easyJet Pilots Offered Work as Cabin Crew in January
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: The Universe
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
In the next few days, what is being negotiated by CTC with easyJet to overtly abuse their own pilots will come into the public domain. Any of you who thought that slavery was a thing of the past will think again.
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Balpamyass Palace
Age: 53
Posts: 262
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Balpa cant do anything against flexi crew ****, the management has to find a way to cut the cost, if the cadets are paid as normal pilots then the company will be financially in serious danger.
I am glad that cadets are now treated like ****, they thought they could overtake everybody with there crap pay to fly scheme, and now they realise they have downgraded the pilots salary and conditions, and easyjet is not anymore a great place to work. This is low cost after all.
I am glad that cadets are now treated like ****, they thought they could overtake everybody with there crap pay to fly scheme, and now they realise they have downgraded the pilots salary and conditions, and easyjet is not anymore a great place to work. This is low cost after all.
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: York International
Posts: 677
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Engineer's Pinny
In the past BA offered surplus Flight Engineers CC work which they accepted. It is very hard to imagine some of those that I know who did it wearing a pinny down the back! They made a change from the standard image of male CC I'm sure.
We'll see how long it last!
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: uk
Posts: 516
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Pilot salaries are NOT going to bankrupt easyJet. The airline is a profitable, going concern. Just look at the share price. It's not exactly sky rocketed, but it has held up well during the downturn.
All this scheme is, is a cynical management ploy to:
a) Divide and conquer,
b) Lower costs because they can,
c) undermine the easyJet pilot community.
There will be further battles ahead I'm sure, but I do hope the easyJet BALPA CC have a strong mandate from their members. They are going to need it.
To say "I'm glad the Cadets are being treated like ****" is ridiculous. I'm an A320 Captain. I want my FO to be well rewarded for doing a professional job. If he/she doesn't have to worry about paying the rent/bank loans/food bills/kids nappies, then it's one less thing to distract them from their job in hand. Flying an aeroplane safely.
Stress manifests itself differently in all of us, but to advocate increasing stress levels directly through creating financial hardship is just plain bizarre.
Finally, it's worth considering that IF your airline were to fail, and you were to be a job hunter again, the T&C's you can expect will be directly linked to the success or failure of such management practices.
Be careful what you wish for, because anyone's airline could collapse this Winter.
All this scheme is, is a cynical management ploy to:
a) Divide and conquer,
b) Lower costs because they can,
c) undermine the easyJet pilot community.
There will be further battles ahead I'm sure, but I do hope the easyJet BALPA CC have a strong mandate from their members. They are going to need it.
To say "I'm glad the Cadets are being treated like ****" is ridiculous. I'm an A320 Captain. I want my FO to be well rewarded for doing a professional job. If he/she doesn't have to worry about paying the rent/bank loans/food bills/kids nappies, then it's one less thing to distract them from their job in hand. Flying an aeroplane safely.
Stress manifests itself differently in all of us, but to advocate increasing stress levels directly through creating financial hardship is just plain bizarre.
Finally, it's worth considering that IF your airline were to fail, and you were to be a job hunter again, the T&C's you can expect will be directly linked to the success or failure of such management practices.
Be careful what you wish for, because anyone's airline could collapse this Winter.
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Dre's mum's house
Posts: 1,432
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Mr 100%
PULLEEEEZE
That is called ADVICE, based on hard won experience of the way the 40 Thieves worked within bmi: it doesn't, didn't change my view on the Thieves. It just demonstrates my humanist approach and concern for my colleagues who haven't yet seen the light!
NSF - I resemble that remark!
The evidence as to the efficacy of your beloved union is running pretty much at an all time low: in fact, not only has the dam burst, but the reservoir is looking dry and cracked.
Your, and several less eloquent and cogent others, beloved BALPA, has singularly failed to implement any coherent IR strategy, despite the silver words of the several tongued Brandon et al: the wreckage of the easyjet flexi crew scheme, and now the flexi cabin crew scheme, which even to a non Marxist like me, stinks of your cowardly union cohorts lunching in Mrs Miggins pie shop drowning your sorrows in Leo's much beloved Montrachet whilst the plan was hatched.
