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Doncaster Sheffield-2

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Doncaster Sheffield-2

Old 2nd Apr 2019, 17:53
  #241 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
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Originally Posted by egcntristar View Post
Should be in the next week.

One route should be IAH-DSA-FRA-DWC-HKG other should be ORD-DSA-SVO-HKG or some variation.
Four flights per week according to the below interview. Prestwick has already started at two so no reason to dispute it - just waiting for the start.

https://www.aircargonews.net/airline...a-brexit-plan/
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Old 3rd Apr 2019, 07:45
  #242 (permalink)  
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I guess the big question now for the future of DSA is whether anyone is going to come in and fill the gap left by Flybe?

This loss will be several hundred thousand passengers per year.

I just can't see who. Easyjet maybe?
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Old 3rd Apr 2019, 08:00
  #243 (permalink)  
 
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What about Wizz / Wizz UK?
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Old 3rd Apr 2019, 08:03
  #244 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by toledoashley View Post
What about Wizz / Wizz UK?
Would be a completed untested market for them, picking up the FlyBe routes. Just can't see it myself, but who knows.
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Old 3rd Apr 2019, 08:16
  #245 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by TimmyW View Post
Would be a completed untested market for them, picking up the FlyBe routes. Just can't see it myself, but who knows.
Everything except the UK domestic routes could be a possibility for Wizzair UK with their aircraft type. The BHD and JER would be the biggest losses that need a regional aircraft realistically but has potential from still being served by Flybe or the likes of Loganair.

Dublin has proven demand and too could be picked up by Ryanair / Aer Lingus should they have capacity to do so.

That would just leave NQY as an unserved route,.Qith it being available as a PSO route to LBA i can't see there being any need for replacement at DSA.

I wouldn't be surprised to see the Flybe base be wound up before summer the way they are going. Very sad. Best wishes to all the crew and staff that handle the operation.
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Old 3rd Apr 2019, 10:12
  #246 (permalink)  
 
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[color=left=#000000]Everything except the UK domestic routes could be a possibility for Wizzair UK[/color]
Wizz Air UK seem to be building up their fleet of A321s so far at the expense of one A320 - a lot of seats to fill.

As I have posted elsewhere DSA seems to be the loser in an area where I think there are too many airports. I don't know what the business case was but would have thought it included taking at least some traffic from LBA. It hasn't done that (except for TUI maybe) and competing with LBA and EMA where Jet2 and RYR are entrenched and to a lessor extent HUY it will be difficult.
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Old 3rd Apr 2019, 10:48
  #247 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by 22/04 View Post
Wizz Air UK seem to be building up their fleet of A321s so far at the expense of one A320 - a lot of seats to fill.

As I have posted elsewhere DSA seems to be the loser in an area where I think there are too many airports. I don't know what the business case was but would have thought it included taking at least some traffic from LBA. It hasn't done that (except for TUI maybe) and competing with LBA and EMA where Jet2 and RYR are entrenched and to a lessor extent HUY it will be difficult.
The masterplan would argue that DSA can become the airport with the best infrastructure, and entice passengers and freight from EMA, LBA & even MAN. The commercial development around DSA has grown significantly in the last three years with massive warehousing for the likes of Amazon. To call it a loser does not properly reflect the full growth of the airport and surrounding business in recent years specifically since the opening of direct link roads from the Motorway network.

DSA still lacks a proper UK based Loco, but the deal with Flybe has at least shown a market for the flights they have chosen to operate. Wizz (quietly) remain the largest operator, and hopefully their relationship with Peel/DSA can be constructive in replacing and lost BE routes with a Wizz UK operation. On Peels part they will not be upsetting an incumbent as might be the case if they were to pursue RYR or EZY. Peel wont upset TUI trying too hard for Jet 2 - but if growth can be maintained over the next few years proving the calims of the masterplan, maybe even Jet 2 will see the restrictions of LBA and move some of their capacity to the airport that has room to grow.
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Old 3rd Apr 2019, 10:54
  #248 (permalink)  
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Interested points, but where is that growth coming from?
Unless a replacement is found for FlyBe in the next few weeks, this years passenger numbers will be massively down.

I don't see Wizz picking it up, they have said previously they are interested in operating bucket and spade routes from the UK, and I don't see them going against their business model with routes such as AMS.
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Old 3rd Apr 2019, 10:58
  #249 (permalink)  
 
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Last time an airline screwed Peel over like this they screwed them back to the tune of £12m...
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Old 3rd Apr 2019, 11:51
  #250 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by TimmyW View Post
Interested points, but where is that growth coming from?
.
You would hope TUI are monitoring what JET2 are doing up the road at LBA (and everywhere else) and try to take back some of the market they have lost - to DSA of course as TUI's airport of choice
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Old 3rd Apr 2019, 19:02
  #251 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
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Originally Posted by Robert-Ryan View Post
Last time an airline screwed Peel over like this they screwed them back to the tune of £12m...
BMI baby at Teesside?
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Old 3rd Apr 2019, 19:51
  #252 (permalink)  
 
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There are about 30 Wizzair flights at present for Winter 19/20.

It remains to be seen what the Flybe schedule will be, I suspect there will be a daily BHD and then on to AMS/CDG and back with a late return to BHD. Its difficult to see how anything else can be flown thru, maybe the Jersey but thats limited, unless they do something like EDI-AMS-DSA-AMS-EDI.

Lots more to come out of this in my opinion. For sure it seems DSA/CWL don't fit with what Virgin want (to feed their hub at LHR and MAN) but Connect are also 30% owned by Stobart.. DSA themselves won't want to lose these routes and I imagine will do what they can to find a replacement, the loads have been good so clearly the demand is there.

