P2F Cancer of Aviation (merged)/ petitions.
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: HON121º/14 NM
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192 already!
I am pretty sceptical about whether these petitions work or not, but I know if you don't sign then nothing will change...
You don't really expect BALPA to support it do you? They should have been on the case years ago but weren't...
I am pretty sceptical about whether these petitions work or not, but I know if you don't sign then nothing will change...
You don't really expect BALPA to support it do you? They should have been on the case years ago but weren't...
Airlines have been doing this for how long
??? some 20 years plus??? And now there's a petition to put a stop to this practice!?!?
!
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: NW
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The standards are so low these days...what caused it? Apathy probably, and a lack of serious proffesional ethics..
It's about profits....hiring kids, marshmellows, hire on attitude, hire abinitio, hire peeps that pay for training...anything to pay less, profit more...P2F isnt the only problem.
I used to think the aviation insurance companies or even the FAA would step in...the underwriters just jack up the premiums, the FAA is asleep at the wheel...like SEC, FDIC and the other stock market regulators....
You can choose to be part of this circus or not, I chose not to.
It's about profits....hiring kids, marshmellows, hire on attitude, hire abinitio, hire peeps that pay for training...anything to pay less, profit more...P2F isnt the only problem.
I used to think the aviation insurance companies or even the FAA would step in...the underwriters just jack up the premiums, the FAA is asleep at the wheel...like SEC, FDIC and the other stock market regulators....
You can choose to be part of this circus or not, I chose not to.
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: In the clouds above
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PPRuNe - pilot news network and debating forum, not a spelling/grammar critique. There are greater priorities than if someone can spell correctly because not everyone using this website has English as a first language, it still surprises me how many get on their high horse over this issue.
Yes, the petition wasn't composed in the most compelling or erudite way, it would have maybe been better to post a first draft on here and invite amendments. However if we hone in on this we miss the greater picture and give unfair criticism towards Karl for starting it.
What is more important is why he felt he had to do it in the first place and why it takes a lowly pilot off his own back to organise it when there are others with greater resources to do so.
I've signed it regardless of the argument he gave to support it. For me, if it is recognised and investigated by the politicians/public then we as a group can re-write a better supporting statement, this is the first step to gain better and wider recognition outside our industry.
I'd asked my friends and family to sign it as it should be remembered its not limited to pilots or wanabee's, its for anyone affected and don't like the trend our industry is moving towards.
Yes, the petition wasn't composed in the most compelling or erudite way, it would have maybe been better to post a first draft on here and invite amendments. However if we hone in on this we miss the greater picture and give unfair criticism towards Karl for starting it.
What is more important is why he felt he had to do it in the first place and why it takes a lowly pilot off his own back to organise it when there are others with greater resources to do so.
I've signed it regardless of the argument he gave to support it. For me, if it is recognised and investigated by the politicians/public then we as a group can re-write a better supporting statement, this is the first step to gain better and wider recognition outside our industry.
I'd asked my friends and family to sign it as it should be remembered its not limited to pilots or wanabee's, its for anyone affected and don't like the trend our industry is moving towards.
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: UK
Age: 78
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All very well signing this crap, and moaning abouit p2f, well if you don't want p2f and want a superiour person instead than I would expect the english to be rather good.., and should their not be a selection process as well so we can decide whom shall use the english language, If you no inglish shut up.
some of you guys are much the same as white supremists, one whom rightly was hacked to pieces in South Africa, may more follow.
some of you guys are much the same as white supremists, one whom rightly was hacked to pieces in South Africa, may more follow.
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Costa del Thames
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Ahh, I suspect the old "posting under the influence"...
I shall immediately retire to the drawing board devising a cunning alco-lock for desktops and laptops alike. I know such a thing would have saved me some embarrassment a couple of times. Would it be a huge financial success shall I, without delay, retire from the aviation industry.
I shall immediately retire to the drawing board devising a cunning alco-lock for desktops and laptops alike. I know such a thing would have saved me some embarrassment a couple of times. Would it be a huge financial success shall I, without delay, retire from the aviation industry.
Last edited by Brenoch; 5th Apr 2010 at 08:45.
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Europe
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Europetition
What about to create one of this petition in each EU country? 
-The European Parliament Petitions Committee has an active online petition submission website and the Lisbon Treaty introduces Citizens’ Initiatives, whereby citizens will be able to call on the Commission to bring forward new policy proposals.
We should try to get this pay2fly scheme banned in the EU!
-The European Parliament Petitions Committee has an active online petition submission website and the Lisbon Treaty introduces Citizens’ Initiatives, whereby citizens will be able to call on the Commission to bring forward new policy proposals.
We should try to get this pay2fly scheme banned in the EU!
