EDINBURGH
Join Date: Jul 2007
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Edi runway works.
My experience having lived in Spain for the last 7 months was that building projects take forever to finish. As for Madrid's new terminal it was the worst one I have had to endure for a long time and hope to avoid it if possible.
Join Date: Jan 2004
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Its great fun watching BA make an approach to 12/30 in the dark, rain and howling wind! How these boys are having to work for their money... SHAME 
Then the comments from the crew about EDI...
Its also fun watching the freighters, charters and execs landing too with NO trouble, comment or issues.
In fact certain BA crews (irrespective of weather conditions) have commented they would rather go to GLA than land on 12/30... Granted there is no ILS etc, but if its good enough for easyjet, flybe, bmi etc...
Then the comments from the crew about EDI... Its also fun watching the freighters, charters and execs landing too with NO trouble, comment or issues.
In fact certain BA crews (irrespective of weather conditions) have commented they would rather go to GLA than land on 12/30... Granted there is no ILS etc, but if its good enough for easyjet, flybe, bmi etc...
Join Date: Feb 2004
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It's only shut from 2300-0545 so unless things are running rather late it shouldn't affect them.
Except for that one instance a couple of weeks ago in the afternoon when due to surface break-up 06/24 was closed then everything did divert to GLA.
12/30 was available but visibility wasn't great hence the diverts, but that didn't stop all the Execs making it in no bother. In fairness it was a BACF ARJ that was the first to brave 12/30 before 06/24 re-opened.
The 0500 MON ZTH departure chickened out of using 12/30 last week and departed late using 24 pretty much as soon as it re-opened. Whether being able to use 24 was the reason for the delay, I don't know.
Except for that one instance a couple of weeks ago in the afternoon when due to surface break-up 06/24 was closed then everything did divert to GLA.
12/30 was available but visibility wasn't great hence the diverts, but that didn't stop all the Execs making it in no bother. In fairness it was a BACF ARJ that was the first to brave 12/30 before 06/24 re-opened.
The 0500 MON ZTH departure chickened out of using 12/30 last week and departed late using 24 pretty much as soon as it re-opened. Whether being able to use 24 was the reason for the delay, I don't know.
Join Date: Aug 2002
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ts great fun watching BA make an approach to 12/30 in the dark, rain and howling wind! How these boys are having to work for their money... SHAME Then the comments from the crew about EDI...
Its also fun watching the freighters, charters and execs landing too with NO trouble, comment or issues.
In fact certain BA crews (irrespective of weather conditions) have commented they would rather go to GLA than land on 12/30... Granted there is no ILS etc, but if its good enough for easyjet, flybe, bmi etc...
Its also fun watching the freighters, charters and execs landing too with NO trouble, comment or issues.
In fact certain BA crews (irrespective of weather conditions) have commented they would rather go to GLA than land on 12/30... Granted there is no ILS etc, but if its good enough for easyjet, flybe, bmi etc...
Join Date: Feb 2007
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Don't think any mainline crew wants to try LCY's 5.5 degree slope!
And yes, it was a BACF RJ100 that was the first aircraft in on 12-30 before 06-24 re-opened, as I was on the flightdeck of it. Great stuff seeing the lights exactly at 'Minimums' and a completely empty apron!
To me, there's no problem landing on 12-30 at all. Just another runway and SRA's are interestingly challenging, expecially in those conditions. Fly safe...!
And yes, it was a BACF RJ100 that was the first aircraft in on 12-30 before 06-24 re-opened, as I was on the flightdeck of it. Great stuff seeing the lights exactly at 'Minimums' and a completely empty apron!
To me, there's no problem landing on 12-30 at all. Just another runway and SRA's are interestingly challenging, expecially in those conditions. Fly safe...!
Join Date: Jan 2004
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Skipness... No one is suggesting OR has suggested BA crews are less competent etc etc, blah blah blah... WHATEVER... 
It is a FACT that BA crews AND BA Ops LHR have advised the handling agent (AVIANCE UK in EDI) - that they would rather go to GLA than land on 12/30 under ceretain conditions - Fair point, although other airlines and aircraft (same aircraft type), have landed with NO problems or issues.
Granted different operators may have slightly different minimums / operating criteria but in general, BA are the ones who do most of the humming and hawing.
Beleive me, AVIANCE GLA dont like it much when they are put on 'standby' to accept an A319/20/21 at very short notice!
It is a FACT that BA crews AND BA Ops LHR have advised the handling agent (AVIANCE UK in EDI) - that they would rather go to GLA than land on 12/30 under ceretain conditions - Fair point, although other airlines and aircraft (same aircraft type), have landed with NO problems or issues.
Granted different operators may have slightly different minimums / operating criteria but in general, BA are the ones who do most of the humming and hawing.
Beleive me, AVIANCE GLA dont like it much when they are put on 'standby' to accept an A319/20/21 at very short notice!
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Just mildly curious Tristar500 but are you ex BA staff? Many of your posts are pretty anti BA most of the time.... I'm not a huge fan of flying these days but I take BA over the competition every time as whatever their many faults, they've not yet managed to screw me over yet. I avoided T5 lol.
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DutchBird-757,
Glad that my SRA to the flight you were on worked out so well. It was nice of the crew to pass on their thanks the next day. Despite the newspapers recent 'harem scarem' stories about the Globespan 737 SRAs to RWY12/30, there is nothing wrong with them. The paper/s really were writing sensationalist crap - as is usually the case with most aviation-related stories.
Done well, an SRA is an extremely effective approach aid. It's just that when the weather is really s...e, nothing can replace a CATII/III ILS. However, can an airport operator really justify the significant financial investment installing an ILS on a RWY that is used so infrequently and is relatively limited in length? RWY12/30 is a visual RWY only and would require significant funds to upgrade it for an ILS fit. Add to that, the future plans for Edi and the money could possibly be better spent elsewhere. Just a thought......
