easyjet
Join Date: Mar 2001
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The BALPA argument is won
Seems to me that the argument in favour of union recognition is won:
The only UK airline that has CUT pilot pay continually and successively in recent years is Ryanair
The only airline that refuses to give proper employment contracts to anyone who joins is Ryanair
The only airline that has enforced unpaid leave without negotiation is Ryanair
The only airline that uses badly photocopied approach plates in the cockpit is Ryanair
The only airline that has negotiated a special arrangement on working hours to allow its pilots to fly more hours than those of any other major UK/Irish airline is Ryanair
The only airline that makes crews pay for food on board, uniforms, sim renewals etc etc is Ryanair
And the only major UK airline that doesn't have BALPA recognition is...... oh I think I might leave some of you to work that one out.
Desk-pilot (Who has absolutely no connection with BALPA other than as a member who pays his subscriptions and is bloody glad they are there)
The only UK airline that has CUT pilot pay continually and successively in recent years is Ryanair
The only airline that refuses to give proper employment contracts to anyone who joins is Ryanair
The only airline that has enforced unpaid leave without negotiation is Ryanair
The only airline that uses badly photocopied approach plates in the cockpit is Ryanair
The only airline that has negotiated a special arrangement on working hours to allow its pilots to fly more hours than those of any other major UK/Irish airline is Ryanair
The only airline that makes crews pay for food on board, uniforms, sim renewals etc etc is Ryanair
And the only major UK airline that doesn't have BALPA recognition is...... oh I think I might leave some of you to work that one out.
Desk-pilot (Who has absolutely no connection with BALPA other than as a member who pays his subscriptions and is bloody glad they are there)
Join Date: Oct 2001
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How predictable it is that the pious pontification from Ryanairs finest should eminate whenever BALPA is mentioned as a positive attribute. Quite apart from maintaining the employment conditions of professional employees, BALPA also has a healthy interest in flight safety either directly or indirectly by lending support to pilots. The list of Ryanair incidents over recent history is quite long. Could it be perhaps, that unmoderated management pressure has anything to do with it ?
Join Date: Feb 2001
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Every day that I fly for the big orange machine I am amazed at how often, when time permits, and I say good bye to our passengers there are many who say how pleasent it was and so much nicer than Ryanair. There are those that will never fly with them and those that are fed up with all the hidden charges. So time will tell.
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I can only stand and applaud Desk-pilot's extremely accurate grasp of Ryanair's truly desperate emloyment practices. It nonetheless astounds me that a man of Leo's obvious intelligence is unable to recognise the direct relationship between there being no BALPA recognition at Ryanair and the pitiful tale of abuses catalogued above. Ah yes - we should be just grateful that we have jobs rather than worry about minor details like whether we are hungry or not. Indeed, for humble employees to have any ideas at all about what may be best for themselves or the company they work for would represents a terrifying combination of anarchy and ignorance. After all, the ideas and actions of our bosses should of course be beyond question. To quote that great philanthropist Josef Stalin - “Ideas are far more powerful than guns. We don't allow our enemies to have guns, why should we allow them to have ideas?”
It is at times like this I recognise more than ever the enormous benefits of having BALPA representation. As long as the only people eligible to join BALPA are human beings then there will always be problems. Nonetheless, I can think of nothing worse than leaving my fate in the hands of a few bounty-hunting managers, whose only ambition is to stagger out the door of Hangar 89, their pockets bulging under the weight of their employees' money.
As can be seen from the enormous number of disappointed applicants to easyJet - we are one of the most sought after companies in Europe to work for. EasyJet will emerge strong from this recession, and due almost entirely to BALPA's efforts to defend its pilots' futures, will actually still be an airline of choice afterwards.
It is at times like this I recognise more than ever the enormous benefits of having BALPA representation. As long as the only people eligible to join BALPA are human beings then there will always be problems. Nonetheless, I can think of nothing worse than leaving my fate in the hands of a few bounty-hunting managers, whose only ambition is to stagger out the door of Hangar 89, their pockets bulging under the weight of their employees' money.
As can be seen from the enormous number of disappointed applicants to easyJet - we are one of the most sought after companies in Europe to work for. EasyJet will emerge strong from this recession, and due almost entirely to BALPA's efforts to defend its pilots' futures, will actually still be an airline of choice afterwards.
Join Date: Oct 2007
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Gentlemen,
I am finishing my flying career in the next 14 months and the only thing that has been constant throughout has been change.
