Easyjet Hold Pool
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eagle 21
not having a go at you or direspecting you, two of my mates lost their job at bmi because of the P2F scam.
the point i was trying to make is, it would be interesting to know if any of the P2F guys will be offered perm contracts too.
m
not having a go at you or direspecting you, two of my mates lost their job at bmi because of the P2F scam.
the point i was trying to make is, it would be interesting to know if any of the P2F guys will be offered perm contracts too.
m
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Well I personally feel it is sad to see a comparison being made between one of the biggest operators in Europe and what is essentially a flag carrier from a developing country in the Far East. When viewed in that context, it is laughable.
Perhaps it is just me but does anyone else get the feeling that as time passes, many more people are donning the rose tinted glasses and are now starting to view the glass as half full with the current recruitment practices?
For anyone who does want to join easyJet then I can only sympathise wholeheartedly, since having no option than to take such an indignant entry into the RHS of an Airbus, is extremely sad. Even more so, since I think many of us know very well that things will only get worse and are very unlikely to get better.
Perhaps it is just me but does anyone else get the feeling that as time passes, many more people are donning the rose tinted glasses and are now starting to view the glass as half full with the current recruitment practices?
For anyone who does want to join easyJet then I can only sympathise wholeheartedly, since having no option than to take such an indignant entry into the RHS of an Airbus, is extremely sad. Even more so, since I think many of us know very well that things will only get worse and are very unlikely to get better.
I concur with EpsilonVaz. The CTC Flexicrew pilots who were originally stood down in 2008 have now been offered permanent positions from 1st November.
I don't know anyone from Parc but have heard if they have over 750 hours they have been offered a position.
I don't know anyone from Parc but have heard if they have over 750 hours they have been offered a position.
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If you are CPI ready as you say I doubt these guys will get a command ahead of you. They will need to do at least one good LPC, then get a pre-CPI, then wait to be rostered for the three command prep flights to get to the position where you are now. Not sure how long that is at the current flow but from what I hear at least three years.
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As always, on this forum there are a wide range of opinions - some informed and others less so. I have never pretended that I have anything other than utter disdain for the current FO contracts. I have to say, however, that things are not all bad at easyJet - right now there are few other companies in Europe I would wish to work for. If you are fortunate enough to have commenced a career at an early age with your national flag carrier, then I say well done to you - assuming it does not go bankrupt underneath you then you are truly blessed. For anyone else, companies like easyJet are a godsend.
Let us look at what is actually happening right now at easyJet rather than the failings of the past. As a little aside, if you are an FO or Captain with days leave to sell back you can get some serious money right now - I myself have just finished 2 days' leave flying at £980/day + sector pay + my regular salary. I would suggest to you that this is a good deal. If you are a Captain, and you are willing to surrender your 5/3/5/4 rostering for random rostering from June - August inclusive, easyJet are offering an EXTRA £10,000(or £5,000 if you are an FO). Once again, I would suggest there are worse fates to befall you. I have also, along with everyone else at easyJet, just been given 2 weeks' salary worth of share options as a thanks from the company for all our hard work during the recent disruption - I am frankly extremely grateful.
Regarding FO contracts, which quite rightly have been the source of much angst in the pilot community, things are changing. We are offering permanent contracts to around 50 pilots in 'seniority' order assuming you have more than 750 hours on type - thereby provding permanent jobs to both redundant BMI pilots and CTC cadets who have been on temporary contracts for the last 2 years. Once again, I would invite contributions from others who know of other UK airlines offering such opportunities right now. I will quote from the latest p-mail internal news to state what else is happening to give a feel for what is happening at easyJet right now.
We were originally planning a total of 37 promotions to Captain for the summer 2010 programme. Operating additional aircraft and re-phasing of the flying programme together with increased attrition means that we have now increased this to just over 80 Commands with a smaller number operating in the LHS on a seasonal basis. We are now at maximum training capacity. All Command offers have been on the current Terms and Conditions with the exception of a potential FRV (Flexible Rostering Variation) period for 6 months over the Winter period (there is a payment attached to this period if FRV is undertaken). EasyJet have confirmed to pilot representatives that they do not plan to engage Contract Captains for the Summer providing we can achieve the necessary flexibility through the schemes that have proposed (not withstanding the small number of CTC Trainers that operate for us as part of the CTC training contract).