The fairy dust they have sprinkled in your eyes won't bring Santa or any little elves to your doors this Xmas with a sackful of jobs for you to choose from: but your BALPA Xmas card and the latest copy of The Log might arrive in time for you to use them to light the kindling on your fire.
In the spirit of Xmas tho Norman, think of the 3 wise men of Thomson, bmi and bmibaby who followed the BALPA star: they didn't find a child in the manger and they didn't take any gifts.
What they found was a dog: a dog bearing P45s.
Luckily, Leo and Slim were on hand to tell the 3 wise men that even though the BALPA mongrel had let them down, the hand of the blessed Mikey of Mullingar was open and jobs, security and a warm Irish welcome were available to some of the P45 holders.
Damn, it just doesn't get more accurate than that!
PULLEEEEZE
NSF - you may not be able to get a Slim Shady to change his spots, but have a look at what colour his true spots are...
The more I listen to Slim, and his more intelligent and eloquent fellow traveller Leo, the more convinced I am about the need for a union. I cannot really work out if these are decent guys with genuinely held views against all the evidence (that is known as a delusion incidentally)
The evidence as to the efficacy of your beloved union is running pretty much at an all time low: in fact, not only has the dam burst, but the reservoir is looking dry and cracked.
Your, and several less eloquent and cogent others, beloved BALPA, has singularly failed to implement any coherent IR strategy, despite the silver words of the several tongued Brandon et al: the wreckage of the easyjet flexi crew scheme, and now the flexi cabin crew scheme, which even to a non Marxist like me, stinks of your cowardly union cohorts lunching in Mrs Miggins pie shop drowning your sorrows in Leo's much beloved Montrachet whilst the plan was hatched.
The fairy dust they have sprinkled in your eyes won't bring Santa or any little elves to your doors this Xmas with a sackful of jobs for you to choose from: but your BALPA Xmas card and the latest copy of The Log might arrive in time for you to use them to light the kindling on your fire.
In the spirit of Xmas tho Norman, think of the 3 wise men of Thomson, bmi and bmibaby who followed the BALPA star: they didn't find a child in the manger and they didn't take any gifts.
What they found was a dog: a dog bearing P45s.
Luckily, Leo and Slim were on hand to tell the 3 wise men that even though the BALPA mongrel had let them down, the hand of the blessed Mikey of Mullingar was open and jobs, security and a warm Irish welcome were available to some of the P45 holders.
Official Announcement:
BALPA today announced that it is changing its emblem to a CONDOM because it more accurately reflects the Union's stance.
A condom allows for inflation, halts production, destroys the next generation, protects a bunch of pricks, and gives you a sense of security while you're actually being screwed.
A condom allows for inflation, halts production, destroys the next generation, protects a bunch of pricks, and gives you a sense of security while you're actually being screwed.
Damn, it just doesn't get more accurate than that!
Mr 100%
PULLEEEEZE
That is called ADVICE, based on hard won experience of the way the 40 Thieves worked within bmi: it doesn't, didn't change my view on the Thieves. It just demonstrates my humanist approach and concern for my colleagues who haven't yet seen the light!
PULLEEEEZE
That is called ADVICE, based on hard won experience of the way the 40 Thieves worked within bmi: it doesn't, didn't change my view on the Thieves. It just demonstrates my humanist approach and concern for my colleagues who haven't yet seen the light!
On this occasion I'll take your advice and "Unite or Perish". Thanks for your "concern".
And on the condom front - personally, I always like to be protected.
But I hope for your sake that MOL is wearing one as he skulks around behind you...
In the mean time, we at eJ are united not to protect jobs (since BALPA cannot do that when a company needs to lose employees) but to try and ensure we are not unnecessarily shafted by greedy and myopic managers.
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: uk
Posts: 139
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
On a lighter note.
Is Ms Lacole part of getting the CTC guys to accept the CC T&C's.....
