Jet2 - 3
Join Date: Mar 2007
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Mr @ Spotty M,
You are right, they don't just get ETOPS, infact we have to satisfy the following criteria:
Approval for ETOPS
ETOPS approval is a two-step process. Firstly: the airframe and engine combination must satisfy the basic ETOPS requirements during its type certification. This is called ETOPS type approval. Such tests may include shutting down an engine and flying the remaining engine during the complete diversion time. Often such tests are performed in the middle of the oceans. It must be demonstrated that, during the diversion flight, the flight crew is not unduly burdened by extra workload due to the lost engine and that the probability of the remaining engine failing is extremely remote. For example, if an aircraft is rated for ETOPS-180, it means that it should be able to fly with full load and just one engine for 3 hours.
Secondly: An operator who conducts ETOPS flights must satisfy his own country's aviation regulators about his ability to conduct ETOPS flights. This is called ETOPS operational certification and involves compliance with additional special engineering and flight crew procedures on top of the normal engineering and flight procedures. Pilots and engineering staff must be qualified and trained for ETOPS. An airline with extensive experience operating long distance flights may be awarded ETOPS operational approval immediately, others may need to demonstrate ability through a series of ETOPS proving flights.
Regulators closely watch the ETOPS performance of both type certificate holders and their affiliated airlines. Any technical incidents during an ETOPS flight must be recorded. From the data collected , the reliability of the particular airframe-engine combination is measured and statistics published. The figures must be within limits of type certifications. Of course, the figures required for ETOPS-180 will always be more stringent than ETOPS-120. Unsatisfactory figures would lead to a downgrade, or worse, suspension of ETOPS capabilities either for the type certificate holder or the airline.
As I stated in my earlier post, the ETOPS approval isn't so we can do 4 flights to New York. It will be used as another revenue channel as and when required. We are and do get asked to fly ETOP routes, which without the approval we can not do - consequently turning down lucrative contracts.
I would imagine the approval will open many more doors for Jet2, yes an expensive exercise, but hopefully in the long run with the extremely pro-active charter department at the helm - a lucrative one!
You are right, they don't just get ETOPS, infact we have to satisfy the following criteria:
Approval for ETOPS
ETOPS approval is a two-step process. Firstly: the airframe and engine combination must satisfy the basic ETOPS requirements during its type certification. This is called ETOPS type approval. Such tests may include shutting down an engine and flying the remaining engine during the complete diversion time. Often such tests are performed in the middle of the oceans. It must be demonstrated that, during the diversion flight, the flight crew is not unduly burdened by extra workload due to the lost engine and that the probability of the remaining engine failing is extremely remote. For example, if an aircraft is rated for ETOPS-180, it means that it should be able to fly with full load and just one engine for 3 hours.
Secondly: An operator who conducts ETOPS flights must satisfy his own country's aviation regulators about his ability to conduct ETOPS flights. This is called ETOPS operational certification and involves compliance with additional special engineering and flight crew procedures on top of the normal engineering and flight procedures. Pilots and engineering staff must be qualified and trained for ETOPS. An airline with extensive experience operating long distance flights may be awarded ETOPS operational approval immediately, others may need to demonstrate ability through a series of ETOPS proving flights.
Regulators closely watch the ETOPS performance of both type certificate holders and their affiliated airlines. Any technical incidents during an ETOPS flight must be recorded. From the data collected , the reliability of the particular airframe-engine combination is measured and statistics published. The figures must be within limits of type certifications. Of course, the figures required for ETOPS-180 will always be more stringent than ETOPS-120. Unsatisfactory figures would lead to a downgrade, or worse, suspension of ETOPS capabilities either for the type certificate holder or the airline.
As I stated in my earlier post, the ETOPS approval isn't so we can do 4 flights to New York. It will be used as another revenue channel as and when required. We are and do get asked to fly ETOP routes, which without the approval we can not do - consequently turning down lucrative contracts.
I would imagine the approval will open many more doors for Jet2, yes an expensive exercise, but hopefully in the long run with the extremely pro-active charter department at the helm - a lucrative one!
Join Date: Oct 2004
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Without out sourcing their management services and engineering to a decent outfit the chances of jet 2 obtaining ETOPS approval are slim to say the least.
Last edited by smudgethecat; 1st Oct 2008 at 16:27.
Join Date: Mar 2007
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Without out sourcing you management services and engineering to a decent outfit the chances of jet 2 obtaining ETOPS approval are slim to say the least.
An exciting company to work for at the moment, lots of variation such as charters etc.... so I for one am enjoying flying Jet2's aircraft. Long may it continue!!!!
