Emirates Pilot Recruitment Roadshows In Uk.
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Is it so hard to understand that the problem is the SYSTEM and not the pilots??
I m sure you once dreamed of being a pilot, and I am sure you would have taken any job back then, at any wage. So leave the new kids alone, it's not their fault.
It just does not make sense to shrug your shoulder or moan about how "rotten the world has become" and allow airlines to open the floodgates of cadet scams undermining our T&C's that way. In the long run you're certainly not doing these cadets a favour, but in fact you are making their life much harder to pay back their loans, pay for a mortgage, start a family etc. PILOTS would be doing these young guys a much bigger favour by making sure that they will be hired on a normal contract like everybody else! That way they can get on with their lives, career etc and won't have to escape to some godforsaken desert!
The current low-cost airline SYSTEM of Jell-O-spined PILOTS is a downward spiral, a catch 22, and it's the very reason people are now thinking en mass of leaving the low-cost industry in the first place.
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It's all relative...
Hey, this job might actually work for some people and not others. Have you considered that? Some people desire to live in an over-built desert. Some people aspire to long-haul flying. Some people want widebody flying (and EK guarantees it). Some people want to see the world beyond Western Europe. Why wait for 25 years to fly left seat at BA? Some people don't have families to tug along to the desert - they are more flexible with their living arrangements and requirements. How many Indian blokes would trade their left teste for a job at EK? It's all relative mates - and EK know it.
Everyone is so negative about EK on this board. Sure, it sounds like they will jerk you around and over-work you at EK. You should understand that before you start - you will work very, very hard at EK and you will be exhausted. If you cannot understand the fact that you live in another country and you agree to abide by local rules, then don't go there. Stay in the UK or Germany. If you did not do your due diligence and thoroughly vet the place before going, then it is your own fault. Get the facts before you agree to go - that way you will set your expectations and not be so disappointed if it becomes a difficult job. If your spouse doesn't want to leave Ireland, then don't expect her to love Dubai. Think before you sign on the dotted line.
Point is, if you are unbound by obligations and you want some adventure (and you don't want to fly LCC in Europe for the rest of your bloody career), maybe EK should be a consideration. But consider the pros and cons and get the facts. Who knows, maybe after a few years you'll actully like flying the A380 worldwide.
Everyone is so negative about EK on this board. Sure, it sounds like they will jerk you around and over-work you at EK. You should understand that before you start - you will work very, very hard at EK and you will be exhausted. If you cannot understand the fact that you live in another country and you agree to abide by local rules, then don't go there. Stay in the UK or Germany. If you did not do your due diligence and thoroughly vet the place before going, then it is your own fault. Get the facts before you agree to go - that way you will set your expectations and not be so disappointed if it becomes a difficult job. If your spouse doesn't want to leave Ireland, then don't expect her to love Dubai. Think before you sign on the dotted line.
Point is, if you are unbound by obligations and you want some adventure (and you don't want to fly LCC in Europe for the rest of your bloody career), maybe EK should be a consideration. But consider the pros and cons and get the facts. Who knows, maybe after a few years you'll actully like flying the A380 worldwide.
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Iver - I think you are right - EK may well suit some people - but from what I saw at the open day in STN - it is mostly people who failed command in Ryanair or have other issues that are applying to EK.
The fact is very few people have left from FR to EK or any other Gulf carrier.
Ryanair pilots - all day every day for weeks on my flights - have been talking about going to an open day and then not going. Visiting Dubai for a SIM check - is a very different matter - to actually then getting offered a position and resigning your job.
Doug - PB was actually very humorous outside the EK roadshow - if it was my business I would keep an eye on the competition.
No high quality airline appears to be hiring Captains in the Gulf unless they are rated. The FO deals are not that attractive financially.
FlyDubai have hired a handful from FR but I do not think that makes financial sense other than if you do not wish to be in the European tax system. If FlyDubai get short of pilots and improve their deal - well then FR may lose a few more.
Interested to hear what Norman SF can tell us about the situation at EzyJet where I heard there was a very large turnout in LTN at the EK open day.
The fact is very few people have left from FR to EK or any other Gulf carrier.
Ryanair pilots - all day every day for weeks on my flights - have been talking about going to an open day and then not going. Visiting Dubai for a SIM check - is a very different matter - to actually then getting offered a position and resigning your job.
