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-   -   Ryanair Cancelling flights! (https://www.pprune.org/terms-endearment/599355-ryanair-cancelling-flights.html)

GScapture 16th Sep 2017 06:34

The airline will not change it's culture nor it'll be changing their t&c's. Maybe some minor bonuses etc. might come to sort everything out but nothing permanent. That's just how the airline is built and how the management thinks about it.

I was told during my type rating, line training and line flying to leave. By several captains who all said the same; "Believe me I've been here x amount of years, nothing will change regardless what happens". Seeing these cancellations to happen is music to my ears personally but I'd still encourage everyone in the company to pursue something elsewhere, if they can. I understand the guys/girls who has limited options or actually have found a base/situation they've managed to sort their life in. Good for them. Anyone else hoping that something will change; It won't.

I'd rather stop flying than return there.

Denti 16th Sep 2017 07:29


Originally Posted by highfive (Post 9893254)
600 ++ Ex Air Berlin B737 rated pilots should sort out any shortages. Seen it all before with Air Europe, for those who can remember.

There might be a slight problem with that. Air Berlin operates an Airbus only fleet. So those pilots are Airbus rated. Yes, a few kept their old 737 rating active, but most didn't. Still, yes, Ryanair was the first to offer a job to AB pilots, 2 hours after the news broke about the brankruptcy they had a job offer in their Linkedin inboxes. Base of choice, direct contract with Ryanair, 20.000€ signing bonus and €130k a year (at 900 hours though).

RAT 5 16th Sep 2017 08:42

What happened to the old pre-EASA 'trick' of zeroing pilots hours at the start old pre- financial year in April? Is that still allowed, or do all pilots, and rostering, keep a rolling 7 day, 28 day, 90 day + annual total? If the zeroing policy was stopped that would have an impact on increasing pilot numbers.

There is some irony here. RYR is a cash machine. They fly >90m pax. Recently they introduced a €2 'seat choice' charge. About 40m pax take up the option. K-ching. The profits rise €80m. No R&D investment; no improvement in product; no capital investment and profits rise by nearly 10%. Brilliant. And if you lower T's & C's as well, at no cost, then profits rise even more. The irony is that 5 years go, after the Volcanic ash affair, they added a €2 charge for 'EU261 compensation' bills. They claimed that affair had cost them €60-80m. Over the past 5 years there has not been a repeat, but every year €160m went into the kitty. K-ching at no extra cost. Now, by their own hand, they will have to dip into that kitty and spend out some of that EU261 insurance premium. It'll be like pulling teeth, but it will need to be done.
One wonders what will be the next €2 add on to recover profits. It is an astonishing business to be able to boost profits by 10% at no investment cost or improvement to the product, just by an inconspicuous € here & € there. Think what €1 could do to provide a proper pension fund & proper T's & C's. and stop crews having to pay for their own recurrent training and associated travel costs etc. etc. They might even then have enough pilots and not have to pay EU261 compensations. i.e. money invested wisely and productively instead of being spent painfully to achieve only negative PR outcomes.

Bravo Zulu 16th Sep 2017 09:16

Sounds like the wheels are finally falling off at Ryanair....!

eduelp 16th Sep 2017 09:23

Don't worry, as usual, dozens of their contractors will come to the rescue flying on their month off and thinking that they are making "extra hours" that way. My colleagues still there already told me about a few cases.

Poor ignorants.... RYR pilots have always lacked balls.

smith 16th Sep 2017 10:00


Originally Posted by SliabhLuachra (Post 9893134)
Oh, grow up! Tell that to the bank and your family who's house will be taken away after you've bounded it to a loan if you don't start working. It's the management's fault. Sickening stuff goes on there. They're working in their office with slides and pool tables in blissful ignorance while people are having their careers ruined and their lives as well.

Yeah sickening stuff goes on but people have been aware of this for years and still sign the dotted line. I'm talking about the youngsters who don't have a mortgage and no debts as mum and dad payed their training. These are the ones that will trample over anyone and drop their pants to their ankles. The secret is to get a decent job before you get a mortgage. No sympathy for FR merecenaries.

