PPRuNe Forums

PPRuNe Forums (https://www.pprune.org/)
-   Terms and Endearment (https://www.pprune.org/terms-endearment-38/)
-   -   Ryanair Cancelling flights! (https://www.pprune.org/terms-endearment/599355-ryanair-cancelling-flights.html)

babemagnet 10th Sep 2017 15:05

Ryanair Cancelling flights!
Ryanair just cancelled 2 flights out of spain because there is no crew! According to managment Ryanair has enough captains 😩

BluSdUp 10th Sep 2017 15:19

Were was this and how do you now for a fact it was due to lack of crew.
They would take the Learjet and fly in crew if they had any or fly a spare aircraft with crew in if any inside say 2-3 hrs range.

Just curious were?

Jonnyknoxville 10th Sep 2017 17:47

quick look on the website shows 3 flights from CRL canx for bad weather (even though its fine) to corfu ,pisa and santander

Stn canx malaga and beziers

bcn canx vigo and ibiza

7 flights out of CIA canx

5 out of pisa canx
2 out of lisbon canx

Mostly refers to bad weather although it doesn't seem too bad out there now

TheMightyAtom 10th Sep 2017 19:12

I can add another to the list for today, no FO rostered and none on standby for the (rather large) base.

I-PIERLU 10th Sep 2017 20:35

We covered our colleagues' flight to be operated at 4:30 with 8 hours delay, after our duty... They look pretty well organized and ready.

RAT 5 10th Sep 2017 20:39

This idea of cancelling flights due Wx or ATC has been tried many times before so that 'extraneous circumstances' can be claimed by the operator & no EU compensation paid. I thought that dubious practice had been exposed and thwarted previously. If that is correct, and if these stories are correct, how can this attempt at scurrilous excuses succeed?

Skipname 10th Sep 2017 21:55

It can succeed because your average passenger doesn't know how to determine if the weather is actually bad enough to cancel a flight. They see some clouds out there and take the airline's word for it.

It makes me very happy to see that they have crew problems. After screwing the crew for so long, it was long overdue for the roles to reverse. I also hope this is just the tip of the iceberg.

Ideally the Ryanair crew will follow the pilots from Thomas Cook and go on strike for few days.

EDDT 10th Sep 2017 22:48

They can't strike, because they are not organized in a workers union.

Vokes55 11th Sep 2017 01:12

Well they could go on strike. I think an airline this short on crew is going to be pretty powerless if half the workforce don't turn up one morning, unionised or not.

But of course this won't happen, the majority of Ryanair pilots either have no backbone or would use such an event as an excuse to boost their own career prospects ("look at me, I turned up when everyone else didn't").

Excellent news nonetheless, and certainly more cancellations to follow.

UAV689 11th Sep 2017 11:01

Just a few cancelled flights yesterday...


Yes some are genuine weather/tech. But a lot compared to other days!

7574ever 11th Sep 2017 11:25

One thing I could add: In my experience Ryanair are highly reluctant to cancel flights for any reason, let alone transitory weather conditions. Generally they would delay them as long as crew duty permits or call up a standby crew as necessary. This is certainly odd that they would cancel nearly 80 flights solely for weather reasons. In my personal opinion, if they had standby crew they would mostly have been operated, one way or another.

UAV689 11th Sep 2017 11:45

80 is a lot, especially for a company with bases and aircraft all around the network.

Or maybe, it wasnt a lack of pilots, maybe the 2 people that day in crewing called sick and this was the outcome! I mean, a couple of crewers for 10,000 cabin crew and 4000 pilots is just a bit to 'lean'

Jonnyknoxville 11th Sep 2017 14:07

Doesn't matter anymore anyway , according to the IT guys in Ryanair , soon we won't be an airline anymore , gonna be an online digital something or other . maybe they should have flown the planes .

RAT 5 11th Sep 2017 20:18

They can't strike, because they are not organized in a workers union.