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: The Far Side
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I think it is supremely ironic that, as I write this, I am looking at a headline ad for 300 hour and 500 hour F/O line training, not more than 1 inch above the reply box.
Oh dear, this could be an uphill battle.
Oh dear, this could be an uphill battle.
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Manchester,uk
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" All very well signing this crap, and moaning abouit p2f, well if you don't want p2f and want a superiour person instead than I would expect the english to be rather good.., "
Unlike yours
"some of you guys are much the same as white supremists, one whom rightly was hacked to pieces in South Africa, may more follow"
BING! knob alert!
Did you happen on here by accident whilst trying to find the Guardian comments site?
Bravo for getting this petition going. About time something was done seeing as our union is determined to stick its fingers in its collective ears and shout "No I can't hear anything Na na na na ....."
The fastest way to stop this would have been a total, immediate and ongoing withdrawal of labour until the whole thing was abandoned. Instead it will take an accident or serious incident. We never learn.
Best of luck.
Unlike yours
"some of you guys are much the same as white supremists, one whom rightly was hacked to pieces in South Africa, may more follow"
BING! knob alert!
Did you happen on here by accident whilst trying to find the Guardian comments site?
Bravo for getting this petition going. About time something was done seeing as our union is determined to stick its fingers in its collective ears and shout "No I can't hear anything Na na na na ....."
The fastest way to stop this would have been a total, immediate and ongoing withdrawal of labour until the whole thing was abandoned. Instead it will take an accident or serious incident. We never learn.
Best of luck.
Join Date: Jul 2008
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All very well signing this crap, and moaning abouit p2f, well if you don't want p2f and want a superiour person instead than I would expect the english to be rather good.., and should their not be a selection process as well so we can decide whom shall use the english language, If you no inglish shut up.
some of you guys are much the same as white supremists, one whom rightly was hacked to pieces in South Africa, may more follow.
some of you guys are much the same as white supremists, one whom rightly was hacked to pieces in South Africa, may more follow.
Join Date: Apr 2002
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Oh dear, it seems that chocolate IS toxic and some on here have been piggies with those Cadbury's cream eggs 
FFS, who gives a monkeys if anyone can reed or rite
Of much more relevance / concern
WHY was it left to this well meaning individual to get the ball rolling with a petition
WHY didn't BALPA (or perhaps I should start saying BLAPA like dear ol Leo HC - wherever he has gone, what did he mean
BLA BLA BLA Pilots Union perchance ? maybe he wasn't so far wrong 
) take some action many moons before this individual decided that he , and we, should stand up and be counted. If this isn't something that 1% of your salary shouldn't be spent eradicating what is ? ?
Or, he says only slightly cynically, is it the fact that it doesn't (directly) affect BA . . . . . Yet
Nothing less than a total loss of credibility for BALPA on this one. I imagine NSF will remind us all what splendid hard working chaps the Easy CC are, and I don't doubt it for a moment. If however, the dead wood in head office are content to sit back and let this happen (nay accept advertising revenue no less) where is their credibility in their intention to be your industrial representation ? crashed & burned IMHO.
Happy Easter
FFS, who gives a monkeys if anyone can reed or rite
Of much more relevance / concern
WHY was it left to this well meaning individual to get the ball rolling with a petition
WHY didn't BALPA (or perhaps I should start saying BLAPA like dear ol Leo HC - wherever he has gone, what did he mean
BLA BLA BLA Pilots Union perchance ? maybe he wasn't so far wrong ) take some action many moons before this individual decided that he , and we, should stand up and be counted. If this isn't something that 1% of your salary shouldn't be spent eradicating what is ? ? Or, he says only slightly cynically, is it the fact that it doesn't (directly) affect BA . . . . . Yet
Nothing less than a total loss of credibility for BALPA on this one. I imagine NSF will remind us all what splendid hard working chaps the Easy CC are, and I don't doubt it for a moment. If however, the dead wood in head office are content to sit back and let this happen (nay accept advertising revenue no less) where is their credibility in their intention to be your industrial representation ? crashed & burned IMHO.
Happy Easter
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Up there
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Has anyone thought about creating a group on Facebook about this to draw attention to it? Possibly including the petition link also?
From previous problems/situations people have faced they have been able to reach a MASSIVE audience through the means of a group on Facebook, these groups can spread like wildfire and reach thousands of people in a matter of hours!
From previous problems/situations people have faced they have been able to reach a MASSIVE audience through the means of a group on Facebook, these groups can spread like wildfire and reach thousands of people in a matter of hours!
Join Date: Jun 2006
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There's a website coming soon.........then if you can promote it via FB, tweeting and any other social net-workng site, that would be great.
Last edited by Global Warrior; 5th Apr 2010 at 14:52.