LEEDS 5
Interesting debate. bmi pulled off LBA-LHR despite the fact that yields were more than double those on MAN-LHR (LBA was into three figures, MAN was rather well below that) and although they were operating the E145 at the time on LBA-LHR with which you could never make a profit given fixed LHR charges, they chose to concentrate on MAN-LHR where the overall revenue potential was not dissimilar.
And in terms of the slot sitting debate, there are quite a few duplicated frequencies on routes into LHR in the BA portfolio which I'd think were more at risk. If departures from LHR to MAN at 2005, 2025 and 2140 when only one aircraft is really needed to nightstop MAN isn't a prime example of slot sitting, I don't know what is. At least by operating LBA-LHR, BA are generating some new revenue at the expense of KLM connections over AMS instead of operating multiple frequencies very close together on MAN-LHR which simply spread the existing revenue over three flights where one would suffice
And in terms of the slot sitting debate, there are quite a few duplicated frequencies on routes into LHR in the BA portfolio which I'd think were more at risk. If departures from LHR to MAN at 2005, 2025 and 2140 when only one aircraft is really needed to nightstop MAN isn't a prime example of slot sitting, I don't know what is. At least by operating LBA-LHR, BA are generating some new revenue at the expense of KLM connections over AMS instead of operating multiple frequencies very close together on MAN-LHR which simply spread the existing revenue over three flights where one would suffice
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I think BA will be hoping that they offer a better proposition to some of those premium eastbound LH customers who have been heading over the Pennines and into the hands of the middle eastern carriers.
Somebody is filling up those A380s, and they're not all from Manchester...
Somebody is filling up those A380s, and they're not all from Manchester...
Last edited by BKS Air Transport; 5th Jun 2013 at 22:52. Reason: spelling
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BA's new long haul aircraft are also replacing old ones so there will not be loads of new routes.. if LBA was a slot sitter, why would BA invest time and money on a new destination instead of adding extra frequencies to MAN & NCL? I really hope the route does well and I have seen the loads for the 'little red' from MAN and they are similar to BA's when they just started LBA.
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Correct AP1995
The majority are like for like replacement of an ageing fleet. Actual Long Haul expansion isn't actually that many hulls over next few years. Given that a LH jet requires one slot pair a day there isn't going to be the massacre of SH many are predicting.
RTM started the same day as LBA and has interesting stats also. Plenty of v quiet sectors but plenty >100 also but interestingly its far more point to point. LBA is very high in terms of transfer which as I said has to give it some viability. They can't just fill the LH routes entirely from the SE.
The schedule is a problem but then a nightstop, despite being the BA model, is an expensive commitment.
The 'early' south and late 'north' are doing fine. The late south is really a positioner so doesn't concern me with its very quiet loads - MAN is an über-established route and has similar loads on its 2100-2200 southbounds. The problem is the middle rotation and most importantly the early North.
The T5 move shifted this service from 0700 ex T1 (zero connectivity) to 0755 ex T5 (lots of connectivity from all the LH Arrs Pre 0655) and I thought it would do really well and that hasn't materialised. It regularly has <50 on board. I am mystified by this.
The majority are like for like replacement of an ageing fleet. Actual Long Haul expansion isn't actually that many hulls over next few years. Given that a LH jet requires one slot pair a day there isn't going to be the massacre of SH many are predicting.
RTM started the same day as LBA and has interesting stats also. Plenty of v quiet sectors but plenty >100 also but interestingly its far more point to point. LBA is very high in terms of transfer which as I said has to give it some viability. They can't just fill the LH routes entirely from the SE.
The schedule is a problem but then a nightstop, despite being the BA model, is an expensive commitment.
The 'early' south and late 'north' are doing fine. The late south is really a positioner so doesn't concern me with its very quiet loads - MAN is an über-established route and has similar loads on its 2100-2200 southbounds. The problem is the middle rotation and most importantly the early North.
The T5 move shifted this service from 0700 ex T1 (zero connectivity) to 0755 ex T5 (lots of connectivity from all the LH Arrs Pre 0655) and I thought it would do really well and that hasn't materialised. It regularly has <50 on board. I am mystified by this.
Last edited by Gate 8; 6th Jun 2013 at 12:14.
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It's actually quite fascinating seeing it grow and seeing how it pans out.
Interestingly compared with KLM. Schipol has unlimited slots and runways and so KLM can run 80-90 seat a/c happily as they do to LBA, HUY etc
If BA had such a luxury LBA would be doing very well load-wise already. The paucity of slots at LHR renders such a machine unworkable (as with the BMI ER145's alluded to above). If you want a service to LHR you have to be able to fill a 319 a few times a day or you're toast - it really is as simple as that.
Still think LBA could make a final push with numbers to convince BA to nightstop the last service, provide a proper early south, remove the empty late positioner and cement the routes future but it's not going to happen on today's figures. Have to hope they keep building.
I'm certainly thrilled every day to see so many people heading south on the 1341 starting their journeys from our gateway airport to all corners of the globe with the national carrier. I don't think I'm alone to see it as a good thing for Yorkshire.
Interestingly compared with KLM. Schipol has unlimited slots and runways and so KLM can run 80-90 seat a/c happily as they do to LBA, HUY etc
If BA had such a luxury LBA would be doing very well load-wise already. The paucity of slots at LHR renders such a machine unworkable (as with the BMI ER145's alluded to above). If you want a service to LHR you have to be able to fill a 319 a few times a day or you're toast - it really is as simple as that.
