ZIMbobWE seizes US cargo Plane and Mercenaries
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: The frequency jungle
Posts: 975
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Deanw
Are you trying to apply logic here? Remember where this is taking place. These folks dont even know the meaning of the word or the effect that logic has on day to day life. Just read about the english TV-crew that was expelled from the country for illegally covering the cricket!!!! Geeez, when is somebody gonna step up and do something about these fools? Come on Thabo, show us and the world what a man you can be! You should've arrested him while he was there in your house in Pretoria!!!!
My prayers are with those poor guys in that Zim s
thole prison.
Are you trying to apply logic here? Remember where this is taking place. These folks dont even know the meaning of the word or the effect that logic has on day to day life. Just read about the english TV-crew that was expelled from the country for illegally covering the cricket!!!! Geeez, when is somebody gonna step up and do something about these fools? Come on Thabo, show us and the world what a man you can be! You should've arrested him while he was there in your house in Pretoria!!!!
My prayers are with those poor guys in that Zim s
thole prison.
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: oppieplaas
Posts: 190
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
To all frothblowers,
They are not going to take the train or ships or automobiles to get them to Malabo.......
Maybe they will march them there?
The South African ANC Goverment did blow the whistle after they left SA.
They have decide to have an example made of them. They are using it as a deterrent because they fear the same thing in SA. They cannot make an example of them in SA as the public opinion will let things get out of hand, because of the liberal constitution.
Obiang did come to power as the result of the a coup. He shot his uncle in the back of the head with a 9mm. Personally. He has not been charged for murder......
He did get rid of his opposition long before he held any election. Opposition party busines is not a healty living style in EG.The Fang ethnic group to which Obiang belongs also used the whole opposition ticket to rid Malabo of and torture the Bubi population that were the oridginal native tribe on the iland.
EG is not ruled from Malabo but from Mongomo on the Gabon/EG border. It is ruled by the village elders of the Fang tribe in Mongomo. Obiang is their appointed president. I am sure they can be convinced that this whole issue is getting out of hand.......
It has been said that Obiangs son is not prepared to wait patiently in the wings anymore, while waiting that his farther's prostate canser finish him off. That is why Obiang surrounded himself with merecenary Morrocan body guards. He doesnt trust his own tribes men.
If anyone wants to read about the EG regime there is a wonderful book that is banned in EG, Tropical Gangsters that is available on Amazon.com.
They are not going to take the train or ships or automobiles to get them to Malabo.......
Maybe they will march them there?
The South African ANC Goverment did blow the whistle after they left SA.
They have decide to have an example made of them. They are using it as a deterrent because they fear the same thing in SA. They cannot make an example of them in SA as the public opinion will let things get out of hand, because of the liberal constitution.
Obiang did come to power as the result of the a coup. He shot his uncle in the back of the head with a 9mm. Personally. He has not been charged for murder......
He did get rid of his opposition long before he held any election. Opposition party busines is not a healty living style in EG.The Fang ethnic group to which Obiang belongs also used the whole opposition ticket to rid Malabo of and torture the Bubi population that were the oridginal native tribe on the iland.
EG is not ruled from Malabo but from Mongomo on the Gabon/EG border. It is ruled by the village elders of the Fang tribe in Mongomo. Obiang is their appointed president. I am sure they can be convinced that this whole issue is getting out of hand.......
It has been said that Obiangs son is not prepared to wait patiently in the wings anymore, while waiting that his farther's prostate canser finish him off. That is why Obiang surrounded himself with merecenary Morrocan body guards. He doesnt trust his own tribes men.
If anyone wants to read about the EG regime there is a wonderful book that is banned in EG, Tropical Gangsters that is available on Amazon.com.
..the time has come the walrus said.to speak of many things,of pirate ships and selaing wax and cabbages and kings...."
Gatvol
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: KLAS/TIST/FAJS/KFAI
Posts: 4,195
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Latest:
DA seeks clarity on captured mercenaries
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The Democratic Alliance said on Sunday it was concerned about the prospects of suspected South African mercenaries getting a fair trial in Zimbabwe and Equatorial Guinea, where they are currently being held.
The DA's Douglas Gibson said he intended to ask searching questions about how the government had handled the whole situation, particularly because the so-called mercenaries might not receive a fair hearing if tried in the countries which had captured them.
"Mercenary activity of any kind can under no circumstances be defended, due to its scurrilous history on the African continent. Yet no matter how deplorable mercenaries may be, everyone is entitled to a fair trial and the presumption of innocence before guilt. It appears that the South Africans being held in Zimbabwe and Equatorial Guinea are unlikely to receive either of these most basic of rights."
He said the DA wanted to get clarity on the government's handling of the situation and intended to pose a number of questions in Parliament to the ministers of foreign affairs and intelligence.
The DA wanted to know:
Were the South African intelligence services aware that there were suspected mercenaries on their way to Zimbabwe? If they were, why did they not impound the plane in question before it left South Africa?
Who took the political decision to allow the plane in question to depart for Zimbabwe; if not the president, was he advised of this decision? In this regard was the national director of public prosecutions consulted about possible criminal charges being laid in South Africa?
