Fly for KLM… no Dutch language required.

[DND delivery]

Originally Posted by Lepo

What's the mandatory retirement age in KLM? Can pilots work until 65 or they have to retire earlier?

Retirement age is 58 if you work full time. You can extend it to 62.5 years if you work part time.

[oboema]

Originally Posted by BRNL

I’d like to thank all of you who replied back explaining the salary system at KLM.

• Another few questions (sorry): at my age, 39, how much of a pension would I get a month? 40%? Looks like the pension scheme it goes from 25% to 42%.

• Can I choose to have the 40% pension of my gross salary on the top of my pay and make it part of my salary as well?

• And I guess the salary + 40% pension would be taxable all the same, right?

• Does the company pay per diem when you’re flying? At AA the company pays $3.41 per hours for the time you show up to work til the last hour of the sequence (or paring, here we call sequence). So let’s say your sequence lasts 72:48h from the time you show up to work til you shut down the engines back to your base. It’s gonna be 72:48h x $3.41.

When you fly out of the US, even to the Caribbean/Canada, it goes to $4.01 per hour. Any international flight the per diem is a little higher. And it’s not taxable in the US, I guess in Netherlands is not taxable as well.

So, Using the example above to clarify about the salary + pension;

- 2nd year pay is: €8.380,00 a month + the 40% pension.
Thus, we would have the following math:

€8.380 + 40% = €11.732,00 (gross salary a month if you choose to have your pension at the top of your salary) + your per diems.

Is my thinking correct?

Sorry once again for those questions, but it looks completely different pay scheme and pension then here at American Airlines (the “pension” in the US is called 401K and the 3 legacies in the US pays the same. 18% of your gross salary on your 401k, however, you can not ask them to put on the top of your salary and receive it as part of your salary) and other companies I’ve flown with.

Just trying to understand a bit and see what I could expect, IF one day I have the chance to join KLM.

By the way I just applied. Meanwhile I started studying for my EASA as well. 🤞🏼

Cheers and safe flights guys!!

The pension contribution indeed ranges from around 25% to 42% of your salary. The exact percentage depends on your age: closer to retirement = higher percentage.
According to the law a part of that pension money goes un-taxed into your pension fund, it remains "invisible" and untouchable until you retire. The pension money that remains (over a certain amount, no longer eligible to be put tax-free into the fund) will be added to your salary. With this money you can do as you please; our pension fund has additional investment vehicles available. Long story short: the pension contribution will not be available 1 on 1 on your salary.

Regarding per diems, we have a different system but with more or less the same outcome. For every destination the company makes a separate calculation, so a 3 day trip with only Scandinavian destinations amounts to more that €200, a layover in Eastern Europe will generate less. Hotels are all 4/5*, in city centers (by contract) and breakfast is always on the company dime, so your per diems can be spent on dinner, beer and entertainment.

Good luck with studying for your EASA papers; as far as I know we will be hiring for the next 2 years to come, so there is time

[BRNL]

Oboema, your the man!👍🏼👊🏼


if you could just explain what I saw at KLM careers regarding the part time. “KLM offers the option of part-time work (90%, 80%, 67% and - under certain conditions - 50%).”

what does this 90, 80, 67 and 50% exactly means? It doesn’t make much sense for those not familiar. Is it 90, 80, 67% of the salary? Of the work time?

whatis the salary “loss” when you get part time?

and can you request part time half of the year and another half full time?

thank you once again, man!

[Hank Moody]

Originally Posted by BRNL

Oboema, your the man!👍🏼👊🏼


if you could just explain what I saw at KLM careers regarding the part time. “KLM offers the option of part-time work (90%, 80%, 67% and - under certain conditions - 50%).”

what does this 90, 80, 67 and 50% exactly means? It doesn’t make much sense for those not familiar. Is it 90, 80, 67% of the salary? Of the work time?

whatis the salary “loss” when you get part time?

and can you request part time half of the year and another half full time?

thank you once again, man!

you’re asking questions that has already been answered in this tread. I suggest to you to read the tread.

[bluewhy]

Originally Posted by BRNL

Is it 90, 80, 67% of the salary? Of the work time?

whatis the salary “loss” when you get part time?

I would guess that the 80% part time is 80% of what full time work is, with 80% of what full time pay is.

[semmern]

In KLM, if you work 80% part-time, are you restricted to 720 BLH per year, or can you still fly 900 BLH, but in 80% of the days?

[oboema]

It’s exactly that. So EUR fleet at 100% =16 on/12 off, 90% =14 on 14 off etc etc.

parttime can also be taken in “blocks” so you work a few months 100% or 80% and then every fourth month off, multiple options available.
KLM has no blockhour pay so income is always guaranteed. Working fulltime on 737, only flying 40 hours per month is not uncommon (had 37 in november) but total duty hours can be way longer due to the network inefficiencies.

Company must honor parttime requests by EU law, switching every half year should be possible but don’t know the details (and if planning department would be very happy about it)

[7574ever]

Originally Posted by oboema

previous poster sums it up quite nicely.

