Southampton-3
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Last edited by SouthernAlliance; 13th Nov 2023 at 07:27.
Join Date: Apr 2023
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That might be the timetabled cross country schedule. In reality many are regularly cancelled-totally unreliable service at ridiculous fares.
Two recent trips, 7 hours Bournemouth to Manchester. The next one 4.5 hours Winchester to Stockport, standing in first class for 4.5 hours. Most passengers denied boarding after Basingstoke due to overcrowding. People having to stand in toilets. This is reality of the so called train service.
The sooner someone gets back on the SOU-MAN route the better.
Two recent trips, 7 hours Bournemouth to Manchester. The next one 4.5 hours Winchester to Stockport, standing in first class for 4.5 hours. Most passengers denied boarding after Basingstoke due to overcrowding. People having to stand in toilets. This is reality of the so called train service.
The sooner someone gets back on the SOU-MAN route the better.
I'm currently writing this from the 05:05 Avanti service from Piccadilly to London, from where I'll be later travelling onwards to Chichester to work for the next couple of days. Very much missing that route right now! Fingers crossed Loganair make an announcement soon.
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The trouble is, if you were the Loganair CEO would you be keen to launch SOUMAN given that EZY has previously jumped on them at MAN (NQY and others) and at SOU (GLA obviously)?
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There are significant costs to setting up new bases and only SOU would actually be interested in having Logan base there. MAN actively discourage smaller gauge aircraft from basing there.
And then there's an issue with peak time slots/terminal capacity at MAN....
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I don't think this is the issue at all. You all seem to be missing the point that Logan don't have a based aircraft at either SOU or MAN. If you are going to serve the route properly, this is a prerequisite.
There are significant costs to setting up new bases and only SOU would actually be interested in having Logan base there. MAN actively discourage smaller gauge aircraft from basing there.
And then there's an issue with peak time slots/terminal capacity at MAN....
There are significant costs to setting up new bases and only SOU would actually be interested in having Logan base there. MAN actively discourage smaller gauge aircraft from basing there.
And then there's an issue with peak time slots/terminal capacity at MAN....
Last edited by SouthernAlliance; 13th Nov 2023 at 10:20.
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Runway distances yeah, but it's the obstacle clearance on runway 20 where SOU currently suffers compared to SEN. Hence why the airport are so desperate to finally get those trees cut.
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I must admit, I'm a tad confused by these trees and the obstacles.
TODA includes the clearway and the airport's recent appeal to cut the trees made very little reference to their impact upon performance.
Are they even still really an issue considering the distances now available and comparable to other airports like SEN?
TODA includes the clearway and the airport's recent appeal to cut the trees made very little reference to their impact upon performance.
Are they even still really an issue considering the distances now available and comparable to other airports like SEN?
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I don't think this is the issue at all. You all seem to be missing the point that Logan don't have a based aircraft at either SOU or MAN. If you are going to serve the route properly, this is a prerequisite.
There are significant costs to setting up new bases and only SOU would actually be interested in having Logan base there. MAN actively discourage smaller gauge aircraft from basing there.
And then there's an issue with peak time slots/terminal capacity at MAN....
There are significant costs to setting up new bases and only SOU would actually be interested in having Logan base there. MAN actively discourage smaller gauge aircraft from basing there.
And then there's an issue with peak time slots/terminal capacity at MAN....
Slots at MAN are within five minutes of what they asked for. Can’t easily tell if those are historic slots moved around from other routes. But it looks as if they have every ability to schedule this route with slots and aircraft if they actually want to do it.
And state of relations between Loganair and AGS at the moment can only be guessed!
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It would be a big and ballsy jump, but realistically - going forwards Loganair are going to have a big fight on their hands with price point. I think the next logical step is something like the E190E2.
A base at Southampton, alongside Aberdeen, Edinburgh, Glasgow and their Heathrow operations would easily support a fleet of 12 or so. It would open up opportunities with travel agents on charters out of the likes of Southampton, Isle of Man, Newquay and their bases, closer working partnership with BA perhaps even out of LCY again.
As mentioned, Flybe used to fill 78 seats multiple times a day out of SOU on at least 6 routes. Is it really behind belief that Loganair could offer a better price point, properly compete with easyJet and fill 110 seats on SOU-ABZ/EDI/GLA/NCL/MAN/BHD 3-6 daily?
I only recall NCL-SOU accurately enough to comment but Flybe operated up to 4 daily and pulled up to 12,000 monthly passengers. That should profitably sustain 3 daily flights on an 290 sized aircraft with decent load factors. And Flybe weren’t necessarily cheap either.
A base at Southampton, alongside Aberdeen, Edinburgh, Glasgow and their Heathrow operations would easily support a fleet of 12 or so. It would open up opportunities with travel agents on charters out of the likes of Southampton, Isle of Man, Newquay and their bases, closer working partnership with BA perhaps even out of LCY again.