Doug - PB was actually very humorous outside the EK roadshow - if it was my business I would keep an eye on the competition.
No high quality airline appears to be hiring Captains in the Gulf unless they are rated. The FO deals are not that attractive financially.
FlyDubai have hired a handful from FR but I do not think that makes financial sense other than if you do not wish to be in the European tax system. If FlyDubai get short of pilots and improve their deal - well then FR may lose a few more.
Interested to hear what Norman SF can tell us about the situation at EzyJet where I heard there was a very large turnout in LTN at the EK open day.
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I would like to acknowledge fiftypercentn1's point about unions.
If you are lucky enough to join a company that recognise BALPA great, life is so much easier. I joined a very reputable tour operator and on day one management introduced the BALPA rep. He made it clear we were expected to join up on the spot. For the rest of my time there it was easy, 98% union membership, if management wanted to do anything they had to consult the union. The hardest battle I fought was getting through rush hour Leeds traffic to position to LBA from another base.
Conversely in FR its a different beast, stand up and fight aeh! so many have this vision and I agree with it, the problem with forcing recognition is as 50%N1 mentioned they just close the UK bases and thats it, wife kids house everything you work for up in the air while you try to relocate to mainland Europe.
FR is aggressive in all regards and people have to do whats right for them, this fragments the pilot workforce as it suits some people and infuriates others.
My main point is: if you join a good company with union recognition life is to a greater extent easier and better for the pilot.
If you join an airline without a union and you have to fight tooth and nail risking all to get the union in it is so much harder (you have to actually do something instead of just rowing in with the status quo)
So for all of you who are lucky to have the recognition and good T's&C's take it easy on the bashing. You own fate could have been different.
How many of you regular line pilots actually fight and petition on a regular basis? or do you just let you CC do the job then moan all year?
Its not just as simple as stand up and fight.
If you are lucky enough to join a company that recognise BALPA great, life is so much easier. I joined a very reputable tour operator and on day one management introduced the BALPA rep. He made it clear we were expected to join up on the spot. For the rest of my time there it was easy, 98% union membership, if management wanted to do anything they had to consult the union. The hardest battle I fought was getting through rush hour Leeds traffic to position to LBA from another base.
Conversely in FR its a different beast, stand up and fight aeh! so many have this vision and I agree with it, the problem with forcing recognition is as 50%N1 mentioned they just close the UK bases and thats it, wife kids house everything you work for up in the air while you try to relocate to mainland Europe.
FR is aggressive in all regards and people have to do whats right for them, this fragments the pilot workforce as it suits some people and infuriates others.
My main point is: if you join a good company with union recognition life is to a greater extent easier and better for the pilot.
If you join an airline without a union and you have to fight tooth and nail risking all to get the union in it is so much harder (you have to actually do something instead of just rowing in with the status quo)
So for all of you who are lucky to have the recognition and good T's&C's take it easy on the bashing. You own fate could have been different.
How many of you regular line pilots actually fight and petition on a regular basis? or do you just let you CC do the job then moan all year?
Its not just as simple as stand up and fight.
Last edited by enigmajet; 24th Sep 2010 at 10:31.
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You see enigma even though you are absolutely right, maybe you didn' t get my point.
I am not talking about fights inside companies, in fact I am not even talking about aviation.
I am talking about laws from the Authorities which companies (any, not just airlines) must obey to.
Example:
Paying for your own type rating/line training: forbidden
Paying for anything more than a CPL: forbidden
Closed number of student pilots for anything more than a PPL every year, based on demand
Flying more than 70 (for example) hours a month: forbidden
The first company that will not observe the rules will be immediately closed and the owners banned from ever starting a similar business ever again.
etc etc etc
What I am talking about is to LIMIT this nonsense of an excessive capitalist attitude which has largely proven not to work (exactly like communism has!).
As I said this won t happen because in this world the only thing that counts is MONEY. So we should stop blaming people trying to create a future for themselves, and look a bit higher up on the ladder. The fish stinks from the head, this is the problem.
I am not talking about fights inside companies, in fact I am not even talking about aviation.
I am talking about laws from the Authorities which companies (any, not just airlines) must obey to.
