Monarch
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 238
Likes: 0
From: London
Ok that's makes more sense, even so £4300 must be a good month I can't imagine you were taking home that much during the winter months. Even so I totally agree with you comments about the old guard at Monarch they enjoyed terms and conditions the rest of us will never experience, unfortunately this industry has gone backwards and Monarch needed to join the rest at the bottom.
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 134
Likes: 0
From: London
Just went through my finances and that is average , well completely average would be £4220 (2016) were you a CTC grad ? That really does top it up ! It's a great shame about the overall state of things at play in the industry ! May I ask Enzo where you went to after Mon ? Just for interest
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 238
Likes: 0
From: London
No was not CTC, so I guess if your figure includes top up payments for that it would make sense as I say most months I was taking home between 3.5 and 3.8 a month. I went to BA, heard about guys getting quick commands so thought I would join them, unfortunately I am now sat at the bottom of a seniority list longer than a phone book with no movement expected any time soon, still as the saying goes you win some and you loose some.
Joined: Aug 1999
Aviation Qualifications: ATPL
Posts: 473
Likes: 3
From: Al tube.
Snapper, what was done with the final salary pension was criminal in my and I believe many other people's minds. I and many others will not get what we put into our final salary pension, nor will we ever get a large proportion of the companies contribution of what was basically defered pay. If I did that to you then you would call it theft.
Not a criticism of ZB, rather the industry, but I'm not aware of any other profession where professionals are prepared to go on seasonal (10/13 etc.) pay and contracts in the quiet months just to start employment having payed for their own professional licence. We are our own worst enemies at times.
Not a criticism of ZB, rather the industry, but I'm not aware of any other profession where professionals are prepared to go on seasonal (10/13 etc.) pay and contracts in the quiet months just to start employment having payed for their own professional licence. We are our own worst enemies at times.
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 134
Likes: 0
From: London
Enzo - we get some strange bond repayment scheme not entirely sure how it works . I know some guys that went to BA , heard it's like marmite. At least you don't have the cloud
Alloy - It is definitely criminal what the company has done or should I say what the mantagezzas have done , Is the reason they did it so the company was attractive for a purchase ?
I love working part time !! The way you should look at it is essentially working less for more income (tax reasons) also in the winters you would just be sitting around on standby , besides I flex a week in winter if I have no plans , tops the salary back up ! Win win !
The way the industry is going most people will burn out after a career in aviation unless they go part time .
You need to talk to the cadets at Ryanair and easy , pay to fly anyone ? Flexiscrew , they have screwed it for us
Alloy - It is definitely criminal what the company has done or should I say what the mantagezzas have done , Is the reason they did it so the company was attractive for a purchase ?
I love working part time !! The way you should look at it is essentially working less for more income (tax reasons) also in the winters you would just be sitting around on standby , besides I flex a week in winter if I have no plans , tops the salary back up ! Win win !
The way the industry is going most people will burn out after a career in aviation unless they go part time .
You need to talk to the cadets at Ryanair and easy , pay to fly anyone ? Flexiscrew , they have screwed it for us
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 123
Likes: 0
From: uk
Sounds very much like you're alright Jack. Well done.
I remember people on here 7-8 years ago encouraging everyone to join as it was the best T&C's about, while others could see the huge pension hole for what it was turning the company into.
A bit less of the wallet waving and a bit more educated delving into future plans would serve you well.
I remember people on here 7-8 years ago encouraging everyone to join as it was the best T&C's about, while others could see the huge pension hole for what it was turning the company into.
A bit less of the wallet waving and a bit more educated delving into future plans would serve you well.
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 134
Likes: 0
From: London
Renort do you really think in this world that there is such a thing as a job for life ? I can't think of any airline that was the same as it was 7-8 years ago ( although Thomson I hear is very good still)
The whole purpose of this thread was how is monarch doing ? How is it to work there ?
Monarch is doing ok .
To work here it is excellent! Great people !treated like an adult ! But as explained there is always a slight niggle in the back of your mind regarding the future , if you can get over that keep your head down and just enjoy your life then you will be rewarded with one of the best airlines in the U.K.
The whole purpose of this thread was how is monarch doing ? How is it to work there ?
Monarch is doing ok .
To work here it is excellent! Great people !treated like an adult ! But as explained there is always a slight niggle in the back of your mind regarding the future , if you can get over that keep your head down and just enjoy your life then you will be rewarded with one of the best airlines in the U.K.
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 2,766
Likes: 4
From: Here and there
The family wound the company up for a number of reasons, the pension defecit being one, but also increased financial regulation made their money laundering much more difficult.The industry had changed and a failure to invest and move with the times meant they were actually going to have to spend serious amounts of money.