Sexy Laura Lacole previews the new Airbus 319 | FAMEmagazine.co.uk
Is Ms Lacole part of getting the CTC guys to accept the CC T&C's.....
Sexy Laura Lacole previews the new Airbus 319 | FAMEmagazine.co.uk
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Dre's mum's house
Posts: 1,432
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
In the mean time, we at eJ are united not to protect jobs (since BALPA cannot do that when a company needs to lose employees) but to try and ensure we are not unnecessarily shafted by greedy and myopic managers.
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: uk
Posts: 516
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Slim is confused.
Slim,
"something we have been notably unsuccessful at to the extent that we have allowed the management to shaft the cadets whilst taking the jobs of our existing FOs".
Is this not the very same case as in your beloved Ryanair?
The only difference as I see it is that if the easyJet FO's are being paid £1200 plus allowances as Cabin Crew, that's more than:
A) Ryanair cabin crew get (never be able to offer the same deal there Slim);
and
B) Ryanair Cadets get paid when on line.
It's time to put the sock in your mouth Slim. People aren't interested in your anti BALPA rants.
No airline is perfect. We're in the midst of a terrible economic contraction and all you keep going on about is Condoms. The rant has worn thin.
Please, Slim, just go fly your perfect Boeing for your perfect company.
"something we have been notably unsuccessful at to the extent that we have allowed the management to shaft the cadets whilst taking the jobs of our existing FOs".
Is this not the very same case as in your beloved Ryanair?
The only difference as I see it is that if the easyJet FO's are being paid £1200 plus allowances as Cabin Crew, that's more than:
A) Ryanair cabin crew get (never be able to offer the same deal there Slim);
and
B) Ryanair Cadets get paid when on line.
It's time to put the sock in your mouth Slim. People aren't interested in your anti BALPA rants.
No airline is perfect. We're in the midst of a terrible economic contraction and all you keep going on about is Condoms. The rant has worn thin.
Please, Slim, just go fly your perfect Boeing for your perfect company.
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: One hump; two if you're pretty.
Posts: 293
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From the Desk of the Vegetarian Hyena.
Welcome back Stan. Nice to see you treading the boards once more after your little holiday in the hole. Lets be nice to each other from now on, shall we? I'd very much like that.
Bravo Slim! Your Magnum Opus to date.
I spend more time than I should wondering why it is that truly good and decent men like Norman continue to be seduced by the hollow promises of BLAPA when, demonstrably, they deliver nothing. In fact less than nothing since they routinely betray the implicit promise of their membership. Standing inert whilst the headless chickens at the Grand Luton Orangery utilise your CTC rape victims as cabin staff is just the latest in a long line of failures. Remind me Norman, what is a union for exactly? Oh, that’s right, to protect the rights of all members, especially those least able to defend themselves from that most hollow mantra of the whining aviator, bad management. Well, my dear, were that true, you'd have been out on strike ages ago. What is happening to your CTC cadets, or rather, what is about to happen, it utterly despicable. You certainly don’t find that sort of evil on our side of the Irish Sea. On the contrary, it is you who have established the new nadir, long ago in fact, and you a unionised airline! Gosh.
The word from your beloved BLAPA? "Sorry lads, we sympathise but there's ‘nowt we can do." Were your BLAPA all they claim to be, there wouldn't be a G registered airliner flying above the skies of Britain until this horror story is resolved. But there are, aren't there Norman? Lots of them, and what does that tell us? BLAPA doesn't give a shyte, or rather, they can't.
You write much of the benefits of unity and warn against the dangers inherent in a "divide and conquer" strategy. Have a closer look at BLAPA, Norman. Decentralised, airline specific CC's who are blameless in the event of their (regular) failures since, how does it go again, oh yes "BLAPA are the pilots and the pilots are BLAPA. We're only as strong as our membership permits." Really Norman, do you expect those possessed of a rational mind to accept such shamelessly regurgitated bollocks?