Still think LBA could make a final push with numbers to convince BA to nightstop the last service, provide a proper early south, remove the empty late positioner and cement the routes future but it's not going to happen on today's figures. Have to hope they keep building.
I'm certainly thrilled every day to see so many people heading south on the 1341 starting their journeys from our gateway airport to all corners of the globe with the national carrier. I don't think I'm alone to see it as a good thing for Yorkshire.
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The T5 move shifted this service from 0700 ex T1 (zero connectivity) to 0755 ex T5 (lots of connectivity from all the LH Arrs Pre 0655) and I thought it would do really well and that hasn't materialised. It regularly has <50 on board. I am mystified by this.
25 isn't a huge wave really. 3 of these (Nairobi, Doha and Muscat) have got no connection opportunity outbound form LBA. Another 3 (Sydney, Buenos Aires and Moscow) have got a minimum layover > 5 hours connecting outbound form LBA.
At Schipol, there are about 50 arrivals that connect onto the first departure from LBA - and they're filling an aircraft half the size.
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My experience is that anA310 is louder on takeoff than a 777
Interesting to see the first downgraded all Y refitted A310 on the LBA route. Doesnt bode well for a dramatic increase in capacity and maintanence of a J cabin
Interesting to see the first downgraded all Y refitted A310 on the LBA route. Doesnt bode well for a dramatic increase in capacity and maintanence of a J cabin
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The 777 is quieter than the A310. PIA have been saying they will put the 777 on to keep the council happy as they keep breaking the planning rules for the runway extension from many years ago which put a noise limit on night flights. The A310 is regularly late meaning it departs after the curfew and they have to get permission for the departure each time.
It will be interesting to see what happens to the loads now the A310s are going all Y as from what I understand it was the business seats they were struggling to sell.
It will be interesting to see what happens to the loads now the A310s are going all Y as from what I understand it was the business seats they were struggling to sell.
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Just a question relating to overnighting aircraft at Leeds are there enough stands? I understand there are 3 Ryanair aircraft, 1 Thomson and over 10 Jet2 aircraft? There doesn't seem to be enough stands?
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Jack1985
There are 24 stands if I remember correctly.They are just about full overnight.There will have to be more concrete poured if more aircraft are night stopping.
There are 24 stands if I remember correctly.They are just about full overnight.There will have to be more concrete poured if more aircraft are night stopping.
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LBA currently has 20x parking stands on its apron. Stands 2 and 4 no longer exist and 20 and 23 are class B stands that when in use block stands 19, 21 and 22, 24 respectively. So yes its going to be quite full with 22x aircraft either been based or over nighting this summer season.
Eastern Airways = 1x JS41
KLM City Hopper = 1x FK70
Thomson = 1x B738
Monarch = 2x A320
Ryanair = 3x B738
Jet2.com = 9x B733, 1x B738 & 4x B752
I understand that 3x aircraft are able to be parked overnight at holding points N2, N3 and N4. There are procedures in place to turn the bits of taxiway between N3 and N4 into an extended apron. This means that no escorting is required out to the aircraft.
Eastern Airways = 1x JS41
KLM City Hopper = 1x FK70
Thomson = 1x B738
Monarch = 2x A320
Ryanair = 3x B738
Jet2.com = 9x B733, 1x B738 & 4x B752
I understand that 3x aircraft are able to be parked overnight at holding points N2, N3 and N4. There are procedures in place to turn the bits of taxiway between N3 and N4 into an extended apron. This means that no escorting is required out to the aircraft.
Last edited by LBIA; 10th Jun 2013 at 16:42.
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CAA have today published the Provisional May 2013 passenger stats.
LBA handled 329,127 passengers in May 2013 which is a massive increase of 19.6% on the same month last year (May 2012)
The even better news is that the magic 3 million passenger barrier has finally been broken. As the year rolling 12-month total figure now stands at an impressive 3,021,652....
LBA handled 329,127 passengers in May 2013 which is a massive increase of 19.6% on the same month last year (May 2012)
The even better news is that the magic 3 million passenger barrier has finally been broken. As the year rolling 12-month total figure now stands at an impressive 3,021,652....
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Jet2 have just announced that it will restart flights to Budapest from Leeds/Bradford next summer 2014. Jet2 dropped the Leeds - Budapest route last November after operating it for only 6 months, I wonder what's made them change there mind?
Anyway it looks as though the service will once again be operated 2x weekly on Thursday and Sundays with flights commencing from April 3rd.
Anyway it looks as though the service will once again be operated 2x weekly on Thursday and Sundays with flights commencing from April 3rd.
Last edited by LBIA; 3rd Jul 2013 at 15:42.
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Better late than never. The CAA june 2013 stats have just been published for LBA.
LBA handled 387,217 passengers in June, up 12.9% on June 12. Also the Atms were up 4.5%
Meanwhile the year Rolling 12-month total now stands at 3,065,971, up 4.6% on a year ago.
Another set of good results once again. Whats more it looks as though LBA handled more passengers than Liverpool did in June 2013....
LBA handled 387,217 passengers in June, up 12.9% on June 12. Also the Atms were up 4.5%
Meanwhile the year Rolling 12-month total now stands at 3,065,971, up 4.6% on a year ago.
Another set of good results once again. Whats more it looks as though LBA handled more passengers than Liverpool did in June 2013....
Last edited by LBIA; 19th Jul 2013 at 10:48.
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At LBA we can accept up to B767 primarily from within Europe but can accept
intercontinental if necessary
intercontinental if necessary