Aer Lingus - 6
Not "unlikely to be true" but in your words "false". Good Heavens above, it's almost as if you state this with some form of insider knowledge. Jings, crivvens and help ma boab racedo it's giving some people the mad impression you're on the payroll. Who WOULD have thought such a thing?
I see spending 500m to shut them down as not a likely event because there is no benefit to FR in doing so.
Now if MO'L was an ego owning 100% of FR and trying to get even it would be understandable but he doesn't and he isn't. Shareholders would rightly question spending 500m for nothing.
Expanding the TA model as outlined previously using FR as a feeder makes a lot more financial sense.
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Expanding the TA model as outlined previously using FR as a feeder makes a
lot more financial sense.
Yesterday and Friday AerLingus flew a couple of their European routes via Dublin. FAO and ALC for e.g.
As a result take yesterday, BFS DUB ALC was by a 319; Belfast crew took the plane with all 28 passengers to DUB (not surprising load so light as it was the last one), the Belfast Crew were sent by taxi back to Belfast and the Dublin crew came on and took the plane to ALC and then Back to BFS.
These crew had to be taken to DUB last night by taxi, so since Friday probably 5 taxis approx.
The reason for this crew change is due to Union agreement, where BFS or LGW crews cannot operate out of DUB.. Amazing. . .
MOL would not flex on the issue of unions and as a result this fact alone would bring the company to its knees. When Dublin airport went out on strike in support of FR baggage handlers many years ago, guess which airlines was flying.. Ryanair, so that should be enough to show lack of tolerance for Union agenda, hence the issues. In my view.
On a separate and unrelated note, BHD flights launced this A.M. first flights into BHD almost full. So where school term of not, there is good awareness of the brand on the route. Also BAs 1st flight mon- fri from BHD to LHR note until 0750, this should serve EI very well in its first season...
EI-BUD
Last edited by EI-BUD; 28th Oct 2012 at 13:42.
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Expanding the TA model as outlined previously using FR as a feeder makes a lot more financial sense.
Last edited by EI-A330-300; 28th Oct 2012 at 13:43.
There are monumental tasks to overcome from a MOL perspective. Firstly the huge hole in the deficit is one such task, not to mention unions.
If pension fund wins the 300 million it wants then pretty much no need to worry about EI future as there isn't one because you can pretty much guarantee they will be back again.
EI owned only by its shareholders one of whom with 29% will be voting against this as may other holders as well if realising the voting away its cash.
In relation to Unions, the adding of costs as you describe, is supposedly protecting jobs if listening to the Union, but ensuring loads of additional costs are added in to make reinvesting harder.
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Yawn, the usual expect hired hack diatribe, re no future for EIN. Just like your boss....bluff and bluster.
2 big problems do sit with EIN....the pension fund mess and a hostile share holder sitting on de facto 30% of stock. These are causing huge problems with the stock going forward irrespective of bumper loads qx3.
2 big problems do sit with EIN....the pension fund mess and a hostile share holder sitting on de facto 30% of stock. These are causing huge problems with the stock going forward irrespective of bumper loads qx3.
Yawn, the usual expect hired hack diatribe, re no future for EIN. Just like your boss....bluff and bluster.
2 big problems do sit with EIN....the pension fund mess and a hostile share holder sitting on de facto 30% of stock. These are causing huge problems with the stock going forward irrespective of bumper loads qx3.
2 big problems do sit with EIN....the pension fund mess and a hostile share holder sitting on de facto 30% of stock. These are causing huge problems with the stock going forward irrespective of bumper loads qx3.
Issue with the stock going forward is the Unions willing to strike or threaten strike when ever they wish.
If Aer Lingus stock was so undervalued then its stock price would be well above the 1.04 it finished at on Friday, in fact well above the 1.30 of the last bid, the market doesn't think it is................not a shock really.
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As a result take yesterday, BFS DUB ALC was by a 319; Belfast crew took the plane with all 28 passengers to DUB (not surprising load so light as it was the last one), the Belfast Crew were sent by taxi back to Belfast and the Dublin crew came on and took the plane to ALC and then Back to BFS.
These crew had to be taken to DUB last night by taxi, so since Friday probably 5 taxis approx.
The reason for this crew change is due to Union agreement, where BFS or LGW crews cannot operate out of DUB.. Amazing. . .
These crew had to be taken to DUB last night by taxi, so since Friday probably 5 taxis approx.
The reason for this crew change is due to Union agreement, where BFS or LGW crews cannot operate out of DUB.. Amazing. . .
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ayroplain the point is that LGW and BFS crews were hired on inferior terms and conditions to DUB pilots. Unless they were prevented from flying from DUB, all DUB terms and conditions would be eroded over time down to the inferior levels. Did you know that?
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Yes, Skipness, I'm aware of the different terms and conditions but it is just another example of the old-fashioned, warped and senseless thinking that unions indulge in and that has plagued EI forever.
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gives micko huge political clout
EI-BUD
Of course there is benefit to FR in closing EI. It gives them almost total control over access to Ireland, it's passengers and airports. In turn this gives micko huge political clout. Which is what this is all about, an egotistical power trip to have the loudest voice in his own backyard. Ultimately he's a small town man, he can't be the biggest fish in the EU pond, but he can certainly be that in Ireland. There'll be no end to the fawning then, as only the Irish can revere the local bigwig.