Example:
Paying for your own type rating/line training: forbidden
Paying for anything more than a CPL: forbidden
Closed number of student pilots for anything more than a PPL every year, based on demand
Flying more than 70 (for example) hours a month: forbidden
The first company that will not observe the rules will be immediately closed and the owners banned from ever starting a similar business ever again.
etc etc etc
What I am talking about is to LIMIT this nonsense of an excessive capitalist attitude which has largely proven not to work (exactly like communism has!).
As I said this won t happen because in this world the only thing that counts is MONEY. So we should stop blaming people trying to create a future for themselves, and look a bit higher up on the ladder. The fish stinks from the head, this is the problem.
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Completely agree Enigmajet. If you join a company with a union you are likely to have more control and negotiating leverage - that's intuitive. If you join EK or another airline in the Gulf (any airline that is government owned), don't expect much negotiating leverage. Don't expect the local government to necessarily abide by their agreements - don't be that naive. EK will do what EK wants to do. So, if you go to EK, don't expect any negotiating leverage - you are basically along for the ride (good or bad).
So, go to EK with your eyes wide open. If you can't handle that lack of control, then don't go to EK.
So, go to EK with your eyes wide open. If you can't handle that lack of control, then don't go to EK.
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Doug, wind it in and stop sniping at colleagues who are as unhappy with the state of affairs as you are. All companies have their problems, but criticising the staff for their managers' actions is not going to fix anything - we're supposed to respect and help each other not be at each others' throats. Leave the inter-airline politics to the managers; at least they're paid for it.
Back on topic, I went to the LTN show. There were only about 15 attendees, seemingly a mix mostly of RYR, EZY, BMI and Flybe F/Os. Some had the hours, some not. I had hoped to see the room packed, but there was only one show at LTN and many of my colleagues were working, but there are other ways of finding out about the job.
The show was very slick and the contract offers a lot of money for existing F/Os to think about, especially those who are still single, but isn't going to tempt many current Captains and very few family men. The job and life look very exciting in the show, but reading up on ex-pat life (especially the article in The Independent) shows another side of it. Neither party has skewed the truth, but the papers and the company have very different perspectives.
Some will think hard about it and apply, others will walk away, and good luck to each. It's a big decision, especially for those with families. I don't think it's for me at the moment, though I wouldn't ever rule it out.
Whatever else you say about EK, though, their training system looks amazing, and I can't imagine them cutting corners on training or maintenance given what they clearly spend on infrastructure.
Back on topic, I went to the LTN show. There were only about 15 attendees, seemingly a mix mostly of RYR, EZY, BMI and Flybe F/Os. Some had the hours, some not. I had hoped to see the room packed, but there was only one show at LTN and many of my colleagues were working, but there are other ways of finding out about the job.
The show was very slick and the contract offers a lot of money for existing F/Os to think about, especially those who are still single, but isn't going to tempt many current Captains and very few family men. The job and life look very exciting in the show, but reading up on ex-pat life (especially the article in The Independent) shows another side of it. Neither party has skewed the truth, but the papers and the company have very different perspectives.
Some will think hard about it and apply, others will walk away, and good luck to each. It's a big decision, especially for those with families. I don't think it's for me at the moment, though I wouldn't ever rule it out.
Whatever else you say about EK, though, their training system looks amazing, and I can't imagine them cutting corners on training or maintenance given what they clearly spend on infrastructure.
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Hi all I'm new to this prune business and just wanted to see if anyone had any info about Emirates. I'm going out there for my interview soon and just wanted to get a run down of the T's&C's along with benefits etc. Can anyone help? My baptism into aviation was a roasting with Ryanair followed by EasyJet so I'm not exactly wet behind the ears when it comes to fighting my corner but that is besides the point. I can't take the boredom of fixed roster routine and 4 sector days so I'm after long haul, heavy type and a tax break. Here's what I'm looking for. Sector pay for fo? How long to SFO and CAPT with 3500 hrs? Typical roster? staff travel? the rest of the info I've go so if anyone can help with this I'd really appreciate it.
Cheers
Oh and P.S. Nobody is happy even mates at BA & Virgin but their complaints are not what I'd call hardships and my complaints make them cringe so can Emirates be worse than the low cost pimps if you tolerate living out there?
Cheers
Oh and P.S. Nobody is happy even mates at BA & Virgin but their complaints are not what I'd call hardships and my complaints make them cringe so can Emirates be worse than the low cost pimps if you tolerate living out there?