They have now moved into river cruises with their company Avalon waterways,and property As the airline was being deliberately prepared for execution they purchased a lot of brand new vessels, and built the Palazzo Mantegazza in Lugano.
They have now moved into river cruises with their company Avalon waterways,and property As the airline was being deliberately prepared for execution they purchased a lot of brand new vessels, and built the Palazzo Mantegazza in Lugano.
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 128
Likes: 6
From: UK
A couple of years ago I watched the film 'Wall Street' even though it is over 30 years old.
It involves Michael Douglas thinking he is very clever in maximising money for himself (and only himself) as he s****s some airline employees in the Midwest US.
Some of the parallels with Monarch were uncanny.
I am sure there was a Gordon Gecko somewhere in the midst of the negotiations (at some, no doubt, swanky villa/hotel somewhere) as the Greybull 'team' discussed the best options with the Mantegazza 'team' as to how to do what was best for them.
As people have said already - the pension theft was criminal.
The people at Monarch are, generally, superb. It needs more than that, though.
It involves Michael Douglas thinking he is very clever in maximising money for himself (and only himself) as he s****s some airline employees in the Midwest US.
Some of the parallels with Monarch were uncanny.
I am sure there was a Gordon Gecko somewhere in the midst of the negotiations (at some, no doubt, swanky villa/hotel somewhere) as the Greybull 'team' discussed the best options with the Mantegazza 'team' as to how to do what was best for them.
As people have said already - the pension theft was criminal.
The people at Monarch are, generally, superb. It needs more than that, though.
Joined: Nov 2006
Aviation Qualifications: ATPL
Posts: 243
Likes: 11
From: Top Bunk
I'm glad in a way that Monarch has had its change or modernisation as they like to call it . Pre 2014 the airline was almost like a legacy carrier from the 60s ,
Lots of the 20+ year captains were living the life of Larry , 600 hours a year mixed fleet on full pay , a monthly week trip to the Maldives or Goa etc.. , staying in a nice all inclusive and still getting £1k worth of voyage pay ,
A pension which would give them 60k a year ? (Better than the top legacy carriers)
Whilst all this was happening the orange airline and the Irish airline were appearing and squashing T&Cs , making everything cheaper ,the start of the race to the bottom ,
So we had to do something to compete , and for now it's worked ,
I find it very frustrating when the older guys moan about how they lost out , whilst deep down I know I will never see that type of remuneration and lifestyle ,
Look at BA SH modernising , BOB food , smaller seats , pp34 , lots of bad press recently , supposedly a unhappy place to work especially with Mr Cruz at the helm ,
Why pay £150 for BA when you could pay £70 for easy ? Same package , easy is probably better in there own game
Everyone has felt the squeeze and these are the toughest aviation conditions ever with over saturated roots , terror , fuel ...
But considering all of this I still get my 4300k a month (6yr fo) and I'm part time , still fly with my friends , and always have a great day out ! Even if Monarch ever went tits up ( considering it is the oldest airline in the U.K. It hasn't done too bad ) I'm sure it would be bought or absorbed into another airline , thus no job loss (no pilots have ever been let loose)
Lots of the 20+ year captains were living the life of Larry , 600 hours a year mixed fleet on full pay , a monthly week trip to the Maldives or Goa etc.. , staying in a nice all inclusive and still getting £1k worth of voyage pay ,
A pension which would give them 60k a year ? (Better than the top legacy carriers)
Whilst all this was happening the orange airline and the Irish airline were appearing and squashing T&Cs , making everything cheaper ,the start of the race to the bottom ,
So we had to do something to compete , and for now it's worked ,
I find it very frustrating when the older guys moan about how they lost out , whilst deep down I know I will never see that type of remuneration and lifestyle ,
Look at BA SH modernising , BOB food , smaller seats , pp34 , lots of bad press recently , supposedly a unhappy place to work especially with Mr Cruz at the helm ,
Why pay £150 for BA when you could pay £70 for easy ? Same package , easy is probably better in there own game
Everyone has felt the squeeze and these are the toughest aviation conditions ever with over saturated roots , terror , fuel ...
But considering all of this I still get my 4300k a month (6yr fo) and I'm part time , still fly with my friends , and always have a great day out ! Even if Monarch ever went tits up ( considering it is the oldest airline in the U.K. It hasn't done too bad ) I'm sure it would be bought or absorbed into another airline , thus no job loss (no pilots have ever been let loose)
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 134
Likes: 0
From: London
45989
Yes it used to be a great Profession ! Until airlines started selling you a dream
Very sad , then you get guys on here bitterly hoping that a good airline with still respectable terms should fold ? Also sad ?
