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Old 30th Aug 2012, 05:13
  #4501 (permalink)  
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The problem is overnight stands. I would expect they would be used as soon as they were put in use, first come first served.
Thatís assuming that there is that much pent up demand from the airlines for new overnight stands from day one. It might be a long process to fill those stands. Stansted has plenty of spare capacity which is just sitting there.

Some of those spare stands are already available as Ocean Sky only occupies part of the South Apron. Maybe by the end of the year the whole southern apron will return to airline use but without the terminal extension and particularly the extra security lanes could those stands be used for night stoppers for another couple of years?

If all the 15 new stands are filled then it is likely to come from Easyjet or Ryanair moving some services from Stansted. Easyjet have already stated what they expect from an expanded Luton including more non-stop trains from London via East Midland Trains and the shuttle bus being made free again although if £1 or so was added to the train fare to pay for the shuttle no one would notice.

Also there were plans from the council to extend the new pier to the south apron, is that still the case or has that been dropped?

Last edited by LTNman; 30th Aug 2012 at 06:27.
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Old 30th Aug 2012, 05:49
  #4502 (permalink)  
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Not orange and not blue

By 2014, Monarch will have withdrawn: 4 x A300, 3 X 757 and 1 A320 (which is going this year). Taking into account they have a couple of new bases which will no doubt have based aircraft, I can not see how Monarch could expand its services or fleet at Luton? In fact if their goal is to reach a fleet of 40 aircraft, they will have to order another 16 aircraft!

Don't get me wrong because I would like to see Monarch double if not treble it's presence at Luton and offer more choices in holiday destinations (for summer schedules) which appears to be exclusive to both Gatwick and Manchester operations these days.
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Old 30th Aug 2012, 11:33
  #4503 (permalink)  
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A couple of comments on recent posts:

Overnight stands - I expect Wizz would love to have some of their aircraft overnight. At the moment they only have one overnighting but that is only in the peak of summer

Attracting new airlines - I think that you can forget Air Berlin since they joined the One World Alliance

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Old 30th Aug 2012, 11:50
  #4504 (permalink)  
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I think from memory the master plan was looking at an increase in pax of between 400/500k per annun up to 2025, with only about another 1m up to 2031. Also improvements to reflect demand, so not everything will happen at once but spread over the years. Improving the passenger experience in the terminal and access would seem to have a high priority.
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Old 30th Aug 2012, 11:58
  #4505 (permalink)  
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LTNman - difficult to add a pound to train fares to Luton Airport Parkway, without adding a similiar amount to train fares to Luton and/or Harpenden. If you don't, someone will pick up on it and it'll feed its way into the local press somehow.

Furthermore, on tickets purchased immediately before travel (as opposed to being booked months in advance), the principle of the further you travel, the more you pay is normal - break this principle and you start to get people doing strange things to save money.

The high prices charged at Stansted train station work only because it's a terminus station rather than being on the way to somewhere else.

Last edited by davidjohnson6; 30th Aug 2012 at 16:54.
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Old 30th Aug 2012, 12:55
  #4506 (permalink)  
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Monarch could base an additional one or two aircraft at LTN and just serve destinations they already serve from their other bases, such as Dubrovnik, Venice and Madiera.

If Wizz were to base aircraft and crew at LTN, they would probably have to pay the crew more than Eastern-Europe-based personnel, so there may not be a benefit to them. As it is, they are constantly adding to their 'first wave' arrivals (now 13 on most days), which takes advantage of the time difference between the UK and their destinations.

Thomas Cook are extremely unlikely to base aircraft anywhere new, as they are struggling financially, and reducing their fleet.

I agree that Air Berlin are unlikely - they have dramatically reduced UK operations, moved from STN to LGW, and joined OneWorld.

I suspect that the airport finance director won't want to attract too many 'struggling' airlines. However, there may be potential for European-based airlines to reduce their London costs by transferring one or two flights a day away from LHR, much as El Al has done. There would be some duplication, but I could see that being an attractive option for the likes of Alitalia, Aegean, Turkish, Air Portugal. Their only problem would be direct competition from EZY, which they don't suffer at LHR.

Of course there could be a wild card - a Middle East carrier looking to offer connections to the Indian sub-continent perhaps, or an airline using Gatwick such as Norwegian wanting to split their London flights and tap north and south markets separately (unlikely until the economy improves).

I quite like the idea of FlyBe transferring all or some of their London operations from LGW - I'm sure competition from EZY would be no more challenging at Luton than at Gatwick.

Ryanair are looking at taking a 25% stake in Stansted, so one wonders what effect that would have on their choice of London terminal - if it happens. They have operated the four based airframes for 7 years now with big changes in routes flown, but essentially no increase in the size of their operation. They probably want to keep a foothold at LTN to maintain a presence in the market, and keep STN management on their toes, although I can't see major growth from them unless EZY leave.