What were the criteria used to decide that it would be best to allow South African citizens to stand trial in Zimbabwe or Equatorial Guinea? If convicted, the group coulod be given the death penalty in both countries. Given the absence of a proper judicial system in either country the prospect of a fair trial does not seem very likely.
Did the security forces co-operate with their counterparts from Zimbabwe and Equatorial Guinea, if so to what extent?
Why were South African diplomatic officials so slow to intervene after the arrest of the 15 South African suspected mercenaries in Equatorial Guinea? More than 11 days were allowed to elapse before any South African official visited the group in jail.
Why has the South African government not taken steps to bring the South Africans involved to stand trial in South Africa under the Foreign Military Assistance Act? In this regard, has the government taken cognisance of the fact that Jan Henning of the National Prosecuting Authority has stated that South Africa should have no involvement in the trial in Equatorial Guinea, as there is no chance of a fair trial taking place in that country.
What steps will the South African government take to assist its citizens in Equatorial Guinea and Zimbabwe?
Gibson said party members would monitor the situation carefully.
"The DA will continue to scrutinise the actions of the government in this matter, not because it is a champion of mercenaries, but because it firmly believes in the notion that all South Africans deserve to be presumed innocent until proven guilty and that everyone deserves the right to a fair trial."
Sapa
DA seeks clarity on captured mercenaries
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The Democratic Alliance said on Sunday it was concerned about the prospects of suspected South African mercenaries getting a fair trial in Zimbabwe and Equatorial Guinea, where they are currently being held.
The DA's Douglas Gibson said he intended to ask searching questions about how the government had handled the whole situation, particularly because the so-called mercenaries might not receive a fair hearing if tried in the countries which had captured them.
"Mercenary activity of any kind can under no circumstances be defended, due to its scurrilous history on the African continent. Yet no matter how deplorable mercenaries may be, everyone is entitled to a fair trial and the presumption of innocence before guilt. It appears that the South Africans being held in Zimbabwe and Equatorial Guinea are unlikely to receive either of these most basic of rights."
He said the DA wanted to get clarity on the government's handling of the situation and intended to pose a number of questions in Parliament to the ministers of foreign affairs and intelligence.
The DA wanted to know:
Were the South African intelligence services aware that there were suspected mercenaries on their way to Zimbabwe? If they were, why did they not impound the plane in question before it left South Africa?
Who took the political decision to allow the plane in question to depart for Zimbabwe; if not the president, was he advised of this decision? In this regard was the national director of public prosecutions consulted about possible criminal charges being laid in South Africa?
What were the criteria used to decide that it would be best to allow South African citizens to stand trial in Zimbabwe or Equatorial Guinea? If convicted, the group coulod be given the death penalty in both countries. Given the absence of a proper judicial system in either country the prospect of a fair trial does not seem very likely.
Did the security forces co-operate with their counterparts from Zimbabwe and Equatorial Guinea, if so to what extent?
Why were South African diplomatic officials so slow to intervene after the arrest of the 15 South African suspected mercenaries in Equatorial Guinea? More than 11 days were allowed to elapse before any South African official visited the group in jail.
Why has the South African government not taken steps to bring the South Africans involved to stand trial in South Africa under the Foreign Military Assistance Act? In this regard, has the government taken cognisance of the fact that Jan Henning of the National Prosecuting Authority has stated that South Africa should have no involvement in the trial in Equatorial Guinea, as there is no chance of a fair trial taking place in that country.
What steps will the South African government take to assist its citizens in Equatorial Guinea and Zimbabwe?
Gibson said party members would monitor the situation carefully.
"The DA will continue to scrutinise the actions of the government in this matter, not because it is a champion of mercenaries, but because it firmly believes in the notion that all South Africans deserve to be presumed innocent until proven guilty and that everyone deserves the right to a fair trial."
Sapa
GunsssR4ever
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: Out there somewhere ...
Posts: 3,816
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Merc's in leg irons
Great post Contraxdog - very nice summary.
Here are the latest from today's "court " proceedings.
Harare - Zimbabwean authorities put 70 accused mercenaries in leg irons around the clock after learning of a plot to spring them from jail, state lawyers said on Monday.
The men have been held at the Chikurubi prison complex in Zimbabwe's capital Harare since being arrested in March on suspicion of plotting a coup in Equatorial Guinea.
"On Friday senior officials and other officials came to the prison and ordered that the prisoners should be in leg irons. There were plans to spring the prisoners out of Chikurubi," state lawyer Lawrence Phiri told a court inside the complex.
"The authorities saw it fit that they should be kept in leg irons until further notice given that it would be easier to spring someone out of prison that did not have leg irons," he said, giving no more detail on the alleged plot.
The accused were forced to remain in leg irons throughout Monday morning's hearing, even though a magistrate had ordered the chains be removed during court sessions.
Zimbabwean authorities have begun legal moves that could see the group, who are mainly from South Africa, Angola and Namibia, extradited to face trial in oil-rich Equatorial Guinea where another smaller group is being held on suspicion of being involved in the same plot.
From IOL
Here are the latest from today's "court " proceedings.
Harare - Zimbabwean authorities put 70 accused mercenaries in leg irons around the clock after learning of a plot to spring them from jail, state lawyers said on Monday.
