BIRMINGHAM - 4
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Qatar Airways
When are Qatar ever starting at BHX? Someone said on another forum that they are about to announce BHX as a destination. Any more news about that?
A news article regarding Air India's Amritsar-Toronto flight to resume soon (you should be able to find an article with that name), says the following:
So that's good news for people flying Air India and for people spotting planes at BHX.
What has come of Mahan Air's A340? They said they were going to lease an A340-300 to be used on the Tehran-Birmingham route. This is a good idea as an A340 is very much suited for that long a route and for Birmingham's runway.
Are Emirates going to start a third daily flight soon to BHX? If not, someone should suggest it to someone at the airport, hopefully it'll start in a couple of months because Emirates is doing extremely well at BHX.
A news article regarding Air India's Amritsar-Toronto flight to resume soon (you should be able to find an article with that name), says the following:
A memorandum submitted to Patel demanded that the Amritsar-London-Toronto flight be resumed immediately and new flights be introduced to Brimingham, New York and Vancouver to cater to the NRIs travelling to Amritsar from Europe, United Kingdom, United States and Canada.
What has come of Mahan Air's A340? They said they were going to lease an A340-300 to be used on the Tehran-Birmingham route. This is a good idea as an A340 is very much suited for that long a route and for Birmingham's runway.
Are Emirates going to start a third daily flight soon to BHX? If not, someone should suggest it to someone at the airport, hopefully it'll start in a couple of months because Emirates is doing extremely well at BHX.
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Emirates will add a 3rd service to BHX only after one is in place at MAN. If you look at the figures that Pete's posted every month, you have to factor in MAN was consistently 3000 to 5000 passengers per month ahead of BHX even before the A380 was placed onto one of MAN's services.
As it stands, EK haven't been using the 442 seat 77W at BHX for very long - they would need to see sustained loads using that prior to the next decision of A380 or 3rd daily. That's likely to be October next year at the earliest or more likely March 2012 (depends on fleet availability)
As it stands, EK haven't been using the 442 seat 77W at BHX for very long - they would need to see sustained loads using that prior to the next decision of A380 or 3rd daily. That's likely to be October next year at the earliest or more likely March 2012 (depends on fleet availability)
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Aa/ai/qr/ek
AA
There were rumours a few months back re 2011 but that was false and considering that Manchester is now just a daily 757 in summer after years as a 763 does not fill one with hope.
Also the last new transatlantic service bombed (US Air PHL) won't have helped.
AI
Politics, when it is on the apron I might just believe it.
QR
Who knows, however the Manchester service had a dip before recovering a little bit this year but still below the 2007 figures and you have to wonder if BHX or EDI will be considered until the economy picks up more. Although if a regional APD reduction is brought in it will no doubt help such services.
EK
The rumours persist re a third service but the figures show it is not needed yet. However as Ringwayman has said late 2011 or early 2012 it might happen.
Long-haul is the least of BHX's problems, it is more the lack of direct services to European capital cities (Rome, Madrid, Stockholm, Oslo, Helsinki, Budapest, Prague year-round, Vienna, Athens & Lisbon) or major tourist/cutural centres (Barcelona, Berlin, Venice, Sicily etc) that needs addressing.
Pete
There were rumours a few months back re 2011 but that was false and considering that Manchester is now just a daily 757 in summer after years as a 763 does not fill one with hope.
Also the last new transatlantic service bombed (US Air PHL) won't have helped.
AI
Politics, when it is on the apron I might just believe it.
QR
Who knows, however the Manchester service had a dip before recovering a little bit this year but still below the 2007 figures and you have to wonder if BHX or EDI will be considered until the economy picks up more. Although if a regional APD reduction is brought in it will no doubt help such services.
EK
The rumours persist re a third service but the figures show it is not needed yet. However as Ringwayman has said late 2011 or early 2012 it might happen.
Long-haul is the least of BHX's problems, it is more the lack of direct services to European capital cities (Rome, Madrid, Stockholm, Oslo, Helsinki, Budapest, Prague year-round, Vienna, Athens & Lisbon) or major tourist/cutural centres (Barcelona, Berlin, Venice, Sicily etc) that needs addressing.
Pete
Last edited by OltonPete; 31st Dec 2010 at 13:52. Reason: spelling
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2x weekly Lahore-Islamabad-Birmingham-Toronto
They should consider something like this in 2011.
They should consider something like this in 2011.
Also, Emirates should go three times daily next year, ahead of Manchester for once.
