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Sgt Pepper.
To you and all the Cityjet bashers I say get a life!
Unlike most of the posters to this column, I actually work for Cityjet and have for over 5 years. I work hard and enjoy it. I get paid well. I do not have a hidden agenda unlike the knockers.
There has been a lot of pilots who left in the last year or two. Mainly for long haul or to Air France or Aer Lingus. More power to them. There are also those who left because they felt that they were victims (usually having failed command checks or being demoted from a training job) This second group think that it was everyones elses fault except their own. I guess their type exist in every airline.
These are the facts:
Reasonably well paid (I get about €9000 per month into my hand)
Pension plan.
Loss of licence, income continuence, medicals, uniforms etc all paid for.
Brilliant staff travel with Air France for me and my family.
Fixed roster 6 on 3 off when you are there a while.
Transparent leave system
Paid from day 1.
Bonded for 3 years.
Good routes (would have prefered AMS to Knock but my cross wind landings will probably improve)
If you want a job in a secure airline - join us!
If you want reasonably good pay - join
If you want a great introduction to the airline business - join
If you want to work hard - join
If you have a sense of humour - join (I like a bit of a laugh on the flight deck)
If you are a whinging moaner - join somewhere else.
The management have taken a whipping on this thread. In my opinion, it is not deserved. Better them than me. I just fly!
To those of you who reply with 'facts' based on bar talk and rumour - I care not a jot!
To those who have said good things about us - thanks.
I am proud of this little Irish success story and will continue to do all I can to ensure its continued success.
Safe flying.
To you and all the Cityjet bashers I say get a life!
Unlike most of the posters to this column, I actually work for Cityjet and have for over 5 years. I work hard and enjoy it. I get paid well. I do not have a hidden agenda unlike the knockers.
There has been a lot of pilots who left in the last year or two. Mainly for long haul or to Air France or Aer Lingus. More power to them. There are also those who left because they felt that they were victims (usually having failed command checks or being demoted from a training job) This second group think that it was everyones elses fault except their own. I guess their type exist in every airline.
These are the facts:
Reasonably well paid (I get about €9000 per month into my hand)
Pension plan.
Loss of licence, income continuence, medicals, uniforms etc all paid for.
Brilliant staff travel with Air France for me and my family.
Fixed roster 6 on 3 off when you are there a while.
Transparent leave system
Paid from day 1.
Bonded for 3 years.
Good routes (would have prefered AMS to Knock but my cross wind landings will probably improve)
If you want a job in a secure airline - join us!
If you want reasonably good pay - join
If you want a great introduction to the airline business - join
If you want to work hard - join
If you have a sense of humour - join (I like a bit of a laugh on the flight deck)
If you are a whinging moaner - join somewhere else.
The management have taken a whipping on this thread. In my opinion, it is not deserved. Better them than me. I just fly!
To those of you who reply with 'facts' based on bar talk and rumour - I care not a jot!
To those who have said good things about us - thanks.
I am proud of this little Irish success story and will continue to do all I can to ensure its continued success.
Safe flying.
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: USA, Ireland
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get the job, get hours, save a bit of money and leave wx ASAP for a bigger fish !!!
things are getting better but its so unstable !! no garanty at all, look at what happenned for paris base people, there are just nothing for the management.
Expect in DUB, obviously office is there!! LCY is not safe as well, AF can close the base if WX not getting better, load are low and there is too much concurence!! AF is gonna stop investment for all AF-KLM companies and wait to the end of fuel crise. For us everything can happen...even been getting fire for (alomost) nothing...
Good start for young F/O, new captains are a bit desapointed, promesses done by HR are not there!!!
They're in deeply **** for CPT, but I won't tell any guy to come (as CPT)
As senior FO I do 4200 a month after tax and 50 flying hours.
Irish success story?? thanks AF for all the money they put in it...without AF the company would have been down years ago specially with our management....AF invest in us to avoid to pay tax in france that it!!!
things are getting better but its so unstable !! no garanty at all, look at what happenned for paris base people, there are just nothing for the management.
