Sabian Air
Join Date: Nov 2007
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"professional Pilots"???????
Quote from Benjamin Franklin:
"I will speak ill of no man even in the matter of truth but rather excuse the faults I hear and upon proper occasions, speak all the good I know of everybody".
Give it a break guys, this is so demeaning of a "PROFESSIONAL PILOTS" forum.
"I will speak ill of no man even in the matter of truth but rather excuse the faults I hear and upon proper occasions, speak all the good I know of everybody".
Give it a break guys, this is so demeaning of a "PROFESSIONAL PILOTS" forum.
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Africa somewhere. Baggage somewhere else...
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Complete Stranger (are you to Sabian?), I do not agree with the personal attacks on anybody. However, it seems more and more as if a number of people and organisations have been hurt through unscrupulous dealings with a certain individual.
I do not think aviation can afford the likes of such person(s), who will gain the trust of well meaning people, wanting to experience the joys of flying, only to have that trust broken, in some cases, in the worst possible way. It gives aviation a bad name and tarnishes the safe and professional image that most of us are working very hard on.
Thus, I think it prudent for such (
) individuals to be exposed on this forum, both that they can learn that in today's day and age it will not be tolerated, as well as to warn others to stay away. If they are truly innocent, enough people (real ones) will come to the fore to vouch for them. And using biblical quotes? I would be careful as to my intentions and sincerity with that.
I do not think aviation can afford the likes of such person(s), who will gain the trust of well meaning people, wanting to experience the joys of flying, only to have that trust broken, in some cases, in the worst possible way. It gives aviation a bad name and tarnishes the safe and professional image that most of us are working very hard on.
Thus, I think it prudent for such (
) individuals to be exposed on this forum, both that they can learn that in today's day and age it will not be tolerated, as well as to warn others to stay away. If they are truly innocent, enough people (real ones) will come to the fore to vouch for them. And using biblical quotes? I would be careful as to my intentions and sincerity with that.
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We are watching carefully guys and we're perfectly happy with the greater good argument.
Additionally the sudden influx of pro Sabian signups, posting with a technical naivety which makes us gasp here at the Towers, firmly puts them out of play as anything other than a solo glove puppet.
Step forward Alfred R, Steven Swanburg and Banber. Please have a chat with a bright 9 year old and ask them to explain why you are making complete prats of yourself, singular.
Rob
Additionally the sudden influx of pro Sabian signups, posting with a technical naivety which makes us gasp here at the Towers, firmly puts them out of play as anything other than a solo glove puppet.
Step forward Alfred R, Steven Swanburg and Banber. Please have a chat with a bright 9 year old and ask them to explain why you are making complete prats of yourself, singular.
Rob
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agreed
No connection with the aviation fraternity - happened by chance on this site and it doesn't take a rocket scientist to establish that this a personal vendetta, that is why I suggested the aggrieved parties go through the correct channels - let justice be done the correct way instead of airing their dirty washing through a site that could be misused and abused. The vicious postings may have the desired effect against the individual concerned, but at the same time it also drags the Professional Pilots name through the mud as it appears that they have sunk to the same level. I have always had the highest regard for Pilots as a whole but this forum has made me wonder. If and when I fly, I use regular flights but the vindictiveness on this site has shocked me and makes me question the integrity of "Professional Pilots".
The biblical scripture was sincere and written with all good intention. Other people may say "what goes around, comes around" or "what you sow, you reap" - that applies to all parties whoever they may be.
As one guy put it, this is ugly and I will not be party to any more postings.
The biblical scripture was sincere and written with all good intention. Other people may say "what goes around, comes around" or "what you sow, you reap" - that applies to all parties whoever they may be.
As one guy put it, this is ugly and I will not be party to any more postings.
Join Date: Oct 2004
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Ok... I'll take the bait here...
In light of the Pprune comment with respect to S Swanburg... and considering that this post is from Sabian, how should the following comment be viewed from Swanburg?
"Court cases? you will never win one! I give him credit, he's fair, but one ruthless son of a b*#ch if you try to double cross him..... !!!!"
This thread has taken a turn for the worse...
In light of the Pprune comment with respect to S Swanburg... and considering that this post is from Sabian, how should the following comment be viewed from Swanburg?
"Court cases? you will never win one! I give him credit, he's fair, but one ruthless son of a b*#ch if you try to double cross him..... !!!!"
This thread has taken a turn for the worse...
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Complete stranger said
No connection with the aviation fraternity - happened by chance on this site and it doesn't take a rocket scientist to establish that this a personal vendetta,
Great, you ask a question only to be accused by a complete stranger that you are trying to get a personal vendetta going against somebody!
