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Monarch - 3

Old 17th Jul 2014, 20:43
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Fleet order

Am I alone in being a bit underwhelmed by this 'big' announcement ....firstly there is no actual order , and then the actual numbers talked about are less than the existing fleet size !
So is monarch planning to announce significant cutbacks shortly ? They are still losing money ....what is the future for them ??
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Old 18th Jul 2014, 20:43
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Let's not forget that they've taken delivery of various brand-new A321s over the last 15 months and there's 2 more to come next year, as well as some second-hand example and 2 brand-new A320s.

Putting the options aside, I wonder whether the plan is to keep the newer A321s long-term for the routes where the extra capacity is needed and use the MAX-8s to replace the A320s and most of the A321s, especially some of the older ones which will be nearly 20 years old by the time the first MAX-8 is delivered. Yes it will involve different types in the fleet, though that didn't stop Monarch from keeping 3 757s in the fleet for several years after the rest were withdrawn.

As for the order itself, I too was surprised that they switched to Boeing. Pity in some respects because as a passenger, I have a slight preference for the A320 Family over the 737s. i presume Boeing made Monarch a very good deal.
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Old 18th Jul 2014, 20:51
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Well if they do go firm on the order, rather than a letter of intent (which isn't worth the paper it's written on btw) they can then add to the list of Boeings they've offloaded from orders to other carriers i.e. 767's to Eva Air and 787's to BA I believe!
Useless management too busy doing deals and funny hand shakes at the Masonic Lodge I'm afraid!
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Old 20th Jul 2014, 13:51
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Which Aircraft leasing companies do Monarch own, or have links with?
There's a small blurb on the Monarch website about aircraft leasing, but little further info.
You can trace the holiday/flight chain back from Monarch Airlines, to Monarch Holdings, to Globus Travel group, and finally back to Amerald Investments nv.
But I can see no links to an aircraft leasing company. If anyone can enlighten me, just out of curiosity, that would be great.
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Old 20th Jul 2014, 15:41
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The Luton Leasing Company of Tokyo may be one of them? And a German leasing company, with a less memorable name?
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Old 21st Jul 2014, 06:34
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Weekend Telegraph article

Swiss billionaires inject cash into Monarch for third time in five years - Telegraph
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Old 21st Jul 2014, 06:52
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Fly by wire

FBW - according to press article GE Aviation in conjunction with JV partners and CFM International are the firms behind the Monarch Boeing potential order. As article says Joint Venture partners expect this means > http://www.gecas.com/en/index.html however, like you, found it difficult to actually find out who does 'own' the Monarch leased planes.

Last edited by 111KAB; 21st Jul 2014 at 06:56. Reason: Link
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Old 21st Jul 2014, 07:46
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So long as the cash flow is + then the investment will probably just reduce tax elsewhere, after all its a private company, it not like Alitalia.

No one in the airline i've spoken to seems to be in the least concerned about job security, staff are frequently told not worry over press comments about 'profitability' its not a conventional airline and its been around for ever and the 'family' are happy.........
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Old 21st Jul 2014, 11:41
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Within a group of companies, it is fairly straightforward to camouflage the performance of any single subsidiary through the use of transfer pricing and management fees remitted to the parent. Especially so when the group is held privately.
I anticipate Monarch will enjoy a lengthy period of successful independence unless its owners decide to sell, for their own reasons.
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Old 21st Jul 2014, 15:19
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unless its owners decide to sell, for their own reasons...
Please for God sake don't even mention that!

I know another airline that would be biting at the ankles to buy the airline division, the dreaded easyJet!

A fleet that is currently compatible with their own and I am sure they would appreciate the A321's, unlike the days of when they took over GB and simply thought they were too big!

Extra slots at Gatwick and Manchester they can use up.

Headquarters at Luton also, so gives them immediate new office space and new hangars within the vicinity of their own at the airport too!

A new sizeable instant base at Birmingham. Not sure how LBA and EMA would however fit into the mix.