I've heard that Qatar Airways are close to announcing BHX as a destination, in 2011
I think EDI might get a QR flight first. BHX has PIA/EK/W5 for sub-continent and middle east connections, whilst all of scotlands are concentrated at GLA. With EK being at GLA, they wil add a second daily there before expanding to EDI, so its likely QR will tap into this gap in the market.
Demand for a Chicago-Birmingham flight using American Airlines seems to be quite high,
I think BHX is too close to AA's Fortress Heathrow to make it work, especially if ORD gets a shuttle service the same as JFK.
that Manchester is now just a daily 757 in summer after years as a 763 does not fill one with hope
I'm not fully sure if Air India should operate 5 flights per day, that's a lot, it should just be a once or twice daily to start with, because demand is absolutely there (you should have heard about the campaign and petition earlier this year).
Rome, Madrid, Stockholm, Oslo, Helsinki, Budapest, Prague year-round, Vienna, Athens & Lisbon
As for Madrid, hopefully once the BA/IB merger is fully incoroporated, IB might open the likes of MAN/BHX/GLA/EDI for a 'shuttle' type service similar to the MAN/GLA/EDI-LHR shuttles.
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I wonder if Birmingham have ever suggested Air China using A330's. Air China previously visited BHX for a VIP visit during 2006, using a 747 also. The only concerns about this route are:
* runway length
* pax
* demand
* profitability
* fuel
A story earlier this month called 'Amritsar-Toronto flight to resume soon' mentions something about new routes being introduced to Birmingham.
Qatar & Etihad may be an issue competing with Emirates and Manchester & Heathrow. PIA could make their ISB-BHX flight daily (if the pax are good) because nothing exciting about that route is going on right now.
The international pier is usually not full, unlike Manchester and Heathrow and other airports. We need a lot more international flights along with domestic flights to fill up the stands because it's not nice seeing it empty.
I don't get why they didn't extend the runway years ago, if it was done, BHX would have a third terminal by now.
* runway length
* pax
* demand
* profitability
* fuel
A story earlier this month called 'Amritsar-Toronto flight to resume soon' mentions something about new routes being introduced to Birmingham.
Qatar & Etihad may be an issue competing with Emirates and Manchester & Heathrow. PIA could make their ISB-BHX flight daily (if the pax are good) because nothing exciting about that route is going on right now.
The international pier is usually not full, unlike Manchester and Heathrow and other airports. We need a lot more international flights along with domestic flights to fill up the stands because it's not nice seeing it empty.
I don't get why they didn't extend the runway years ago, if it was done, BHX would have a third terminal by now.
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I wonder if Birmingham have ever suggested Air China using A330's. Air China previously visited BHX for a VIP visit during 2006, using a 747 also. The only concerns about this route are:
* runway length
* pax
* demand
* profitability
* fuel
* runway length
* pax
* demand
* profitability
* fuel
PIA could make their ISB-BHX flight daily
I don't get why they didn't extend the runway years ago, if it was done, BHX would have a third terminal by now.
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January 2011
The usual round of frequency reductions in January on some routes
including BMI Baby suspending Alicante (a first since the base opened)
until April and Prague again until February half-term.
G-TOYF BMI Baby departed 17.32 today became the first schedule flight
by the airline from BHX to Belfast City.
However there is a capacity boost from today, as the Lufthansa
Munich service changed to the EMB195, which per the LH site is
116 seats compared to the 86 seat CRJ900.
The real benefit won't happen until Monday 10/01/11 when the route
reverts back to three daily in the week, as it appears the morning service LH2508/9 is not operating next week.
A small change but an increase in available seats nevertheless.
I have still not seen the summer Lufthansa schedule for Frankfurt
with the BMI A320 times.
Pete
including BMI Baby suspending Alicante (a first since the base opened)
until April and Prague again until February half-term.
G-TOYF BMI Baby departed 17.32 today became the first schedule flight
by the airline from BHX to Belfast City.
However there is a capacity boost from today, as the Lufthansa
Munich service changed to the EMB195, which per the LH site is
116 seats compared to the 86 seat CRJ900.
The real benefit won't happen until Monday 10/01/11 when the route
reverts back to three daily in the week, as it appears the morning service LH2508/9 is not operating next week.
A small change but an increase in available seats nevertheless.
I have still not seen the summer Lufthansa schedule for Frankfurt
with the BMI A320 times.
Pete
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Government Backing For BHX Expansion
Consternation on the Manchester thread as they belatedly realise the Government has accepted the logic of using Birmingham as an overflow airport for the South East.
Excellent idea of course!
As they have kindly put up a link to e-mail Theresa Villiers, the Minister of State for Transport, I think I'll just send off a message of support.