Why would he want to be the local bigwig in a country with a population of 4.6 Million
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Why would he want to be the local bigwig in a country with a population of 4.6 Million
Is that a serious statement? My own view is shared by the majority of Ryanair shareholders, and I know racedo you're probably going to refrain from digging at your own CEO for obvious reasons. Only Michael O'Leary and his ego have led to the 3 takeover attempts and the 29.4% shareholding in Aer Lingus and not Ryanair's shareholders. For some reason he wants Aer Lingus and we will probably never know what that reason is, the only massive one I can think of worth value is the 7 aircraft in the Long Haul fleet and slots at Heathrow and others Aer Lingus hold. He has wasted millions of Ryanair's cash in Aer Lingus for no benefit to Ryanair or its shareholders and the only way he can get this money back is by buying Aer Lingus shutting it down or merging it and selling of the assets. Advantage of all this? he's the main airline in the state and the competition Ryanair love to talk about bringing in e.g. BA, Virgin etc.. would be running because not one company with commercial sense would take him on after previous attempts by many e.g. easyJet, Go etc. O'Leary then leaves with an unblemished and hugely successful career at Europe's largest carrier and his ego unchanged.. oh and the massive paycheck as well.
My own view is shared by the majority of Ryanair shareholders,
Tell you what.........provide the evidence for that and will read the rest of the diatribe.
(Plus spaces)
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Tell you what.........provide the evidence for that and will read the rest of the diatribe.
The initial shareholdings in Aer Lingus were accepted in 2006, that's changed quite a bit since the loss Ryanair has incurred because of that investment.
At the time of the 2006 offer, Aer Lingus represented in excess of 25 per cent of Ryanair's gross assets and, accordingly, the transaction would have required Ryanair shareholder approval. Since 2006, Ryanair has increased in size, while the market value of Aer Lingus has declined, and accordingly this offer is not a "significant transaction" under the Listing Rules and will not require Ryanair shareholder approval, said Ryanair. The Sunday Business Post
Because it wouldn't be approved by the shareholders if it had to be.
Back at you, where's the evidence of shareholders support of all 3 of Ryanair's take-over attempts on Aer Lingus?
The initial shareholdings in Aer Lingus were accepted in 2006, that's changed quite a bit since the loss Ryanair has incurred because of that investment.
At the time of the 2006 offer, Aer Lingus represented in excess of 25 per cent of Ryanair's gross assets and, accordingly, the transaction would have required Ryanair shareholder approval. Since 2006, Ryanair has increased in size, while the market value of Aer Lingus has declined, and accordingly this offer is not a "significant transaction" under the Listing Rules and will not require Ryanair shareholder approval, said Ryanair. The Sunday Business Post
Because it wouldn't be approved by the shareholders if it had to be.
The initial shareholdings in Aer Lingus were accepted in 2006, that's changed quite a bit since the loss Ryanair has incurred because of that investment.
At the time of the 2006 offer, Aer Lingus represented in excess of 25 per cent of Ryanair's gross assets and, accordingly, the transaction would have required Ryanair shareholder approval. Since 2006, Ryanair has increased in size, while the market value of Aer Lingus has declined, and accordingly this offer is not a "significant transaction" under the Listing Rules and will not require Ryanair shareholder approval, said Ryanair. The Sunday Business Post
Because it wouldn't be approved by the shareholders if it had to be.
Claiming "it won't be approved by shareholders" when it was never put to shareholders nor have any of them publicly or privately briefed against it shows you forming a deluded opinion based on no facts. In effect you again have provided no evidence.
If major shareholders disapprove of anything the management of a company is doing they can
1.) tell the company publicly
2.) vote or abstain against the board at AGM
3.) call and EGM to remove board
4.) brief the press privately to ensure it becomes public, adding pressure on the company board.
As NONE of these have happened at Ryanair I think its safe to conclude you know nowt.
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Claiming "it won't be approved by shareholders" when it was never put to shareholders nor have any of them publicly or privately briefed against it shows you forming a deluded opinion based on no facts. In effect you again have provided no evidence.
Last edited by PPRuNeUser0176; 30th Oct 2012 at 13:48.
The Goverment and Etihad won't approve the takeover and don't start saying that it will be the EU/IMF deciding.
Irish Govt needs the cash and will sell if price is right that is unless Denis O'Brien tells them not to. Given the Irish tribunals proved Mr O'Brien paid off party members of the current govt in the 1990's to gain a Telecom license then anything is possible.
Course Mr O'Brien previously worked for Tony Ryan who parted company with him and employed Michael O'Leary afterwards.
Oh and Irish Govt can decide not to sell its shareholding but if EU approve then all is needed is 50.000001% for a takeover.
Last edited by racedo; 30th Oct 2012 at 15:02.
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Ethihad have 1/10 of the shareholding of Ryanair yet people complain Ryanair is able to influence Aer Lingus policy but seems like you are saying Ethihad can do it more !!!
Irish Govt needs the cash and will sell if price is right that is unless Denis O'Brien tells them not to. Given the Irish tribunals proved Mr O'Brien paid off party members of the current govt in the 1990's to gain a Telecom license then anything is possible.
Course Mr O'Brien previously worked for Tony Ryan who parted company with him and employed Michael O'Leary afterwards.
Oh and Irish Govt can decide not to sell its shareholding but if EU approve then all is needed is 50.000001% for a takeover.
Irish Govt needs the cash and will sell if price is right that is unless Denis O'Brien tells them not to. Given the Irish tribunals proved Mr O'Brien paid off party members of the current govt in the 1990's to gain a Telecom license then anything is possible.
Course Mr O'Brien previously worked for Tony Ryan who parted company with him and employed Michael O'Leary afterwards.
Oh and Irish Govt can decide not to sell its shareholding but if EU approve then all is needed is 50.000001% for a takeover.