we are talking about here, not the contractor.:ugh:

18th Jul 2007, 13:49
So have you decided on taking the plunge L70?

Dom you didn't say how the type ride went?

The paperwork is like any flying job now days, there is a lot of it. I leave in 2 days and just received even more paperwork. Taxes I just pay them and whine about it...

19th Jul 2007, 21:43
Still thinking about it... Have wife and kids, difficult to drag them all over and I don't like 2 of the specifics of the contract, mainly that your days off include commuting (other places I've seen give you commuting days on top of the block of days off) and secondly that they don't give you business class positive space when they move you around, it's all in coach (yuck).

Zed fares on another carrier business class back and forth stateside are pricey, too.

It's a great gig if you are at a regional or about to retire state-side, but with me being on 2nd year AirTran getting ready to upgrade into a $120k a year CA seat in 2 years here, it's a harder decision, even though I'd love to be immersed in the culture. Gotta make a decision not just for me, but for the whole family.

20th Jul 2007, 02:11
Hi Lear.
Ive been in the AJX/AJV deal for a while now. Feel compelled to say something.
I would assume you're looking at coming across as an F/O. Having spoken to the Japanese management guys and listened to the rumour mill (sometimes very accurate), I get the impression that things will be slow for upgrades here, historically it's taken anywhere between 3.5 to 5 years for an upgrade , expect more of the same maybe longer.
If command is important, and it should be, your present gig should see you move left a lot earlier.
Commuting is a major problem here for most guys and the management seems unable/unwilling to do what has to be done to make it work. Better allowance, business class seats, travel on company time. Other employers are starting to offer this, so competition is increasing.
AJX/AJV do NOT have the facility to get business class ZED fares with ANY company. All zeds are economy ONLY, NO UPGRADE POSSIBLE. This includes flights with the parent ANA.
Don't be misled by this, also ANA seemsunwilling to mke any concessions here, so things will not change in the near future, if at all!!!!
If you live Stateside the value of the US$ may not be an issue. But for anyone living elsewhere the continuing slide of the US$ is a major problem. Once again, there appears to be no attempt to sort this out.
Sounds all doom and gloom. Nt necessarily so, this could be a good gig, IF the company started to be a bit proactive and made an effort to be more competitive. There are only so many good pilots out there and, if they are snapped up by other operators, it could affect the company's future, even threaten it.
Hopet this has been some help in making the decision.

20th Jul 2007, 02:36
Does any one know they offer ZED tixs to spose and kids when they travel?

20th Jul 2007, 04:28
Hi Ishi, and thanks for the information.

To answer your question, no, I would only be interested in a command position. I have just shy of 10,000 hours total time, 5 type ratings, 4,500 PIC Turbine, previous B727 command as well.

On a different note, I don't know how they would preclude you purchasing business class ZED on OTHER carriers. I used to work for a ZED carrier, and my carrier had absolutely ZERO ability to limit my purchases of ZED passes on a DIFFERENT carrier in whatever class I desired to travel in. I simply went online, booked it over the internet site, and it was payroll deducted.

How does it work there? Do you have to request the passes through some type of pass bureau? Sounds like another detractor... :(

I'll probably stay put, but it was tempting for a bit. In my current position I'll probably never see widebody international, and the Japanese/Asian culture in general is fascinating to me, has been since childhood... If I wasn't married I might go for it anyway, but I'd need to get back stateside regularly.

Maybe in 20 years when I'm burnt out here they'll have changed enough there to make it worth a jump in my last 5 years before retirement. ;)

20th Jul 2007, 08:16
Just wanted to compliment you on a fair and balanced post, might assist some who are looking at making the move.
Cerainly on the whole not a bad contract but with a little assistance from management could almost be the best (certainly in the top 3) contracts in the region but management don't want to go down that road for whatever reason(s).
Good post! :ok:

20th Jul 2007, 09:11
Lear 70

To answer the zed question for you. The issuing authority appears to be ANA. ALL applications are submitted to the AJX office, who forward them to, I guess, ANA. They are then processed in some obscure office in Haneda (or Tokyo). The AJX office staff are very helpful but the time expected for ZED ticket issue (international travel) is 14 days. Sometimes it takes less but never less than 7 days.