Self-employed? Surely you just phone in as 'unavailable' or 'on another job that has taken a bit longer than expected' or 'I'm sick' or ..........Ive been diverted and will be a couple of hours late, or......

doniedarko 11th Sep 2017 20:27

So RYR would never offer Direct Entry Command upgrades for FO's then .....or is that just a rumour I heard :E

italian stallion 11th Sep 2017 22:09

Well the latest advert offers 10000EU starting bonus if successful. ...

doniedarko 12th Sep 2017 08:54

Big list of cancellations today.....all due to French ATC of course. MOL has constantly called out ATC

“We need to deregulate air traffic control. And there has been no deregulation of airports, airport monopolies have not been broken up,” he says. “The problem is, we do not have a Peter Sutherland any more, there is nobody there with the will or the bottle to break up the airport or air traffic control monopolies.”

and deregulation has worked so well to improve airline T & C's :sad:

Reverserbucket 12th Sep 2017 09:28

French ATC industrial action was Notamed for last night and tonight affecting Marseille and Reims. Might have been a factor?

PSEULGT 12th Sep 2017 10:17

Shortage of crew is a becoming a big issue. Not sure how next summer will shape up when this summer wasn't finalised until April. Many asking where their €10,000 is for staying with the company after 10+ years. How to alienate your workforce. Give DE FOs their base of choice instead of the loyal ones already in the company. FOs with base transfers in to their home bases being told there's no space for them yet DE FOs being put into them instead. There you have a reason why there is a shortage of experienced FOs. SFIs, who are FOs, only flying ~90hrs a year as they're always in the sim. "The best roster in the business; stable 5 on 4 off pattern"....yeah, right. Maybe 5 years ago, not my experience anyway. Duties changed without notifying the crew in advance. There are cases where they don't even know where people are when they're at work - crewing calling their home numbers asking for them when they're at work?

Bayerische 12th Sep 2017 10:35

Just to put things into perspective on how badly T's and C's have fallen.

A friend of mine got his command in Stansted with Ryanair in 2001. His net salary per month was roughly £5000.

Today 16 years later a Captain in Stansted earns roughly the same.

TheMightyAtom 12th Sep 2017 11:50

For context that's a 59% reduction in net income, wonderful!

Skyjob 12th Sep 2017 11:52

Some references t weather seem genuine.
On 10/09 e.g. Barcelona did not accept any inbound aircraft due weather for over an hour, many pilots had toehold or divert to suit their needs.

smith 12th Sep 2017 12:03

Originally Posted by Bayerische (Post 9889293)
Just to put things into perspective on how badly T's and C's have fallen.

A friend of mine got his command in Stansted with Ryanair in 2001. His net salary per month was roughly £5000.

Today 16 years later a Captain in Stansted earns roughly the same.

Is he complaining or doing anything about it?

Bayerische 12th Sep 2017 13:20

He is long gone.

DND delivery 12th Sep 2017 15:29

"Ryanair schrapte zes vluchten op Charleroi door gebrek aan personeel, niet door slecht weer" - HLN.be

According to this Belgian site (in Dutch), Ryanair cancelled 6 flights from Charleroi on Sunday due to lack of pilots, and not bad weather as they had claimed.

RobsonCanolo 13th Sep 2017 19:32

I would put my money on the in house vehicle for bargaining instead of currency fluctuations why the pay is the same. It's not a great development...

WindSheer 13th Sep 2017 20:10

What's the purpose of an airline?

RAT 5 13th Sep 2017 21:28

Salaries stay the same, profits rise. Hm? There must be a connection. Do the same calculation for euro bases and I suspect you'll find the same relationship, so Brexit is a red-herring.

Shooting_Star 14th Sep 2017 10:41

Anyone knows whats the excuse to cancel tomorrows flights ? https://www.cloud.scorebuddy.co.uk/ryanair-services/cancellations.php?date=2017-09-15

pax britanica 14th Sep 2017 12:59

Anything that damages MOL 's credibility must benefit the aviation industry overall.

Running an airline is not like tarmacing drive ways even if it has been profitable it has basically trashed the business and customer experience for everyone, employees and customers alike

TheMightyAtom 14th Sep 2017 14:13

Funny you should say that...

modelflyer 14th Sep 2017 15:23

Originally Posted by pax britanica (Post 9891512)
Anything that damages MOL 's credibility must benefit the aviation industry overall.