We have added a further 110 First Officers to the pilot establishment numbers for Summer compared to an initial requirement of 88. We are now at maximum training capacity for the summer. We have engaged both ab-initio pilots from CTC and Oxford as well as a significant number of experienced Airbus FO’s from Parc Aviation and CTC. We have offered a letter of intent to employ just under 50 First Officers that have a minimum of 750+ factored easyJet hours and will fly for us over the coming Summer months. These pilots will be employed from 01 November 2010. Tell me, all you nay-sayers, where in Europe there is another company who can even come close to all this?
Is this a perfect company to work for? Absolutely not. Are there tensions due to the pressures on training and the overall flying programme? Absolutely. Am I mighty glad to have these problems rather than wondering whether I will ever work as a pilot again? Absolutely. In short, we are one of the few genuinely successful and stable airlines in Europe who are continuing to recruit despite the dire state of the overall airline industry. I fly brand new Airbuses every day to a staggering range of destinations in a safety conscious environment. I am delighted to be here, and for all its faults there is nowhere else in the world I would rather work right now. I will continue to back BALPA 100% in making easyJet 'a great place to work', and to fight the worst excesses of our management, but please let us see that we are genuinely in as safe a place as I know of right now.
Let us look at what is actually happening right now at easyJet rather than the failings of the past. As a little aside, if you are an FO or Captain with days leave to sell back you can get some serious money right now - I myself have just finished 2 days' leave flying at £980/day + sector pay + my regular salary. I would suggest to you that this is a good deal. If you are a Captain, and you are willing to surrender your 5/3/5/4 rostering for random rostering from June - August inclusive, easyJet are offering an EXTRA £10,000(or £5,000 if you are an FO). Once again, I would suggest there are worse fates to befall you. I have also, along with everyone else at easyJet, just been given 2 weeks' salary worth of share options as a thanks from the company for all our hard work during the recent disruption - I am frankly extremely grateful.
Regarding FO contracts, which quite rightly have been the source of much angst in the pilot community, things are changing. We are offering permanent contracts to around 50 pilots in 'seniority' order assuming you have more than 750 hours on type - thereby provding permanent jobs to both redundant BMI pilots and CTC cadets who have been on temporary contracts for the last 2 years. Once again, I would invite contributions from others who know of other UK airlines offering such opportunities right now. I will quote from the latest p-mail internal news to state what else is happening to give a feel for what is happening at easyJet right now.
We were originally planning a total of 37 promotions to Captain for the summer 2010 programme. Operating additional aircraft and re-phasing of the flying programme together with increased attrition means that we have now increased this to just over 80 Commands with a smaller number operating in the LHS on a seasonal basis. We are now at maximum training capacity. All Command offers have been on the current Terms and Conditions with the exception of a potential FRV (Flexible Rostering Variation) period for 6 months over the Winter period (there is a payment attached to this period if FRV is undertaken). EasyJet have confirmed to pilot representatives that they do not plan to engage Contract Captains for the Summer providing we can achieve the necessary flexibility through the schemes that have proposed (not withstanding the small number of CTC Trainers that operate for us as part of the CTC training contract).
We have added a further 110 First Officers to the pilot establishment numbers for Summer compared to an initial requirement of 88. We are now at maximum training capacity for the summer. We have engaged both ab-initio pilots from CTC and Oxford as well as a significant number of experienced Airbus FO’s from Parc Aviation and CTC. We have offered a letter of intent to employ just under 50 First Officers that have a minimum of 750+ factored easyJet hours and will fly for us over the coming Summer months. These pilots will be employed from 01 November 2010. Tell me, all you nay-sayers, where in Europe there is another company who can even come close to all this?