Maybe we could drag everyone down and start a new level of low cost . Level ? now that sounds familiar
Yes it used to be a great Profession ! Until airlines started selling you a dream
Very sad , then you get guys on here bitterly hoping that a good airline with still respectable terms should fold ? Also sad ?
Maybe we could drag everyone down and start a new level of low cost . Level ? now that sounds familiar
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 128
Likes: 6
From: UK
Some people have been in the industry a long time and have seen how airlines and their owners work. Sometimes good. Sometimes bad. Perhaps they are just being practical but you are misunderstanding that? The more you come out with sentences like the above then the more likely the word 'paranoia' gets used.
People have been very supportive and complimentary of the airline, in general, and quite right too.
Excellent post, by the way, G-DAJB.
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 177
Likes: 2
From: London
Put aside the issues which are largely now put in the past which have been discussed already.
Some of the great things about the company:
-Brilliant people and good working relationship between crew and flight deck
-Good T&C'S
-Good overtime rate £448
-Good definition of a day off
-Easy day at work. 2 sectors and 99% of the time have a cracking day out at "work"
-Good training department
You could do a lot lot lot worse. Overall, a great place to work in my opinion.
Some of the great things about the company:
-Brilliant people and good working relationship between crew and flight deck
-Good T&C'S
-Good overtime rate £448
-Good definition of a day off
-Easy day at work. 2 sectors and 99% of the time have a cracking day out at "work"
-Good training department
You could do a lot lot lot worse. Overall, a great place to work in my opinion.
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,034
Likes: 2
From: MIDDLE EAST
GDAJB
A mature and measured reply to some rather disappointing and selfish comments from other readers. Your articulate reflection of a once great Company and a bygone era is extremely accurate, as is the mention of pay & conditions 15-20 years ago. Thankfully, as you say, the culture of such a legacy remains in those still working there. It is the people, ultimately, that makes the airline what it is...or isn't!
One of the best and somewhat poignant posts I've read in a very long time. Thank you.
A mature and measured reply to some rather disappointing and selfish comments from other readers. Your articulate reflection of a once great Company and a bygone era is extremely accurate, as is the mention of pay & conditions 15-20 years ago. Thankfully, as you say, the culture of such a legacy remains in those still working there. It is the people, ultimately, that makes the airline what it is...or isn't!
One of the best and somewhat poignant posts I've read in a very long time. Thank you.
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 569
Likes: 0
From: London
GDAJB
An eloquent post clearly borne out of a long association with the 'Monarch family'! There is definitely a legacy feel to many of my more senior colleagues, both pilots and cabin crew.
Monarch is by and large a warm and friendly airline and I'm proud to be part of the team. The training cadre is second to none. High standards are expected but with that comes empathy and understanding from the trainers. A very pastoral approach, where if you show hard work, potential and importantly, humility, you will be nurtured and your potential ultimately fulfilled.
There is a 'Monarch type' and the recruitment team have known this for years - birds of a feather...............
An eloquent post clearly borne out of a long association with the 'Monarch family'! There is definitely a legacy feel to many of my more senior colleagues, both pilots and cabin crew.
Monarch is by and large a warm and friendly airline and I'm proud to be part of the team. The training cadre is second to none. High standards are expected but with that comes empathy and understanding from the trainers. A very pastoral approach, where if you show hard work, potential and importantly, humility, you will be nurtured and your potential ultimately fulfilled.
There is a 'Monarch type' and the recruitment team have known this for years - birds of a feather...............
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 1,643
Likes: 0
From: UK
Us older ones have a lot of affection for MON. I learnt much from a true legend there GE the ex Crewing Manager whose base line answer was always NO.
But what about this n that that other Airlines get - NO.
But despite this everyone I knew at MON loved working there.
At the same time MON were competing with Britannia and they have survived with many of the "benefits" that MON Staff have lost so you can understand some of the angst.
But what about this n that that other Airlines get - NO.
But despite this everyone I knew at MON loved working there.
At the same time MON were competing with Britannia and they have survived with many of the "benefits" that MON Staff have lost so you can understand some of the angst.
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 2
Likes: 0
From: UK
I'm going to be starting with Monarch non type rated soon and am very much looking forward to it. Throughout the whole interview process it felt very warm and friendly and the impression from everyone I met working for the company was always positive so am looking forward to becoming part of the team.
Joined: Sep 1999
Posts: 783
Likes: 0
From: The Deep South (Sussex)
As an ex LHS chap from F.C. (but without any staff travel)...I regularly fly Monarch to the Canaries and Faro.....because my wife and I like it.
In particular the attitude of the cabin staff leaves us both happy and looking forward to the next trip.
Keep it up team!
In particular the attitude of the cabin staff leaves us both happy and looking forward to the next trip.
Keep it up team!