Note however that he is not to concerned by the overwhelmingly large number of negative reports about this operator. Instead he seems to want to shield him. A bit of Stockholm Syndrome maybe?
No connection with the aviation fraternity - happened by chance on this site and it doesn't take a rocket scientist to establish that this a personal vendetta,
Great, you ask a question only to be accused by a complete stranger that you are trying to get a personal vendetta going against somebody!
Note however that he is not to concerned by the overwhelmingly large number of negative reports about this operator. Instead he seems to want to shield him. A bit of Stockholm Syndrome maybe?
Join Date: May 2006
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Circuss Exposures
The one sad aspect of this entire thread is the bt inability of SACAA to firmly put a stop to such unscrupulous people.
We are actually talking human life here when 4 Bar PPL’s fly aircraft for hire & reward, can anyone maybe get a photo of this Charming 4 Bar PPL and post it here so that all can see it for what it is.
The media being so obsessed with aviation could actually make a good story out of this for a change and entertain the whole country and not just the aviation fraternity.
t inability of SACAA to firmly put a stop to such unscrupulous people.We are actually talking human life here when 4 Bar PPL’s fly aircraft for hire & reward, can anyone maybe get a photo of this Charming 4 Bar PPL and post it here so that all can see it for what it is.
The media being so obsessed with aviation could actually make a good story out of this for a change and entertain the whole country and not just the aviation fraternity.
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Write A Letter Of Complaint
Nickerbal.
It is so easy to sit back and bitch about CAA and them not doing anything about this Slime-ball.
It is so easy to chirp, (not getting at you), that this 4 bar PPL is doing PRIVATE flights with PAYING PAX.
It is also very easy to say that he is not filling in the flight folio's of the hours flown.
So easy to chirp about many things.
BUT.....before CAA can act, they also need avidavidts from witnesses to these so called allegations.
I have heard from some of the so called hero's of this particular site about how this Slime-ball is transgressing the law, and when they are asked to put pen to paper, all you get is promises of loooooooong letters....more like looooong stories of hot air.......STILL WAITING FOR THESE LETTERS.
Then I have heard stories of how ALL the CAA inspectors are in this Slim-ball's pocket.....VERY STRONG WORDS...but never a written complaint....Oh many verbal chirps, but never facts.
There is no ways any one is going to act on a whim, but rather on a written complaint, as should this be a personal vandetta, and the facts are hogwash, then at least CAA are in the legal clear....I am sure all you boffins out there understand that one.
Sure, there are facts, but about cheques bouncing.....a civil matter, not a CAA matter.
So for some of the hero's out there, should you see this guy flying and you have the proof that they are/were fare paying passangers on board, get all the facts, write a formal complaint and channel it the right way so that CAA can nail this Slimeball....
Dont just sit on the fence and throw stones, as then you are just as guilty as him.....WRITE A LETTER...TALK IS CHEAP.
Oh, and make sure your own back door is clean.
Goffel ..
It is so easy to sit back and bitch about CAA and them not doing anything about this Slime-ball.
It is so easy to chirp, (not getting at you), that this 4 bar PPL is doing PRIVATE flights with PAYING PAX.
It is also very easy to say that he is not filling in the flight folio's of the hours flown.
So easy to chirp about many things.
BUT.....before CAA can act, they also need avidavidts from witnesses to these so called allegations.
I have heard from some of the so called hero's of this particular site about how this Slime-ball is transgressing the law, and when they are asked to put pen to paper, all you get is promises of loooooooong letters....more like looooong stories of hot air.......STILL WAITING FOR THESE LETTERS.
Then I have heard stories of how ALL the CAA inspectors are in this Slim-ball's pocket.....VERY STRONG WORDS...but never a written complaint....Oh many verbal chirps, but never facts.
There is no ways any one is going to act on a whim, but rather on a written complaint, as should this be a personal vandetta, and the facts are hogwash, then at least CAA are in the legal clear....I am sure all you boffins out there understand that one.
Sure, there are facts, but about cheques bouncing.....a civil matter, not a CAA matter.
So for some of the hero's out there, should you see this guy flying and you have the proof that they are/were fare paying passangers on board, get all the facts, write a formal complaint and channel it the right way so that CAA can nail this Slimeball....
Dont just sit on the fence and throw stones, as then you are just as guilty as him.....WRITE A LETTER...TALK IS CHEAP.
Oh, and make sure your own back door is clean.
