British Airways Direct Entry Pilot
Join Date: Apr 2022
Location: Europe
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Flew with someone in recruitment recently who expected DEC at Euroflyer again in the not-too-distant future. BA have been releasing some senior bidders from their LH freezes to fill the void in the LHS 320 at Heathrow for the time being.
I was equally shocked by the Easy pay deal (or rather, how poor the BA one was/is). Hypothetically any DEC recruitment at Heathrow would mean joining on a starting salary about £42k below your year 1 DEC Easy skipper - a gap which actually grows as the Easy loyalty bonus kicks in. Not to mention the appalling lifestyle at the bottom of the BA list.
I was equally shocked by the Easy pay deal (or rather, how poor the BA one was/is). Hypothetically any DEC recruitment at Heathrow would mean joining on a starting salary about £42k below your year 1 DEC Easy skipper - a gap which actually grows as the Easy loyalty bonus kicks in. Not to mention the appalling lifestyle at the bottom of the BA list.
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Earth
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The whole LH earning more than SH at the bottom of the payscales comparing with mates not much in it with just the basics.
If you start factoring in spending down route etc unless you are sitting in your hotel room of course. 10 years in yes the gap widens a fair amount. Loads of variables in all the calculations. Living close to LHR means about £5 (£10ish before tax) a day in fuel round trip for me. I don’t mind the crew food and have gone days with only having 1 meal a day at home. Have also done 3 day trips away with lounge access, chilling by the pool, beers, food all included and come back having not spent a single penny. I have flown with skippers who bring their own food or go and grab an itsu before the flight. £5-£10 (as before is £10-£20 from your pre tax) a day soon adds up.
Commuters will have higher costs be it fuel, flying, hotels etc as well.
Year 2 SH and I average £2k per month on mostly day trips. NCP wise can usually get 10 hours quite easily just by swapping for higher credit stuff. Yes I have gone nuts on a few months and pushed out nearly 50hrs NCP, hard to do on SH. LH can get some high credit trips that easily eclipse that in a month.
I boiled it down to career options and being SH the night curfew at LHR is a bit of a god send. Latest I have been walking through my door is 1am. Rare occasion. Even on a run of lates I’m in bed by 11pm 90% of the time.
If you start factoring in spending down route etc unless you are sitting in your hotel room of course. 10 years in yes the gap widens a fair amount. Loads of variables in all the calculations. Living close to LHR means about £5 (£10ish before tax) a day in fuel round trip for me. I don’t mind the crew food and have gone days with only having 1 meal a day at home. Have also done 3 day trips away with lounge access, chilling by the pool, beers, food all included and come back having not spent a single penny. I have flown with skippers who bring their own food or go and grab an itsu before the flight. £5-£10 (as before is £10-£20 from your pre tax) a day soon adds up.
Commuters will have higher costs be it fuel, flying, hotels etc as well.
Year 2 SH and I average £2k per month on mostly day trips. NCP wise can usually get 10 hours quite easily just by swapping for higher credit stuff. Yes I have gone nuts on a few months and pushed out nearly 50hrs NCP, hard to do on SH. LH can get some high credit trips that easily eclipse that in a month.
I boiled it down to career options and being SH the night curfew at LHR is a bit of a god send. Latest I have been walking through my door is 1am. Rare occasion. Even on a run of lates I’m in bed by 11pm 90% of the time.
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: England
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From getting the successful email to a phone call with a start date was about 2 hours for me. My friend got the call before his success email even came through. So zero swimming time at the moment
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: England
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I have an interview at LHR next week to join the SH fleet as a type-rated FO. The roster is an important part of the work/lifestyle and I managed to find about 4 examples of a monthly roster and was quite alarmed at the number of stops away from base, between 10-15 per month. Can any SH speedbirds here confirm what is normal? I'd like to sleep at home as many nights as possible. What's the lowest average nights away from base that can realistically be achieved? Thanks for any help
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: UK
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Near the bottom of the list I can see someone doing only 4 nights away in May. A little higher up someone only has 1 night away. Swaps will be your friend but mostly day trips should be achievable as people seem to favour tours near the bottom of the list.
As always, you can’t see what they are actually budding for but you definitely won’t be away 15 nights unless you ask to be.
As always, you can’t see what they are actually budding for but you definitely won’t be away 15 nights unless you ask to be.
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: Manchester
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Is anyone able to provide any light on this really open ended question - applying for SH but I'm really comfortable with the SH airline I'm currently with and so I'm holding out for LH. I've heard there's still spaces for the LH fleet but they said they want 1500 hours on type by the time of the sim. Now I'm about 50 hours away from 1500 hours on type and so my question is this, the sim assessors, are they quite chilled normal guys/girls? Would they say no to LH if you were about to hit your 1500 hours very soon but not by the time of the sim?
I know the simple answer is to just wait until 1500 hours then do the sim but I'm worried there won't be any spots in LH by then, especially on the 350. Additionally, has anyone told BA when offered SH that they only want LH and then been able to negotiate it?
Thank you in advance, John
I know the simple answer is to just wait until 1500 hours then do the sim but I'm worried there won't be any spots in LH by then, especially on the 350. Additionally, has anyone told BA when offered SH that they only want LH and then been able to negotiate it?
Thank you in advance, John
Join Date: Aug 2023
Location: London
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Is anyone able to provide any light on this really open ended question - applying for SH but I'm really comfortable with the SH airline I'm currently with and so I'm holding out for LH. I've heard there's still spaces for the LH fleet but they said they want 1500 hours on type by the time of the sim. Now I'm about 50 hours away from 1500 hours on type and so my question is this, the sim assessors, are they quite chilled normal guys/girls? Would they say no to LH if you were about to hit your 1500 hours very soon but not by the time of the sim?