The men have been held at the Chikurubi prison complex in Zimbabwe's capital Harare since being arrested in March on suspicion of plotting a coup in Equatorial Guinea.
"On Friday senior officials and other officials came to the prison and ordered that the prisoners should be in leg irons. There were plans to spring the prisoners out of Chikurubi," state lawyer Lawrence Phiri told a court inside the complex.
"The authorities saw it fit that they should be kept in leg irons until further notice given that it would be easier to spring someone out of prison that did not have leg irons," he said, giving no more detail on the alleged plot.
The accused were forced to remain in leg irons throughout Monday morning's hearing, even though a magistrate had ordered the chains be removed during court sessions.
Zimbabwean authorities have begun legal moves that could see the group, who are mainly from South Africa, Angola and Namibia, extradited to face trial in oil-rich Equatorial Guinea where another smaller group is being held on suspicion of being involved in the same plot.
From IOL
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: uk
Posts: 267
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: In the oil wealth of sand dunes
Posts: 293
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From this mornings News 24
Zim jail 'worse than Auschwitz'
04/05/2004 22:28__-_(SA)__
Pretoria - Advocate Francois Joubert SC and Alwyn Griebenow who are representing the 70 men being held in Harare's maximum security Chikurubi Prison on charges of coup plotting have described the jail as a camp worse than Auschwitz.
The legal team was speaking after their arrival in South Africa from Zimbabwe where they have been dealing with the men's case.
They say the white men in the group, in particular, are at times placed in a cell that measures only a square metre.
The men are given food in this cell - mostly pap - once a day. This is pushed under the door and they have to eat with their hands.
While in these cells, they are not allowed anything to read, nor are they allowed anything with which to write.
Some of the men are forced to undress and sit naked in front of the other prisoners. On some days, it is "officially" approved that prisoners be abused.
Bodies are carried out of prison
"One hears how the people are assaulted with batons to anything (that is handy).
"Reon Schutte, another South African who is dying of cancer and who has been in Chikurubi for more than 10 years on charges of apartheid crimes, has had all his teeth knocked out.
One also sees how bodies are carried out of the prison.
"Only then is the abuse over," said Joubert.
According to him, this has had a traumatic effect on the South Africans and their families.
The prison supplies only a blanket and the men wear summer prison clothes.
Lice is rife, but prison authorities refuse to allow the man insecticides.
Joubert said some of the men had contracted a skin disease, possibly due to the poor food. One also had chickenpox. These were the most horrific conditions that one could imagine.
He said that every day the men got pap and a cup of dried rice with a bit of cooked cabbage.
After the legal team got a court order to allow them to take in food, the prison authorities claimed it would have to be tasted in their presence.
The prison also had no jerseys for the men. The men's families organised jerseys that looked exactly like prison ones as well as socks.
Kept under restraint 24 hours a day
Now, the prison authorities were refusing to allow the men to have the jerseys.
There were reports that the men were planning to escape and they were now being kept in handcuffs and leg irons 24 hours a day.
"They are also not allowed to wear the socks because then the leg irons don't chaff as much," said Griebenow.
He said it was ironic that the "experienced" prisoners were helping the South Africans. They kept up their spirits and advised them from experience.
Griebenow said: "They are hardened and used to the conditions. Surprisingly, the men are in good spirits and are positive."Zim Jail
04/05/2004 22:28__-_(SA)__
Pretoria - Advocate Francois Joubert SC and Alwyn Griebenow who are representing the 70 men being held in Harare's maximum security Chikurubi Prison on charges of coup plotting have described the jail as a camp worse than Auschwitz.
The legal team was speaking after their arrival in South Africa from Zimbabwe where they have been dealing with the men's case.
They say the white men in the group, in particular, are at times placed in a cell that measures only a square metre.
The men are given food in this cell - mostly pap - once a day. This is pushed under the door and they have to eat with their hands.
While in these cells, they are not allowed anything to read, nor are they allowed anything with which to write.
Some of the men are forced to undress and sit naked in front of the other prisoners. On some days, it is "officially" approved that prisoners be abused.
Bodies are carried out of prison
"One hears how the people are assaulted with batons to anything (that is handy).
"Reon Schutte, another South African who is dying of cancer and who has been in Chikurubi for more than 10 years on charges of apartheid crimes, has had all his teeth knocked out.
One also sees how bodies are carried out of the prison.
"Only then is the abuse over," said Joubert.
According to him, this has had a traumatic effect on the South Africans and their families.
The prison supplies only a blanket and the men wear summer prison clothes.
Lice is rife, but prison authorities refuse to allow the man insecticides.
Joubert said some of the men had contracted a skin disease, possibly due to the poor food. One also had chickenpox. These were the most horrific conditions that one could imagine.
He said that every day the men got pap and a cup of dried rice with a bit of cooked cabbage.
After the legal team got a court order to allow them to take in food, the prison authorities claimed it would have to be tasted in their presence.
The prison also had no jerseys for the men. The men's families organised jerseys that looked exactly like prison ones as well as socks.
Kept under restraint 24 hours a day
Now, the prison authorities were refusing to allow the men to have the jerseys.
There were reports that the men were planning to escape and they were now being kept in handcuffs and leg irons 24 hours a day.