Goffel ..
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Biggles of Africa
Flight Planning
Joined: 27 Nov 2007
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Location: Sandton
Posted: 2007 Post subject: Warning to potential charter clients
I would just like to warn everyone who may be a potential charter client to be sure they are using a reputable company.
My company are chartering aircraft for our annual get away for our sales conference coming up in January, it transpired that they were in negotiations with Sabian Air to do the charter.
After the whole Sabian Air debate on Avcom, which I followed with sheer amazment, I hurriedly brought the directors attention to the thread, after which all negotiations were shelved until further investigation.
The findings are as follows, Sabian Air do not own and never have owned thier own charter licence, they apparently piggy back on another company's licence, this company was "Fair Aviation" based at Lanseria.
A few calls to the owner revealed that he had removed Sabian Air from his licence due to non-compliances on Sabian Air's part. This before our company approached them with our charter needs, and at no time was this ever mentioned, I wonder why, had I not been an avid follower of Avcom, we would have been none the wiser and would have had our company flying with a totaly illegal operation, should anything have happened, we would have had no recourse.
Thank you Avcom
Please be very careful if your company or family are flying on chartered flight these holidays, Sabian Air continues to operate without any form of charter licence, and all thier flights are totally illegal.
We have sinced approached an old and established operator at Lanseria, and the contrast in service is like day and night.
This again posted on "that other forum". Was started as a new thread. Also, I was at Rand yesterday and noticed two signs attached to the Sabian Air hangar. These signs were in red on a white background and informing all and sundry that hangar 2 at Rand is Sabian Air's storage depot only. These signs were apparently necessary as CAA walked into the hangar two days ago and caught some unlicensed "engineers" working on aircraft without an AMO license neither! The plot thickens!
Flight Planning
Joined: 27 Nov 2007
Posts: 5
Location: Sandton
Posted: 2007 Post subject: Warning to potential charter clients
I would just like to warn everyone who may be a potential charter client to be sure they are using a reputable company. My company are chartering aircraft for our annual get away for our sales conference coming up in January, it transpired that they were in negotiations with Sabian Air to do the charter.
After the whole Sabian Air debate on Avcom, which I followed with sheer amazment, I hurriedly brought the directors attention to the thread, after which all negotiations were shelved until further investigation.
The findings are as follows, Sabian Air do not own and never have owned thier own charter licence, they apparently piggy back on another company's licence, this company was "Fair Aviation" based at Lanseria.
A few calls to the owner revealed that he had removed Sabian Air from his licence due to non-compliances on Sabian Air's part. This before our company approached them with our charter needs, and at no time was this ever mentioned, I wonder why, had I not been an avid follower of Avcom, we would have been none the wiser and would have had our company flying with a totaly illegal operation, should anything have happened, we would have had no recourse.
Thank you Avcom
Please be very careful if your company or family are flying on chartered flight these holidays, Sabian Air continues to operate without any form of charter licence, and all thier flights are totally illegal.
We have sinced approached an old and established operator at Lanseria, and the contrast in service is like day and night.
This again posted on "that other forum". Was started as a new thread. Also, I was at Rand yesterday and noticed two signs attached to the Sabian Air hangar. These signs were in red on a white background and informing all and sundry that hangar 2 at Rand is Sabian Air's storage depot only. These signs were apparently necessary as CAA walked into the hangar two days ago and caught some unlicensed "engineers" working on aircraft without an AMO license neither! The plot thickens!
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Supposed illegal operations
The supposed illegal operation of Sabian Air is nothing but disinformation.
Aircraft owners do not have to own there own AOC and the fact that Fair Aviation operates the Sabian Air aircraft fleet is fully legal.
I had a chat with Clint from Fair Aviation, who confirms that Sabian air is current with there AOC and this may be confirmed by the CAA.
I subsequently did this my self and guess what?
Sabian Air is fully legal.
Aircraft owners do not have to own there own AOC and the fact that Fair Aviation operates the Sabian Air aircraft fleet is fully legal.
I had a chat with Clint from Fair Aviation, who confirms that Sabian air is current with there AOC and this may be confirmed by the CAA.
I subsequently did this my self and guess what?
Sabian Air is fully legal.
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Camanel,
To bring Fair aviation into this discussion is an interesting angle...
If Sabian are HYPOTHETICALLY operating illegally in some instances, then would their illegal operation apply to Fair - since they are in effect bound by ther terms of their license? In other words Sabian may run the risk of jeapordising the whole of Fairs operation.
