easyjet
 

Hi,
I was just after you thoughts and opinions on the chances of a job with easyjet next year.

I'm currently a Captain on a Q400. I've got about another year of my bond left and was thinking of easyjet as a possible move. Projecting my hours forward to next march I'll have around 5500 or so. From what I hear the chances of a direct entry are slim to nil. So I'd be looking at a stint in the right hand seat.

My questions are.....

How long might I have to spend as an FO before command?
What are the chances of getting the base I want?

I'm asking about easyjet as the flying they do is about the same as what I do at the moment. ie sectors of around 1-2hrs. 2-4 rotations a day.

Thanks in advance

Homer J

Homer J,

you could start by using some initiative and looking here;

http://www.pprune.org/terms-endearme...ding-pool.html

Sorry to shatter your illusions!

Ivor:ugh::ugh::ugh:

Yea, had a look on there, most of the posts seemed to be from a few years ago, and the last few pages were all about CTC cadets(I'm assuming low houred, but might be wrong) on temp contracts. Is that the general theme with easy, or is it any different for relativly experienced folk?

Your best bet is go to the easyJet website - they have a detailed recruitment section, but don't expect anything until the economy picks up. As for bases, you go where your are told & then join the bid queue for the base you want. There are a lot of SFOs waiting for command right now.

HomerJ,

You are right, being a prop captain only forces you to start as an FO.

When you apply it might take a long time before they let you go to the interview and assesments.
Then you will have to swim in the holding pool for a very long time with the others that have been waiting for more than a year.

If you are then offered a job then you have to wait a minimum of 6 months before you can apply for the upgrade process.
That's provided your 2 previous sims have been above standard in order to join the process.
If accepted for the upgrade process you then have to complete this which can take more than a year, as in the summertime the upgrade process is temporarily frozen.
If you pass then you have to join the pool for a command course which to my best knowledge consists of 150 people at the moment.
With 20 temporary commands for this summer and a command list that gets longer and longer for every day that goes by I predict a very very very LOOOONG time of waiting for you :uhoh:

All of a sudden my current job is looking rather good. might be staying here for a while.

thanks for the info

The Flying Cokeman - excellent and accurate view of the current situation. My only question is whether you have underestimated the 150 guys currently on the command list - I am given to understand it is considerably larger than that. Nonetheless, as you rightly say, whatever size the list is, it is growing every day.

Homer_J - As others have said, there is no possibility right now of a permanent job at easyJet as an FO. In the past we have taken DECs (I was one myself a few years ago), but barring a dramatic change in circumstances that would be verging on the miraculous, those days are gone. We have literally hundreds of top quality FOs now available for command courses, all of whom have thousands of jet hours - anyone joining now would therefore go to the back of a long and distinguished queue.

I am not sure if you were being serious about the possibility of going from a Q400 command to a DEC on a 737/Airbus. At no point in easyJet's history has there been DECs from turboprops, nor am I aware of any company in the UK who has ever offered that either. To go from the left seat of a turboprop and go straight into the left seat of an Airbus would be a recipe for disaster. That is not in any way to knock turboprop guys - I was one myself previously, and it was a fantastic start to my commercial flying career that I will always be grateful for. Nonetheless the jet world is a whole new deal, and it just takes time and experience to get comfortable with it. After being a turboprop captain, I was an FO for another 2 1/2 years on the Airbus before getting a command. In retrospect I am extremely grateful the chance for promotion did not come before then, as I would not have been able to do the opportunity justice.