WJMcP
Glad that my SRA to the flight you were on worked out so well. It was nice of the crew to pass on their thanks the next day.
Despite the newspapers recent 'harem scarem' stories about the Globespan 737 SRAs to RWY12/30, there is nothing wrong with them. The paper/s really were writing sensationalist crap - as is usually the case with most aviation-related stories. Done well, an SRA is an extremely effective approach aid. It's just that when the weather is really s...e, nothing can replace a CATII/III ILS. However, can an airport operator really justify the significant financial investment installing an ILS on a RWY that is used so infrequently and is relatively limited in length? RWY12/30 is a visual RWY only and would require significant funds to upgrade it for an ILS fit. Add to that, the future plans for Edi and the money could possibly be better spent elsewhere. Just a thought......
WJMcP
Join Date: Sep 2005
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Well jock if it was you gving me an SRA to 30 when the main runway was closed you did an excellent job - it can be just as effective as an ILS (with higher minima obviously). Just managed to scrape in before the cloudbase lowered - Happy Days.
Best Regards
OP
Best Regards
OP
Join Date: Jan 2007
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Runway / International Terminal Facilities / Stands at EDI
I'd be interested to hear opinions from any pilots / airline ops staff whose airlines currently (or potentially might) fly long haul from EDI as to whether the runway length / international terminal facilities / stand size & availablity are impeding long-haul growth at EDI.
It strikes me that there's lots of demand for more long-haul ops from EDI but I'm not sure whether the airport facilities are up to accomodating it as the runway length prevents MTOW departures in most long haul aircraft and the international stands and terminal facilities are inadequate.
I'd have thought that EDI could support a similar long-haul route network to Dublin given its status as a major financial centre and a popular tourist destination.
It strikes me that there's lots of demand for more long-haul ops from EDI but I'm not sure whether the airport facilities are up to accomodating it as the runway length prevents MTOW departures in most long haul aircraft and the international stands and terminal facilities are inadequate.
I'd have thought that EDI could support a similar long-haul route network to Dublin given its status as a major financial centre and a popular tourist destination.
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I'd have thought that EDI could support a similar long-haul route network to Dublin given its status as a major financial centre and a popular tourist destination.
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en2r said;
There are a number of reasons why Dublin has a superior longhaul network. Most importantly, Dublin has a much higher population than Edinburgh, it has roughly 3.5 times the population.
There are a number of reasons why Dublin has a superior longhaul network. Most importantly, Dublin has a much higher population than Edinburgh, it has roughly 3.5 times the population.
Dublin City: 505,739
Dublin Urban Area: 1,045,769
Dublin Region: 1,186,821
Greater Dublin Area: 1,661,185[2]
Also, according to Wikipedia, the population of Edinburgh is;
City: 448,624 (2001 census)
Greater Edinburgh area (including parts of Fife and the Scottish Borders: 1,250,000.
In addition, Edinburgh's population is increased by about 100,000 students during University terms and the city is one of Europe's major tourist destinations, attracting around 13 million visitors a year.
If you expand EDI's client base to include other towns and cities within the airport's catchment area, I suspect that it will be similar to, and perhaps higher, than Dublin's. e.g. a substantial portion of greater Glasgow has shorter journey times to EDI than to GLA.
Your other points are well made though.
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Including parts of Glasgow in Edinburgh's Catchment area??? I don't think Glasgow people would be too impressed with that. I think Edinburgh and Glasgows problem is that the airports are too close to each other. If there was one airport in between the two then maybe it might reach the size of Dublin airport. However having the two means they're always going to be fighting each other for routes and ye're never going to have a proper long haul network out of either of them.
Oh and Dublin has 3 universities as well as a fourth on the outskirts.
Oh and Dublin has 3 universities as well as a fourth on the outskirts.
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en2r said:
Including parts of Glasgow in Edinburgh's Catchment area??? I don't think Glasgow people would be too impressed with that.
Including parts of Glasgow in Edinburgh's Catchment area??? I don't think Glasgow people would be too impressed with that.
The DfT's Regional Air Services Co-ordination (RASCO) Study in 2002 showed that 2.54m or 50.1% of the Scottish population are within 1-hour access time of EDI by road, and 4.01m or 79.2% are within 2-hours.
I know lots of business people from Glasgow who fly from EDI rather than GLA because EDI has a better choice of scheduled flights and it is easier and quicker to get to than GLA. GLA's problem is that it's the wrong side of a traffic jam for most of the population of Scotland whereas EDI sits between Edinburgh and Glasgow (albeit closer to Edinburgh). The express parcel airlines (TNT, DHL etc) operate most of their Scottish flights from EDI rather than GLA because of EDI's more convenient location.
My suspicion is that BAA does little to encourage international flights from EDI and GLA beacuse they would rather try to route pax via LHR, LGW and STN thereby generating two lots of revenue from each connecting pax rather than just one lot of revenue if the same pax was to fly direct from EDI. I suspect that EDI's international short-haul expansion in recent years has been in spite of BAA rather than because of them and has more to do with the Scottish Parliament encoraging route development.
The availability of international terminal facilities and stands at EDI seems to me to be continuously lagging behind demand and the runway length is too short for MTOW departures of most long-haul types which significantly restricts payload, range and therefore operating economics on long-haul routes.
An independantly owned Edinburgh Airport would, in my opinion, have remedied these deficiencies years ago, but under BAA's virtual monopoly of UK airports there would appear to be no incentive them to do anything other than try to route as many pax as possible via LHR, LGW and STN for as long as they can get away with it. This might be a good thing for BAA but it's not in Scotland's best interests IMHO.