Originally Posted by nowhereasfiled
(Post 10697346)
Me. Swiped some Ryanair flights to Milan for a fiver next weekend. Will be happy to make the most of having the city to ourselves, no queues at the bar, every cloud and all that.
Returning travellersStay indoors and avoid contact with other people if you’ve travelled to the UK from the following places in the last 14 days, even if you do not have symptoms:
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Confused. So what happens to operating crews or is airside considered safe? Likewise transit.
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Very good points but I expect air travel to northern Italy to end for no other reason than there will be few passengers wanting to travel there to make flights viable.
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This is worth watching
This is well worth watching and difficult to challenge but will give the airline industry an idea of how long this is going to last....
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Here in Thailand and last week in Singapore, the reaction to the virus is a lot more measured by the general public. Before we headed out here both countries had way more cases than the U.K. 35 and 90. Now the situation is reversed and for all the people who were worried about us going travelling we are now saying that we are more worried about coming home than being out here. There is no mass panic or crazed purchases of shop supplies. People are getting on with their day to day lives and just taking sensible precautions. Hand gel is everywhere in all public places and in shopping centres, public buildings and attractions in Singapore are taking your temperature before being allowed in. The same experiences here in Thailand at a couple of hotels we have stayed in. Some people wear masks but most people tend to stick to the advice that masks are only useful if you are high risk or ill yourself. The government of Singapore has provided masks for all of their citizens to use if they become ill and airports have medics checking temperatures of arriving passengers with teams on standby to take you into quarantine should you raise any concern.
Anyway my point is that the west seems to be in mass hysteria and south east Asia is not. |
Very good link and should be compulsive viewing for those that want a understanding about the growth in infections
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And another update from China, in a bizarre twist, China now saying anyone from even low risk countries like UK must undergo 14 day quarantine at home. France and Germany are medium risk but the logic is if low risk countries are not separating themselves from medium risk then low risk is just as bad.
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Anybody fancying taking the Golden Road to Samarkand would be well advised to read the UK Government Travel Advice:
British nationals arriving in Uzbekistan from the United Kingdom, Thailand, Azerbaijan, Malaysia or UAE are subject to 14 days medical supervision at their place of stay/residence and are advised not to visit public or crowded places and to limit contacts with other people. Arrivals from these countries are subject to medical monitoring by medical personnel during the 14-day period. This will include physical examination, measurement of body temperature and medical consultations by telephone. If symptoms of acute respiratory viral infections are detected the person will be hospitalised in a medical institution for the purpose of diagnosis and treatment. Under the measures introduced by the Uzbek authorities, any person subject to quarantine or self-isolation who breaches these controls is liable to a minimum fine of 11 Million UZS (approx £900) or up to 3 years imprisonment. These measures may be subject to change. Entry requirements may vary and further restrictions could be applied at short notice by the Uzbek authorities. |
China has the right idea. We and Europe have been too lax. Decisions are being taken for economic reasons although a slow response to take action will cost more in the long run. The youtube link shows the increase is by a factor of 10 every 16 days. What is happening in Italy now is our tomorrow. All we can do is to try and slow the growth rate but there isn’t much sign of that happening.
Another argument would be just to do nothing and just let it run its course as it can’t be stopped. |
To paraphrase that YouTube video (above)...
If sufficient numbers of the population are worried then there is a lot less to worry about. But if no one is worried, then that's when you should worry. |
That is because worried people are more likely to wash their hands more often while those that don’t worry do nothing.
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There are over 3,250 deaths per day on the roads worldwide LTNman. Therefore we should take all vehicles off the roads don't you think?
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Mass Hysteria caused by the gutter press who are hell bent on scaremongering. It is only now we are seeing a decrease in cases in China - another week or so and it'll hopefully be something and nothing.
Amazingly looking at the cases that have been diagnosed and then recovered - the numbers are very high. Why don't the press report that? Or does it not fit in with their evil peddling of poison into the public. Said it before, will say it again, the only disease spreading its self around the world is the press. |
Originally Posted by eu01
(Post 10706537)
I find it a bit controversial. Is it ecologically acceptable to carry out almost empty flights just because the payments were made much earlier and the cancellations would mean returning the money to all customers?
However, understand there is concern about reducing flights at slot restricted airports like Heathrow, that others may come in during the interim and grab the slots. So far there has been no statement about any concession. In any event, even if there was such a concession announced there is no guarantee that someone keen for a slot (Qatar, Delta, your list may vary) would not mount a legal challenge to it, when it's all down to what some non-aviation judge gets persuaded, or that in the interim the Greta Gushers get the ear of politicians and have the reduction made permanent. Airlines have to look to the long term protection of their interests and their assets, well beyond this issue. |
Originally Posted by BRUpax
(Post 10707681)
There are over 3,250 deaths per day on the roads worldwide LTNman. Therefore we should take all vehicles off the roads don't you think?
Road traffic is regulated with laws and safety standards for that very reason!! |
Deaths on the road aren't infectious diseases. Neither is stupidity, thank goodness.
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I disagree. There is much infectious stupidity with this virus.
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Doesn’t matter what I think but I note that vehicle deaths don’t go up by a factor of 10 every 16 days and don’t shut down countries, cause stock markets to plummet and oil prices to go into free fall.
The only affect on me so far is a few empty shelves and a drop in my multi asset income funds but I know it won’t be long before you and I are affected big time. I have holidays booked up in April and May and am giving them around 50% of them going ahead due to either both of us having the virus or not being able to get to the destination due to a lockdown. All this because someone in China sold some wild animals at a market for no doubt pennies. |
"the numbers are very high" is nearly an exact quote from Trump about the recovered..