"They are also not allowed to wear the socks because then the leg irons don't chaff as much," said Griebenow.
He said it was ironic that the "experienced" prisoners were helping the South Africans. They kept up their spirits and advised them from experience.
Griebenow said: "They are hardened and used to the conditions. Surprisingly, the men are in good spirits and are positive."Zim Jail
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Tunisia
Posts: 31
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Help please!
PLEASE TAKE 2 MINUTES TO READ ... OUR FAMILY NEEDS YOUR SUPPORT - THEN PLEASE PASS ON AND COPY MY BROTHER-IN-LAW Craig Hudson on [email protected]
Dear Friends,
I am writing this e-mail as a last desperate attempt to save 70 men, from what will surely be, a terrible human rights violation, if Mr. Mugabe's plan to extradite them from Zimbabwe to Equatorial Guinea goes through. For those of you that are not aware of the events leading up to their incarceration, I will briefly paint the scenario:
On the 7 March 2004, 3 crew, 64 security guards, and a cargo of supplies left South Africa on a chartered flight for the Democratic republic of Congo. On route they landed in Zimbabwe, at Harare International Airport, to pick up a consignment of arms and ammunition which had been legally purchased from Zimbabwe Defense Industries. The men, the supplies and the ammunitions were to be used to guard mines in the DRC. On landing in Harare the plane was boarded by the Zimbabwe military, and all the crew and passengers were arrested, for supposedly contravening Zimbabwe immigration laws, for contravening laws regarding the possession of weapons, (Which they did not have in their possession yet), and plotting a coupe in Equatorial Guinea.
Unbeknown to any of the men, 15 men had been arrested in Equatorial Guinea for supposedly plotting to kill the president of that country, and overthrow his government. Allegedly they were going to replace him with the previous leader of the country, in return for oil and mining rights. The president of EG is MR Nguema, an absolute dictator, who rules his country with an iron fist. There are no newspapers or bookshops in EG. The people do not receive any education. And there is definitely no Rule of law. This man had is own Uncle executed after he took over the country. A South African man named Nick Du Toit appeared on National television claiming that the men in Zimbabwe were destined for Equatorial Guinea, and the 14 men in EG were an advance party. Anyone who watched this broadcast could have seen that he was making this statement under duress. It could be clearly heard that someone was coaching him from behind the camera. Mr. Du Toit an ex Special Forces member and now businessman in EG, had made this confession only two days after his arrest. What self serving Special Forces member would give up this information so quickly? A week later it was reported that one of the 15 had died from Cerebral Malaria. A man who was this sick was going to overthrow the government? I can't believe it.
Meanwhile back in Zimbabwe the 70 men were sitting in jail. Many accusations were being reported in the media, without may I add any solid proof, to back any of the media reports. Our own Foreign Minister the Honorable DR. Zuma went on national television and stated that Foreign affairs could do nothing for these men as they had committed a crime in another country. What crime? No charges had been laid against any of the men yet. What happened to our Constitutional right to be Innocent until Proven Guilty? The charges as mentioned earlier were only laid a number of days later, and the men were remanded in custody until their court appearance date of the 5 April 2004. On this date the case was postponed, and after numerous postponements the case was finally heard this weak. Meanwhile the men remained in a maximum security prison in Zimbabwe, where the have allegedly been tortured and beaten by some "other force" according to the Zimbabwe courts. On Wednesday the defense gave there closing arguments, but the prosecution claimed they were not ready with their closing arguments, and the case was adjourned until today 30 April 2004. I believe no credible evidence was given against the 70 men, and the defense requested that all charges be dropped, and the men be released.
The story now takes a turn for the worse. On Wednesday 28 April 2004, Zimbabwe suddenly signs an extradition treaty with Equatorial Guinea. On Thursday President Nguema flies into Bulawayo and has a meeting with President Mugabe, and now all of a sudden the 70 men are to be extradited to EG. If I am not mistaken in most countries you can only be extradited to another country to stand trial if you have committed a crime in that country. 99% of these men never been to Equatorial Guinea, let alone committed a crime there. The South African Foreign affairs ministry sent a delegation to EG in March to visit the detainees. They never got to see them. On their return to South Africa they stated in their report, that they do not believe that the men would receive a fair trial in that country. If this is the case, then the 70 men, will surely also not receive a fair trial.
The Foreign Ministry has stated that they cannot intervene, as they have no legal grounds. What happened to our constitution, which gives every one of us the right to a fair trial? If the Foreign Ministry believes that they are guilty then the 70 men should have been extradited to South Africa, and stand trial under The Foreign Military Assistance act? But they have not applied for extradition to RSA, so we must assume they to have no evidence to support the claims, in which case the 70 men are innocent, and DR. Zuma should be doing everything in her power to have the 70 men released, and returned home. These 70 men do have rights under our constitution, just as all prisoners in South Africa have rights.
I have put you through the agony of this story, as one of the 70 men, is my Father in-law. He was the flight Engineer on this plane, and was only contracted for this charter flight. Even if the Foreign Ministry has no legal grounds to oppose the extradition, they have a moral and civic duty to ensure that all South Africans are awarded all Human Rights under our constitution, and that includes a fair trial. Quiet diplomacy will not help.