I just hope this cash blip gets sorted, and I am sure that is all it is - a "blip". But with the newspapers reporting this news, it does the airline no favours whatsoever and can make people thinking of booking flights get nervous and going elsewhere to book. This can then explode in to a problem that doesn't exist.
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Old 21st Jul 2014, 16:06
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I just hope this cash blip gets sorted, and I am sure that is all it is - a "blip".
There is a distinct danger that the injection of cash into a company to finance investment in new equipment is being turned into some sort of dire financial situation.

The more it is discussed, and the more it is speculated upon the greater the chance that something insignificant could be turned into something more, purely through rumours and comment - and nobody wants that, least of all those working for the company - of which I am not one!
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Old 26th Jul 2014, 13:26
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Travel weekly reports on a survey of the LCC market by HSBC:

Monarch was described as "fast-growing" and a "potential threat" to Thomas Cook and TUI.

Only easyJet has seen yield growth in all 4 quarters last year, Air Berlin saw double-digit second-half decline, and Ryanair 10% down in Q3.

HSBC said that, against this background "second-tier" carriers such as Jet2, Monarch and Norwegian have emerged.

"In their local markets Jet2 (northern England) and Monarch (southern England) are both growing fast while Wizz continues to grow fast from eastern Europe"

HSBC sees "a new surge in competition from Ryanair and easyJet" and questions whether TC and TUI are strong enough to withstand the threat from MON, Jet2 and Norwegian.

(Just reporting an interesting piece - don't shoot the messenger!)
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Old 26th Jul 2014, 15:55
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Very interesting to read, thumbs up to Monarch.
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Old 26th Jul 2014, 23:13
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LGS6753

Interesting comments about the growth of Monarch, Jet2 & Norwegian, i think the most positive thing is that the growth is coming from other than Ryanair & easyJet, although i suspect it may be short lived as Ryanair slowly changed their customer focus from intolerable back to to tolerable but still have a massive cost advantage and of course size brings its own benefits plus moving to mainstream airports, going forward i think Monarch biggest challenge will be London Gatwick, i see a bloodbath between easy jet & Norwegian causing significant collateral damage to Monarch.

Jet2 don't really feature south of EMA and Norwegian have shown no interest in North of LGW other than some scandi flights to MAN/EDI & that kind of leaves LTN/BHX to Monarch, I'm told their prices are high and their flights are full, a lot of loyal passengers that return time and time again, but they are losing market share at LGW

Personally 9 months after they said they were close to a larger fleet order Farnborough was a damp squib, as someone else said a LOI isn't worth the paper its written on, i just hope the owners are up for it ! we need airlines like Monarch & Jet2 in the UK to be successful
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Old 26th Jul 2014, 23:21
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Summer 2015 flights are up. Notable Changes:
All flights to Dubrovnik not bookable (except Gatwick)
All flights to Ibiza not bookable
BHX-GIB not bookable

I would Imagine these are late being loaded into the system
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Old 26th Jul 2014, 23:35
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Monarch Summer 2015

MKY661 wrote
BHX-GIB not bookable
26/7/2014 2330 none of Birminghams Summer 2015 flights are showing as bookable yet
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Old 26th Jul 2014, 23:42
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26/7/2014 2330 none of Birminghams Summer 2015 flights are showing as bookable yet
Ah OK. Wasn't aware. Cheers
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Old 26th Jul 2014, 23:49
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Looks like BHX and LBA are in the process of being uploaded because if you search for a flight from April onwards it says "No Flights" below each day of the week.




All the EMA routes however display the usual proper message saying there's no flights and advises the latest date that flight operates. Could mean nothing but it's making me think they are not planning to upload EMA yet. I hope they are not pulling out!?
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Old 27th Jul 2014, 08:40
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FLB it looks like the owners are not up for it least not on their own

Monarch airline seeks new backers | The Sunday Times

The media do print some rubbish, take on easyJet & Ryanair !!!!
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Old 27th Jul 2014, 15:13
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LNIDA - you make your dislike for Monarch quite apparent on here so there is no need to keep reminding everyone. That article doesn't suggest Monarch will ever match ezy/fr for size just that they want to compete on price and product and with them, which is something they already do to an extent. They compete with one or the other or both at every base they have anyway!
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