If this is the case, your argument would carry some weight if Fair came out and said that they were satisfied that Sabian are operating in accordance to the law and that they had done due dilligence on Sabian Air. Wouldnt it be nice if Fair did this to put an end to this speculation?
What would be particularly concerning, is that Fair in fact MAY know of some very worrying aspects of Sabians operation, and they know of transgressions and they have done nothing to sort this out. If they knew of transgressions and allowed this to continue, they would therefore be accomplices. Am I right?
To merely state that a company is operating legally because they are operating under someones license does nothing. In fact it may only bring in an accomplice to the fact...
To bring Fair aviation into this discussion is an interesting angle...
If Sabian are HYPOTHETICALLY operating illegally in some instances, then would their illegal operation apply to Fair - since they are in effect bound by ther terms of their license? In other words Sabian may run the risk of jeapordising the whole of Fairs operation.
If this is the case, your argument would carry some weight if Fair came out and said that they were satisfied that Sabian are operating in accordance to the law and that they had done due dilligence on Sabian Air. Wouldnt it be nice if Fair did this to put an end to this speculation?
What would be particularly concerning, is that Fair in fact MAY know of some very worrying aspects of Sabians operation, and they know of transgressions and they have done nothing to sort this out. If they knew of transgressions and allowed this to continue, they would therefore be accomplices. Am I right?
To merely state that a company is operating legally because they are operating under someones license does nothing. In fact it may only bring in an accomplice to the fact...
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AirwayBlocker
Makes you (th)/(dr)ink does it not?
So easy to add a "location". If they run out they can call me, I have some ideas. Pofadder/Skilpadskraal/Tweebuffelsmeteenskootdoodgeskeithetfontien etc.
Makes you (th)/(dr)ink does it not?
So easy to add a "location". If they run out they can call me, I have some ideas. Pofadder/Skilpadskraal/Tweebuffelsmeteenskootdoodgeskeithetfontien etc.
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General manager shafted
Here is the cherry on the top.
Their general manager, who has been instrumental in shafting all the pilots, the general public and anyone else who was around, got shafted up the naught by the very hand that fed him.
He got into an argument with his lustrious boss, (and wait for it), his very own daughter who, by the GM's own words, is sleeping with the boss whilst the boss's wife is sick at home.....then got clobbered by his own son, who is getting (from the GM's own mouth), steriods from the boss.....talk about "Days of our lives".
Now the GM has not been paid for two months...(what goes around comes around).
Also Fair aviation is/has taken Sabian off their AOC, (cannot comfirm that at the mo), as they are not happy with all the bullsh1t going around....especially as Fair aviation got a bill from Lanseria regarding Sabian, which Sabian now refuses to pay in cash as they only have a cheque book.
So ja well no fine...........I suppose we are going to have another 10 probationary prunes with a zillion things to say.
Oh and I believe the Ferrari was repossed as was a couple of other things.
Goffel...lying like a beached whale on the beach.
Their general manager, who has been instrumental in shafting all the pilots, the general public and anyone else who was around, got shafted up the naught by the very hand that fed him.
He got into an argument with his lustrious boss, (and wait for it), his very own daughter who, by the GM's own words, is sleeping with the boss whilst the boss's wife is sick at home.
....then got clobbered by his own son, who is getting (from the GM's own mouth), steriods from the boss.....talk about "Days of our lives".Now the GM has not been paid for two months...(what goes around comes around).
Also Fair aviation is/has taken Sabian off their AOC, (cannot comfirm that at the mo), as they are not happy with all the bullsh1t going around....especially as Fair aviation got a bill from Lanseria regarding Sabian, which Sabian now refuses to pay in cash as they only have a cheque book.
So ja well no fine...........I suppose we are going to have another 10 probationary prunes with a zillion things to say.
Oh and I believe the Ferrari was repossed as was a couple of other things.
Goffel...lying like a beached whale on the beach.
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I told this story a couple of weeks ago - fight was about GM stealing Porsche rims - yes daughter has been sleeping with owner for about two years between his on off relationships with several other unfortunate victims. GM 17yr old son is supplied roids by owner. GM wife sponsored bi polar meds by owner. Now before anyone talks about slandering and accusations and medical prognosis etc - THE OWNER IS BI POLAR, ON STEROIDS, AND IS DYSLEXIC. These are facts -heard it straight from the horses mouth! Another thing - check him out when he answers his phone - he has to hold the phone right at his nose to see the display-he really is as blind as a bat. Wife (ex?) is at home with MS.
Last edited by phukibear; 21st Dec 2007 at 12:40.