EDINBURGH
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Edinburgh
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if any of the middle eastern airlines (minus Emirates) came to Edinburgh, then I would be extremely happy.
Emirates already have a chokehold on Scotland with their Glasgow route. Any competition would be great. At least for passengers.
Emirates already have a chokehold on Scotland with their Glasgow route. Any competition would be great. At least for passengers.
Join Date: May 2000
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Glasgow is just along the road.
Taunts and jibes are best ignored. Concentrating on the forum subject, ignoring hecklers, would be good?
Taunts and jibes are best ignored. Concentrating on the forum subject, ignoring hecklers, would be good?
Last edited by Joe Curry; 2nd Nov 2010 at 18:53. Reason: format
Join Date: May 2000
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According to this:
Aircargo Asia Pacific - Edinburgh seeks Middle East connection
....He said the airport is hoping attract either Etihad Airways (hubbing at Abu Dhabi), Gulf Air (hubbing at Bahrain or Muscat) or Qatar Airways (Doha)....
Aircargo Asia Pacific - Edinburgh seeks Middle East connection
....He said the airport is hoping attract either Etihad Airways (hubbing at Abu Dhabi), Gulf Air (hubbing at Bahrain or Muscat) or Qatar Airways (Doha)....
Join Date: Feb 2010
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I personally can see Qatar Airways serving EDI.
They used EDI for a divert during the ash chaos, and I personally think their business model suits EDI more.
On the other hand, Etihad growth in the UK has been quite stagnant. They pulled LGW and the only 'major' growth from EY recently has been switching MAN equipment from the A332 to the B773, so, could it be about time to open a new UK port?
Cant see Gulf Air comming, they have shrunk a heck of a lot on the international scale, and the UK outside of LHR has never really interested them.
They used EDI for a divert during the ash chaos, and I personally think their business model suits EDI more.
On the other hand, Etihad growth in the UK has been quite stagnant. They pulled LGW and the only 'major' growth from EY recently has been switching MAN equipment from the A332 to the B773, so, could it be about time to open a new UK port?
Cant see Gulf Air comming, they have shrunk a heck of a lot on the international scale, and the UK outside of LHR has never really interested them.
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This one is over the top:
"which fly non-stop from the city to Asia, Australia and the Middle East".
Edinburgh Airport May Make Some Long Haul Flights Direct | FHR Travel News | BOOKFHR.com
"which fly non-stop from the city to Asia, Australia and the Middle East".
Edinburgh Airport May Make Some Long Haul Flights Direct | FHR Travel News | BOOKFHR.com
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Qatar certainly have the 'muscle'.
Current Long haul fleet
Airbus A340-600s 4
Airbus A330-200s 16
Airbus A330-300s 13
Boeing 777-300ERs 11
Boeing 777-200LRs 8
Fleet on Order
80 Airbus A350s (including options)
60 Boeing 787s (including options)
29 Boeing 777s (including freighters and options)
5 Airbus A380-800s
Current Long haul fleet
Airbus A340-600s 4
Airbus A330-200s 16
Airbus A330-300s 13
Boeing 777-300ERs 11
Boeing 777-200LRs 8
Fleet on Order
80 Airbus A350s (including options)
60 Boeing 787s (including options)
29 Boeing 777s (including freighters and options)
5 Airbus A380-800s
Join Date: Sep 2005
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Edi - Uae
Given that Emirate are operating at 80%+ load factor on a daily service out of GLA it would make a lot more sense for them to operate a twice daily service than adding EDI to the network. 50 miles isn't that big a deal !
Although EDI can no doubt offer very competitive deal (the must have to attract FR) the reality of that the west of Scotland catchment is more lucrative for most of the middle east and far eastern routes due to the demographic composition of much of Glasgow.
The traffic figures from BAA show a decline at GLA and growth at EDI which suggests that short haul (budget) is recession proof but Medium/long haul and charter is not. It will be interesting to see if EDI can maintain its growth without selling its soul to Mr O'Leary.
Although EDI can no doubt offer very competitive deal (the must have to attract FR) the reality of that the west of Scotland catchment is more lucrative for most of the middle east and far eastern routes due to the demographic composition of much of Glasgow.
The traffic figures from BAA show a decline at GLA and growth at EDI which suggests that short haul (budget) is recession proof but Medium/long haul and charter is not. It will be interesting to see if EDI can maintain its growth without selling its soul to Mr O'Leary.
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I believe that Emirates intends to withdraw all of their 777-200 classics and A330s in the near future. The 777-300ER is too heavy to use EDI as the runways, taxiways and aprons will not support its weight when loaded for long range ops (see my earlier post). Unless EDI increase their PCNs and/or Emirates orders aircraft with a lower ACN, I can't see Emirates coming to EDI in the near future.
Looking further into the future, both the 787 and A350 have ACNs that exceed the PCNs at EDI when fully loaded based on provisional data published by Boeing and Airbus. Both look like they would need to reduce their potential fuel + payload quite significantly to stay within the current PCN limits.