Join Date: Jan 2000
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Those of you knocking RYR's alternative airports like GRO, NRN, BVA etc etc have no idea.
Apart from the obvious cost savings they offer, they have small, modern terminals that you can pass through in a fraction of the time it takes to get through the majors. the whole experience is so much easier and quicker.
You are also much more likely to meet up with any baggage etc you have checked in, and in half of the time there as well.
If you travel on one of the bus services they are easy to find and run in line with the aircraft schedules. car hire is normaly cheap, easy to find, and the roads in and out easily navigated.
Traveling as SLF through a large airport is a nightmare these days, even if you are a seasoned traveller.
I was down in GRO a few weeks ago, The road signs say Barcelona Gerona Airport, so I guess you need to tell the Spanish they don't know where Barcelona is!
Apart from the obvious cost savings they offer, they have small, modern terminals that you can pass through in a fraction of the time it takes to get through the majors. the whole experience is so much easier and quicker.
You are also much more likely to meet up with any baggage etc you have checked in, and in half of the time there as well.
If you travel on one of the bus services they are easy to find and run in line with the aircraft schedules. car hire is normaly cheap, easy to find, and the roads in and out easily navigated.
Traveling as SLF through a large airport is a nightmare these days, even if you are a seasoned traveller.
I was down in GRO a few weeks ago, The road signs say Barcelona Gerona Airport, so I guess you need to tell the Spanish they don't know where Barcelona is!
Join Date: Aug 2000
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"CAT1 REVERSION", l am not knocking your company, l am just trying to point out you did not need to arrange 4 flights to NYC to get your ETOPS approval.
You could have applied for it and when approved started to sell your product for those longhaul charters that are out there.
I know once the flights were set up it was the kick that was needed to get the ball rolling for ETOPS approval and the winglet mod on "AB".
You have been operating proving flights on your TFS type routes with the CAA if l am correct.
Yes l agree the 4 flights were all that was planned but they have not gone that well in the market and so that is it for know.
You could have applied for it and when approved started to sell your product for those longhaul charters that are out there.
I know once the flights were set up it was the kick that was needed to get the ball rolling for ETOPS approval and the winglet mod on "AB".
You have been operating proving flights on your TFS type routes with the CAA if l am correct.
Yes l agree the 4 flights were all that was planned but they have not gone that well in the market and so that is it for know.
Join Date: Dec 2005
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"By my argument Leeds, Manchester and Sheffield are not the same place at all. They're in close proximity though, and very simply, that's the point. They're close to each other."
Thanks Harrogate (or should I in the spirit of FR call you 'York'?).
I wonder how FR will market LBIA abroad? Manchester (Leeds Bradford) perhaps? They might even go for Newcastle-Teesside-Doncaster-Sheffield-Barnsley-Liverpool-Manchester-Woodford-Humberside-Leeds-Bradford in order to catch the market for the whole of the North of England. At least with Jet2.com you know with a reasonable degree of certainty where the crew intends to take you
Thanks Harrogate (or should I in the spirit of FR call you 'York'?).
I wonder how FR will market LBIA abroad? Manchester (Leeds Bradford) perhaps? They might even go for Newcastle-Teesside-Doncaster-Sheffield-Barnsley-Liverpool-Manchester-Woodford-Humberside-Leeds-Bradford in order to catch the market for the whole of the North of England. At least with Jet2.com you know with a reasonable degree of certainty where the crew intends to take you
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They'll likely big up the general Yorkshire thing if they were to push it abroad. But then the airport and their partners do that themselves already. The 'York to Mayorka' promo on the LBIA homepage is proof enough of that.
I imagine 'Leeds/Bradford' suits Ryanair fine. It already names two places.
I imagine 'Leeds/Bradford' suits Ryanair fine. It already names two places.
Join Date: Mar 2007
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"CAT1 REVERSION", l am not knocking your company,
Fully agree with what you have said. I beleive that the NY flights were always designed as a target and test bed. Having said that, as you point out, they haven't sold too well - hence company employees being offered discounted fares!!!
Now upto the commercial department and beancounters to sell the capability once/if approved.!!
Join Date: Aug 2007
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Newquay - fabulous! Better get some practice on good old St Mawgan's 9000ft wide and 300ft long runway. Quite similar to LBA in many ways now I come to think of it - but with the added fun of being tempted to flare while still 50 feet up.
Join Date: Feb 2004
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Newcastle doesn't seem to appear in any of the latest spate of new route announcements this week.
Is anything else in prospect?....Cork confirmed for summer 09 but reduced to 2 per week..Fri and Sun
Is anything else in prospect?....Cork confirmed for summer 09 but reduced to 2 per week..Fri and Sun