Finally, Thomson. They have slowly reduced seats from LTN from the heady days when they (as Britannia) had 10 or more aircraft based. Their market is in long-term decline, so the best we can expect is continuity.
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Old 30th Aug 2012, 14:23
  #4507 (permalink)  
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The development plans still show potential for a new twin tunnel under taxiway Delta/Foxtrot to Century Park - assume this would be part of a new A505 realinement south of the airport, proposals once talked about a few years ago?
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Old 30th Aug 2012, 15:16
  #4508 (permalink)  
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Any airport development from what I understand must still include access to Century Park!
Although unlikely in the current environment it hasn't been shelved and is still in the long term plans for Luton.
The tunnel appeared to be the only option then and still is.
Percival way was once looked at as being upgraded from the Holiday Inn roundabout all the way around past the cargo and long term car park but wasn't perceived as viable.
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Old 30th Aug 2012, 16:49
  #4509 (permalink)  
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I think you will find LGS that as well as the four based aircraft they operate quite a few ī`W`` patterns with aircraft based in Canaries, Gerona, Kaunas etc at less busy times which must suit both the airport and operator but whether they will base further aircraft that is another matter - all depends on price of course!
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Old 30th Aug 2012, 16:57
  #4510 (permalink)  
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The development plans still show potential for a new twin tunnel under taxiway Delta/Foxtrot to Century Park
Thought the tunnel was always planned to start in the mid term car park and come out beyond the long term car park.

Last edited by LTNman; 30th Aug 2012 at 16:57.
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Old 30th Aug 2012, 21:07
  #4511 (permalink)  
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Thanks to a PPRuNer I have been emailed a copy of the plan.

I note that only 5 extra stands will become contact stands. All the rest including the south stands will be bussed stands which the Low cost operators don't like as it slows down boarding.

On the Councils plans which have now been dropped there was going to be a new apron which had a pier and so did the south stands.

Last edited by LTNman; 30th Aug 2012 at 21:45.
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Old 31st Aug 2012, 05:40
  #4512 (permalink)  
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Just been counting the old and new stands. At the moment there are 35 stands for airline use including 3 on the south stands. This will increase to 44 stands excluding cargo, as the airport have included stands that will be used for FBO movements so the increase is 9 and not 15 as far as I can see.

The eastern apron though shows 8 stands at the moment and 8 stands in the future even though it will be made slightly wider so maybe the total of new stands will be 11 and not 9 as I think this apron is still being used as a 6 pack for now.
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Old 31st Aug 2012, 20:41
  #4513 (permalink)  
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I have been plodding through the differences between the original Abertis plans and the new joint plans with the council. Basically the new joint plans are based on the Abertis plan with a few of the councilís ideas thrown in. The differences I have found so far are as follows:

Construction of a multi-storey car park on part of the existing short-term car park (STCP), to provide additional parking capacity if passenger demand arises in the future.

Provision of a new taxiway parallel to Taxiway Delta.

A slight increase in the apron next to Signature ( stands 16 and 17) which will allow 4 stands to be created and not the original 3 stands planned.

The southern apron will be increased a little more than originally planned to allow 6 stands and not 5

The road layout in the CTA has been changed again with now a dedicated drop off area instead of dropping off in the short term car park.

What is surprising is that the potential Century Park access is from what is now part of the short term car park so all of the traffic for this large proposed industrial area will pass through the middle of the CTA.

The new pier will contain 7000sqm of floor space and not the 6000sqm first planned.

Even though the drawing shows the same additions to the entry and exit point to the runway the text has been changed from:

At the western end of the runway, the parallel taxiway will be extended by 300 metres and at the eastern end by 200 metres.

At the western end of the runway, the taxiway will be extended by 540 metres and at the eastern end by 340 metres.
So either the drawing is wrong or the text is wrong. With this additional length I would have thought the taxiway will be the full length of the runway.

Last edited by LTNman; 31st Aug 2012 at 20:46.
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Old 3rd Sep 2012, 09:32
  #4514 (permalink)  
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The revised Masterplan now on airport website available to download.
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Old 3rd Sep 2012, 16:50
  #4515 (permalink)  
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Noticed on Wiki, Air Blue have BHX & LTN rumoured to be starting in late 2012. Nothing on their website. Also a couple of tweets seen stating LTN will be via Istanbul. Do we take this as "a pinch of salt" or could there be some substance to this. Anyone heard anything ?
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Old 3rd Sep 2012, 16:51
  #4516 (permalink)  
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Air Blue

From Air Blue Twitter

"We can confirm that Airblue will be serving two new destinations to UK. First is Birmingham and second will be London Luton. The London Luton route will be served via Istanbul."

Good news for Luton

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Old 3rd Sep 2012, 17:50
  #4517 (permalink)  
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'Bout time someone served a route to the Subcontinent. The SWE Fly route obviously wasn't going to be a success.

Is there a reason why an airline can't operate a B762 on a direct route to possibly Mumbai or other Western Indian destinations plus Pakistan?
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Old 3rd Sep 2012, 17:58
  #4518 (permalink)  
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Danny - which airlines might be interested in offering a Luton-India B767 service, given there's such a large Indian community in West London ?
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Old 3rd Sep 2012, 18:10
  #4519 (permalink)  
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... there is a large Asian community of course in Luton. Not just that; it provides good healthy competition.
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Old 3rd Sep 2012, 18:48
  #4520 (permalink)  
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Ocean Sky has applied for planning permission to change the layout of the new stand next to stand 10 (west apron) on the main apron. In the original application which was approved, access to this new parking area was via stand 10 but the new arrangement is that access will be via taxiway echo.

As the revised stand is a different shape the hole that has been dug for the foundations will need to be worked on.

Better picture can be found here but not overnight

Last edited by LTNman; 3rd Sep 2012 at 22:24.
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