Chaos at Terminal 5
Join Date: Dec 2000
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I experienced T5 yesterday evening and I was looking forward to experiencing an new era in the British airline industry. I was greeted with utter chaos and pandemonium. I was so relieved that I was not in uniform since I had been operating that morning and I was off to visit family.
It was a very embarrassing and frustrating spectacle to watch and what was more embarrassing was that the check in concourse was littered with camera crews as well as journalists clutching notepads whilst chatting to passengers. It was clear that the Media were loving every minute of this debacle! I look forward to seeing how extensive the coverage is in the newspapers in the morning.
What I did find very sad was that the few BA staff that were working in the check in area, looked to be confused and bewildered by their new surroundings. The usual friendly and confident attitude that so many BA staff exude had disappeared yesterday. Pax (including me) were left stranded by groundstaff whilst we were waiting to find out what was happening to our bags that we were waiting to be taken off us after we had checked in. It was nothing short of an utter PR disaster for BA and I feel sorry for the groundstaff that looked that they had been abandoned and could not offer the level of customer service that they are so accustomed to offer! Very sad!
I had hold luggage and was flying domestic so I did not relish the thought of fighting for a hotel room so I walked off to Terminal 1. I was greeted by an oasis of tranquillity (nice change!
) and I went on bmi instead which I thought was rather poignant ending to my encounter with T5 on its first day!!!
It was a very embarrassing and frustrating spectacle to watch and what was more embarrassing was that the check in concourse was littered with camera crews as well as journalists clutching notepads whilst chatting to passengers. It was clear that the Media were loving every minute of this debacle! I look forward to seeing how extensive the coverage is in the newspapers in the morning.
What I did find very sad was that the few BA staff that were working in the check in area, looked to be confused and bewildered by their new surroundings. The usual friendly and confident attitude that so many BA staff exude had disappeared yesterday. Pax (including me) were left stranded by groundstaff whilst we were waiting to find out what was happening to our bags that we were waiting to be taken off us after we had checked in. It was nothing short of an utter PR disaster for BA and I feel sorry for the groundstaff that looked that they had been abandoned and could not offer the level of customer service that they are so accustomed to offer! Very sad!
I had hold luggage and was flying domestic so I did not relish the thought of fighting for a hotel room so I walked off to Terminal 1. I was greeted by an oasis of tranquillity (nice change!
) and I went on bmi instead which I thought was rather poignant ending to my encounter with T5 on its first day!!!
Last edited by Mister Geezer; 28th Mar 2008 at 01:05.
Join Date: Aug 2002
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With the eyes of the world watching, both BAA and BA have made us all look like bloody fools again. I'm embarrased and shocked. Laughing stocks the bloody lot of you, hang your useless heads in shame. How many holidays ruined? Again? Words are cheap and your actions have proven to be laughable. Heathrow East and Runway 3 my arse, you no longer deserve it.
Many Moons ago one of our very Senior Managers told a group of us how happy and chuffed he was that T5 reduced the Staff headcount ( self service check in etc). He didn't give a stuff about the travelling publics need to interface with a human being, all he cared about was a reduction in the BA headcount and the associated reduction in cost...today we have seen the consequences of that mentality.
In the last few months those of us who work for BA have heard countless tales of T5 trials not working but of managers walking particpants through issues ( such as no bags being offloaded) in order to keep close to the timeline and "prove" that T5 was fit for purpose. After all, who would dare to be the first manager to tell their boss that, "err, boss, T5 won't work as planned unless we employ more people"?
And now we come to the CRM issue. Walsh and others have engendered a "don't ask, don't tell" mentality in BA managers..he (Walsh) doesn't want to know that the pilots/cabin crew/engineers/ etc are p****ed off, and he sure as hell doesn't want to hear that the T5 trials failed because of a lack of resources. So no one told him....what's the expression - credible deniability?
He, and the whole laughingly titled leadership team should go. Now.
In the last few months those of us who work for BA have heard countless tales of T5 trials not working but of managers walking particpants through issues ( such as no bags being offloaded) in order to keep close to the timeline and "prove" that T5 was fit for purpose. After all, who would dare to be the first manager to tell their boss that, "err, boss, T5 won't work as planned unless we employ more people"?