Please send this mail to all your friends and colleagues, and copy me. This way we can form a petition to take to our Honorable President Mr. Mbeki that he may intervene and ensure that these men come home safely.
Best Regards
Craig Hudson
Boksburg 17 Round Table
East Rand Area IRO/PRO
Tel : +27 11 455 0265
Fax : +27 11 455 0268
Mobile: +27 82 820 8658
e-mail : [email protected]
Dear Friends,
I am writing this e-mail as a last desperate attempt to save 70 men, from what will surely be, a terrible human rights violation, if Mr. Mugabe's plan to extradite them from Zimbabwe to Equatorial Guinea goes through. For those of you that are not aware of the events leading up to their incarceration, I will briefly paint the scenario:
On the 7 March 2004, 3 crew, 64 security guards, and a cargo of supplies left South Africa on a chartered flight for the Democratic republic of Congo. On route they landed in Zimbabwe, at Harare International Airport, to pick up a consignment of arms and ammunition which had been legally purchased from Zimbabwe Defense Industries. The men, the supplies and the ammunitions were to be used to guard mines in the DRC. On landing in Harare the plane was boarded by the Zimbabwe military, and all the crew and passengers were arrested, for supposedly contravening Zimbabwe immigration laws, for contravening laws regarding the possession of weapons, (Which they did not have in their possession yet), and plotting a coupe in Equatorial Guinea.
Unbeknown to any of the men, 15 men had been arrested in Equatorial Guinea for supposedly plotting to kill the president of that country, and overthrow his government. Allegedly they were going to replace him with the previous leader of the country, in return for oil and mining rights. The president of EG is MR Nguema, an absolute dictator, who rules his country with an iron fist. There are no newspapers or bookshops in EG. The people do not receive any education. And there is definitely no Rule of law. This man had is own Uncle executed after he took over the country. A South African man named Nick Du Toit appeared on National television claiming that the men in Zimbabwe were destined for Equatorial Guinea, and the 14 men in EG were an advance party. Anyone who watched this broadcast could have seen that he was making this statement under duress. It could be clearly heard that someone was coaching him from behind the camera. Mr. Du Toit an ex Special Forces member and now businessman in EG, had made this confession only two days after his arrest. What self serving Special Forces member would give up this information so quickly? A week later it was reported that one of the 15 had died from Cerebral Malaria. A man who was this sick was going to overthrow the government? I can't believe it.
Meanwhile back in Zimbabwe the 70 men were sitting in jail. Many accusations were being reported in the media, without may I add any solid proof, to back any of the media reports. Our own Foreign Minister the Honorable DR. Zuma went on national television and stated that Foreign affairs could do nothing for these men as they had committed a crime in another country. What crime? No charges had been laid against any of the men yet. What happened to our Constitutional right to be Innocent until Proven Guilty? The charges as mentioned earlier were only laid a number of days later, and the men were remanded in custody until their court appearance date of the 5 April 2004. On this date the case was postponed, and after numerous postponements the case was finally heard this weak. Meanwhile the men remained in a maximum security prison in Zimbabwe, where the have allegedly been tortured and beaten by some "other force" according to the Zimbabwe courts. On Wednesday the defense gave there closing arguments, but the prosecution claimed they were not ready with their closing arguments, and the case was adjourned until today 30 April 2004. I believe no credible evidence was given against the 70 men, and the defense requested that all charges be dropped, and the men be released.
The story now takes a turn for the worse. On Wednesday 28 April 2004, Zimbabwe suddenly signs an extradition treaty with Equatorial Guinea. On Thursday President Nguema flies into Bulawayo and has a meeting with President Mugabe, and now all of a sudden the 70 men are to be extradited to EG. If I am not mistaken in most countries you can only be extradited to another country to stand trial if you have committed a crime in that country. 99% of these men never been to Equatorial Guinea, let alone committed a crime there. The South African Foreign affairs ministry sent a delegation to EG in March to visit the detainees. They never got to see them. On their return to South Africa they stated in their report, that they do not believe that the men would receive a fair trial in that country. If this is the case, then the 70 men, will surely also not receive a fair trial.
The Foreign Ministry has stated that they cannot intervene, as they have no legal grounds. What happened to our constitution, which gives every one of us the right to a fair trial? If the Foreign Ministry believes that they are guilty then the 70 men should have been extradited to South Africa, and stand trial under The Foreign Military Assistance act? But they have not applied for extradition to RSA, so we must assume they to have no evidence to support the claims, in which case the 70 men are innocent, and DR. Zuma should be doing everything in her power to have the 70 men released, and returned home. These 70 men do have rights under our constitution, just as all prisoners in South Africa have rights.
I have put you through the agony of this story, as one of the 70 men, is my Father in-law. He was the flight Engineer on this plane, and was only contracted for this charter flight. Even if the Foreign Ministry has no legal grounds to oppose the extradition, they have a moral and civic duty to ensure that all South Africans are awarded all Human Rights under our constitution, and that includes a fair trial. Quiet diplomacy will not help.
Please send this mail to all your friends and colleagues, and copy me. This way we can form a petition to take to our Honorable President Mr. Mbeki that he may intervene and ensure that these men come home safely.