Running an airline is not like tarmacing drive ways even if it has been profitable it has basically trashed the business and customer experience for everyone, employees and customers alike

Sorry, but I am one happy customer.http://cdn.pprune.org/images/smilies/thumbs.gif

For me Ryanair provide reliable, punctual flights at a cost per mile a fraction of what it costs to travel on a UK train - and I've never had to stand in a packed aisle with Ryanair. Two delays in fifteen years. First - Luton-Dublin diverted to Shannon so was late back at Luton (not by much) to take us to Murcia. Second - fire in control tower at Murcia so had to be bussed to Alicante - handled very efficiently.

squeaker 14th Sep 2017 15:29

Glad you like them, however this article sums up why I wouldn't want to fly with them, let alone work for them.

Ryanairpilot 14th Sep 2017 16:16

Modelflyer I'm very pleased for you. Glad you've found the service so good over the years. The problem is that the low fares you enjoy come at the price of continually eroded terms and conditions over the years. This eventually reaches a tipping point as O'Leary is now finding out.

How about putting pressure on the management to treat the staff in a manner that stops swathes of resignations, stops pissing the rest of us off and creates a stable workforce that can maintain the schedule.

I hope you never get caught up in a cancellation because as the small print says, you're on your own.

RAT 5 14th Sep 2017 17:46

Sorry, but I am one happy customer.

Do you buy 'fair trade' coffee & veggies & jeans/clothing etc? Or do you buy the cheapest available? Cheapness comes at a price to the workers & suppliers. Cheap & good value are not the same thing. Mill workers conditions should not be part of 21st century in a hi-tech industry that demands high levels of education, entry cost, dedication, self-sufficiency, leadership, manuals & mental skills in multi-tasking environment while under stress, etc. Once you get to the raw bone there is nothing left to cut and nasty things start to happen. There is no muscle to support the core body and it starts to buckle then collapse. The world is full of examples and those at the top who had bank accounts filled with dosh as the walls burned around their ears.

thetimesreader84 14th Sep 2017 18:10

Sorry, but I am one happy customer.
This is why we can't have nice things.

GScapture 14th Sep 2017 18:54

I wonder how's the 10k bonus thing going on.. :hmm:

Well nevertheless Ryanair will do whatever they can to continue the same story with the cost of employees health and money. At least some happy news today from ECA;

"Ryanair’s Irish fiction refuted by European Court of Justice.

"This ruling puts the convenient fantasy that aircraft registered in Ireland are somehow an airline's own ‘private kingdom’, to the flame”, says ECA Vice-President Jon Horne.

“This argument has been wrongly used to deny mobile workers all over Europe their fundamental rights and made them feel like subjects, not employees. The Court not only clearly states that a worker's home base is their place of employment, but – in addition – that it is the real home base that matters, not an invention by some crafty employers."

modelflyer 14th Sep 2017 19:02

Originally Posted by thetimesreader84 (Post 9891794)
This is why we can't have nice things.

I'm not sure I understand why Ryanair is stopping you having nice things, but if it's a different type of flight you are after then turn up at your preferred airport and await the private jet you could charter. Nice as you like if you've got the money.

My comment certainly stirred up a bit of a hornets' nest it would appear.

However, it seems to me that flying has become a thing of, and for, the masses and as a consequence market forces will drive payscales like most other private-sector places.

Perhaps a corner will be turned soon.

I would applaud the flight deck person who came on the PA and said "We've all got crap wages so would you all please put £10 in the hat as it goes round and I will ensure it gets shared fairly amongst us".

I'm sure if the airlines find staffing a problem (reduced profiyability) things might improve.

TheMightyAtom 14th Sep 2017 19:21

Originally Posted by Normal Pilot (Post 9891744)
Why? care to expand on your comment?

The rumour is they intend to launch a direct entry command upgrade program for experienced FOs

thetimesreader84 14th Sep 2017 19:28

I think there's a more reasonable option between "chartering a private jet" and the FR model of "screwing as much as we can get out of our crews". A few quid (literally single digit numbers) on the ticket price would more than cover adequate Ts & Cs and probably leave enough over for a few bottles of fizz at the CEOs Christmas party.

But that's the issue with the world isn't it? At some point in the last 20 or so years, certainly in my lifetime, we went from "a rising tide lifts all boats" to a "I want as much as I can, for as little as possible".

Like I said, that's why we can't have nice things.

All times are GMT. The time now is 04:03.

Copyright © 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.