TheMightyAtom 16th Sep 2017 10:44

So if you had a freshly minted CPL/IR in hand, you would gladly stay in the dole queue rather than kick start your career with Ryanair assuming there was no other option? It seems hard to believe that someone would be so noble in the face of having their career, potentially permanently, put on hiatus. Are we also supposed to believe that someone who, through sheer circumstance and good fortune ended up in a pleasant company enjoying generous T&Cs that their predecessors have fought for, are simply made of sterner stuff - if they were to end up in the position of a Ryanair pilot, their unstoppable willpower and sense of decency would stop the rot, not like those thousands of cowards who currently work there, sobbing during the pushback, absolutely incapable of improving their situation because they lack the cast iron balls of those gentlemen aviators in Air Utopia.

slowjet 16th Sep 2017 11:06

My posts keep being deleted so this one may not stay up for long. But, a gentle reminder, chaps. Airlines are not in business to employ pilots. We jump on the band waggon . Top stars were here today, gone tomorrow; Laker (BUA/Laker Airways), Bristow,Goodman etc, etc.They and those of today are all top performing aces in the industry, within their field. Entrepreneurs out to make a lot of money and hugely successful in their pursuits. "We" hitch our wagons to those shooting stars and must accept the fall-out when, in "our" field, it all goes belly up.


As "commercial" pilots, go wherever it suits you & be prepared to jump wherever the grass looks greener. The loyalty cards became extinct, decades ago.


I still serve on Selection Boards in a consultancy role . I still hear CP's asking "How long do you intend staying with us ?". I stifle a giggle into my sleeve.

Skyjob 16th Sep 2017 12:08


Originally Posted by Denti (Post 9893323)
There might be a slight problem with that. Air Berlin operates an Airbus only fleet. So those pilots are Airbus rated. Yes, a few kept their old 737 rating active, but most didn't. Still, yes, Ryanair was the first to offer a job to AB pilots, 2 hours after the news broke about the brankruptcy they had a job offer in their Linkedin inboxes. Base of choice, direct contract with Ryanair, 20.000€ signing bonus and €130k a year (at 900 hours though).

More than what their own pilots now earn in some bases, good offer!

Faldo 16th Sep 2017 12:20

Well doesn't it just serve them right
 
Ha ha ha ha ha At last the arrogant self important Irishman can see what happens when
you treat one of your most important employee groups, the pilots, like under paid overworked
taxi drivers ! I hope your unfortunate customers remember your total disregard for them when
they next book a ticket with you.

fmgc 16th Sep 2017 12:37


Originally Posted by slowjet (Post 9893473)

As "commercial" pilots, go wherever it suits you & be prepared to jump wherever the grass looks greener. The loyalty cards became extinct, decades ago.

But that is not always possible as many of the more sought after jobs are in airlines with seniority.

Seniority is massively to blame for this industry's woes. It thwarts job mobility and so traps those in seniority based airlines and stops movement of experienced (Captains) pilots into seniority based airlines allowing the likes of FR to take advantage.

Yet the unions still push seniority as all pilots have is industrial might and so protects the unions' membership levels.

Skyjob 16th Sep 2017 12:44

AGREED 100%

Can737 16th Sep 2017 12:44


But that is not always possible as many of the more sought after jobs are in airlines with seniority.
Seniority is great when you want to keep all the backstabbing whores out of the CP office.
Nice to see that karma is b***, even with RYR. I am getting a popcorn and I plan to enjoy the show.

babemagnet 16th Sep 2017 15:06

Anybody heard that Ray (Rene for the dutch) Conway has resigned!?

doniedarko 16th Sep 2017 15:37

As far as I know it was a gross misconduct offence for a ryr pilot to delay a flight for non operational reasons.
One wonders if any management will suffer (position or bonus) at the hands of the shareholders.
Who if any should take the blame for this ? CEO / Director of flight ops / personnel ......or maybe we should blame pilots for leaving / not joining or taking holidays 😀

Say Mach Number 16th Sep 2017 16:17

If Ray has resigned genuinely sorry to hear that.

However what is clear is that the lunatics that took over the asylum were never going to blame themselves.

jeehaa 16th Sep 2017 16:26

Seems like a hoax though

dan1165 16th Sep 2017 17:55

Titanic is sinking :}

CaptainSensible 16th Sep 2017 18:11

They make the profit that most Airlines can only dream of and still not enough. When eventually all the facts are known it'll probably be used as a lesson during business courses.

fr666andback 16th Sep 2017 18:12


Originally Posted by Long Haul (Post 9893272)
According to this article in the Guardian, "The airline is changing its internal calendar as part of increases in holiday allowances for pilots and cabin staff, which has contributed to the backlog." Anyone noticed "increases in holiday allowances" recently?

https://www.theguardian.com/business...ve-punctuality

In case of cabin crew their “holidays” it’s an unpaid leave….


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