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Doncaster Sheffield-3

Old 27th Sep 2022, 16:47
  #681 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by rodan View Post
Humberside may not benefit in the immediate aftermath, but it could do well in the medium term from this. It used to punch above its weight with IT flights, before DSA opened.
I certainly hope so. Anything to avoid the hell hole that is LBA.
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Old 27th Sep 2022, 20:10
  #682 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by wowzz View Post
I would have thought the catchment area would be far too small to interest the likes of TUI. Anyone living west of the A1 is more likely to head for LBA or EMA.
TUI will know the postcode of every booking which went through DSA. If the numbers add up Humberside might have a chance of capacity increases.
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Old 27th Sep 2022, 21:18
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Originally Posted by wowzz View Post
I would have thought the catchment area would be far too small to interest the likes of TUI. Anyone living west of the A1 is more likely to head for LBA or EMA.
I am fairly confident in saying that Humberside has, in the past, been Tui/Thomsonís best selling UK departure point. Weíre going back a few years, but it genuinely rings a bell. Over the years, they flew to Palma, Ibiza, Tenerife, Reus, Corfu, Dalaman and a couple more. Even 767 on the Corfu (W LBA).

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Old 27th Sep 2022, 22:02
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767-300 of Britannia/Thomson would have been circa 2004 or 2005. Is Humberside H24 or have the facility to extend opening into the night for delayed movements?
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Old 27th Sep 2022, 22:45
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Originally Posted by Buster the Bear View Post
767-300 of Britannia/Thomson would have been circa 2004 or 2005. Is Humberside H24 or have the facility to extend opening into the night for delayed movements?
It was an LBA based 767-200. Did Corfu W, and either PMI or IBZ W also.

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Old 27th Sep 2022, 23:46
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Originally Posted by BristolexFlyer View Post
I am fairly confident in saying that Humberside has, in the past, been Tui/Thomsonís best selling UK departure point. Weíre going back a few years, but it genuinely rings a bell. Over the years, they flew to Palma, Ibiza, Tenerife, Reus, Corfu, Dalaman and a couple more. Even 767 on the Corfu (W LBA).

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BristolexFlyer
Can you explain what you mean by "best selling departure " point ?
It obviously wasn't the number of passengers, or the number of flights, so what was it ?
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Old 27th Sep 2022, 23:51
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Originally Posted by wowzz View Post
Can you explain what you mean by "best selling departure " point ?
It obviously wasn't the number of passengers, or the number of flights, so what was it ?
Afraid I have no idea. I followed HUY closely, still do. Itís not out of thin air, but I completely understand without hard evidence, it cannot be substantiated.

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Old 28th Sep 2022, 00:05
  #688 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by BristolexFlyer View Post
Afraid I have no idea. I followed HUY closely, still do. Itís not out of thin air, but I completely understand without hard evidence, it cannot be substantiated.

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BristolexFlyer
I seem to recall it was rate of sale that was amongst the best performing in the UK. The year DSA opened, HUY had 8 weekly departures to PMI alone, including one on a Thomson 767. Obviously things conspired. I would question whether there is any will from the owners of HUY to pursue this market once more, given the increased costs in doing so.
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Old 28th Sep 2022, 08:13
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Originally Posted by pug View Post
I seem to recall it was rate of sale that was amongst the best performing in the UK. The year DSA opened, HUY had 8 weekly departures to PMI alone, including one on a Thomson 767. Obviously things conspired. I would question whether there is any will from the owners of HUY to pursue this market once more, given the increased costs in doing so.
What exactly does "rate of sale" mean in this context?
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Old 28th Sep 2022, 11:26
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Basically how quickly the flights are selling. Those airports with a high rate of sale (basically percentage of seat capacity sold over a given period of time) may be in line for more capacity than those with a low rate of sale who may lose capacity. But you also have to factor in area of country as Northern airports tend to sell more early on than Southern ones but this effect works itself out eventually as Southern one’s catch up. Also long haul sells earlier than short/medium haul. Each tour operator will have its own expectation at to where it expects to be at a particular point in time for a particular airport and will also need to account for new route effect, route mix etc. when analysing and comparing. An interesting science for all concerned.
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Old 28th Sep 2022, 12:51
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There is still some pressure on locally to resolve this and either find a buyer or carry out CPO.

Now Tui have started to move their flights I have my doubts how it can be viable, but airports have had closures and near misses, and come back so who knows. I'm far form certain how successful a CPO would be. I'm sure that would be a long drawn out process with a lot of disagreement on value!
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Old 28th Sep 2022, 13:14
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Originally Posted by davidjpowell View Post
There is still some pressure on locally to resolve this and either find a buyer or carry out CPO.