I am not sure there is a single jet airline in the world right now where there is a quick command. That will no doubt all change, but if you have a stable job I would be hanging onto it rather than join the rat-race of summer jobs at easyJet. Although you have 5500 hours, from what you say none of it is jet time. You would need substantial jet experience to be considered for a command, but right now the limitation would not be that but the enormous group of people in front of you. If you wanted a figure, I would say that anyone joining today could wait 5 years' + to get a sniff of a command and even that might turn out to be very optimistic. Regarding bases, it is basically a case of initially taking an FO job where you are offered it. As soon as you join you can then put your name on the list for wherever you want to go. It is completely down to supply and demand when your slot comes up. For example, if you want to go to Gatwick you would get there in a few months, but if you want to go to East Midlands or Berlin you could wait several years. Once you get promoted the fun all begins again. You have to take the promotion where it is offered or it goes to the next guy. Once you are on the command list you have to apply to the base of your choice but you are now at the bottom of the transfer list - the fact you have been an FO there for years is no help whatsoever!

Best of luck!

Hey Homer, why not bid command on the E195 when you get the seniority? E195 looks like a nice ride too...

Q400
 

Hi all,

NSF, I regularly read your posts with interest and regard you as you are one of pprune's sensible, balanced contributors, so please don't take this as a personal attack. I merely want to take issue with your comments regarding turboprop commands.

I am personally in the middle of a Q400 conversion (not for Flybe) having moved from a command on the F100 and having earlier flown the 737 for Excel/XL. I can confidently say that anyone who can fly this rough diamond can equally well cope with a jet which is in almost all respects MUCH easier to operate.

Command qualities are common to all types and as the recession bites and as more operators look to save every last penny, the turbo prop looks likely to enjoy a renaissance.

Nevertheless, I accept that the traditional path has tended to be left seat turboprop to right seat jet and I accept that Homer J will find it difficult to circumvent this. Like so much in life, "it ain't right and it ain't fair".

KT

That is a tremendous bulld****. I used to fly Turboprop, now on a big jet in a big passenger airline and I found the jet far easier thant the heavy turboprop I flew before.
As for airlines promoting DEC even from turboprop there is at least Cityjet (known as ****yjet :}) and Wizzair have tooken lots of ATR captain with no jet experience, straight on the left hand seat of a brand new airbus and so far there have been no accident nor incident report.

Finally, Hommer-J, with your flight hours and experience you'd better apply to Cargolux as an FO but you will be treated and paid much better than at easyjet.
easyjet=ryanair

Good luck.

SSS

Nah not true Ryanair will still put you on a Command Course 20 minutes after you've joined as a Cadet.

I must agree with NSF, there is no chance of a direct entry to the left hand seat from a turboprop in easyJet, all ( so far ) have always had to do a little time RHS.

British World.

ATP command to command on 757. ( Not myself by btw )

It's about ability and in some cases who your drink buddies are.

seasexsun
 

As for airlines promoting DEC even from turboprop there is at least Cityjet (known as ****yjet http://static.pprune.org/images/smilies/badteeth.gif) and Wizzair have tooken lots of ATR captain with no jet experience, straight on the left hand seat of a brand new airbus and so far there have been no accident nor incident report.

Not strictly true. Several of these ATR guys were employed by Wizzair as DECs and it was suggested afer a while that they would benefit from a period in the RHS. At least one actually requested that he did 6 months RHS before movng to LHS (very experienced etc but had the nouse to recognize it could be a tadge demanding to operate unfamiliar equipment in demanding environment). A few went left-to-left but had considerable jet time in the past. In any case, Hungarian law requires a very large number of LHS sectors with trainer.

This is not meant in any way to diminish skills and talents of ATR drivers. I agree, these types can be mored difficult.

Turbo-props and jets are different - period.

I have flown as FO and Captain of turbo props and as FO and soon to be Captain of a Jet.

One does not qualify you for the other.

Jets and swept wings require more attention in crappy weather than a turbo prop does, and for that reason, on stormy nights with strong crosswinds when I hit the stick off the stops on the electric jet that I pine for my old turboprop back!

Another thing about Jet flying is Energy management, and that is a skill that is best learnt from the RHS with a safety net beside you in the LHS, and the ability to hone that skill very much comes down to the individual, and even the most experienced guys still get it wrong from time to time:O

Ok, big deal, you Go around and try again, next thing about being on a jet is the alarming rate that a Go around and subsequent approach uses up your fuel, so careful energy management and fuel management are areas that a prop captain may use on his a/c but IMHO, having flown both, the Prop can get you out a spot easier than a Jet can.