Excellent idea of course!
As they have kindly put up a link to e-mail Theresa Villiers, the Minister of State for Transport, I think I'll just send off a message of support.
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Alvechurch
Reading the latest doom and gloom on this thread about Birmingham -
I send you my warmest regards and wish you every success if/when this
plan materialises?
MM
Reading the latest doom and gloom on this thread about Birmingham -
I send you my warmest regards and wish you every success if/when this
plan materialises?
MM
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If it all goes ahead, what additional facilities will need to be built at BHX with reference to all aviation-related expansion of facilities being frowned upon as being costly and environmentally unfriendly, or would it all be able to be undertaken with minimal expansion?
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Ringwayman,
Would suggest outside of the runway expansion not a lot. Any uptake of routes would surely be only minimal, I posted on your good airports thread this reads nothing more to me than the government trying to push people in the M40 corridor and North London toward BHX rather than being reliant on the South Easts airports. For it to work the airlines would have to brought into the concept, something I'm just not sure will happen, why leave the tried and tested for the 'doom and gloom' as Mickeyman puts it. To be fair the last few pages of this thread does suggest BHX is the airport equivalent of the Liverpool football team.....
Would suggest outside of the runway expansion not a lot. Any uptake of routes would surely be only minimal, I posted on your good airports thread this reads nothing more to me than the government trying to push people in the M40 corridor and North London toward BHX rather than being reliant on the South Easts airports. For it to work the airlines would have to brought into the concept, something I'm just not sure will happen, why leave the tried and tested for the 'doom and gloom' as Mickeyman puts it. To be fair the last few pages of this thread does suggest BHX is the airport equivalent of the Liverpool football team.....
I'll repeat what I wrote on the White paper forum
As in previous posts I'll repeat myself again by reminding everyone that the infrastructure needs upgrading not the 'Tie Rack'
What airlines would want to operate into BHX anyway? Air Malta and Cyprus Airways are pulling out so BHX soon so they will loose 2 national carriers.
You can't force airlines to operate into an airport especially if the route isn't going to be viable. Brum has tried and tested many short haul routes over the years, and there have been some dummy airlines wanting to start up from Brum along with a few paper airlines. They're still waiting to see if Armenia will eventually start a route after all the fanfare last year. Air India were petitioned with God knows how many signatures for a restart. They were also wined and dined with promises made. It seem to me that too much money is being spent on 'tea and biscuits' trying to entice airlines into BHX
You can't force airlines to operate into an airport especially if the route isn't going to be viable. Brum has tried and tested many short haul routes over the years, and there have been some dummy airlines wanting to start up from Brum along with a few paper airlines. They're still waiting to see if Armenia will eventually start a route after all the fanfare last year. Air India were petitioned with God knows how many signatures for a restart. They were also wined and dined with promises made. It seem to me that too much money is being spent on 'tea and biscuits' trying to entice airlines into BHX
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Crewmeal,
That's the point though, at present BHX is largely reliant on the West Mids for it's catchment, given this fact it is doing very well, better than any other English airport in the same position by a long stretch. If the plan behind this is to entice passengers from the South East to BHX then clearly we have a much bigger catchment area with which to play with, BHX would cease to be a regional airport it would become a gateway. In realistic terms though who outside of the M40 corridor or North London would consider it? Let's have it right if you live near the Northen Line, BHX is easier to get to than any London airport, swap the tube for the mainline at Euston and you're pretty much there. Getting the airlines to cater for them is a different matter, it's the chicken and egg scenairo....
That's the point though, at present BHX is largely reliant on the West Mids for it's catchment, given this fact it is doing very well, better than any other English airport in the same position by a long stretch. If the plan behind this is to entice passengers from the South East to BHX then clearly we have a much bigger catchment area with which to play with, BHX would cease to be a regional airport it would become a gateway. In realistic terms though who outside of the M40 corridor or North London would consider it? Let's have it right if you live near the Northen Line, BHX is easier to get to than any London airport, swap the tube for the mainline at Euston and you're pretty much there. Getting the airlines to cater for them is a different matter, it's the chicken and egg scenairo....
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They only need to stop at MAN en-route to JFK purely as a customs formality, then it runs JFK-LHE non stop on the way back.
realise the Government has accepted the logic of using Birmingham as an overflow airport for the South East.
Excellent idea of course!
Excellent idea of course!
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Mickyman
Thanks for your regards, mind you our 'doom and gloom' might have been a little overdone as I notice that Manchester has lost more passengers in percentage terms in the last 12 months than Birmingham.