Best Regards
Craig Hudson
Boksburg 17 Round Table
East Rand Area IRO/PRO
Tel : +27 11 455 0265
Fax : +27 11 455 0268
Mobile: +27 82 820 8658
e-mail : [email protected]
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Cape Town (where else?)
Posts: 579
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From News24
Double standards over torture
05/05/2004
Cape Town - Freedom Front Plus leader Dr Pieter Mulder on Wednesday accused government of double standards when it comes to the issue of torture around the world.
The FF Plus supported Deputy Minister Aziz Pahad's condemnation of the alleged torture and humiliation of Iraqi prisoners by American and British soldiers.
In the so-called war against terrorism actions such as these were like pouring oil on the fire of extremist Muslim groups, and confirmed the ignorance of the United States regarding the handling of terrorism.
However, South Africans "are sick and tired of double standards".
"For what reason did Deputy Minister Pahad at the same time not condemn the torture and maltreatment of 70 South African citizens in Zimbabwean jails?
"Shocking evidence of poor treatment of South African citizens in Zimbabwean jails was published during the last couple of weeks," he said.
These South African citizens were still awaiting trail and should therefore be regarded as not guilty.
Pahad and government's silence and lack of action sent a clear message of double standards regarding Zimbabwe.
When Robert McBride was imprisoned in 1999 for alleged arms trafficking and espionage in Mozambique the government did everything in its power to assist him.
"For what reason is government now acting differently?" Mulder asked.
05/05/2004
Cape Town - Freedom Front Plus leader Dr Pieter Mulder on Wednesday accused government of double standards when it comes to the issue of torture around the world.
The FF Plus supported Deputy Minister Aziz Pahad's condemnation of the alleged torture and humiliation of Iraqi prisoners by American and British soldiers.
In the so-called war against terrorism actions such as these were like pouring oil on the fire of extremist Muslim groups, and confirmed the ignorance of the United States regarding the handling of terrorism.
However, South Africans "are sick and tired of double standards".
"For what reason did Deputy Minister Pahad at the same time not condemn the torture and maltreatment of 70 South African citizens in Zimbabwean jails?
"Shocking evidence of poor treatment of South African citizens in Zimbabwean jails was published during the last couple of weeks," he said.
These South African citizens were still awaiting trail and should therefore be regarded as not guilty.
Pahad and government's silence and lack of action sent a clear message of double standards regarding Zimbabwe.
When Robert McBride was imprisoned in 1999 for alleged arms trafficking and espionage in Mozambique the government did everything in its power to assist him.
"For what reason is government now acting differently?" Mulder asked.
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: South Africa
Posts: 5
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Bob Expecting Trouble
Popped into Charles Prince airport the other day to find the place crawling in soldiers. An Armoured car and twin anti-aircraft gun was parked right on the threshhold of runway 24. Didn't see what may have been parked on the other thresholds!!
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Sandpit
Posts: 313
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Nguema expecting trouble as well?
Just coming back from a medevac in Malabo. These guys were already freaks before, but now it seems they have become completely crazy about incoming planes. My company used to have authorizations valid for 3 months to fly into Equatorial Guinea, now their validity has gone down to 48 hours!!!
Also, the Mi24s which used to be based in Bata have been brought back to the capital.
Also, the Mi24s which used to be based in Bata have been brought back to the capital.
Guys, this is reaching crisis point.
the only way we can we can influence the outcome here is through Mbeki.
We need to establish a link. Zim is so short of so many things right now, leaverage is our best weapon. How is this done?
Forget about your Geneva Convention etc. This is the real world
the only way we can we can influence the outcome here is through Mbeki.
We need to establish a link. Zim is so short of so many things right now, leaverage is our best weapon. How is this done?
Forget about your Geneva Convention etc. This is the real world
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Cape Town (where else?)
Posts: 579
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Harare court refuses to drop 'mercenary' case
Harare court refuses to drop 'mercenary' case
May 12 2004
Harare - A Zimbabwe magistrate on Wednesday refused to dismiss a case against 70 suspected mercenaries, saying there was evidence to suggest that they were part of a plot to topple the president of oil-rich Equatorial Guinea.
Magistrate Mishrod Guvamombe told a special court hearing in a high-security Harare prison that government lawyers had shown that the men - mostly South Africans - should stand trial.
"I am satisfied that there is a reasonable suspicion that the 70 suspected persons committed a crime as alleged by the state," Guvamombe said, rejecting a defence bid to have the case dismissed.
The men were arrested in March after their plane landed in Harare on what Zimbabwe officials said was a mission to oust President Teodoro Obiang Nguema Mbasogo of Equatorial Guinea, sub-Saharan Africa's third largest oil producer.
'The state has got no case to start with'
The suspects have denied the charges, saying they were heading to the Democratic Republic of Congo to guard mining operations.
But state lawyer Lawrence Phiri told the court on Wednesday that prosecutors had evidence of a contract between one of the detained men, Simon Mann, and exiled Equatorial Guinea opposition leader Severo Moto.
"There is an existing contract, and we have that contract, to show that Simon Mann and his men were going to be paid a certain amount, with the highest being $15-million for Simon Mann and $3-million for the generality," Phiri said.
Phiri also said the government had a videotape of Mann contracting to buy "dangerous weapons" from state-owned arms maker Zimbabwe Defence Industries during an earlier trip to Zimbabwe.