Now Tui have started to move their flights I have my doubts how it can be viable, but airports have had closures and near misses, and come back so who knows. I'm far form certain how successful a CPO would be. I'm sure that would be a long drawn out process with a lot of disagreement on value!
Going back to my post a few days ago regarding the legalities, I would assume that there are no legally binding clauses which stipulate land at DSA must be retained for aviation uses given the news on Monday. Iíve seen the CPO option mentioned a few times during the last few months, but like blocking any planning applications Iím not sure how it would stand up at appeal. Who sets the amount of compensation to those subject to a CPO? How would the land be valued should it be subject to a CPO, as an airport that has apparently lost a lot of money, or a large plot of development land worth £hundred of millions?

I donít think itís over yet.
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Old 28th Sep 2022, 15:29
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Originally Posted by GAXLN View Post
Basically how quickly the flights are selling. Those airports with a high rate of sale (basically percentage of seat capacity sold over a given period of time) may be in line for more capacity than those with a low rate of sale who may lose capacity. But you also have to factor in area of country as Northern airports tend to sell more early on than Southern ones but this effect works itself out eventually as Southern oneís catch up. Also long haul sells earlier than short/medium haul. Each tour operator will have its own expectation at to where it expects to be at a particular point in time for a particular airport and will also need to account for new route effect, route mix etc. when analysing and comparing. An interesting science for all concerned.
Thank you for your comprehensive reply.
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Old 28th Sep 2022, 15:53
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https://ukaviation.news/doncaster-sh...business-park/
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Old 28th Sep 2022, 16:54
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Originally Posted by Buster the Bear View Post
Well that didnít take long for them to announce their intentions, quite disgusting actually when this affects hundreds of airport staff!
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Old 28th Sep 2022, 17:20
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"How would the land be valued should it be subject to a CPO, as an airport that has apparently lost a lot of money, or a large plot of development land worth £hundred of millions?"

Guess.

And who can afford a CPO on any grounds? The council has better uses for its cash - or it will have shortly after the "mini-budget"
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Old 28th Sep 2022, 18:00
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Originally Posted by wowzz View Post
I have used DSA as much as possible, but basically, unless you want to fly with TUI, you were out of options. If Easy or Jet2 had based just two airframes there, the story might have been different.
I agree, the usual purpose of an airport is that you get on an aeroplane which takes you where you want to go, rather than looking at where the airline wants you to go!

(Yes I have flown from thereÖI actually used to work there).
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Old 28th Sep 2022, 19:28
  #698 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by GAXLN View Post
Basically how quickly the flights are selling. Those airports with a high rate of sale (basically percentage of seat capacity sold over a given period of time) may be in line for more capacity than those with a low rate of sale who may lose capacity. But you also have to factor in area of country as Northern airports tend to sell more early on than Southern ones but this effect works itself out eventually as Southern oneís catch up. Also long haul sells earlier than short/medium haul. Each tour operator will have its own expectation at to where it expects to be at a particular point in time for a particular airport and will also need to account for new route effect, route mix etc. when analysing and comparing. An interesting science for all concerned.
Sorry for thread drift, but I understand that Humberside sold premium holidays early at a high rate for Thomson (as was). Iím not sure how it works in comparison to the flight only airlines, but Iím of the impression that the tour operators like to sell early at a good mark up, which is why you tend to see cheap last minute deals to fill hotel rooms that would otherwise be left empty.. Conversely the lower cost seat only airlines sell their bargain bucket fares early and increase the prices as it gets closer to departure. Obviously it is far more complex than that in reality, but itís a simple overview. Itís relevant here because Humberside for a number of years before DSA did exceptionally well with the IT Charter market, the catchment area supported the flights well. The opening of DSA and the impact of consolidation during the financial crash fractured this market and HUY has all but abandoned this sector to focus on what it sees as its core business. It is actually profitable in this state, albeit marginally. Iím sceptical as to whether there is a will to pick up where it left off 16 or 17 years ago when traffic was at its peak, lots has changed in the industry since then.

Im seeing the closure of DSA as a net loss to the region currently.
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Old 28th Sep 2022, 20:14
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Originally Posted by Buster the Bear View Post
Is Humberside H24 or have the facility to extend opening into the night for delayed movements?
Only H24 for the Search and Rescue helicopters. Otherwise PPR (Prior Permission Required) 2115-0630
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Old 28th Sep 2022, 22:02
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Meanwhile Wizz is still selling tickets for flights to/from DSA for November and beyond. Evidently they failed to make a plan B for the airport being closed because of their amateurish business decisions.
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