The more rudimentary, reflexive grunts from those of the slack jawed, gravel rash on the knuckles brigade (hello Dim Repa) are at least excusable since they know no better, or as in the case of many colleagues I truly admire, fail to escape the conditioning of their parents generation which is at least explicable within a psychological context, but Norman, you continue to perplex with your blinkered support of a turgid, morally corrupt, broke organisation, who promises everything and delivers nothing. I suggest to you, with the greatest of respect, it is a variation of Stockholm Syndrome where you've come to identify with your captors. And captive you truly are.
BLAPA knows very well that they're the only game in town. They also know that by fostering a sense of fear among the pilots they stand to greatly gain. In a fact not lost among the BLAPA leadership (such as it is), the two principal motivators of human nature are fear and greed. Manipulate those correctly, and you can make us walk on water, even the most reluctant. Shove an electric probe up a horses arse, and if given sufficient electricity, you can teach it to play Canasta. Compliance, then, becomes a question of voltage. Facts not lost upon your unclothed Emperor BLAPA. Do you, sometimes, feel the odd twinge in your prostate, Norman? Nothing to worry about I can assure you, its just BLAPA shoving a few extra volts down the wire.
To paraphrase Primo Levi, a sceptical generation of pilots stands at the threshold of a new order of things, bereft not of ideals but of certainties, indeed distrustful of the grand revealed truth; disposed instead to accept the small truths, changeable from month to month on the convulsed wave of BLAPA manipulation, whether guided or wild.
Your airline is rudderless, Norman, and until that is resolved with a sound new CEO, be it Brady or Coyle, BLAPA will seek to colonise your collective uncertainly to the benefit of their coffers and at the expense of your faith, trust and hope.
Bravo Slim! Your Magnum Opus to date.
I spend more time than I should wondering why it is that truly good and decent men like Norman continue to be seduced by the hollow promises of BLAPA when, demonstrably, they deliver nothing. In fact less than nothing since they routinely betray the implicit promise of their membership. Standing inert whilst the headless chickens at the Grand Luton Orangery utilise your CTC rape victims as cabin staff is just the latest in a long line of failures. Remind me Norman, what is a union for exactly? Oh, that’s right, to protect the rights of all members, especially those least able to defend themselves from that most hollow mantra of the whining aviator, bad management. Well, my dear, were that true, you'd have been out on strike ages ago. What is happening to your CTC cadets, or rather, what is about to happen, it utterly despicable. You certainly don’t find that sort of evil on our side of the Irish Sea. On the contrary, it is you who have established the new nadir, long ago in fact, and you a unionised airline! Gosh.
The word from your beloved BLAPA? "Sorry lads, we sympathise but there's ‘nowt we can do." Were your BLAPA all they claim to be, there wouldn't be a G registered airliner flying above the skies of Britain until this horror story is resolved. But there are, aren't there Norman? Lots of them, and what does that tell us? BLAPA doesn't give a shyte, or rather, they can't.
You write much of the benefits of unity and warn against the dangers inherent in a "divide and conquer" strategy. Have a closer look at BLAPA, Norman. Decentralised, airline specific CC's who are blameless in the event of their (regular) failures since, how does it go again, oh yes "BLAPA are the pilots and the pilots are BLAPA. We're only as strong as our membership permits." Really Norman, do you expect those possessed of a rational mind to accept such shamelessly regurgitated bollocks?
The more rudimentary, reflexive grunts from those of the slack jawed, gravel rash on the knuckles brigade (hello Dim Repa) are at least excusable since they know no better, or as in the case of many colleagues I truly admire, fail to escape the conditioning of their parents generation which is at least explicable within a psychological context, but Norman, you continue to perplex with your blinkered support of a turgid, morally corrupt, broke organisation, who promises everything and delivers nothing. I suggest to you, with the greatest of respect, it is a variation of Stockholm Syndrome where you've come to identify with your captors. And captive you truly are.