An airline does not offer careers, it offers employment. It facilitates an individual's ambitions. Most of you who are disappointed are at fault, because you having being looking outwards rather than inwards for success.
We do not work for easyJet, etc. We work for ourselves. We are highly trained professionals who work for our families, and our own development.
easyJet happens to be that medium at present. What ever we do not like we can and should change.
Those of you who in the year 2009 believe in the good old airline rewards, must have been absent for the last 20 years.
It is my licence, and as such I offer it to the highest bidder. I believe in BALPA as a collective Union, however it's success lies within it's members and not in the name.
If we are not willing to fight, if we are not willing to unite, we shall always be divided.
I say to Mr Corr and Mr. Harrison, I am here to make the airline safe and efficient, not make money for you. You were hired for that. If you cannot do it, do not blame me, get out and leave. The shareholders will find someone who knows and can lead the company.
We gentlemen do not sell tickets, nor do we make pricing decisions, nor do we buy and hedge fuel. We are only on the pointy side to keep the operation safe and efficient.
Fuel saving initiatives, and efficiency measures are not there to make profits for the airlines, they are there to save money and probably provide bonuses.
The management is now relying on our discretion to make money. This to me shows that they have no clue, they have lost the plot, they are not up to the task.
Enough said about the incompetent lot. Stop whining and get up to be heard, tell BALPA that you will fight all the way, not because your are militant but because you believe in your value, and in the unity of the pilot body, otherwise if you do not believe in yourselves take the shafting in silence.
Regards
I am finishing my flying career in the next 14 months and the only thing that has been constant throughout has been change.
An airline does not offer careers, it offers employment. It facilitates an individual's ambitions. Most of you who are disappointed are at fault, because you having being looking outwards rather than inwards for success.
We do not work for easyJet, etc. We work for ourselves. We are highly trained professionals who work for our families, and our own development.
easyJet happens to be that medium at present. What ever we do not like we can and should change.
Those of you who in the year 2009 believe in the good old airline rewards, must have been absent for the last 20 years.
It is my licence, and as such I offer it to the highest bidder. I believe in BALPA as a collective Union, however it's success lies within it's members and not in the name.
If we are not willing to fight, if we are not willing to unite, we shall always be divided.
I say to Mr Corr and Mr. Harrison, I am here to make the airline safe and efficient, not make money for you. You were hired for that. If you cannot do it, do not blame me, get out and leave. The shareholders will find someone who knows and can lead the company.
We gentlemen do not sell tickets, nor do we make pricing decisions, nor do we buy and hedge fuel. We are only on the pointy side to keep the operation safe and efficient.
Fuel saving initiatives, and efficiency measures are not there to make profits for the airlines, they are there to save money and probably provide bonuses.
The management is now relying on our discretion to make money. This to me shows that they have no clue, they have lost the plot, they are not up to the task.
Enough said about the incompetent lot. Stop whining and get up to be heard, tell BALPA that you will fight all the way, not because your are militant but because you believe in your value, and in the unity of the pilot body, otherwise if you do not believe in yourselves take the shafting in silence.
Regards
Join Date: Mar 2001
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Completely agree
Norman, glad that you agree - I don't work for Easy, I work for Flybe and yet we're facing very similar issues to yourselves in terms of pay freezes etc despite the fact that the company made its biggest profit ever last year and is on target to still make a profit in the current financial year due in no small part to its hard working and relatively lowly paid crews.
It does sadden me that terms and conditions are not what they were in this profession. It is a challenging career, it's very demanding and exacting at times and the work pattern can be relentless and fatiguing and can have a big impact on family life. I think all of that is deserving of a reasonable level of remuneration and I think collectively via BALPA is the only way pilots can represent themselves to stem the continual downward spiral.
I was astounded to learn that the 28 year old plumber who fitted our dishwasher and works for the local electricity board earns £10 000 per year more than I do as a First Officer flying a commercial airliner - that shows you how far things have gone.
Wishing you all clear skies,
Desk-pilot
It does sadden me that terms and conditions are not what they were in this profession. It is a challenging career, it's very demanding and exacting at times and the work pattern can be relentless and fatiguing and can have a big impact on family life. I think all of that is deserving of a reasonable level of remuneration and I think collectively via BALPA is the only way pilots can represent themselves to stem the continual downward spiral.
I was astounded to learn that the 28 year old plumber who fitted our dishwasher and works for the local electricity board earns £10 000 per year more than I do as a First Officer flying a commercial airliner - that shows you how far things have gone.
