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Airline Interviews rant

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Airline Interviews rant

Old 9th Aug 2019, 16:11
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Airline Interviews rant

I wanted to ask the recruiters and managment people on here what they think about compensating qualified applicants (like type rated, experienced FO or CPT) for the cost of a night in the hotel and a ticket on their own airline to reach the interview location.
It seems to be normal these days that pilots will line up and beg for a job while paying for the effort. Are we this desperate again?

I remember recruiting some metal workers at my parents company. Those that came a long way were provided with a hotel and a dinner. The company has not gone out of business since. Seems to be too expensive for airlines these days.
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Old 9th Aug 2019, 16:49
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In an ideal world, they'd pay.

However, having flown for three different airlines and worked for three (big) companies in a previous career - including recruitment and management - none of them remimbursed expenses. The same goes for the dozens of other interviews I've attended over the years. The only exceptions were two sandpit based airlines that paid for a return ticket for the interview, plus a night in a hotel. And they only did that because otherwise no-one would make a 6,000 mile return trip for an assessment. The last company - in fact the only one - that offered to pay my travelling expenses to an interview was way back in 1990. God I feel old.

It's not just airlines, it's the modern world I'm afraid. Airlines - make that employers in general - don't expect to pay expenses and candidates generally don't expect to claim them. It would soon change if everyone refused to attend interviews unless their expenses were paid, but I suspect that's as likely as no-one paying for a type rating . . .
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Old 9th Aug 2019, 17:40
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G SXTY is correct. Both my kids have recently graduated and it is most unusual for any of their mates to have been compensated for any interview costs associated with travel, even abroad. Many are also asked for various application processing fees. There are exceptions in the NHS and public bodies and big IT firms who appear more generous. (Or is that honorable)
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Old 9th Aug 2019, 21:56
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BA used to fly you down to Heathrow. Then again they used to provide fully sponsored training which was the reason I went to see them back in the early 90's. Unfortunately I didn't get selected and had to pay my own way.

Since then the only freebie I have had at an interview has been a cup of Coffee, biscuits and snacks. Some never even offered me a drink.
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Old 9th Aug 2019, 23:19
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It wouldn’t be a problem to compensate if people would only apply to one company but reality is they apply to 3-5 various outfits and see where they pass and who offer the best t&c. So it will not happen any time soon.
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Old 10th Aug 2019, 04:24
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Originally Posted by Council Van View Post
Since then the only freebie I have had at an interview has been a cup of Coffee, biscuits and snacks. Some never even offered me a drink.
You still get that at BA - especially if you land off an unstable approach.
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Old 10th Aug 2019, 07:58
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Given the number of chancers in this industry now its not surprising that potential employers won't wear the cost.
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Old 10th Aug 2019, 08:29
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A major international airline in New Zealand give candidates a simulator check as part of the interview process. Keep in mind the applicant almost certainly has never flown the type of simulator used for the assessment.
There is the usual instrument approach (ILS) as well as intercepting radials inbound and outbound. Steep turns are thrown in for good measure. The check pilot then deliberately needles or tries to distract the candidate during the flight by asking inane questions, including among other things, the endurance based on current fuel state while at the same time the applicant is trying to figure out an entry into the hold prior to the ILS. The theory being he is testing how the applicant copes with stress and distraction despite the fact that the testing officer is not a qualified psychologist. How do you accurately measure stress and distraction? All very subjective nonsense.
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Old 10th Aug 2019, 08:52
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Admittedly it is many years since I attended an interview, but I never paid. If the airline would not cover costs, I figured we probably would not get on with each other, or that perhaps they could not afford the basics, so what else could they not afford?
Later, as a chief pilot, I never expected candidates invited for interview to pay. This sometimes brought me in conflict with the CEO and sundry beancounters. But one must be very selective, almost to the point of being ruthless, to weed out potential time wasters by looking closely at claimed experience and following up references first.
It can be costly for the airline when duds and fakes slip through to final selection, only to prove their ineptitude in the simulator evaluation. MCDU2 alludes to this.

Now for some thread drift resultant from Sheppey’s post #8...
A rigorous simulator evaluation is money well spent. I believe that the New Zealand airline described above is on the right track. Now that I am relegated to a back seat, it gives me comfort to know that some operators still want pilots who can fly while dealing with stress and distraction!

Last edited by Mach E Avelli; 10th Aug 2019 at 09:21.
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Old 12th Aug 2019, 18:29
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Originally Posted by sheppey View Post
A major international airline in New Zealand give candidates a simulator check as part of the interview process. Keep in mind the applicant almost certainly has never flown the type of simulator used for the assessment.
There is the usual instrument approach (ILS) as well as intercepting radials inbound and outbound. Steep turns are thrown in for good measure. The check pilot then deliberately needles or tries to distract the candidate during the flight by asking inane questions, including among other things, the endurance based on current fuel state while at the same time the applicant is trying to figure out an entry into the hold prior to the ILS. The theory being he is testing how the applicant copes with stress and distraction despite the fact that the testing officer is not a qualified psychologist. How do you accurately measure stress and distraction? All very subjective nonsense.
TOP TIP: Part of that ‘distraction’ is knowing when to say “I’m concentrating on the flying. Let me answer that when I’ve done the A+N of ANC”
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Old 12th Aug 2019, 20:34
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Quiet common with GOOD companies, e.g. most ME carriers(I know I know, a lot beg to differ about good, but compared to RYR and Co they are "good"), but as well a lot of Asian Carriers, take Korean as an example. Hotel and flight paid and I am sure they still struggle to get enough suitable candidates(I would never apply for such outfits, but I am just too old "for that shit" I guess).