BLAPA knows very well that they're the only game in town. They also know that by fostering a sense of fear among the pilots they stand to greatly gain. In a fact not lost among the BLAPA leadership (such as it is), the two principal motivators of human nature are fear and greed. Manipulate those correctly, and you can make us walk on water, even the most reluctant. Shove an electric probe up a horses arse, and if given sufficient electricity, you can teach it to play Canasta. Compliance, then, becomes a question of voltage. Facts not lost upon your unclothed Emperor BLAPA. Do you, sometimes, feel the odd twinge in your prostate, Norman? Nothing to worry about I can assure you, its just BLAPA shoving a few extra volts down the wire.
To paraphrase Primo Levi, a sceptical generation of pilots stands at the threshold of a new order of things, bereft not of ideals but of certainties, indeed distrustful of the grand revealed truth; disposed instead to accept the small truths, changeable from month to month on the convulsed wave of BLAPA manipulation, whether guided or wild.
I do, however, desire to persuade every single pilot at easyJet that the only real hope for our company is a vibrant BALPA fighting on behalf of the pilots against ruthless management.
Last edited by Leo Hairy-Camel; 13th Dec 2009 at 15:56. Reason: typographical oversights
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Dre's mum's house
Posts: 1,432
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
stansdead, let's get down to business.
Condoms? Only mentioned once, not "keep going on about it": do keep up, dear.
Stop whining about Ryanair and it's perfect Boeings and take a long, hard look through the rose tinted mist of your BALPA card: Thomson making pilots redundant, bmi making pilots redundant, baby making pilots redundant, easyjet shafting cadets and FOs - each and everyone a BALPA recognised airline.
Now BALPA can't stop market forces, nor it appears can they have any influence in stopping redundancies: in that case, why let them interfere with the running of the company in the first place? Why let them insist on expenses that cripple your airline and limit the flexibility the management have to manage the operation. Recall the old NATO doctrine? Flexibility is the key to air power!
Your easy FOs won't be making £1200 a month: the figure quoted was £130 a day, if the work is available, and how much training are they going to get? Cabin crew basic training normally lasts at least 6 weeks and then they have to do supernumerary flights then line training flights: easyjet planning to subsidise that cost are they for 1 month's work?
Anyway our cabin crew get paid more than £1200 a month and our Cadet FOs get paid during line training from the day the safety pilot is released, 35€ an hour until FLC then 55€ an hour, so for a 75 hour month, just over 4000€ for the first month's pay: not bad money for an FO with a 300 - ish hours.
Truly stan, the only people who are boring anybody are the BALPA hardliners who can't see the wood for the trees: you keep paying your subs to keep them in lunches, company cars and C class travel.
The pilots that have been let down, yet again, by BALPA, and are out of work or being measured for their CC uniform, will be taking a more realistic look at what they haven't had for their money.
askfap
FR cadets are filling the RHS of the shiny Boeings: and those in training at the moment will be filling the RHS of the 55 new ones arriving next year.
Do keep up.
Condoms? Only mentioned once, not "keep going on about it": do keep up, dear.
Stop whining about Ryanair and it's perfect Boeings and take a long, hard look through the rose tinted mist of your BALPA card: Thomson making pilots redundant, bmi making pilots redundant, baby making pilots redundant, easyjet shafting cadets and FOs - each and everyone a BALPA recognised airline.
Now BALPA can't stop market forces, nor it appears can they have any influence in stopping redundancies: in that case, why let them interfere with the running of the company in the first place? Why let them insist on expenses that cripple your airline and limit the flexibility the management have to manage the operation. Recall the old NATO doctrine? Flexibility is the key to air power!
Your easy FOs won't be making £1200 a month: the figure quoted was £130 a day, if the work is available, and how much training are they going to get? Cabin crew basic training normally lasts at least 6 weeks and then they have to do supernumerary flights then line training flights: easyjet planning to subsidise that cost are they for 1 month's work?
Anyway our cabin crew get paid more than £1200 a month and our Cadet FOs get paid during line training from the day the safety pilot is released, 35€ an hour until FLC then 55€ an hour, so for a 75 hour month, just over 4000€ for the first month's pay: not bad money for an FO with a 300 - ish hours.