As mentioned, Flybe used to fill 78 seats multiple times a day out of SOU on at least 6 routes. Is it really behind belief that Loganair could offer a better price point, properly compete with easyJet and fill 110 seats on SOU-ABZ/EDI/GLA/NCL/MAN/BHD 3-6 daily?
I only recall NCL-SOU accurately enough to comment but Flybe operated up to 4 daily and pulled up to 12,000 monthly passengers. That should profitably sustain 3 daily flights on an 290 sized aircraft with decent load factors. And Flybe weren’t necessarily cheap either.
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Don't want to be rude but I struggle to believe that someone could use the "Flybe used to do it" argument to suggest a route/aircraft type/frequency is a good idea. I think "Flybe used to do it" is basically a reason not to do something, or at least not to do it the Flybe way. Flybe tried the e jets and they didn't work for them. Even 'though the aircraft would be cheaper now, IMHO you will never achieve the cost per ASK on even an E 195 that you will on an A320.
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Someone above mentioned more growth about PMI Palma --- FYI this Summer (2023) saw BACF operate 5 weekly flights (2 were whole plane charters for TUI Holidays)
Do we need more?
If so, then it will be likely EasyJet Europe (who have a Palma Base) that will supply, as they have done with a SOU-FAO for Summer 2024
(and who have at last restarted SEN leisure flights again with some success)
Re TFS
EasyJet Europe have no bases of Aircraft nor Crews in the Canary Islands, so you will not see a TFS-SOU route unless that situation changes,
or, Easyjet UK actually open a fixed base at SOU with some aircraft and crews (as has been lamented on here for a decade or more).
Do we need more?
If so, then it will be likely EasyJet Europe (who have a Palma Base) that will supply, as they have done with a SOU-FAO for Summer 2024
(and who have at last restarted SEN leisure flights again with some success)
Re TFS
EasyJet Europe have no bases of Aircraft nor Crews in the Canary Islands, so you will not see a TFS-SOU route unless that situation changes,
or, Easyjet UK actually open a fixed base at SOU with some aircraft and crews (as has been lamented on here for a decade or more).
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Someone above mentioned more growth about PMI Palma --- FYI this Summer (2023) saw BACF operate 5 weekly flights (2 were whole plane charters for TUI Holidays)
Do we need more?
If so, then it will be likely EasyJet Europe (who have a Palma Base) that will supply, as they have done with a SOU-FAO for Summer 2024
(and who have at last restarted SEN leisure flights again with some success)
Re TFS
EasyJet Europe have no bases of Aircraft nor Crews in the Canary Islands, so you will not see a TFS-SOU route unless that situation changes,
or, Easyjet UK actually open a fixed base at SOU with some aircraft and crews (as has been lamented on here for a decade or more).
Do we need more?
If so, then it will be likely EasyJet Europe (who have a Palma Base) that will supply, as they have done with a SOU-FAO for Summer 2024
(and who have at last restarted SEN leisure flights again with some success)
Re TFS
EasyJet Europe have no bases of Aircraft nor Crews in the Canary Islands, so you will not see a TFS-SOU route unless that situation changes,
or, Easyjet UK actually open a fixed base at SOU with some aircraft and crews (as has been lamented on here for a decade or more).
FWIW - and applicable to SOU Leisure expansions
TUI have just dropped some new destinations it had planned out of BOH for next Summer (such as Tunisia) and have upped their Palma to 5 weekly flights.
With Ryanair also operating 9 services a week, Palma will now be 14 x 737-800 flights a week from BOH for S24, being the highest ever?
I remember when it was one Spantax CV990 a week, or later on a couple of Palmair 146's per week!
TUI have been advertising for more Bournemouth based cabin and flight crew for next summer, and have said that BOH will have the 2 TUI 738's again for S25.
From the BOH thread >
Hays Travel have sold-out their BOH-Barbados Fly Cruises for Winter 24 & 25 already.
P&O Cruises began the first of their BOH-BGI flights this month with 7 TUI Charters operating this winter for them.
Hays Travel could sell more Fly-Cruises from BOH but have trouble sourcing long-haul aircraft, as a shortage of TUI B787s this winter and no other suitable UK carriers anymore.
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TUI are using easyJet to fly holidaymakers to Portugal and Spain next summer and have added a programme of holidays to fit in
The Tuesday flight to Palma it’s still tba with TUI but I suspect it will be Cityflyer again as they have just added another Tuesday flight from LCY which fits in for the high season ( same as this summer )
There is a massive demand for Palma and not to be underestimated from this region
The Tuesday flight to Palma it’s still tba with TUI but I suspect it will be Cityflyer again as they have just added another Tuesday flight from LCY which fits in for the high season ( same as this summer )
There is a massive demand for Palma and not to be underestimated from this region
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