No type rating ?
 

...
I think the clue is in the genteel expression "... above the clouds ..." (Fourth paragraph of the Zenon advert ) https://www.zenon.aero/jobs/5171-vir...econd-officer/

No mention of type ratings or bonds etc. I guess you get a company-specific, non-portable ticket that would be useless elsewhere, and won't get you any P1S time either.

I would be pleased to be told it ain't so.

LFH
...

Exactly
Also specifically states supporting the Capt & FO, that would highly suggest being a cruise pilot, to me anyway

"Supporting the Commander and First Officer, you’ll provide consistent operational excellence above the clouds"

Here’s an idea. Just throwing it out there. If you’re genuinely interested show a bit of determination and phone up Zenon and ask? Or just slate UK opportunities from afar before having any facts?

Anyone got any idea on what they would be paying second officers? the post only says competetive

Top cadet pay scale is circa £44k and bottom FO is circa £63k . Guessing it will be somewhere in between , probably more likely to be nearer the bottom of those two !!!!

Second officer starting salary is 59k.

Can I ask were you came about this info? A Virgin recruiter my mate messaged directly didn’t even know this info at this stage.

Cheers

https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....99995ef30a.jpg
This may be out of date already, and found above in this forum, but no SO position showing, possibly around the same as CDT figures?

Well we did ask but were ignored which I understand is industry standard until you have been personally registered as an applicant, and then some.

They all say 'competitive'. ... Well they would, wouldn't they ?

In this case, the word in our pub last Friday is that no decision about pay scales for Virgin Cruise Pilots has yet been made. They are waiting to see how many applicants they attract before deciding how low they can afford to pitch the pay.

LFH

It was posted above £59k.

I can confirm that is what I was told on the phone as well.
SO cruise pilot
£59k year 1
£60k year 2

When you move to FO you move to first pay point.
The only real benefit is seniority when it comes to command.
You would be ahead of an FO/SFO if they joined after you.

No it’s not. It’s actually closer to the truth than you realise!
Feel free to wear high heels and make up guys!

I stand by what I said. A forward thinking stance from Virgin, quickly replicated elsewhere.

Welcome to the world where people are (hopefully) not restricted to antiquated gender norms or stereotypes and do not have to kowtow to narrow minded dinosaurs, in or out of the flight deck.

The problem for Virgin is that whilst it's become socially unacceptable for people to openly disagree with their virtue signalling, the company relies on people buying tickets to stay afloat. As this is a thread about recruitment and pilots making career moves into the airline, it is important to highlight that a significant number of people/dinosaurs either disagree with Virgin's stance or are fed up with being preached to and told what to think, and will actively avoid flying with Virgin as a result. This has serious implications on job security.

If virgin is offering tickets at the right price and start/end points those old dinosaurs won’t care and will still book tickets.

I think you’ll find the vast majority of pax won’t give a sh1t so long as they are served professionally by the crew taking care of them and get to their destination relatively on time.

There will be a few people screaming about this, but the silent majority just want to get on with their lives and holidays/flights…

Hi, has anyone that applied for the Virgin SO position heard anything back yet?

Thanks

Applied on the website as instructed and was emailed the other day to ask for details and copies of licence and such to be sent on but not heard back since. (they asked friday last week)

Nope. Notice how P&O Ferries have miraculously carried on trading despite the cries of a boycott? People don’t care in the slightest.

And if you’re that pigheaded to go out of your way to take a less convenient routing to a destination to ensure that there is no way that a male cabin crew member serving you could be wearing a bit of mascara then you can keep your money…

Some will choose not to fly with VS because of the new policies, others will probably find it a reason to book.

The remaining 99% won't give a **** and will book for the usual reasons people always do.

As a potentially new joiner, I'd more concerned by the chronically fatiguing rosters than whether the he/him pronoun crew member bringing the tea is wearing heels or not.

I guess the old interview question about “what would you do if the Captain turned up in the lobby wearing a dress?” has been removed? Or amplified?