Truly stan, the only people who are boring anybody are the BALPA hardliners who can't see the wood for the trees: you keep paying your subs to keep them in lunches, company cars and C class travel.
The pilots that have been let down, yet again, by BALPA, and are out of work or being measured for their CC uniform, will be taking a more realistic look at what they haven't had for their money.
askfap
At least they're getting HOTAC, if and when RYR ever adopt this scheme the hapless cadets will find themselves "camping out" in the car park with some of their future flight deck colleagues.....
Do keep up.
Originally Posted by LHC, on first bottle of Montrachet
I spend more time than I should wondering why it is that truly good and decent men like Norman continue to be seduced by the hollow promises of BLAPA when, demonstrably, they deliver nothing.
Originally Posted by LHC, on second bottle of Montrachet
In fact less than nothing since they routinely betray the implicit promise of their membership.
Originally Posted by LHC, on third bottle of Montrachet
Standing inert whilst the headless chickens at the Grand Luton Orangery utilise your CTC rape victims as cabin staff is just the latest in a long line of failures. Remind me Norman, what is a union for exactly? Oh, that’s right, to protect the rights of all members..snip..
I'm going to guess that your suggested course of action (drop BALPA and become deunionised) will somehow stop this from happening to these CTC pilots. But I fail to see how.
Originally Posted by LHC, on fourth bottle of Montrachet
The word from your beloved BLAPA? "Sorry lads, we sympathise but there's ‘nowt we can do." Were your BLAPA all they claim to be, there wouldn't be a G registered airliner flying above the skies of Britain until this horror story is resolved.
Originally Posted by LHC, on fifth bottle of Montrachet
You write much of the benefits of unity and warn against the dangers inherent in a "divide and conquer" strategy. Have a closer look at BLAPA, Norman. Decentralised, airline specific CC's who are blameless in the event of their (regular) failures since, how does it go again, oh yes "BLAPA are the pilots and the pilots are BLAPA. We're only as strong as our membership permits." Really Norman, do you expect those possessed of a rational mind to accept such shamelessly regurgitated bollocks?
1. Rational mind? Yep.
2. Accept? Yep. But only because it's true.
Originally Posted by LHC, on sixth bottle of Montrachet
.. but Norman, you continue to perplex with your blinkered support of a turgid, morally corrupt, broke organisation, who promises everything and delivers nothing..
Originally Posted by LHC, on seventh bottle of Montrachet
BLAPA .. also know that by fostering a sense of fear among the pilots they stand to greatly gain...
Originally Posted by LHC, on eighth bottle of Montrachet
You airline in rudderless, Norman,
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Dre's mum's house
Posts: 1,432
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
100percent, albeit you are only using a small proportion of that to think, how on earth can you continue to defend the easyJet pilots ( the pilots are BLAPA etc etc) for allowing the exploitation of the cadets, CTC or no?
Are you seriously telling us all that the CC had no knowledge of this scheme?
If they didn't at the outset, when the first shiny faced cadet appeared did the warning bells not sound? Or were they all comatose on Buckfast?
And what on earth have the 40 thieves delivered other than redundancies and deceit? Who allowed the 145s in at LHR and pitted CC against CC now that jobs are at risk?
Why on earth won't you, or can't you see that?
Are you seriously telling us all that the CC had no knowledge of this scheme?
If they didn't at the outset, when the first shiny faced cadet appeared did the warning bells not sound? Or were they all comatose on Buckfast?
And what on earth have the 40 thieves delivered other than redundancies and deceit? Who allowed the 145s in at LHR and pitted CC against CC now that jobs are at risk?
Why on earth won't you, or can't you see that?
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: One hump; two if you're pretty.
Posts: 293
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Laxative's lament.
But 100%, you choose to overlook this one.....
You can almost set your clocks by it. Oh, and there's no Montrachet today. Sadly, I'll have to make to with a 2005 McRae Wood Shiraz by Jim Barry. It's been breathing whilst you, plainly breathless, have not.
The more rudimentary, reflexive grunts from those of the slack jawed, gravel rash on the knuckles brigade