Is this a perfect company to work for? Absolutely not. Are there tensions due to the pressures on training and the overall flying programme? Absolutely. Am I mighty glad to have these problems rather than wondering whether I will ever work as a pilot again? Absolutely. In short, we are one of the few genuinely successful and stable airlines in Europe who are continuing to recruit despite the dire state of the overall airline industry. I fly brand new Airbuses every day to a staggering range of destinations in a safety conscious environment. I am delighted to be here, and for all its faults there is nowhere else in the world I would rather work right now. I will continue to back BALPA 100% in making easyJet 'a great place to work', and to fight the worst excesses of our management, but please let us see that we are genuinely in as safe a place as I know of right now.
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We have offered a letter of intent to employ just under 50 First Officers that have a minimum of 750+ factored easyJet hours and will fly for us over the coming Summer months. These pilots will be employed from 01 November 2010.
regards
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I agree with Foreever again; hence why I started this thread in the first place. I ve sat in the pool since July 2008, with a proposed start date later that year to be based in MXP. I am 737 rated, and was recommended by many TRI/TRE's Captains, Base Captain etc, and when I first applied to Easyjet in 2003, I was told that I needed TP or Jet time to be considered for the TRSS. So I went to an Airline and built up that Jet time, and reapplied, only to pass the selection and then be cast aside, because it now suits EasyJet.
I agree with NSF on many points. I have jumped through every hoop that Easyjet have asked me to jump through, yet I find myself, out of the pool come July, because I now don't have an Airbus rating! I feel that I'm just chasing my tail with this lot.
I've spoken to the recruitment dept, just to be told 'Sorry'! It's not there fault, but I feel very let down through no fault of my own. What's the point in going on about it though? My friends at Easyjet feel just as frustrated as me, but it's my wife and young children I feel really sorry for. I live minutes from STN, and I end having to commute hundreds of miles a week, to keep my job, where we don't know what the future holds from one minute to the next.
I do appreciate that my position is a lot better than those poor buggers, who have been made redundant and have not found work since. I don't forget that! However, I feel really fed up with the way it's all going, and I have started looking for non aviation work, so I can return to normaility, and get to spend time with my family, instead of waking up every morning, wondering if I am going to have a job today.
If, it's not the recession, it's terrorism or Volcanos or rising oil prices etc that's going cause another airline to go under or our T & C's to fall even further. The nature of our industry is highly volitile and vulnerable; that's just the nature of the beast I hear you say! You are right! I think what most of us are looking for is a bit of security for our families, a salary that matches our responsibilities, and some respect from the management. Too much to ask?
It's starting to look that way...
SiJet
I agree with NSF on many points. I have jumped through every hoop that Easyjet have asked me to jump through, yet I find myself, out of the pool come July, because I now don't have an Airbus rating! I feel that I'm just chasing my tail with this lot.
I've spoken to the recruitment dept, just to be told 'Sorry'! It's not there fault, but I feel very let down through no fault of my own. What's the point in going on about it though? My friends at Easyjet feel just as frustrated as me, but it's my wife and young children I feel really sorry for. I live minutes from STN, and I end having to commute hundreds of miles a week, to keep my job, where we don't know what the future holds from one minute to the next.
I do appreciate that my position is a lot better than those poor buggers, who have been made redundant and have not found work since. I don't forget that! However, I feel really fed up with the way it's all going, and I have started looking for non aviation work, so I can return to normaility, and get to spend time with my family, instead of waking up every morning, wondering if I am going to have a job today.
If, it's not the recession, it's terrorism or Volcanos or rising oil prices etc that's going cause another airline to go under or our T & C's to fall even further. The nature of our industry is highly volitile and vulnerable; that's just the nature of the beast I hear you say! You are right! I think what most of us are looking for is a bit of security for our families, a salary that matches our responsibilities, and some respect from the management. Too much to ask?
It's starting to look that way...
SiJet
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I find myself, out of the pool come July, because I now don't have an Airbus rating!
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Double the drift - spot on. The airline is a shambles. Crewing levels are a joke and although I have no problem with people taking the money to fly a flexi roster, I hardly think that is something for NSF to highlight as an example of what a great company we are!!!
Very rose, very tinted specs. Expect pilots to leave in droves as soon as the opportunities arrive.
Very rose, very tinted specs. Expect pilots to leave in droves as soon as the opportunities arrive.