Should you start at 39 y.o, Second officer or First officer EUR fleet year 1: €7.820/month, year 2 approx €8.380/month.

Historically the KLM "standard career" considers entry in the company as a former flight school cadet round 20-22 years old. Hence salaries in the beginning are quite low but have a steep progress, figures on PPJN are quite accurate.
Also take into consideration that the company pays up to 40% of the salary as pension contribution (not visible in the given numbers)

Thanks for the figures! I take it these monthly figures would be multiplied by 14? As there is double play twice a year, yes? Thanks again!

[oboema]

Fully correct

[7574ever]

Hey guys! One more salary related question:

I heard that KLM cityhopper salary is capped when compared to mainline, is this the case? At what level is it capped?? As it is a likely assignment for new joiners and also the fastest command opportunity I think it would be interesting to know… thank you again!

[reivilo]

Originally Posted by 7574ever

Hey guys! One more salary related question:

I heard that KLM cityhopper salary is capped when compared to mainline, is this the case? At what level is it capped?? As it is a likely assignment for new joiners and also the fastest command opportunity I think it would be interesting to know… thank you again!

The salary cap at KLM Cityhopper only becomes applicable after approximately 8-12 years of seniority, depending on the age at which you join KLM.

However, due to recent union intervention, when a new pilot is assigned a position at KLC, the salary cap is automatically waived, as the pilot did not choose the position themselves. Since this is considered a non-voluntary assignment, the salary cap does not apply in such cases. The salary cap only applies when a pilot bids for a position at KLC from another fleet or role.
Many pilots still continue to bid for KLC positions because it allows them to upgrade to command at a relatively junior level of seniority. Currently after around 6-7 years with the company.

[SegAfredo]

Anyone else got the email stating that it might take a while for them to get to us? Anybody got an invite to attend the assessment at all?

[triplejules]

Originally Posted by SegAfredo

Anyone else got the email stating that it might take a while for them to get to us? Anybody got an invite to attend the assessment at all?

Yes! Same here…

[Otterman]

A Commentary from the Other Side of the Telescope. I’m retired now, but I spent more than three decades at KLM—a career that began in the late 1980s when I made the leap from Canada to join the airline. After 13 years, I made widebody captain, a position I held for the next 21 years. Along the way, I spent 10 years as a management pilot and even more years in training roles. KLM was a great place to work. From day one, I felt welcome and had every chance to develop whatever talents I brought to the table. Over time, I learned Dutch (it’s not an easy language, but it’s rewarding!), and if there’s a better airline out there to work for, I haven’t come across it. Living in the Netherlands has been one of the highlights of my life. You really see where your tax euros go—whether it’s infrastructure, healthcare, or public services. My Canadian wife and I raised two kids here, and the country gave them an excellent start in life. They grew up happy, healthy, and independent, with access to affordable, high-quality education. Now, as adults, they’re doing well and making their own way. One of the unique aspects of being a KLM pilot is the retirement age. Stepping away at 58 gives you the chance to enjoy the good years ahead, and the pension system is solid. It’s allowed me to live comfortably while still having plenty of time for life beyond flying. The Dutch Airline Pilots Association has done a great job protecting these important terms and conditions, which makes a big difference for us flying or in retirement. Not everyone who works for KLM lives in the Netherlands. Plenty of my colleagues commuted from other countries, including Canada, for a variety of reasons—some for tax advantages, others for quality-of-life considerations. It’s a personal choice, and there’s no one-size-fits-all answer. As for me, I stayed and have no regrets. I’ve always felt at home here, and I do my part to contribute to the community that gave me so much. Looking back, my career at KLM and my life in the Netherlands have been deeply fulfilling. For anyone considering a similar path, I can only say this: it’s a great ride.

[BRNL]

Originally Posted by Otterman

A Commentary from the Other Side of the Telescope. I’m retired now, but I spent more than three decades at KLM—a career that began in the late 1980s when I made the leap from Canada to join the airline. After 13 years, I made widebody captain, a position I held for the next 21 years. Along the way, I spent 10 years as a management pilot and even more years in training roles. KLM was a great place to work. From day one, I felt welcome and had every chance to develop whatever talents I brought to the table. Over time, I learned Dutch (it’s not an easy language, but it’s rewarding!), and if there’s a better airline out there to work for, I haven’t come across it. Living in the Netherlands has been one of the highlights of my life. You really see where your tax euros go—whether it’s infrastructure, healthcare, or public services. My Canadian wife and I raised two kids here, and the country gave them an excellent start in life. They grew up happy, healthy, and independent, with access to affordable, high-quality education. Now, as adults, they’re doing well and making their own way. One of the unique aspects of being a KLM pilot is the retirement age. Stepping away at 58 gives you the chance to enjoy the good years ahead, and the pension system is solid. It’s allowed me to live comfortably while still having plenty of time for life beyond flying. The Dutch Airline Pilots Association has done a great job protecting these important terms and conditions, which makes a big difference for us flying or in retirement. Not everyone who works for KLM lives in the Netherlands. Plenty of my colleagues commuted from other countries, including Canada, for a variety of reasons—some for tax advantages, others for quality-of-life considerations. It’s a personal choice, and there’s no one-size-fits-all answer. As for me, I stayed and have no regrets. I’ve always felt at home here, and I do my part to contribute to the community that gave me so much. Looking back, my career at KLM and my life in the Netherlands have been deeply fulfilling. For anyone considering a similar path, I can only say this: it’s a great ride.