As I said, IF the company had the WILL to do something about it, it would be done. The contract pilots are marginalised, expect it to remain the same.

Good ruck

20th Jul 2007, 14:48
That's unfortunate, and will probably be the kicker that keeps me from proceeding further in the process, even though some friends of mine like The Dominican and JoBear are either over there or headed that way.

I really detest traveling by air more than 3 hours and not being in business class, and don't mind paying the extra several hundred dollars per ticket on a ZED business class fare. The main idea of taking this job would have been to travel on my off days with the family to the far corners of that part of the world and really immerse ourselves in the cultures.

I'm not going to do that in a cattle car for 5-7-10 hour flights. :ugh:

Thanks for the info, guess I'd better stay stateside... :)

Good luck to all!

21st Jul 2007, 01:15
Brave call but, I think, a good one.

Extra costs for business class out of Japan would be in the thousands, not hundreds, too costly.:=

Hopefully you'll let the company know why you have decided not to proceed further. They need a light nudge and feedback like that will certainly help. Who knows, they might even improve things sufficiently for you to reconsider??

Of course all other pilots will win too;)

The Dominican
21st Jul 2007, 08:21
Who knows, they might even improve things sufficiently for you to reconsider??

We had lunch with a PARC rep. today and he said that they are having trouble getting folks just for the commute issue. The company is under pressure because they want to expand the Air Japan operation so this might work in our benefit. Who knows?

Dom you didn't say how the type ride went?

My partner and I are type rated 67 drivers dude:D Although I'm getting very friendly with Mr. Alka Seltser and Mr. Advil,:ouch: Man that Sake goes down good but it kicks you behind in the morning

21st Jul 2007, 09:08
Ishi is right on the money! :D For F/O's you'll find it's fast turning to a long haul as F/O...for the skippers, you'll fly with skippers, halving your logable command time as there are very few F/O's. Many F/O's looking at moving on. Reasons; much longer time to command, ZED travel is very limiting, No business upgrade, airlines have reduced flights (more difficult to get a seat, no longer to travel on codeshare flights), USD to some currencies is very weak (better off in home country), many more options back in home countries & offshore than ever before :ok:
Sad but true, not the contract it once was :sad: Of course people will leave before things change. :ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh:

21st Jul 2007, 13:19
Anyone know how many Captains AJV/JP Express is looking to hire? I thought they were a little top heavy? I have a Capt. interview in August. One more question- Can any current AJV "American" crew comment on the % of taxes they take out of their own checks for the tax man....are most pulling out 22 or 25%? Also...any "new" info on ANC or ORD rostering in the future...like next year maybe?......Any info would be appreciated......

21st Jul 2007, 13:48
Vive la Dominican!

Congratulations, buddy! Job well-done! :D

Glad to hear things are going well for you. I'm still 2 years from upgrade here at AAI but, when I do, I re-did the math and it'll be right at $140k a year plus per diem and I'll be an hour from my house,,, I just can't give that up, as much as I would absolutely LOVE to be in their culture...

I envy you, man! Maybe when the kids are grown and out of the house and the wife WANTS me out of the house for weeks at a time, instead of just days... ;)

Don't be a stranger!

21st Jul 2007, 20:21
Ran into a wild eyed group in the lobby last night ;-). Now why can't I sleep more than 3.5 hours, lost in translation?

23rd Jul 2007, 05:52
Hi Guys,
I am new to this Japan scene.
I notice there is a lot of North American contact here and thus opinions may be biased and geared to an American standpoint (Commuting, taxes, lifestyle etc)
Are there any Europeans working on the 767 with Hawaii or Parc?
I would like to hear how life works out for people with a centre of life in Central Europe. Anyone doing it? Would love to have some feedback from anyone involved in this. PM me, anyone,please.
Many thanks and good luck to you all.

23rd Jul 2007, 15:31
:):):ok:Yo Bro!
Congats on your Type!