For the 787-8 the reduction looks like it would be about 20% less fuel and 20% less payload (or another combination that amounts to the same weight reduction). For the A350 the reduction is slightly more or slightly less depending on the variant.
Looking further into the future, both the 787 and A350 have ACNs that exceed the PCNs at EDI when fully loaded based on provisional data published by Boeing and Airbus. Both look like they would need to reduce their potential fuel + payload quite significantly to stay within the current PCN limits.
For the 787-8 the reduction looks like it would be about 20% less fuel and 20% less payload (or another combination that amounts to the same weight reduction). For the A350 the reduction is slightly more or slightly less depending on the variant.
Last edited by Porrohman; 7th Nov 2010 at 20:29.
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isnt that just the point, that in regular operations DXB from EDI is not anywhere the maximum ground weight. High density at maximum range round the world with MTOW perhaps, EDI-DXB , no.
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isnt that just the point, that in regular operations DXB from EDI is not anywhere the maximum ground weight. High density at maximum range round the world with MTOW perhaps, EDI-DXB , no.
...I notice that the aprons and runways at EDI are considerably weaker than at other airports such as GLA, PIK, BFS, BHX and NCL. The passenger aprons at EDI are 72R/C/W/T and runway 06/24 is 74R/C/W/T. These are more of an impediment to some long-haul aircraft than the runway length. The most extreme example is the Boeing 777-300ER, which suffers significant fuel/payload reductions because of the relatively low PCNs at EDI. (NB. the figures in brackets below indicate the maximums if there were no PCN or runway length limitations).
Boeing 777-300ER
Max ramp weight at EDI; 595,000lbs (775,000lbs)
Fuel/payload reduction from EDI; 180,000lbs i.e. 49%.
Range from EDI with max payload; 1,350nm (5,700nm).
Range from EDI with 364 pax and no cargo; 2,650nm (6,850nm).
Range from EDI with 364 pax and 30,000lbs of cargo; 1,800nm (5,850nm).
ACN empty; 34. ACN at MTOW; 109 (on rigid pavement with low strength subgrade)
Payload/range from EDI is currently PCN limited; a B773ER only requires 5,920ft runway at this weight (runway is 8,400ft long).
Source data; Boeing: Commercial Airplanes - Commercial Aviation Services - Flight Operations - Airport Technology - Airplane Characteristics for Airport Planning and NATS | AIS - Home .
Boeing 777-300ER
Max ramp weight at EDI; 595,000lbs (775,000lbs)
Fuel/payload reduction from EDI; 180,000lbs i.e. 49%.
Range from EDI with max payload; 1,350nm (5,700nm).
Range from EDI with 364 pax and no cargo; 2,650nm (6,850nm).
Range from EDI with 364 pax and 30,000lbs of cargo; 1,800nm (5,850nm).
ACN empty; 34. ACN at MTOW; 109 (on rigid pavement with low strength subgrade)
Payload/range from EDI is currently PCN limited; a B773ER only requires 5,920ft runway at this weight (runway is 8,400ft long).
Source data; Boeing: Commercial Airplanes - Commercial Aviation Services - Flight Operations - Airport Technology - Airplane Characteristics for Airport Planning and NATS | AIS - Home .
I don't see any airlines being able to operate 777-300ERs from EDI on long-range flights unless the PCNs for the aprons, taxiways and runway are significantly upgraded. As Emirates will soon be disposing of their A330s and 777-200 classics I can't see them operating from Edinburgh in the foreseeable future.
Although they still suffer slight limitations, A330s are better suited to the PCNs at Edinburgh. If any Middle East flights come to Edinburgh they are likely to be by an A330 operator.
I'd still like to know whether or not the PCNs for Taxiways Lima and Mike are an impediment to long-haul ops from EDI. If anyone can confirm the PCNs for these taxiways, please let me know. The NATS site doesn't detail a PCN for these taxiways but it does state that Runway 12/30, which arguably these taxiways are part of, has a PCN of 31/C/X/T. That is less than half the strength of Runway 06/24, Taxiway Alpha and the passenger aprons. If Taxiways Lima and Mike are 31/C/X/T then that most likely prevents long-haul ops from the SE Apron and an A330 stand would need to be added on the main apron. One possibility for this might be in the vicinity of Stand 14, although this would occupy stands 11 and 14 when used.
Last edited by Porrohman; 9th Nov 2010 at 23:31. Reason: Typo
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I should add that airports and airlines sometimes exceed PCNs by mutual agreement but it would tend to be for one-off flights (and involves inspection of the pavements after each operation) rather than for a daily service.
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Iceland Express
Looking at the Belfast thread someone stated that Iceland Express are starting a twice weekly service. Inbound via BFS with outbound direct. Any truth in this?
regards 4es
regards 4es
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Looking at the Belfast thread someone stated that Iceland Express are starting a twice weekly service. Inbound via BFS with outbound direct. Any truth in this?