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Expect pilots to leave in droves as soon as the opportunities arrive
NSF
It will take more than a few grand in exchange for having a life over the summer and some free "conditional" share options to convince me anything has changed at easy. Nothing has - they have completely
it up regarding crew numbers for the peak season, as we all knew they would. Summer of 2006 all over again anyone? They are buying us off to cover their own mistakes and piss poor decisions that were driven by a combination of corporate greed and a complete disdain for anyone within the company other than top level management. The only positive news is offering full time contracts to F/Os who have been treated like part time shelf stackers for 2 years. However, that is no great credit to our paymasters - they are simply doing something that common decency dictates they should have done a long time ago. Same with the pay deal on offer, sector pay for positioning and proper sector pay for flying to the Middle East and back in one duty is not generosity that we should all applaud, it is the company rectifying something we should have had years ago. If they really wanted to make easy "A great place to work" and "re-engage" with the pilot workforce they could. The problem of course, as always, is it would require them to spend some money and take a long term view of how they crew the airline. And we all know they would rather set fire to their own underpants than do that.
I doubt I am alone in thinking this summer will be, erm, "interesting".
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si jet - I cannot in any way justify what has happened to those in the hold pool. What I can tell you is that, in my judgement, it is very unlikely that any of those people will be offered jobs any time soon by easyJet. The whole recruitment situation has changed so dramatically, and we now have large numbers of temporary pilots looking for permanent jobs. Quite rightly they will be considered first, and it is only after they have jobs that we will look elsewhere. I am genuninely sorry that you guys have been treated so shabbily, but I nonetheless think that is what will happen.
Claudio - My comments are not to a 'wider audience'. I have no ambitions whatsoever in management, and neither seek their favour or fear their disdain. I am in the fortunate position of having a job I am very content in at easyJet, and if never promoted again would be very happy with where I have got to. I do, however, have some concerns about the attitudes of some both in and out of easyJet to all that is going on. There are a number of pilots working for easyJet who, if they were given a free Ferrari by the company, would have been given one in the wrong colour! All is not perfect at easyJet, but there are some very positive aspects to working here - which I have tried to highlight. There are a lot of pilots on here who would genuinely feel better if easyJet went bankrupt, and that includes some of those working there. It would somehow justify the ridiculous excesses of their opinions. We are indeed in a crewing shambles - I am unashamedly doing everything I can to ensure we run our program over the coming months. That is because I want our customers to come back again and because it is in all of our interests to fly for a successful airline. That is just pure common sense - alas, experience shows that common sense is neither common or evident to most people. I do not like what has happened in that last couple of years any more than anyone else, but I do detect a new reality coming in among our managers. They now know that keeping the pilots and cabin crew on board makes sound business sense - it is just a shame it has taken them so long to find out what any of us could have told them years ago. Whatever the mistakes of the past, I choose to look towards the future. It can be bright if we choose to make it so. I sure want easyJet to recover from the current situation. If ever there was a time to pull together to make easyJet successful, this is it. I would humbly suggest that those who are within would do well to think likewise.
Claudio - My comments are not to a 'wider audience'. I have no ambitions whatsoever in management, and neither seek their favour or fear their disdain. I am in the fortunate position of having a job I am very content in at easyJet, and if never promoted again would be very happy with where I have got to. I do, however, have some concerns about the attitudes of some both in and out of easyJet to all that is going on. There are a number of pilots working for easyJet who, if they were given a free Ferrari by the company, would have been given one in the wrong colour! All is not perfect at easyJet, but there are some very positive aspects to working here - which I have tried to highlight. There are a lot of pilots on here who would genuinely feel better if easyJet went bankrupt, and that includes some of those working there. It would somehow justify the ridiculous excesses of their opinions. We are indeed in a crewing shambles - I am unashamedly doing everything I can to ensure we run our program over the coming months. That is because I want our customers to come back again and because it is in all of our interests to fly for a successful airline. That is just pure common sense - alas, experience shows that common sense is neither common or evident to most people. I do not like what has happened in that last couple of years any more than anyone else, but I do detect a new reality coming in among our managers. They now know that keeping the pilots and cabin crew on board makes sound business sense - it is just a shame it has taken them so long to find out what any of us could have told them years ago. Whatever the mistakes of the past, I choose to look towards the future. It can be bright if we choose to make it so. I sure want easyJet to recover from the current situation. If ever there was a time to pull together to make easyJet successful, this is it. I would humbly suggest that those who are within would do well to think likewise.