The Birmingham CEO has stated that the BHX existing Terminal capacity can cope with another 8-9 million before any expansion is required.
It's probable that work on the runway extension will start next year.
Thanks for your regards, mind you our 'doom and gloom' might have been a little overdone as I notice that Manchester has lost more passengers in percentage terms in the last 12 months than Birmingham.
The Birmingham CEO has stated that the BHX existing Terminal capacity can cope with another 8-9 million before any expansion is required.
It's probable that work on the runway extension will start next year.
Given that this Govt is taxing everything to the hilt, how much extra would a trip to BHX from the SE cost? We all know that the Paul Kehoe has stated that when HS2 is launched that BHX will be the 3rd runway but how much will a trip on this route add to a journey? BHX is being p****d about with Ryanair, baby don't know if they are coming or going and 2 easy routes to Switzerland don't encourage the lowcost market either. Monarch only cater for the sunspots of Europe and Egypt. Not a good recipe for short haul routes me thinks. Regarding long haul I can't see any major expansion at all. EK and CO may increase their frequencies in future, but China, LA, JNB, CPT? no way. The market from BHX is just not there.
At a time when VAT goes up tomorrow plus the usual round of rip off train fare increases plus the cost of petrol, this Govt will price transport costs out of existence
At a time when VAT goes up tomorrow plus the usual round of rip off train fare increases plus the cost of petrol, this Govt will price transport costs out of existence
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However MAN is now back on the upward swing. Can the same be said of BHX?
The problem that BHX and MAN will have is the willingness of some airlines to "allow" passengers go from airports other than LHR. Sometimes it would appear that departments within the same airline need to talk to each other (was not totally surprised to read on another forum that when BD did their transatlantic routes ex-MAN, their website did not show the MAN option 1st but had the UA options ex-LHR listed above them. That's a bit of a handicap to overcome! Nor can we forget the "gloating" that someone said on another forum that BA's sales team were doing their job in directing passengers away from MAN-JFK onto LHR-JFK). Until that mindset and those individuals cease to be related to the aviation industry, then no amount of airports persuading airlines about alternative British markets will lead to any changes being undertaken.
The problem that BHX and MAN will have is the willingness of some airlines to "allow" passengers go from airports other than LHR. Sometimes it would appear that departments within the same airline need to talk to each other (was not totally surprised to read on another forum that when BD did their transatlantic routes ex-MAN, their website did not show the MAN option 1st but had the UA options ex-LHR listed above them. That's a bit of a handicap to overcome! Nor can we forget the "gloating" that someone said on another forum that BA's sales team were doing their job in directing passengers away from MAN-JFK onto LHR-JFK). Until that mindset and those individuals cease to be related to the aviation industry, then no amount of airports persuading airlines about alternative British markets will lead to any changes being undertaken.
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Ryanair 2011
Krakow - day/time changes
Porto - day/time changes - expected to be Porto based
Malta - at the monement no plans to operate next summer but this may change. The route has poor loads.
Porto - day/time changes - expected to be Porto based
Malta - at the monement no plans to operate next summer but this may change. The route has poor loads.
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Malta
Jamie2k9
Where are you getting your figures from? The route only started mid December and the CAA won't be publishing the figures for another two weeks.
I know fares are a bit soft in January but is this not the case for most routes?
I can't believe that any airline can analyse a route which only started in mid December against long-standing airline (Air Malta) and compare it to the following summer when there will be no competition.
Something somewhere does not add up.
It is a bit late to release late March seats but at present the total BHX-MLA market in summer 2011 will see just one Thomson flight and that was not even a 757 in 2010!!!!!!
Pete
Where are you getting your figures from? The route only started mid December and the CAA won't be publishing the figures for another two weeks.
I know fares are a bit soft in January but is this not the case for most routes?
I can't believe that any airline can analyse a route which only started in mid December against long-standing airline (Air Malta) and compare it to the following summer when there will be no competition.
Something somewhere does not add up.
It is a bit late to release late March seats but at present the total BHX-MLA market in summer 2011 will see just one Thomson flight and that was not even a 757 in 2010!!!!!!
Pete
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It's not too late to release seats for the end of March. A lot of FR routes have yet to be loaded.
The route is only to fill the gap of the Malta and BHX based aircraft. If Ryanair wanted the route to work they would keep it next summer and if the route isn't very profitible then FR will drop it.
The route is only to fill the gap of the Malta and BHX based aircraft. If Ryanair wanted the route to work they would keep it next summer and if the route isn't very profitible then FR will drop it.