Flybe "management" to blame here. for sure they'll be fine tho - as per usual.
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Old 3rd Apr 2019, 20:22
  #253 (permalink)  
 
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Is Timmy bleating here? he has been given short shrift on the Flybe thread.

We don't yet know what is being cut. Flybe have said that they will still be serving DSA using Dash aircraft, presumably on W patterns. It's hard to imagine them doing the longer Spain/Portugal flights, but hopefully we will keep Dublin, Amsterdam, Belfast and Paris in some form.
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Old 3rd Apr 2019, 21:36
  #254 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by Robert-Ryan View Post
Last time an airline screwed Peel over like this they screwed them back to the tune of £12m...
Forgive me for my seeming ignorance, but aren’t the airlines the customer of an airport? If their chosen airport fails to deliver the passenger throughput to sustain a viable operation then the airline is surely free to leave on that basis? Caveats of buy in deals aside - coincidentally FlyBe were bought in - how much leverage do you think that gives a struggling airport when trying to attract new airline custom?

Beggars cant be choosers. As defined here.

Last edited by pug; 3rd Apr 2019 at 22:03.
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Old 3rd Apr 2019, 22:27
  #255 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by pug View Post


Forgive me for my seeming ignorance, but arenít the airlines the customer of an airport? If their chosen airport fails to deliver the passenger throughput to sustain a viable operation then the airline is surely free to leave on that basis? Caveats of buy in deals aside - coincidentally FlyBe were bought in - how much leverage do you think that gives a struggling airport when trying to attract new airline custom?

Beggars cant be choosers. As defined here.
As someone who lives only 25 miles away from DSA, I would love to use the airport for all my flights. However, the only airline that flies anywhere of interest to me, is TUI, but at silly prices compared to flights with Jet2 from BHX or LBA. Not sure how DSA can be blamed for not delivering the passenger throughput if the airline itself is offering uncompetitive fares to pax that would love to use their local airport.
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Old 3rd Apr 2019, 22:40
  #256 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by TimmyW View Post
I guess the big question now for the future of DSA is whether anyone is going to come in and fill the gap left by Flybe?

This loss will be several hundred thousand passengers per year.

I just can't see who. Easyjet maybe?
easyJet have been and gone, can't see any reason they'd be back. The airport need a slice of the Jet2 cake, though that may be extremely hard to achieve, but who knows.
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Old 3rd Apr 2019, 23:01
  #257 (permalink)  
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Age old argument of passengers wanting to reduce an airlines revenue by suggesting that they give them cut price fares on flights where passenger demand is already hard to justify. Well done also to EI-BUD for proposing that Jet2 should multiply its costs and compete on its own services.

The airport owner can only be blamed for opening an airport in an area where propensity to fly isn’t high enough to fulfil their ambitions. My response was aimed directly at a poster that was keen to remind people that the last time an airline crossed Peel by dropping Teesside from their schedule, the airline in question ended up £12million out of pocket. Great incentive to attract new business in an already saturated market.
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Old 3rd Apr 2019, 23:47
  #258 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by pug View Post

If their chosen airport fails to deliver the passenger throughput to sustain a viable operation then the airline is surely free to leave on that basis?
DTVA were delivering the pax though, and I don't buy into the lack of yield argument either
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Old 4th Apr 2019, 09:21
  #259 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
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Originally Posted by pug View Post
Age old argument of passengers wanting to reduce an airlines revenue by suggesting that they give them cut price fares on flights where passenger demand is already hard to justify. Well done also to EI-BUD for proposing that Jet2 should multiply its costs and compete on its own services.

The airport owner can only be blamed for opening an airport in an area where propensity to fly isnít high enough to fulfil their ambitions. My response was aimed directly at a poster that was keen to remind people that the last time an airline crossed Peel by dropping Teesside from their schedule, the airline in question ended up £12million out of pocket. Great incentive to attract new business in an already saturated market.
Good morning Pug,
My point is that the this is the greatest opportunity that the airport can wish for now, they've explored so many avenues already, easyJet, Ryanair etc.
The topic is wasn't about Jet2.
​​​​​​
Jet2 have significant market power particularly in the family and packaged holiday market, if DSA want a big slice of the cake in the region, Jet2 could bring it. I wouldn't speculate on the commercials or such things as cost duplication. We don't always see the cost benefit analysis and many airlines operate from neighbouring airports with commercial justification, let me give you some examples;

Ryanair - bases at PIK, GLA and EDI
Jet2 - bases at LBA, MAN
Jet2 - bases at BHX, EMA
easyJet - bases at LTN, STN, SEN

I agree that the region is incredibly competitive from an airport perspective, but airline do and can often justify having bases close together and there is nothing to say that Jet2 however unlikely it may be, couldn't split their operation between LBA and DSA, without duplication of services. Afterall, reading the history on the threads for DSA, the belief seems to be that DSA could prove an excellent alternstive to LBA. Indeed there was a group of posters proposing a new alternstive airport for Leeds at one point. I wonder what commercial rationale that stood behind that.

Play nice people ...
EI-BUD
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Old 5th Apr 2019, 16:13
  #260 (permalink)  
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EI-BUD, it is less populated than West Yorkshire and East Midlands region, barring some significant strategic shift it just isn’t going to happen. Sorry. Jet2 haven’t grown to be the strong business they are through duplicating costs. Quite the opposite in fact. The examples you have given are of different airlines and entirely different locations which have their own idiosyncrasies.

I maintain that the best best bet for growth in that sector would be from easyJet given that they have no coverage throughout central and Eastern England between NCL and LTN/STN. So if they show no interest, what makes you think that Jet2 -with large bases at LBA, EMA and MAN - would fare any better? Sorry to labour the point, but we were told 15 years ago that airlines would vote with their feet. They have.
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