Dear Otterman,

Thank you so much for your message. It truly added valuable insight to the topic, and I found it incredibly encouraging.

I have been a passionate fan of KLM for as long as I can remember. My parents flew for VARIG for 33 years, and I would always ask them to take me on flights to Amsterdam. I’ve always had a deep admiration for the country itself, and among the more than 50 countries I have visited, I found the Dutch people to be some of the kindest, most polite, and friendliest I’ve ever met. I hope my perception is not mistaken.

Being of Italian descent, I have always dreamed of flying for a globally renowned airline. Unfortunately, VARIG—a fantastic company to work for—ceased operations.

I was fortunate enough to pursue my career in the United States, and I can proudly say that I have reached the top of my profession today, flying for American Airlines for the past two years. Although I am currently an FO on the A32F, I have strong prospects of being promoted next year.

At 39 years old, I would only leave AA—an excellent company that offers a great work-life balance, light flying schedules, and an outstanding salary—for one reason: to fulfill my ultimate childhood dream of flying for KLM and living in the Netherlands. Despite having to start over from the bottom of the seniority list, I would do so with immense joy, as I am truly passionate about this airline.

I recently submitted my application, though I do not yet hold an EASA license. I had never pursued it before because KLM was the only airline in Europe I would ever consider flying for, and I never imagined I would have a real chance of joining them—especially as a non-Dutch speaker.

I don’t know if my application will be accepted, despite my experience of over 7,100 hours on the B737NG/MAX and A32F, my ICAO Level 6 certification, and my international background. But regardless of the outcome, this opportunity has motivated me to obtain my EASA license. In fact, I will be traveling to the Netherlands next month to complete my Class 1 medical with the Dutch aviation authority.

Let’s see where this journey takes me. I am excited and motivated to pursue a lifelong dream I never thought could become a reality.

[Otterman]

Interesting post, BRNL. When I joined KLM, I was quite a bit younger than you are now and came from a very different background—flying a variety of aircraft in the Canadian Arctic, where opportunities were, let’s say, a little less glamorous. For me, the decision wasn’t a tough one; KLM was a clear step up in every way. At the time, I had also passed the first round of recruitment with Cathay Pacific, but KLM extended their offer first. I accepted, thinking I might eventually return to Canada when the hiring situation improved back home. That plan quickly changed once I arrived at KLM. I realized how exceptional the situation was: a great pension, excellent job security, fantastic colleagues, and the chance to live in such a pleasant country. The timing couldn’t have been better either—there was significant expansion and a wave of retirements, which allowed me to move into the right seat of the 747 (200 and 300) by the age of 26. Fast forward to today, and KLM is experiencing a similar wave of retirements (albeit without the expansion we enjoyed back then). Those of us hired during that earlier period are now stepping away in significant numbers, creating opportunities for the next generation. That said, joining KLM at 39 may naturally limit the overall trajectory of your career compared to staying at American Airlines. It’s no small sacrifice to make such a move, especially when you’re already in a strong position. And then there’s the bigger picture. I’m not sure how much your president’s agenda will ripple across the globe, but it’s clear he’s upsetting long-held status quos. My concern is that these ripples could eventually become tsunamis, impacting stability in large parts of the world. And that is usually bad for Europe. Of course, career considerations are only one part of the equation. Life isn’t just about professional progress—it’s about what works best for you and your family. Whatever you decide, I wish you all the best in navigating this decision. On a lighter note, it’s great to hear Varig mentioned—I have fond memories of deadheading with them a few times. They were a class act, and Brazil was always among my favorite destinations (especially Rio). Good luck!

[Climb150]

So I assume the non Dutch speakers who went to work at KLM had Dutch or Euro citizenship?

[BRNL]

Originally Posted by Climb150

So I assume the non Dutch speakers who went to work at KLM had Dutch or Euro citizenship?

Yes, the pilot needs Euro citizenship in order to apply for the job.

[Climb150]

Originally Posted by BRNL

Yes, the pilot needs Euro citizenship in order to apply for the job.

That's not what I asked. There are some people on this thread that said they moved from non EU countries and to work for KLM. Did they have Dutch or EU citizenship?

[Newhairdo]

Originally Posted by Climb150

That's not what I asked. There are some people on this thread that said they moved from non EU countries and to work for KLM. Did they have Dutch or EU citizenship?

Well they did answer.
The simple point is that you need EU citizenship to live and work in the EU.