IRELAND WEST AIRPORT KNOCK
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Great news about the new routes, I think Brian is right, most of the demand at Knock is either family/emigration related travel into the UK or sun routes. I would guess that the longer term success or otherwise of the Barcelona route would have a bearing on whether there is any potential for other city routes.
One other thing I was thinking about though...Knock must be one of the biggest airports in the UK and Ireland not to have a well timed connecting flight through a major European hub (I wouldn't class Dublin as one of these, and the Gatwick flights are largely useless for onward travel). The slot restrictions in Heathrow make that a non-starter, but given the success KLM has had at regional airports all over the UK, should efforts not be made to entice them to Knock to run connecting flights into their long haul network. A morning flight out of Knock, similar to what they operate out of Hull, Norwich, Cardiff, Durham etc. would open up a massive route choice from the airport - and I would guess that the population base would easily exist in the west/north-west to sustain it?
One other thing I was thinking about though...Knock must be one of the biggest airports in the UK and Ireland not to have a well timed connecting flight through a major European hub (I wouldn't class Dublin as one of these, and the Gatwick flights are largely useless for onward travel). The slot restrictions in Heathrow make that a non-starter, but given the success KLM has had at regional airports all over the UK, should efforts not be made to entice them to Knock to run connecting flights into their long haul network. A morning flight out of Knock, similar to what they operate out of Hull, Norwich, Cardiff, Durham etc. would open up a massive route choice from the airport - and I would guess that the population base would easily exist in the west/north-west to sustain it?
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Something like that with a night-stopping/based Fokker 70 could work well. The history of KLM in the UK is actually quite interesting. What today operates to AMS is the remains of AirUK (some of it was sold off to Ryanair as Buzz, other parts were shut down). The crews are mainly UK based and operate four sectors each day. Something like LBA-AMS-MXP-AMS-LBA, for example. KLM is much better known in the UK than in Ireland and they don't even serve Dublin, preferring instead to codeshare with Aer Lingus. SNN with it's connections to LHR, CDG, NYC and BOS is relatively close.
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Knock 25 years young.
It's something that Knock Marketing should talk to them about as they would face no competition. However the yield would have to be good. It would connect Knock to one of the crossroads of the World. The other option would be City Jet to CDG but somehow the connectivity there doesn't suit the Irish Market as much as LHR or SPL. Maybe a based EI plane might Work. NOC AMS NOC LGW NOC with a variety of evening departures to complete the roster.
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This is an interesting article from a few years back:
Western People - 2003/12/24: Knock airport is flying high as passenger numbers soar
It is easy to forget that as recently as seven years ago the airport was still seen as a white elephant in the bog and had only three scheduled international routes (Stansted, Birmingham and Manchester) in comparison to the 15 that are lined up for next year to date. (I say to date because I am still hopeful of something to Edinburgh - its been rumoured for some time now)
Western People - 2003/12/24: Knock airport is flying high as passenger numbers soar
It is easy to forget that as recently as seven years ago the airport was still seen as a white elephant in the bog and had only three scheduled international routes (Stansted, Birmingham and Manchester) in comparison to the 15 that are lined up for next year to date. (I say to date because I am still hopeful of something to Edinburgh - its been rumoured for some time now)
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Yes I agree Knock should develop a hub link to one of the major European or UK airports, to do this it will need support of all the regional industries and business people and a strong government backing to convince one of the mainstream airlines to base an aircraft there and start up the route. Look at Shannon it has 3 Heathrow services/daily, half full at best, but secured them on the back of a strong local lobby and government pressure on EI after they moved the base to Belfast. One of these could be relocated out of Knock if there is enough pressure put on EI and regional support.
Also keep watching the EDI space, this airport will secure a scottish route, as there is proven demand on these routes
Also keep watching the EDI space, this airport will secure a scottish route, as there is proven demand on these routes
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@Mayfly1
If the pressure you are referring to is political, you can forget it. The days of AL responding to TD pleas is over. Mr Mueller won't be bending to that kind of parish pump carry on.
If the pressure you are referring to is political, you can forget it. The days of AL responding to TD pleas is over. Mr Mueller won't be bending to that kind of parish pump carry on.
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@Mayfly1
If the pressure you are referring to is political, you can forget it. The days of AL responding to TD pleas is over. Mr Mueller won't be bending to that kind of parish pump carry on.
If the pressure you are referring to is political, you can forget it. The days of AL responding to TD pleas is over. Mr Mueller won't be bending to that kind of parish pump carry on.
But I agree with Mayfly that the support of the business community is important in securing a good hub connection, and research from the many medical and pharmaceutical industries based in the West on the business case would be welcome, I hope the airport are putting effort into this.
I know of one Mayo base multinational who have a travel policy of booking the GWY-LTN service (despite poor road connections) because of the frequency and timings are more suited to business travel and connecting to LHR.
FR schedules rarely suit business commuters and EI LGW isn't the best with the afternoon slot, nor is it a business hub. AMS would offer fantastic opportunities, and I believe there would also be a big market for inbound tourism on such a route if marketed well.
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Mayfly1, it won't happen. SNN-LHR averages 80% plus. This information is available on the CAA website. Having one flight would be pretty pointless- you'd need all three for connections purposes- and NOC-LHR would only achieve, half full at best. 
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The airport management have, I think, always been pragmatic and realistic about what kind of services they can get in. Heathrow on an A320 would be great but just doesn't seem likely at the present time. Something like a based E190 or a Fokker 70 to AMS would be more achievable capacity wise and would be able to benefit from more suitable slot availability at AMS.