Last edited by Norman Stanley Fletcher; 4th May 2010 at 03:12. Reason: Grammar Crimes!
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I do detect a new reality coming in amongst our managers
Don't be so naive NSF, they are in a hole and you and all the others who are happy to take the Queen's shilling are digging them out! You've been complaining on here for ever about how much the easyJet management are only interested in short term gain, then you have the gall to boast about how much you are making by working your days off.
Sir, you are a hypocrite.
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My wish is that we do not let these contract F/Os go anywhere near a permanent easyjet contract. For while these guys are taken on ahead of those in the hold pool, the temporary contract will be seen by many as the only way into the company. This will lead to more people signing up.
The only beneficiary from this situation is CTC.
Other than for those reasons detailed in the Berger report, I see no benefit of streaming money out of the company to those arrogant CTC Tws when it could be kept inhouse, employing motivated, talented people on permanent contracts.
FPS
The only beneficiary from this situation is CTC.
Other than for those reasons detailed in the Berger report, I see no benefit of streaming money out of the company to those arrogant CTC Tw
s when it could be kept inhouse, employing motivated, talented people on permanent contracts.FPS
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So management screw up and will cause, as yet unknown, significant damage to our brand and inconvenience to our passengers. The tactic some/most of you on here seem to advocate is to cause further damage to our brand and reputation by non co-operation in the hope that our management will be sacked on the spot. Great plan bound to work .....
If you find yourself in a badly damaged boat you don't sit there moaning about the crew that got you into the mess, you start bailing while you moan so you can get to a port were you can then duff the crew up and hold them to account. Maybe your efforts mean the repercussions for the crew are not as severe as they might have been (they will still be severe) but then you are alive in a calm port and not swimming in the ocean (looking for a job) because the boat sank.
NSF is right when he says some of you could be handed a Ferrari and you'd complain about the colour. You are the opposite end of the spectrum to Cor but no less misguided. I am being offered more money in exchange for work when most of my friends are taking pay cuts if they even still have a job. I loath this management but I love my family, my home and my job and I want to keep them. I've already started bailing.
If you find yourself in a badly damaged boat you don't sit there moaning about the crew that got you into the mess, you start bailing while you moan so you can get to a port were you can then duff the crew up and hold them to account. Maybe your efforts mean the repercussions for the crew are not as severe as they might have been (they will still be severe) but then you are alive in a calm port and not swimming in the ocean (looking for a job) because the boat sank.
NSF is right when he says some of you could be handed a Ferrari and you'd complain about the colour. You are the opposite end of the spectrum to Cor but no less misguided. I am being offered more money in exchange for work when most of my friends are taking pay cuts if they even still have a job. I loath this management but I love my family, my home and my job and I want to keep them. I've already started bailing.
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Ashling,
Perhaps you'd like to explain why not offering to give up precious summer leave and days off is "non co-operation". This is just the sort of reverse psychology employed by the management to try to convince us that we are the "problem".
How "co operative" have they been during the pay negotiations? When asked for a day off? When asked for summer leave? When asked for an improvement to the crew food?
I work very hard as it is and I don't think I'm "misguided" in wanting to retain some semblance of sanity and well earned rest during what will, in any event, turn out to be a chaotic summer.
If the management had been more "co operative" then they might have listened to us in December and started recruiting some of your friends who you say don't have jobs.
Perhaps you'd like to explain why not offering to give up precious summer leave and days off is "non co-operation". This is just the sort of reverse psychology employed by the management to try to convince us that we are the "problem".
How "co operative" have they been during the pay negotiations? When asked for a day off? When asked for summer leave? When asked for an improvement to the crew food?
I work very hard as it is and I don't think I'm "misguided" in wanting to retain some semblance of sanity and well earned rest during what will, in any event, turn out to be a chaotic summer.
If the management had been more "co operative" then they might have listened to us in December and started recruiting some of your friends who you say don't have jobs.
Last edited by Company Message; 4th May 2010 at 15:55.