And now we come to the CRM issue. Walsh and others have engendered a "don't ask, don't tell" mentality in BA managers..he (Walsh) doesn't want to know that the pilots/cabin crew/engineers/ etc are p****ed off, and he sure as hell doesn't want to hear that the T5 trials failed because of a lack of resources. So no one told him....what's the expression - credible deniability?
He, and the whole laughingly titled leadership team should go. Now.
Join Date: Aug 2005
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"There's no such thing as bad publicity" --- apparently
BA still don't really seem to have announced what tomorrow's passengers should do. Their website says that people will be able to get refunds for cancelled flights, but flight-only refunds and no other announcements don't really help people heading off on holiday wanting to know what to pack, or to important meetings scheduled. I don't think BA know what to do.
Re wiggy's post,
It takes a very brave manager to tell his boss that his dearest gameplan will work only in his imagination.
Alex - The Telegraph
It takes a very brave manager to tell his boss that his dearest gameplan will work only in his imagination.
Alex - The Telegraph
I feel a little editing of BA's website front page might be in order before the dawn...
"At London Heathrow Terminal 5 we’ve created a natural, logical journey that’s so calm, you’ll flow through. It should only take ten minutes to get from check-in to departures *. Transferring and arriving are just as simple and calm. Spend the time you save enjoying the excellent range of shops, cafes and restaurants. Or simply relax and be wowed by the world class architecture"
and even better....
"Whenever you fly, with or without bags, check-in online"
Obviously whoever came up with the latter slogan was blessed with amazing foresight!
"At London Heathrow Terminal 5 we’ve created a natural, logical journey that’s so calm, you’ll flow through. It should only take ten minutes to get from check-in to departures *. Transferring and arriving are just as simple and calm. Spend the time you save enjoying the excellent range of shops, cafes and restaurants. Or simply relax and be wowed by the world class architecture"
and even better....
"Whenever you fly, with or without bags, check-in online"
Obviously whoever came up with the latter slogan was blessed with amazing foresight!
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derekvader
I don't think BA know what to do.
I don't think BA know what to do.
The whole think STINKS of utterly incompetent management (the current curse of the UK - I think I preferred the unions !). Don't for ONE SECOND expect anyone to offer to resign though, they'll be waiting for their bonuses.
One thing for sure .... if they don't get it fixed PDQ, they won't have an airline left to run. It's their BASE for heavens sake !
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Hand Solo
Well according to CNN, BAA are saying all the baggage infrastructure is working correctly and it's BAs staffs inability to meet the operational demand that is causing the problem.
Well according to CNN, BAA are saying all the baggage infrastructure is working correctly and it's BAs staffs inability to meet the operational demand that is causing the problem.
Surely that's a MANAGEMENT failure to determine the level of demand and ensure they have enough adequately trained staff to deal with it ? Did they not have enough YEARS to work this one out ?
Actually, I KNOW it's a management failure. Either that or the management are calling their staff crap. I reckon I know who's more likely to be crap.
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GobonaStick
Don't quite know why BA is attracting all the vitriol. It doesn't operate the baggage system, or the car park, or the security barriers, or unlock the doors of T5 in the morning surely?
Don't quite know why BA is attracting all the vitriol. It doesn't operate the baggage system, or the car park, or the security barriers, or unlock the doors of T5 in the morning surely?
However it IS BA's responsibility to ensure that their supplier/sub-contractor (BAA) has things properly in hand.
Passing the buck simply isn't good enough.
I have little doubt PLENTY of BA staff KNEW it would be a fiasco. But BA management doesn't listen to the staff it seems. They live in their own secluded world.
There is a concept in Information Technology called "The Parallel Run". I don't think BA can have heard of it.
WHat it means is that you run the new system in parallel with the old system until you have assured yourself that the new system delivers what its supposed to.
Why the heck did BA switch a large chunk of its operations to a new and untested terminal with associated systems in one go?
Surely it would have been safer and far less disruptive, to have started with a few "real" flights and confirm that the wonderful systems worked as advertised, then gradually increase the load on T5 and reduce it elsewhere?
Oh of course! You need loads of staff to do it that way!
WHat it means is that you run the new system in parallel with the old system until you have assured yourself that the new system delivers what its supposed to.
Why the heck did BA switch a large chunk of its operations to a new and untested terminal with associated systems in one go?
Surely it would have been safer and far less disruptive, to have started with a few "real" flights and confirm that the wonderful systems worked as advertised, then gradually increase the load on T5 and reduce it elsewhere?