Wishing you all clear skies,
Desk-pilot
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I was astounded to learn that the 28 year old plumber who fitted our dishwasher and works for the local electricity board earns £10 000 per year more than I do as a First Officer flying a commercial airliner - that shows you how far things have gone.
The problem is not the plumber, but the low cost companies.
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I was astounded to learn that the 28 year old plumber who fitted our dishwasher and works for the local electricity board earns £10 000 per year more than I do as a First Officer flying a commercial airliner
Join Date: Apr 2008
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"two of your former Orange men are now Senior TRE's at our facility at East Nowhere. They tells dreadful stories of high dudgeon in Orange Land!"
From Ryanair Pilot 4 Year Agreement (2008) amended and extended to 2013 :-
"Training allowance payable pro-rate for designated training months only - Maximum 3 no-training months notified to individuals at least one month in advance"
Out of the frying pan into the fire maybe ? .......
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The problem is not the plumber, but the low cost companies.
Ah nuageblanc, how you must miss the good old days of nationalised monopolies where unions guaranteed fat salaries regardless of performance
P
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paying for a plumber!
Wow! Flybe must be paying too much if you can afford to hire a plumber!
DIY is cheaper if you know what you're doing and don't mind getting hands dirty
That said i think Turbo prop pilots are under paid
DIY is cheaper if you know what you're doing and don't mind getting hands dirty
That said i think Turbo prop pilots are under paid
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Plumber
I think you're right the problem isn't the plumber but the free market and doing a job that too many people want to do creating oversupply in the labour market.
Re: the plumber he's actually a bloke in our road and he's doing it as a favour for well below normal rates - £15 an hour in fact so even on a Flybe salary it seemed a better option than letting me loose on pipes and risking water coming in from the ceiling. I am however tiling, painting, floor laying etc in order to keep the costs down. Mind you if I was on a decent salary like many of you here I'd certainly be using my concessions to spend a week in Mauritius and come back when it's all been done!!
Desk-pilot
Re: the plumber he's actually a bloke in our road and he's doing it as a favour for well below normal rates - £15 an hour in fact so even on a Flybe salary it seemed a better option than letting me loose on pipes and risking water coming in from the ceiling. I am however tiling, painting, floor laying etc in order to keep the costs down. Mind you if I was on a decent salary like many of you here I'd certainly be using my concessions to spend a week in Mauritius and come back when it's all been done!!
Desk-pilot
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And by the way Leo, given that "two of your former Orange men are now Senior TRE's at our facility at East Nowhere", I would love to hear their view on leaving now. It is inconceivable to me that anyone who left easyJet in the past, when it was significantly worse than it is now, could hand-on-heart say they are glad they work for Ryanair. I realise that internally people have to justify their actions - as people who leave their wives for a trollop try and do for years afterwards, but inwardly knowing they have really blown it! Ryanair is certainly the trollop of the airline industry - loud, no class, and absolutely no shame!
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I'm confused, Deskpilot. If you want to be a plumber, and paid as one, then be a plumber. If you choose to remain as a Fly Be first officer, however, and yet bitch about it though you admit to being a member of BLAPA, it rather begs the question just what is it you expect them to do for you at a regional airline flying light aircraft? Ask your masters at BLAPA Central Command what they think of your relative worth. Prepare yourself for a hurtful rebuke!
If you're serious about wanting to earn more, come fly for us at Ryanair, presuming you're sufficiently capable, and I don't doubt for a moment that you are. When you do, though, you'll be yanking in around £7000 monthly as a contract floating first officer. More than enough, I'd have thought, to afford even the most expensive plumber, or perhaps even a better house that doesn't require one in the first place?
Sounds to me that you'd be well advised to remember that the view of Ryanair from within, is at vast variance to the view from without, even before filtering out the endless morass of BLAPA bullshyte.
All the best,
Leo.
If you're serious about wanting to earn more, come fly for us at Ryanair, presuming you're sufficiently capable, and I don't doubt for a moment that you are. When you do, though, you'll be yanking in around £7000 monthly as a contract floating first officer. More than enough, I'd have thought, to afford even the most expensive plumber, or perhaps even a better house that doesn't require one in the first place?
Sounds to me that you'd be well advised to remember that the view of Ryanair from within, is at vast variance to the view from without, even before filtering out the endless morass of BLAPA bullshyte.
All the best,
Leo.