There are 111 000 confirmed cases of CoVid-19 and 62 000 that has ben reported recovered. Possibly because full recovery can take as much as 4 weeks, and 4 weeks ago there was hardly any casees in sample Italy. Since the only 2 possible outcomes are recovery or death I don't think reporting on that basis will reduce fear/panic. |
I think some of you scaremongers missed my point, but never mind! I'll leave you to your paranoia. By the way, just for the record, I'm in my early 70s, with heart disease and diabetes. I still think that there are a lot more dangers out there. Furthermore, those of you who, unlike me, are not stupid, may just have spotted certain interesting patterns regarding areas of high infection rates.
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https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-51809818
Israel to introduce compulsory 14 day quarantine for all arrivals into the country. |
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Originally Posted by BRUpax
(Post 10707989)
I think some of you scaremongers missed my point, but never mind! I'll leave you to your paranoia. By the way, just for the record, I'm in my early 70s, with heart disease and diabetes. I still think that there are a lot more dangers out there.
Attempting to say people are paranoid is great but it has zero impact against people's real fears. If they fly somewhere they may come back with something which hurts or kills family and friends.......... rationality has no chance against a real fear like this. Hell I do 40-50 flights a year, I haven't flown since Jan and while scheduled to fly at end of March I am pretty sure I will cancel. Unusually I booked a flexi fare last Nov, I never book flexi fares. |
Originally Posted by ROC10
(Post 10708155)
:ugh: |
I think many people are worried about getting trapped which is far more likely than getting the virus.
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Exactly this. While I love to travel and see new places and explore - I also like to return home when finished! Not held in a hotel room for a further 2 weeks. If I was travelling with a young family then forget it at the minute! I know multiple friends and families who haven't booked their usual sunshine summer holiday this year for that very reason.
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As suspected Ryanair and EasyJet are still running flights to Italy to avoid giving refunds. https://www.forbes.com/sites/martinr...lans-airports/
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They don't really have a much of a choice until EU slot rules are relaxed.
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I am somewhat surprised that the number of new cases in China per day is diminishing fast. Perhaps China is under reporting, or perhaps instead they have achieved it by enforcing quarantine / self-isolation through methods that societies more used to liberal democracies would not tolerate.
It is worth noting that public health is about getting people to change the way they act - it sometimes means the disbelieving few have to accept temporary loss of liberty so disease does not get too ingrained amongst the masses. Those who have not spent 6 years in medical school sometimes just have to trust a little when enough doctors say the same thing... |
The problem is unless the new infections fall to zero around the world, as soon as the restrictions are relaxed those that have not been affected could be affected and it all kicks off again.
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You imply catching this virus will give you immunity. My understanding is this flu is like any other flu. You can catch it over and over again.
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What do you suggest then....the entire World sits at home eating dry pasta until that runs out and then what?
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I am saying the restrictions might achieve nothing apart from a longer economic meltdown. Maybe the virus should just be allowed to run its course to get the pain over faster.
Italy is in lockdown, then what, will the problem then go away? |
I'm still not sure what the problem is!!
Globally an insignificant number of deaths and I suspect more harm will result from the hysterical reaction than the virus itself. Governments and media alike have started something they can no longer control and the fallout (for them both) will be interesting. Meanwhile, if you have the opportunity, just get on with life. |
1. You don't get the same flu again. The virus evolves so that next year's flu viruses are slightly different. We have some immunity, so the illness is rarely serious unless you are unwell already.
2. covid19 is unrelated to flu. So we have no immunity. |
Originally Posted by ZFT
(Post 10708431)
You imply catching this virus will give you immunity. My understanding is this flu is like any other flu. You can catch it over and over again.
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Finnair announce big cuts to European flights:The main changes to Finnair’s domestic and European network in April are:
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Reuters reporting that BA has cancelled all flights from the UK to Italy with immediate effect. Presume others will now do the same.
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Originally Posted by FZRA
(Post 10708438)
What do you suggest then....the entire World sits at home eating dry pasta until that runs out and then what?
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China (population 1.4 billion) got on top of this very quickly after a relatively slow response. A country much larger than Europe (population 750 million) was shut down and controlled by one very “forceful” (communist) government! They clicked their fingers and you did what you were told! In Macau they closed the border and virtually shut down their airport. The result has been only 10 cases and no more despite being right next door to China. In Europe you have “free movement” of people and over a dozen different governments with their own different ideas on how to contain this. The biggest problem right now is “free movement” of people which is going to make this whole outbreak much - “MUCH” worse before it gets better. You have to stop movement from infected areas to slow this down otherwise it won’t stop! Let’s face it, after China’s experience our governments in Europe don’t seem to have a clue where to start! Airports in Northern Italy are still open moving infectious people all over Europe with the result being massive increases in infections everywhere. STOP moving people is the only solution right now. Short term pain is the only solution to long term gain with this! Air traffic needs to come to a virtual stop for up to a month and borders need to be closed across the EU including all the Schengen countries otherwise it WILL NOT be contained will it??? The response so far is too little too late in my view despite the lessons from China! All this nonsense about “use it or loose it” with slots and low cost airlines not wanting to give passengers refunds is totally irrelevant compared to this virus spreading out of control! The Government / industry needs to wake up very quickly indeed! This ‘IS NOT” a practice drill - this is for real and you get one chance!
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