"Any reasonable man, hearing what they did, would conclude that they were terrorists and mercenaries," Phiri said.
They fear the men could be executed if found guilty
Jonathan Samkange, a lawyer for the detained men, said the state had not produced any evidence to back up its allegations and urged the court to free the suspects.
"The state has got no case to start with," Samkange said.
Equatorial Guinea has detained another 15 men on similar charges, saying foreign interests were behind the alleged coup plot.
Friends and family members of the men arrested in Zimbabwe have urged South Africa to intervene, saying they fear the men could be executed if found guilty.
South Africa, which has laws barring its citizens from mercenary activity, has said it will not get involved in the trial but may attempt to intervene if death sentences are passed.
News24
May 12 2004
Harare - A Zimbabwe magistrate on Wednesday refused to dismiss a case against 70 suspected mercenaries, saying there was evidence to suggest that they were part of a plot to topple the president of oil-rich Equatorial Guinea.
Magistrate Mishrod Guvamombe told a special court hearing in a high-security Harare prison that government lawyers had shown that the men - mostly South Africans - should stand trial.
"I am satisfied that there is a reasonable suspicion that the 70 suspected persons committed a crime as alleged by the state," Guvamombe said, rejecting a defence bid to have the case dismissed.
The men were arrested in March after their plane landed in Harare on what Zimbabwe officials said was a mission to oust President Teodoro Obiang Nguema Mbasogo of Equatorial Guinea, sub-Saharan Africa's third largest oil producer.
'The state has got no case to start with'
The suspects have denied the charges, saying they were heading to the Democratic Republic of Congo to guard mining operations.
But state lawyer Lawrence Phiri told the court on Wednesday that prosecutors had evidence of a contract between one of the detained men, Simon Mann, and exiled Equatorial Guinea opposition leader Severo Moto.
"There is an existing contract, and we have that contract, to show that Simon Mann and his men were going to be paid a certain amount, with the highest being $15-million for Simon Mann and $3-million for the generality," Phiri said.
Phiri also said the government had a videotape of Mann contracting to buy "dangerous weapons" from state-owned arms maker Zimbabwe Defence Industries during an earlier trip to Zimbabwe.
"Any reasonable man, hearing what they did, would conclude that they were terrorists and mercenaries," Phiri said.
They fear the men could be executed if found guilty
Jonathan Samkange, a lawyer for the detained men, said the state had not produced any evidence to back up its allegations and urged the court to free the suspects.
"The state has got no case to start with," Samkange said.
Equatorial Guinea has detained another 15 men on similar charges, saying foreign interests were behind the alleged coup plot.
Friends and family members of the men arrested in Zimbabwe have urged South Africa to intervene, saying they fear the men could be executed if found guilty.
South Africa, which has laws barring its citizens from mercenary activity, has said it will not get involved in the trial but may attempt to intervene if death sentences are passed.
News24
Moderator
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Hilton, Sheraton or Marriott
Posts: 1,817
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Now things start to get a little clearer. Or muddier - depending on how you look at it.
Zim 70 in blood-for-fuel deal?
Pretoria - The 70 South Africans being held in Zimbabwe for an alleged coup attempt reportedly will be extradited to Equatorial Guinea in a "blood-for-fuel transaction". The value of the transaction between Zimbabwean President Robert Mugabe and President Obiang Nguema of Equatorial Guinea is estimated at U$1.2bn. The agreement was apparently reached when the two leaders were in South Africa for the inauguration of South African President Thabo Mbeki. Mbeki, Mugabe and Nguema held talks while the two foreign heads of state were here for the inauguration.
Wilna Lubbe, the lawyer representing the men, said in Pretoria on Friday it was alarming that South African lives had become so cheap that they could be exchanged for commodities such as fuel. On Friday, The Independent in Zimbabwe reported that intelligence sources had claimed Zimbabwe would receive the fuel as soon as the men were extradited.
The agreement apparently is that for the next two years Zimbabwe will receive fuel to the value of US$50m a month.
Equatorial Guinea is one of the most-recent African suppliers of fuel, from which countries such as the United States benefits.
According to the agreement, Equatorial Guinea will supply 65 million litres of diesel and 40 million litres of petrol a month.
This deal will greatly alleviate Zimbabwe's dragging fuel crisis after a much-smaller transaction fell through between Harare and Libya in exchange for certain key properties .
These developments follow a change of heart by the Zimbabwean government, which until recently had declared explicitly that the men would not be extradited until they had had a fair trial. Shortly after this announcement, and just before the inauguration in South Africa, Zimbabwe's extradition laws were amended to include Equatorial Guinea. The Zimbabwean government then declared they would extradite the men to Equatorial Guinea, and not only after they had had a fair trial.
Fourteen men, among them eight South Africans, are being held on similar charges in Equatorial Guinea. The Independent reported that Zimbabwe needed about US$40m worth of fuel a month to meet the country's needs. Zimbabwe has had sporadic fuel shortages since 1999, and these have increased drastically since the country's economic decline.