Then there is the differences between Jets. Again I have flown both the bus and the 737 and they are very very different, the bus looks after you in lots of ways but it can still, and one day when your least expecting it, be flown as a conventional a/c and thats when experience on types like the 737 will serve you well, although rusty you will have seen it before.

Taking this argument up to the next level, I don't think two years in the LHS at EZY would qualify me for DEC LHS at the like of Virgin or BA LH. Bigger jets, more engines and of course long haul experience of which I would have none.

In summary I belive in the career ladder and the more rungs you visit on your way up, the more rounded Jet Captain you will make.

But to confirm what others have said any future recruitment of DEC's at EZY is a very very very long way off.

Best of luck, but I think if you have a LHS Q400 job at a base where you want to be and it seems secure, for now, if it were me I'd be staying put. Sometimes it can be hard to see how green the grass is on your present side of the fence!

I have not meant to start a storm here and maybe this will be my last post on this thread. ezydriver - I completely agree with your post. seasexsun - I would respectfully disagree with your perspective on this issue. The practices of Eastern European airlines are not necessarily those we should be seeking to emulate. We are wishing to use the very best possible practices and not the ones we can get away with most of the time. No one is saying every transition to a jet from a turboprop is impossible - what I am saying is that statistically you are significantly more open to a serious flight safety incident if you go from being a captain on a turboprop to a captain on a 737/Airbus. There will always be exceptions to that - but we are dealing with minimising overall risk and not increasing it. A turboprop to jet command in one hit is a massive increase in risk. That does not demean the abilities of pilots coming from the turboprop world (I am one!), but you are vulnerable to significant misjudgements due to the totally different characteristics of these aircraft.

I now train people from every background imaginable and I can tell you that by far and away the best command candidates we have at easyJet are FO's promoted from within with substantial time on type. You do not need to be a rocket scientist to see that - it is just plain common sense that someone who has gained experience in the right seat under the guidance of more experienced pilots will be much better prepared for the challenges of command than someone who is brand new to jets and to the company.

Another poster has alluded to problems at Wizzair - if you put turboprop captains straight into the command of an A320 you are asking for trouble. That does not mean these guys are bad pilots - it does mean they are inexperienced and as such are more likely to make errors. I have now flown thousands of hours on Airbuses and feel comfortable in that role - that does not make me good but it does make me experienced and all the benefits that brings . If I were to now go long haul and be given a command on a 747, I could learn to fly it I am sure. That is not the issue thought. What I would not be is experienced, and therefore I would not be best placed to fulfil the duties of my role. I would want considerable time as an apprentice in the RHS learning from someone who has been there, seen it, done it. That is how you produce the best quality captains. I am not getting into argument here about which is more difficult to fly - you can argue all day about turboprop or jets being more or less demanding. What I am saying is that these are very different animals indeed, and experience is absolutely critical to producing a safe operation. That experience is best obtained in the RHS.

A bit off topic but you shouldn't be "hitting the stick off the stops" in rough weather on the Airbus. If you find yourself doing this you should just take your hand off it for a few seconds and let it do what it does best. You should know this if you're about to get your command on it...

Cutting to the chase, there's a hell of a lot of brilliant SFO's gagging for a command in easyJet so if you're lucky enough to be called for interview you'll have to be grateful for a seat on the Right.

This is unlikely to change. The world has.


WWW

Picking up a dropped wing on the bus has, and will have many pilots hitting the roll stops, all be it momentarily. I believe what you are refferring to is PIO, in which case you should take your hand off, let it settle and start again. What you should NEVER do of course is dance on the rudder.

NSF,
What about all the guys in the US that went from the left seat of a
turboprop to the left seat of a regional jet.
And what's with East Midlands and Berlin tha a lot of guys want to
go there?