I know the simple answer is to just wait until 1500 hours then do the sim but I'm worried there won't be any spots in LH by then, especially on the 350. Additionally, has anyone told BA when offered SH that they only want LH and then been able to negotiate it?
Thank you in advance, John
I know the simple answer is to just wait until 1500 hours then do the sim but I'm worried there won't be any spots in LH by then, especially on the 350. Additionally, has anyone told BA when offered SH that they only want LH and then been able to negotiate it?
Thank you in advance, John
if you are really comfortable in your current airline , A350 bottom of the list will be an eye opening experience for you .
Is anyone able to provide any light on this really open ended question - applying for SH but I'm really comfortable with the SH airline I'm currently with and so I'm holding out for LH. I've heard there's still spaces for the LH fleet but they said they want 1500 hours on type by the time of the sim. Now I'm about 50 hours away from 1500 hours on type and so my question is this, the sim assessors, are they quite chilled normal guys/girls? Would they say no to LH if you were about to hit your 1500 hours very soon but not by the time of the sim?
Join Date: Sep 2022
Location: Perpetually circling LAM for some reason
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If you're only 50 hours away then i'd just wait - surely going into summer schedule you'll get those 50hrs in less than a month, so by the time a sim slot is actually available you'll be good to go?
Depends if you were marked as 'suitable for long haul' in the sim or not. Seems ridiculous, but because training resource is so scarce (especially on LH) if they're even remotely worried you may need more sectors to complete line training, they'll send you to SH first where training is easier to complete due to the number of sectors you fly. If you're 'suitable for long haul' but they offer you short haul (and you'll need to discuss if thats the case or not as they wont tell you up front usually) you can always say you'd rather wait for a LH slot, but at the demise of your seniority number and as you already allude to, what if no LH slots come up for a while?
Depends if you were marked as 'suitable for long haul' in the sim or not. Seems ridiculous, but because training resource is so scarce (especially on LH) if they're even remotely worried you may need more sectors to complete line training, they'll send you to SH first where training is easier to complete due to the number of sectors you fly. If you're 'suitable for long haul' but they offer you short haul (and you'll need to discuss if thats the case or not as they wont tell you up front usually) you can always say you'd rather wait for a LH slot, but at the demise of your seniority number and as you already allude to, what if no LH slots come up for a while?
It all takes some thinking, all I’ll say is that I think it’s a great place to work, and somewhere where you can make the job what you want - part time SH, full time LH, bid for essentially a fixed roster…. but the KEY to making those choices is seniority.
Join Date: May 2021
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On the whole LH vs SH issue and waiting for hours etc. I’m only a few weeks into the company but the only ones that i have met who joined on LH were all type rated on 330, 350 or 777/787
Have not seen anybody doing an initial type rating on the LH fleet new in the company. This could change in the future of course.
Personally, i would not worry about LH vs SH and would just get onto that seniority list asap…
Have not seen anybody doing an initial type rating on the LH fleet new in the company. This could change in the future of course.
Personally, i would not worry about LH vs SH and would just get onto that seniority list asap…
Nailed it, it’s moving quick at the moment but if the music stops those 100-150 or whatever places you’ve lost yourself by waiting could cost you your command by multiple years. Add in the effect on compounding your pension contributions and it’s potentially going to cost you way more than you think you’re gaining.
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: uk
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Historically the low credit trips ABV, RUH, LOS, the latter not on the fleet at the moment.
Now JFK, with 8/9 per day if you’re junior you’ll visit twice a month or more. Any East coast trip will tend towards the bottom of the seniority.
Horses for courses, personally I’ve never had an issue with 3-day Africa/Middle East trips. Short flights and no/minimal time change. It’s just the (lack of) credit that means they are unpopular. With regard to JFK, all slips are in Manhattan so there’s always something to do.
Now JFK, with 8/9 per day if you’re junior you’ll visit twice a month or more. Any East coast trip will tend towards the bottom of the seniority.
Horses for courses, personally I’ve never had an issue with 3-day Africa/Middle East trips. Short flights and no/minimal time change. It’s just the (lack of) credit that means they are unpopular. With regard to JFK, all slips are in Manhattan so there’s always something to do.
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: London
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Just to expand a bit on the above - and apologies if I’m repeating things already covered - low credit trips are unpopular because everyone has to make CAP each month - the credit target set by BA and determined by how much work there is to cover that month. Broadly speaking you might need to do either 3 x HKG/HND for example, 4 x SEA/IAH/MAA or else you could end up doing 5 or even in extremis 6 x JFK/BOS/EWR etc to reach that credit target. Compounding that of course is that the former will be 4 crew with 6 hours in the bunk, the middle 3 crew with 3 hours in the bunk and the latter 2 crew with zero hours in the bunk. It’s easy to see therefore why being very junior - particularly on the 777 - doesn’t make (always) for a particularly enjoyable life.
Personally I quite like certain places on the east coast. IAD/BOS are great cities to visit…. But the credit makes them unpalatable. And it’s just more commuting into Heathrow, more hassle into and out of Heathrow. And of course if you’re a commuter they are a bit of a disaster on a cost level as well.
Personally I quite like certain places on the east coast. IAD/BOS are great cities to visit…. But the credit makes them unpalatable. And it’s just more commuting into Heathrow, more hassle into and out of Heathrow. And of course if you’re a commuter they are a bit of a disaster on a cost level as well.
Join Date: May 2002
Location: uk
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you should understand that - in general - BA is a rules based corporate organisation. The pilots involved in your sim tests and interviews will be top people, but won't have any such discretion.
The airline is pretty much a faceless and characterless entity with very little flexibility; just a lot of processes.
The airline is pretty much a faceless and characterless entity with very little flexibility; just a lot of processes.