Exactly this. Trip patterns are awfully fatiguing, the recent sleep survey results have said “everything is fine” despite repeated safety and fatigue reports. The mantra on the flight deck was “it’ll get better because it has to”, now the chat is “where are you applying to?”.

It cannot be emphasised enough how horrific rostering is at the moment. I thought it would get better with recruitment but even if we achieve the target recruitment numbers, we still can’t fly the summer program.

New joiner courses being cancelled left right and centre because they can’t fill the spots. The secret is out that Virgin is a totally crap place to work now and I think it’s going to get worse.

Middle Eastern rostering and management ethos with poverty pay.

Go in with your eyes wide open.

The recruitment of Second Officers is a really cheap and thoughtless way to address fatiguing patterns. This current recruitment drive should tell you everything about how Virgin are approaching their rostering and fatigue. They’re going sit a cruise pilot at 36,000ft for 8 hours solid whilst the other crew get time in the bunk. Which means the FDP can be extended and/or the experience in the flight deck reduces as they now require one less CN/FO per flight.

problem solved, “it’s all legal”

How many trips per month for a new SFO on a LifeStyle+ contract? Is it even available?

Anyone know what the interview is like and if there will be sim assesment and what type they will use to do it?

you wouldn’t get lifestyle or lifestyle + for years. There’s a big waiting list. But probably 3 or 4 trips.

An extra 7 days off per month and then the company try and squeeze as much as they can into the remaining 23 days. Have seen a roster where they managed 87 hours in that. Anything better is a bonus

Ah, so 100% work for 80% pay? Sounds… Appealing? :ooh:

Met a couple of VS managers recently, who were very pessimistic about the future; which surprised me, what with the new airplanes, hiring and coming out from the dark days of covid.

It truly is a shame to see. I have many friends in Virgin and I can echo the statements above.
Those that can still make a move are actively doing so.

just out of interest what's the lifestyle and lifestyle+?

Welcome to Virgin 2.0

80% and 65% part time options

I thought it was spelled appalling... 😬

12 VS pilots resigned on just one day earlier this week, although, oddly, it still appeals to some who have secure jobs elsewhere.

Not at my 6/5 Biz company...

It means you’ll do your 900 hours across either 80% of the calendar days of a 100% contract for 80% pay, or 65% of the calendar days for 65% pay by what has been said so far…

Not far off. All you need to know about Virgin at the moment is that crewing is (no joke) rebranded as "Crew Establishment and Productivity Department". It's 1984 without the happy ending.

There's a load of fluffy language from management about being "most loved", but underneath it all it's widebody Ryanair without the honesty to admit what it really is. Everyone is knackered and many/most are looking for other options.

If you are in a job that you're vaguely happy with, you'd be foolish to look at Virgin as a step up

Im convinced it’s managements dream to make rostering so bad that everyone takes “part time”. So the company force nearly 100% flying hours into 80% working time.

So basically 20% pay cut for the same work. And, if a recession happens and flying reduces, then happy days because everyone’s on 80% pay. And if flying picks up, then happy days because pilots have part time weeks to pick up extra trips for a fraction of what it costs to employ an additional pilot. It’s genius really. No wonder the CEO got his £3.2m bonus despite there being “no money”.

At least working under O’Leary you knew where you stood.

How dare they!! Nobody has ever used this rostering model before how outrageous!!

Just don’t tell CX, SQ, QF, NZ etc…

Has VS changed so much? I’m ready for the command at the blue/yellow LCC but the management here is so toxic that I’m willing to leave the upgrade to move elsewhere.

Only thing slightly holding me back would be the money once captain and the roster pattern. Ok maybe the chance of a regional base but that ain’t too much of a priority (no kids etc).

From reading this thread sounds like I’m better off staying where I am which says a lot about VS….

And bunk time is split equally across the pilots. Relief goes first that’s all and gets a nap at the end.