Oh of course! You need loads of staff to do it that way!
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take-off
I'm not in favour of nationalistion, but surely somethings should be run by Govt agencies, may not be any better but at least you could find someone to blame.
I'm not in favour of nationalistion, but surely somethings should be run by Govt agencies, may not be any better but at least you could find someone to blame.
Just read in another place ... a trip from London to Manchester by RAIL .... £300 ! Naturally he'll be going by car. Or even plane perhaps !
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Parapunter
Just been chatting with my buddy who's BAA I.T.
Evidently he reckons there's nothing wrong with the baggage system per se, but there is an issue with training here and there - few guys causing big problems hitting the wrong button at the wrong time
Just been chatting with my buddy who's BAA I.T.
Evidently he reckons there's nothing wrong with the baggage system per se, but there is an issue with training here and there - few guys causing big problems hitting the wrong button at the wrong time
but more pertinently, all the dry runs & tryouts are as nothing when compared with a big, networked multi node system gone live
There's a quote in the Guardian today from a baggage handler who says that because working conditions at T5 are so stressful at the moment, he's going to take a few days off sick. But I'm sure management are prepared for teething problems like this, no?
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SAME CIRCUS, JUST A DIFFERENT TENT.
I went through BNE Domestic at 10am on its first day in '84(?). Worked like clockwork. Also CDG on its first day (late 70s?). Even the French got it right.
Both managed with paper tickets and primitive computers.
I went through BNE Domestic at 10am on its first day in '84(?). Worked like clockwork. Also CDG on its first day (late 70s?). Even the French got it right.
Both managed with paper tickets and primitive computers.
Oh dear, oh dear - another own goal for ba.....
Or BAA? Or both??
Whatever, the CEOs should be forced to resign over this ridiculous affair.
Or BAA? Or both??
Whatever, the CEOs should be forced to resign over this ridiculous affair.
Thank God BA have pulled out of the regions & that we don't have to transit LHR. BA have lost all their regional punters who happily transit thro FRA, AMS & CDG. The Domestics to/from LHR chopped everytime there is a whiff of fear in the air.
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So Disappionted
My first post, and I can not believe it has to be this. 
When I left work late on Weds I was so excited. 34 aircraft had been put in place and the equipment move was well under way. Thank you to everyone who helped that night. Even the bus journey back to the staff car park was a joy for once as we drove past and saw all the tails in place ready for the next day. I couldn't wait to get back into work. Christmas had come early and I had a new train set to play with.
Walked back into utter chaos and instead of being peacefully asleep now, I'm sitting here watching the news feeling throughly ashamed and miserably disappointed.
My heart goes out to all the staff, they have tried to do their best with very little or no training under extreme pressure. My thanks to all at the Base. Sorry for dumping so many aircraft at you again, at such short notice, again. But most of all my extreme sorrow goes out to all passengers.
I only hope that we can get this
mess cleared up as quickly as possible, and that T5 will hopefully, one day be all that was promised and delivers all that you deserve.
When I left work late on Weds I was so excited. 34 aircraft had been put in place and the equipment move was well under way. Thank you to everyone who helped that night. Even the bus journey back to the staff car park was a joy for once as we drove past and saw all the tails in place ready for the next day. I couldn't wait to get back into work. Christmas had come early and I had a new train set to play with.
Walked back into utter chaos and instead of being peacefully asleep now, I'm sitting here watching the news feeling throughly ashamed and miserably disappointed.
My heart goes out to all the staff, they have tried to do their best with very little or no training under extreme pressure. My thanks to all at the Base. Sorry for dumping so many aircraft at you again, at such short notice, again. But most of all my extreme sorrow goes out to all passengers.
I only hope that we can get this
mess cleared up as quickly as possible, and that T5 will hopefully, one day be all that was promised and delivers all that you deserve.
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Chief executive Willie Walsh said: "I am very sorry that the problems have meant that some of our customers did not experience the true potential of this amazing new building.
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The Chairman of BA has been very noticable by his absence in all this.
Its him alone who has employed the top team and should be held accountable.
The guy Kirkwood was a complete arse during his interview.Just walking away without answering questions is unforgivable and downright rude.
Its him alone who has employed the top team and should be held accountable.
The guy Kirkwood was a complete arse during his interview.Just walking away without answering questions is unforgivable and downright rude.