I seem to remember Aer Arann running flights fromn GWY to AMS at one point, but I think they were point to point and didn't codeshare or tie in with KLM's operations there, connectivity with other flights would obviously be a must for such a route to succeed.
I wonder will the the tax reduction to €3 bring any more flights to the airport, Ryanair's initial response (perhaps unsurprisingly) suggests that it won't be enough for them to dive head first back into the Irish market but, given their ongoing disputes with the DAA, Knock might be in a position to benefit if they did decide to add any capacity. I would guess that with the development fee firmly in place at the airport, landing charges for Ryanair must be minimal compared to what DUB, SNN and CRK would be looking for.
I seem to remember Aer Arann running flights fromn GWY to AMS at one point, but I think they were point to point and didn't codeshare or tie in with KLM's operations there, connectivity with other flights would obviously be a must for such a route to succeed.
I wonder will the the tax reduction to €3 bring any more flights to the airport, Ryanair's initial response (perhaps unsurprisingly) suggests that it won't be enough for them to dive head first back into the Irish market but, given their ongoing disputes with the DAA, Knock might be in a position to benefit if they did decide to add any capacity. I would guess that with the development fee firmly in place at the airport, landing charges for Ryanair must be minimal compared to what DUB, SNN and CRK would be looking for.
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Concorde Travel will only have 6 flights between Knock - Dubrovnik between May - September.
Although it was Split last year and they went via Dublin it is still a small reduction.
Flights between Knock - Zurich have being dropped for summer 2011. They will now be direct from SNN. Knock airport website says it is returning but it's not.
Irland - Balsam für die Seele | falcontravel.ch
Although it was Split last year and they went via Dublin it is still a small reduction.
Flights between Knock - Zurich have being dropped for summer 2011. They will now be direct from SNN. Knock airport website says it is returning but it's not.
Irland - Balsam für die Seele | falcontravel.ch
Last edited by Jamie2k9; 11th Dec 2010 at 20:02.
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Ya must be looking at different stats the the EI shn Heathrow than I'm looking at! Agree a smaller jet service to a main European hub would work better. Heathrow is so congested at this stage it takes hours to get in and out, not to mention the miles they make you walk in T1 to and from your plane
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Ya must be looking at different stats the the EI shn Heathrow than I'm looking at!
Heathrow is so congested at this stage it takes hours to get in and out, not to mention the miles they make you walk in T1 to and from your plane
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Loads
MayFly. Love to see your backup stats too. Are they actual flown seats or seats booked I.e. Volcanic Ash less seats actually filled. A F70 would never ever work from Knock especially since AF had an EMB145 from SNN that was 80%+ full with a bigger catchment area. Pity the culprits in SAA persuaded Cityjet to up it to an AVRO which killed the route.
Jeez....LHR's a big place, but claiming you have to walk "miles" suggests to me you go lost. I happily travel through it and many other UK Airports in less than 30 minutes (and often as a transfer passenger).
Anyway:
The CAA stats for November state 20,028 travelled EGLL to EINN. I'll let you lot work out load factor etc.
Cheers!
Anyway:
The CAA stats for November state 20,028 travelled EGLL to EINN. I'll let you lot work out load factor etc.
Cheers!
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So where did you pull those stats from exactly? I'd love to hear more about them.
Table: Air Passenger Movement (Number) by Irish Airport, Foreign Airport, Month and Direction
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There seems to be something of a wintry blast heading for Mayo, possibility of Knock (and other Irish airports) being closed in the coming days.
Bannercounty that AF flight would have had much more competition at SNN than a F70 would have at Knock, that needs to be factored in as well as catchment area.
Bannercounty that AF flight would have had much more competition at SNN than a F70 would have at Knock, that needs to be factored in as well as catchment area.
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New airline for NOC
EDI is bookable at Flybe.com.
3 x weekly Q400, hopefully that will grow with positive numbers.
First venture south of the border by Flybe for a few years, other than DUB-SOU/EXT. Good to see another brand coming in.
Flybe also have announced investment by George Soros today and a new strategy to feed AF/KLM codeshare hubs, hopefully this is the beginning of a relationship with NOC that could lead to the previously discussed hub connection, they have the right aircraft mix in the Q400/EMB195/175.
3 x weekly Q400, hopefully that will grow with positive numbers.
First venture south of the border by Flybe for a few years, other than DUB-SOU/EXT. Good to see another brand coming in.
Flybe also have announced investment by George Soros today and a new strategy to feed AF/KLM codeshare hubs, hopefully this is the beginning of a relationship with NOC that could lead to the previously discussed hub connection, they have the right aircraft mix in the Q400/EMB195/175.
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Brilliant.
I knew edinburgh was on the way but thought it was ryanair ,Fantastic to have flybe at noc and will maybe provide the airport with hub access with the new airfrance codeshare deal.
the dh400 makes much more sense than a 737 800 in terms of passenger numbers.
The airport just needs to highlight flybe as much as possible so as to create brand awareness.
Well done to all at knock
I knew edinburgh was on the way but thought it was ryanair ,Fantastic to have flybe at noc and will maybe provide the airport with hub access with the new airfrance codeshare deal.
the dh400 makes much more sense than a 737 800 in terms of passenger numbers.
The airport just needs to highlight flybe as much as possible so as to create brand awareness.
Well done to all at knock