24th Jul 2007, 01:10
Reply to Chinos,
I've been in AJX/AJV over 5 years now. I know of only one guy commuting from the UK, everybody else is from Oz or NZ and now from the US. So can't help you much there.
It seems with the decline of the US $ that applications have dried up from everywhere except the US. The money is just not worth leaving a job downunder for.

24th Jul 2007, 03:53
I have to agree with absolutely.

With the US $ losing value ao rapidly AND expectations that this will get worse and stay that way for a looooong time, there is very little reason to leave a decent job anywhere but possibly USA for this. :yuk:

24th Jul 2007, 06:47
Congrats to the 6 guys who have just passed 767 rides!

Regarding Europeans, there are 5 Danish guys here, and more interviewing.. They would be able to offer some insite..



PS: With ANY luck, the dollar will begin to recover on November 7th 2008!! (Election Day)

24th Jul 2007, 07:02
ishy59 / absolutely.

Many thanks first of all for the insights.

I have some more questions, if I may. :confused::confused:

I was under the impression that starting salary was 11 K + USD + a commuting allowance. Still a reasonable amount of money, even in EU, although the dwindling rate between the two is scary, I admit.

May I assume then that the opinions are based on the cost of living in Japan whilst 20 days ON? PLease correct me, if I got this all wrong...

Do you find the money problem is connected to the total gross salary or rather based on your net savings at the end of the month?

Please PM me, if you are patient enought to endure more questions of mine.. Many thanks again!!!

happy days in japan! :ok::ok:

24th Jul 2007, 10:19

There are so many different salaries now I can't keep up with em all. Depends on when you joined and or when you were upgraded etc.

Our opinions on the US $ have nothing to do with the cost of living in Japan. They relate to taking money home to NZ, Oz or Europe where the exchange rate seriously sucks.

25th Jul 2007, 19:08
Ishi...Good post...just a couple of questions. What do you mean when you say that AJV does not have the Facilities to allow Bussines ZED on other carriers? Maybe Im not understanding the process properly? If the "employee" is going to pay for the "Business ZED" lets say for UAL, what does AJX/AJV care if the employee spend a little more of his/her money to pay for a "stdnby ticket"???? We are just trying to get to work, right? The reason I ask this is if you were to look at any aircraft seat load with any of the "Star Alliance" carriers you will see that with ANA,UAL and others that Ecomomy class is ALWAYS overbooked, while Business typically has 5-12 seats open at any one time....would make sense I think? Just curious....thanks in advance.

The Dominican
26th Jul 2007, 03:41
Yo Bro!
Congats on your Type!

Congrats to you as well compadre:D I guess that since you have your ATPL already you are trully DONE aren't you? Lucky DAWWWWG:ok:

26th Jul 2007, 07:21
The zed situation seems to be confusing many people. Most guys (& gals) from USA, seem to be able to get business class zed tickets as a matter of course.
We have been told by AJX/V that the AGREEMENTS they have with other zed carriers DO NOT include the option of buying business class tickets. So, no matter what the pilots are prepared to pay or do, the business class option is just NOT available here.
We have pointed out the fact to our management that business class zeds are available on most carriers. They say it is not possible. Maybe ANA is just NOT PREPARED to reciprocate.
The company's attitude has always been that getting to work is the pilot's problem not theirs, hence commuting on days off.
Now that other jobs are available, both in Japan and elsewhere in Asia, where business class travel is offered maybe something will change.
As I have always said, potentially a great job but some small issues HAVE to be addressed.
The company should be providing pilots with CONFIRMED BUSINESS CLASS tickets to get to work and back, this zed nonsense is not a practical option.:=

26th Jul 2007, 15:35
Well said Ishi....thanks for the insight.

27th Jul 2007, 02:22
I'll just add to what Ishi said and try and put this subject to bed!

Under the current arrangements at ANA, we at AJX/AJV will NEVER EVER get business class ZED's. It just aint going to happen. As far as I know not even senior management ANA captains can buy a business ZED on their own airline. ANA will not reciprocate with other airlines so it just aint going to happen.

I hope this helps the confusion.

28th Jul 2007, 23:18
Well I finally made it to Japan! Ran into some ANA guys at Jet Lag bar the other night.