So, yes, pretty common to have it paid, as well in the past IF you choose the right companies(other even made you pay just to apply and we all know about whom i am talking about). It is the fault of the pilots(mostly green of course) that we ended up in current conditions. Humans....
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Old 12th Aug 2019, 22:55
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Originally Posted by sheppey View Post
A major international airline in New Zealand give candidates a simulator check as part of the interview process. Keep in mind the applicant almost certainly has never flown the type of simulator used for the assessment.
There is the usual instrument approach (ILS) as well as intercepting radials inbound and outbound. Steep turns are thrown in for good measure. The check pilot then deliberately needles or tries to distract the candidate during the flight by asking inane questions, including among other things, the endurance based on current fuel state while at the same time the applicant is trying to figure out an entry into the hold prior to the ILS. The theory being he is testing how the applicant copes with stress and distraction despite the fact that the testing officer is not a qualified psychologist. How do you accurately measure stress and distraction? All very subjective nonsense.
Should take a qualified applicant all of about 3 seconds to figure out how to enter a hold.What distraction ???
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Old 12th Aug 2019, 22:59
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When you are in the sim and know that how you perform will result in job/no job, you dont wanna be entertaining the checkers whim of how much he can distract you.
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Old 13th Aug 2019, 10:20
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when I got called for my interview (Europe, not too many years ago, company still does it), I got free flights on the company network and a choice of hotels that were about half the price of their market rate comparing to booking websites. Coffee/water was available. This was me with just 200 hours on a CPL
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Old 13th Aug 2019, 19:13
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Jet2 put me up in MAN.

I was pleasantly surprised.
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Old 18th Aug 2019, 08:51
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If an airline has spent time looking at each applicant properly and researching their work history, so can be reasonably sure that they will pass the interview and want the job: they can put them in the company hotel, (£50 corporate rate), and be fairly sure they will get their money back.

Originally Posted by sheppey View Post
................... The check pilot then deliberately needles or tries to distract the candidate during the flight by asking inane questions, including among other things, the endurance based on current fuel state while at the same time the applicant is trying to figure out an entry into the hold prior to the ILS. The theory being he is testing how the applicant copes with stress and distraction..........
A guy did this to me during a SIM check for my first airline, many years’ ago. The SIM was a completely manual piston twin and I had to deal with that and fly a route consisting of VOR and ADF tracking and holding, leading to an ILS and go-around etc. The guy was being very chatty, and initially I thought he was just a pleasant sort of bloke and I was chatting back, but then I realised that he was doing it to try to distract me from my flying and navigation.

As soon as I realised this, the simple comment, “Standby”, from me while I was busy entering the hold or turning onto the localiser stopped him talking, and when I had finished the manoeuvre and had some brain space, I would then ask him: “Sorry, say again”.

I passed


@filejw, I am sure I am not alone in that I can work out many mathematical things in my head, such as a formula for the area of a hexagon from first principles, but if someone is metaphorically leaning over me demanding an answer, my ‘maths brain’ sometimes locks up. Knowing how to deal with this sort of pressure is a good trait to have as a pilot.

Last edited by Uplinker; 18th Aug 2019 at 09:15.
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Old 18th Aug 2019, 14:22
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Originally Posted by level_change View Post
I wanted to ask the recruiters and managment people on here what they think about compensating qualified applicants (like type rated, experienced FO or CPT) for the cost of a night in the hotel and a ticket on their own airline to reach the interview location.
It seems to be normal these days that pilots will line up and beg for a job while paying for the effort. Are we this desperate again?

I remember recruiting some metal workers at my parents company. Those that came a long way were provided with a hotel and a dinner. The company has not gone out of business since. Seems to be too expensive for airlines these days.
Airline Rant
Pilot is set up interview, Flights booked, Hotel booked. Pilot at short notice advises roster has changed - sorry unable to attend. Airline checks with a mate who works at said Airline - no changes to roster.
Works both ways
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Old 18th Aug 2019, 19:18
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I've had an interview cancelled on short notice after I had spent more than 700 euro in travel and accomodation booking for a flag carrier in a small European airline. The interview did take place, I was just uninvited because someone in their office decided so. I dodged a bullet though, they're on the edge of bankruptcy. I will be sorry for the fellow pilots, but when they'll go bust I'll have a field day.
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Old 19th Aug 2019, 11:44
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At the risk of getting shot down here, tbh guys this thread sounds all a bit precious. I'm the first one to have a go about the decline of our t's and c's over the last 20 years and qualified at the start of the recession. So before anyone has a go, please understand I've not had it easy either.

But...

Ranting about airlines not rolling out the red carpet is just ridiculous. If you want the job then its reasonable to assume that you've done the homework and taken the view that the subsequent hoop jumping effort required to attain said job is a worth while endeavour.

I've never expected a company to pay for my airfares, hotels, meals etc and frankly never would do. If they do, great. But I've never begged for a job. Anything I've applied for has been a significant move in the right direction so if it cost me a tank of fuel and a night in a premier inn to make that step then so be it.

It seems to be normal these days that pilots will line up and beg for a job while paying for the effort. Are we this desperate again?
Are we REALLY this precious? Come on.

(Retreating to a safe distance and donning tin hat)
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