Pretoria - The 70 South Africans being held in Zimbabwe for an alleged coup attempt reportedly will be extradited to Equatorial Guinea in a "blood-for-fuel transaction". The value of the transaction between Zimbabwean President Robert Mugabe and President Obiang Nguema of Equatorial Guinea is estimated at U$1.2bn. The agreement was apparently reached when the two leaders were in South Africa for the inauguration of South African President Thabo Mbeki. Mbeki, Mugabe and Nguema held talks while the two foreign heads of state were here for the inauguration.
Wilna Lubbe, the lawyer representing the men, said in Pretoria on Friday it was alarming that South African lives had become so cheap that they could be exchanged for commodities such as fuel. On Friday, The Independent in Zimbabwe reported that intelligence sources had claimed Zimbabwe would receive the fuel as soon as the men were extradited.
The agreement apparently is that for the next two years Zimbabwe will receive fuel to the value of US$50m a month.
Equatorial Guinea is one of the most-recent African suppliers of fuel, from which countries such as the United States benefits.
According to the agreement, Equatorial Guinea will supply 65 million litres of diesel and 40 million litres of petrol a month.
This deal will greatly alleviate Zimbabwe's dragging fuel crisis after a much-smaller transaction fell through between Harare and Libya in exchange for certain key properties .
These developments follow a change of heart by the Zimbabwean government, which until recently had declared explicitly that the men would not be extradited until they had had a fair trial. Shortly after this announcement, and just before the inauguration in South Africa, Zimbabwe's extradition laws were amended to include Equatorial Guinea. The Zimbabwean government then declared they would extradite the men to Equatorial Guinea, and not only after they had had a fair trial.
Fourteen men, among them eight South Africans, are being held on similar charges in Equatorial Guinea. The Independent reported that Zimbabwe needed about US$40m worth of fuel a month to meet the country's needs. Zimbabwe has had sporadic fuel shortages since 1999, and these have increased drastically since the country's economic decline.
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Somewhere South of the Limpopo
Posts: 371
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Absolutely Bloody Incredible....!!!!!!
Mad Bob has gone too far - he has already 'sold' (given away) half of Zim to Gadaffi in exchange for oil. This even includes part ownership in the Kariba Hydro Electric station - and now he is selling blood for oil from yet another dictator.
Why - please tell me - does the rest of the world do nothing..?
Mad Bob has gone too far - he has already 'sold' (given away) half of Zim to Gadaffi in exchange for oil. This even includes part ownership in the Kariba Hydro Electric station - and now he is selling blood for oil from yet another dictator.
Why - please tell me - does the rest of the world do nothing..?
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: oppieplaas
Posts: 190
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Ravings about a mad dog named Bob
I was once told in Cameroon during a discussion with some well educated African gentlemen, that the problem with Africa is that we dont have presidents, but a new generation of kings. A generation of kings that were the Liberation Fighters of the past, that hasnt got the breeding, blood or bearing to be a king.
Be that as it may.
I heard confidentially that Mad Dog has a nasty desease, one that he share with that nasty little block head corporal, that caused all the trouble in WWII. The BIG Crocodile Bite.
Apparently it gets to the brain if not treated timeously, to make one as rabid as a dog with Rabies. One that the most humane cure would be to put it down before it passes the contagious desease around. Makes sence doesnt it!
I am starting to think that we might have another, running loose in the armpit of Africa. He was quite sick a couple of years ago, and from inside the palace the word was, it was the size of tennis balls,he seemed to get a bit better. Now it seems it made a comeback in the same form as Mad Dog
Little T, I hope you are not hoping to inherit the presidency from Daddy. You sounded like such a well educated well balanced young man when I met you in the Pizza Place in Malabo, such promise. Lets hope.
Mad Bob if you get this via your very efficient secret police, I hope your young wife kicks your tennis balls, and you feel it for as long as you still have them.
Captain, Sir, Mr Moderator, Sir, I am sorry for the tone of this post but if you have his personal e-mail adress I will send it to him myself.
Helpless fustration got the better of me.
I promise no animals, women, or small children were harmed during the writing of this post.
Thabo goes ".. nice bob, good bob....." thats something!
Be that as it may.
I heard confidentially that Mad Dog has a nasty desease, one that he share with that nasty little block head corporal, that caused all the trouble in WWII. The BIG Crocodile Bite.
Apparently it gets to the brain if not treated timeously, to make one as rabid as a dog with Rabies. One that the most humane cure would be to put it down before it passes the contagious desease around. Makes sence doesnt it!
I am starting to think that we might have another, running loose in the armpit of Africa. He was quite sick a couple of years ago, and from inside the palace the word was, it was the size of tennis balls,he seemed to get a bit better. Now it seems it made a comeback in the same form as Mad Dog
Little T, I hope you are not hoping to inherit the presidency from Daddy. You sounded like such a well educated well balanced young man when I met you in the Pizza Place in Malabo, such promise. Lets hope.
Mad Bob if you get this via your very efficient secret police, I hope your young wife kicks your tennis balls, and you feel it for as long as you still have them.
Captain, Sir, Mr Moderator, Sir, I am sorry for the tone of this post but if you have his personal e-mail adress I will send it to him myself.
Helpless fustration got the better of me.
I promise no animals, women, or small children were harmed during the writing of this post.
Thabo goes ".. nice bob, good bob....." thats something!