I hope this works out, we are currently working 12 days a month with business class commute. Checked out coach, no way that I will commute that way. We are supposed to have 5 767's here soon so I guess they're serious.

Rob E-mail me if you have any questions. Hope to see you here soon!


29th Jul 2007, 07:34
I'll bite:}
Are you with the ABX operation?
Judging by what you're saying, you're definitely not with AJX/V
Seems ironic that AJV has to bring in a wet lease operation to do a lot of its flying, this operation's pilots are getting more days off, business class travel, better salaries than the AJV guys. Pretty much every point the pilots have been making a fuss about recently.
Management certainly has a great sense of humour, talk about rubbing noses in it.:confused::E

30th Jul 2007, 00:40
Oh yeah, sorry I am an ABX pilot. The schedule and business class commute is temporary until our management and Union can come to an agreement. It's sweet while it lasts though:)

Robiemartin is also an ABX pilot he actually taught me to fly in Nome, Alaska in 1980. I was his first student!

Sorry if anyone thinks we are stepping on their toes. But all I can say is thats big business for you. I am sure our management bid pretty low for this work.

I am in at the ANA gatetower hotel in Kansai for the next couple of days if anyone wants me to buy them a beer! And I am probably going to back at the end of September if our schedules and commutes stay the same.


30th Jul 2007, 01:11
Why are you going to give that up in your new contract? Sounds EXACTLY like that contract SHOULD work.

Wouldn't want to do it without business-class commutes, business-class ZED on other carriers purchasable for your vacation, and 12-14 days off NOT INCLUDING the commute time.

Anything else, might as well stay state-side. Just a thought... :D

30th Jul 2007, 09:15
Hey Kouga.

You're not stepping on toes here, I would expect there would be very few pilots who are upset with you guys here. It would probably be a good thing. Sorry if I gave the impression I was pissed.

You should stick to a decent contract, DON'T accept coach for commuting.

30th Jul 2007, 12:30
No problem ishi.

I think our schedule will be 3 weeks on 3weeks off with business class commute when the dust settles. It's up to our union leadership and management. I don't know if I am going to come over here for that long of a period.

31st Jul 2007, 03:23
Koug, welcome man.. Would love to join ya for a beer but not out that way very much.. I worked with great guys (Past and Present :) )from 1224 when I was involved with CAPA in Washington DC.. Hope to see some of you guys on the line..



PS: As an AJV pilot, I think it is great y'all are out here.. It allows the company to grow while it tries to staff it's own planes!

1st Aug 2007, 03:05
This Japan thing looks very interesting,especially if its possible to get confirmed commuting seats.I am seriously thinking about joining.Anyone who knows any thing about training bond etc.etc.? is that common practice in japan that you have to sign a bond?
How many 767-300 freighters on order? anyone who knows...
Take care all of you:rolleyes:

6th Aug 2007, 21:20
Congrats to the fellas on finishing the most recent 767 course. Thanks for the passdown you guys in the March class gave, and the dinner invites to the "new" additions.
attenuating at an alarming rate

7th Aug 2007, 03:33
I've got a screening for AJV soon. Any examples of a monthly roster for the 76 please?

11th Nov 2007, 12:42
Hi ! Anyone out there joining Ajv/Ajx in january?
Been very silent on this forum for a while.Everybody extremely happy or you working so hard no time left over for chatting?:rolleyes:

12th Nov 2007, 06:43
I think that the forum has been quiet with the recent failure of an entire course. Right now they are not gettiing as many through as they had hoped. It has to do with candidates, JCAB tests and the training.

12th Nov 2007, 11:17
(interesting title!)

I'm happy to be Devil's Advocate.

Any chance of expanding on:

- failure of an entire course?? rumour or fact?? course of 2/6/10??
- candidates, what are the difficulties there??
- JCAB, well certain reputation for being far from the easiest authority but, yet again, a whole course (at what stage- sim check, line check??)
- training?? surely the ANA group train to get pilots to pass the JCAB checks?? or what have I missed??

Cheers and thanks :ok:

Capt Coco
12th Nov 2007, 14:09
It was a course of 4 F/O's.
They gave 2 of them a second go(chance) and they passed their JACB checks last week.