Regarding T's and C's Dubai is an expensive place. Maybe not too bad if you're single with no kids and no mortgage in the UK, but you should not come here for the pay or lifestyle.
Rosters are tough at the moment - even though it's less sectors than loco flying it's still 95 hours a month mostly through the night and with difficult rest patterns.
The working environment can be tough as you don't have the protection you may have in home country should you make a mistake while on the job. Several good people (and some not so good) have fallen foul of this unfortunately. Whatever you do don't ever, ever try to think outside the box unless you're falling uncontrollably from the sky. Just come to work do exactly what it says on the tin then go home. I can't emphasise this enough. Even then, mistakes are usually punished rather than mistakes learned from unfortunately. That's the just the way it is at the moment and you should be prepared for this if you decide to join.
Anyway, as for the good points:
Dubai has great weather most of the year (if you hail from the UK or Ireland anyway).
The flying is the most interesting and varied you will ever get to see.
The aeroplanes are brand new and are all good types to have on the licence.
The time to command is excellent compared to any other major legacy carrier.
The guys you work with are super nice and all of the highest calibre (generally with one or two exceptions).
Keep your head down , your record clean and your finances in check and you could have a great few years in command of a shiny new 777 with your days off on the beach.
Hope this helps!
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Always good to get some "local knowledge" (i assume you are/have been out there?).
a beach covered in ****
FYI it is mostly covered in shady palm trees...
Jumeira Beach and Park Reviews - Dubai, United Arab Emirates Attractions - TripAdvisor
I know this because I actually live out here, as opposed to just making random outspoken statements to make myself feel bigger.
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:'Iver - I think you are right - EK may well suit some people - but from what I saw at the open day in STN - it is mostly people who failed command in Ryanair or have other issues that are applying to EK.':
I know of two Ex Ryanair Capts without issues who have moved to Dubai for a right hand seat in a B777
They love the outdoor life and have been used to the finer things in life.Flying ultra lowcost shorthaul for MOL or Med/Longhaul in a brand new shinyjet with a traditional airline feel albeit for a Sheikh. Its whatever suits you.
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I did not say that to make myself feel anything. It is true. i remembered reading an article about it a few years ago. I know people who have complained about this problem whilst on holiday. Read the Middle east forum, there are comments there too.
BBC NEWS | Middle East | Raw sewage threat to booming Dubai
Just the first link from google.
No malice intended.
Also the thought of flying for Emirates does appeal, however I don't wish to live in Dubai or any Arab country. So that precludes me entirely.
BBC NEWS | Middle East | Raw sewage threat to booming Dubai
Just the first link from google.
No malice intended.
Also the thought of flying for Emirates does appeal, however I don't wish to live in Dubai or any Arab country. So that precludes me entirely.
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New dates for the roadshows in the United Kingdom
London Gatwick - 21st February 2011 10:00am
Sofitel
North terminal Gatwick Airport West
Sussex
Crawley
RH6 0PH
London Stansted - 22nd & 23rd February 2011 10:00am
Radisson Blu Hotel London
Stansted Airport
Waltham Close
London Stansted Airport
Essex
CM24 1PP
Manchester - 24th February 2011 TBA
Seems like they are interested in RYR guys & gals with 2 days in STN!
London Gatwick - 21st February 2011 10:00am
Sofitel
North terminal Gatwick Airport West
Sussex
Crawley
RH6 0PH
London Stansted - 22nd & 23rd February 2011 10:00am
Radisson Blu Hotel London
Stansted Airport
Waltham Close
London Stansted Airport
Essex
CM24 1PP
Manchester - 24th February 2011 TBA
Seems like they are interested in RYR guys & gals with 2 days in STN!
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...Raw sewage threat to booming Dubai
French
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Does anyone know if they serve any refreshments at these roadshows?
Having paid thousands to con men at Gatwick for my jet rating and line training, these roadshows not only offer the chance of a job, but also the opportunity for a decent meal!
TT.
Having paid thousands to con men at Gatwick for my jet rating and line training, these roadshows not only offer the chance of a job, but also the opportunity for a decent meal!
TT.
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well, there is ONE reason, the reason that despite the look of it, they cannot and will never find enough people. American pilots will return to america, UK pilots will return to UK and so on...Dubai is good for a limited amount of time and the unrest in the region (its starting now) will make a few think twice before moving there. Me for example.
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