12th Nov 2007, 15:28
Wow... all 4. :eek:

What did they miss, if you don't mind saying, so that those of us thinking of coming over won't repeat the mistake?

If all 4 had the same problem, seems it would be more of a training issue?

Very interested to hear more...

Glad at least 2 of them made it through the course. :sad:

12th Nov 2007, 23:21
interesting to hear about the fail rate. Sorry for the guys that did not pass.Hopefully the facts about why they failed will be passed on to upcoming crew later so they dont make the same mistakes.
I mean flying is not exactly rocket science...:rolleyes: how difficult can it be??:ouch:


Capt. John Doe
13th Nov 2007, 12:02
From what I have heard from a few friends flying over there, the course before the 4, there were 2 cpts who failed the JCAB ride and one of them was allowed a recheck. Also, I think they said there were a couple more who were let go during training as well. That puts the failure rate at around 60 or so percent for this year. But don't quote me on it.

What I can deduce from reading various posts and talking to the guys over there, it's not that the training is overly hard - yes it is long and demanding and a lot of pilots have gone through it - but the real problem lies in the communication, culture barriers, and politics within the company. I spent many years in that part of the world and I can personally tell you guys that it is very, very political out here. If they want you gone, they can and will find a reason for it. It doesn't matter how good of a pilot you are. Of course, not having a union representation doesn't help either.

I thought about sending my stuff in, but decided against it a while back. The money's actually better than my current job at a legacy carrier in the US, but it seems like a crap shoot coming over here - with all the politics and all (although the new confirmation of confirmed business class and a couple grand raise/month sounds tempting). But......naaaah, I'll stay where I'm at not and hope the damn management don't take away my retirement.

For all the guys out there currently in training, best of wishes and good luck. And watch your back...seriously (you're not in NA, Aus, or Europe anymore)

13th Nov 2007, 12:06
Confirmation of confirmed business class and a couple grand a month raise?

Haven't heard anything about those... did I miss something?

13th Nov 2007, 14:39
Thanks for the information about working in this part of the world.
I have been working in Asia for the last 7 years and have so far loooked at it as a very smooth ride.The dogma is always; sit down in the boat,do not make any wakes,,,,: if you want to discuss anything wait until you see yourself in the mirror back home and then start the conversation.
Not difficult ,just take an extra breath before you say something.Like it or you are gone:)simple as that,no room for discussion.
On line its another ball game,same as anywhere,enjoy life and the good beer/wine where ever you go.

take care mates:p

13th Nov 2007, 15:14
Blacklight is right, if you have a question about anything don't ask it. Otherwise you will be terminated.

If I had it to do again..................

I wouldn't

14th Nov 2007, 18:08
I have to respectfully disagree with Cpt Doe, ANA training is not that political and is not a back stabbing enviroment. The instructors will do all that they can to keep you in the program.
If you asked 10 guys about their training you'd get 10 different answers, some guys are drinking beer hanging out in rappongi and others need to be on a suicide watch.
The opportunity to resit a sim check is dependent on your overall performance, if you've struggled all the way then you won't get a second ride. If you screwded on the day but overall you had done well they'll stay with you.
Of course you have to be able to adapt to ANA procedures, they are not too different than anywhere else. Like any airline they want everyone to be standard.
One more point; don't expect a back slapping cheer if you do a good sim ride, they are humble people that don't hand out praise. The best thing that can ever be said to you is, "I have no comment to make" or if you're really on fire " ready for check"
Gambate ne

Capt. John Doe
15th Nov 2007, 04:18
Meguro, I was not specifically targeting ANA, but overall "politics" in Japan. And every company -whether it be in Japan or in the States has some sort of "shady politics" going on. You cannot deny that - if you do, you've drank too much cool-aid. I'm sure the training is similar to other airlines as well as the instructors who hold the candidates to very high standards - and the ANA instructors are top notch from what I hear. Just wanted to clarify that I wasn't pointing fingers specifically at ANA.

17th Nov 2007, 01:45

I've been reading your post on this forum and PPW in my quest for information on ANA. Your post, as well as others, have been helpful and I very much appreciate your feedback. With that being said, care to elaborate on your last post?