Expect in DUB, obviously office is there!! LCY is not safe as well, AF can close the base if WX not getting better, load are low and there is too much concurence!! AF is gonna stop investment for all AF-KLM companies and wait to the end of fuel crise. For us everything can happen...even been getting fire for (alomost) nothing...
Good start for young F/O, new captains are a bit desapointed, promesses done by HR are not there!!!
They're in deeply **** for CPT, but I won't tell any guy to come (as CPT)
As senior FO I do 4200 a month after tax and 50 flying hours.
Irish success story?? thanks AF for all the money they put in it...without AF the company would have been down years ago specially with our management....AF invest in us to avoid to pay tax in france that it!!!
Join Date: Jun 2002
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sickofthe bashers,you obviously do "care a jot",otherwise you wouldnt have joined with the purpose of placing your ad on the same day.
Bully for you if your happy,fill your boots!,there are lots of happy people,particularly with the great humor on the flightdeck!Credit the Pilot body with some intelligence in making their decision to join,which you seem desperate for them to do.Do you think the rumor network is a huge percentage of their decision making process?Obviously.
Bully for you if your happy,fill your boots!,there are lots of happy people,particularly with the great humor on the flightdeck!Credit the Pilot body with some intelligence in making their decision to join,which you seem desperate for them to do.Do you think the rumor network is a huge percentage of their decision making process?Obviously.
Join Date: Sep 2006
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i am gladsickofwxbashers you enjoy it so much but with all due respect a 6 0n 3 0ff pattern is hardly any good, when the industry standard is 5/4 at ryanair or 5/3/54 at easy.also i hear you can finish on a late on start on an early quite a bit .as for the leave system being transparent, it was also transparent when i was there to be fair, i could always see that my leave was pending!pending what i never quite knew and that was the problem.
the money is quite good to be fair but the problem is quite a high percentage of it still seems to come from sector pay and overnights and i really dont think that 12 night plus in hotels provides a desirable quality of life. more to life than cash!
As for the other things than are offered e.g medicals paid for,pensions etc, to be honest. Again industry standard, most places give that. Not really deal breaker.
And another thing!!, i think referring to the victims! as you put it is very unfair. in my time there,there were people that were demoted from training posts but can you honestly tell me that wx management were not using their powers to bully people. or using commands to make a point, the point usually being challenge their appallinging lack of man management skills and be dealt with in a very under hand manner. that for me was the biggest problem with wx. colleagues were great but some senior management seem to think that the best way to deal with someone who tries to stand up for themselves is to make their life hell.Not good.
Your right though in one thing, wx is a good place to start and good staff travel, but for me and countless others, i reckon over 80 % of the company who worked there in my time and from what i hear still a similiar percentage, thats were its good points ended.That for me was the shame because with more skilled management i think it could have been a superb place to work. well thats what i think anyway!
Sick of wx bashers genuinely do think your reference to the 'victims' is not fair when you know, and you should know if you are there 5 years plus.there were nearly always other more sinister factors involved
the money is quite good to be fair but the problem is quite a high percentage of it still seems to come from sector pay and overnights and i really dont think that 12 night plus in hotels provides a desirable quality of life. more to life than cash!
As for the other things than are offered e.g medicals paid for,pensions etc, to be honest. Again industry standard, most places give that. Not really deal breaker.
And another thing!!, i think referring to the victims! as you put it is very unfair. in my time there,there were people that were demoted from training posts but can you honestly tell me that wx management were not using their powers to bully people. or using commands to make a point, the point usually being challenge their appallinging lack of man management skills and be dealt with in a very under hand manner. that for me was the biggest problem with wx. colleagues were great but some senior management seem to think that the best way to deal with someone who tries to stand up for themselves is to make their life hell.Not good.
Your right though in one thing, wx is a good place to start and good staff travel, but for me and countless others, i reckon over 80 % of the company who worked there in my time and from what i hear still a similiar percentage, thats were its good points ended.That for me was the shame because with more skilled management i think it could have been a superb place to work. well thats what i think anyway!
Sick of wx bashers genuinely do think your reference to the 'victims' is not fair when you know, and you should know if you are there 5 years plus.there were nearly always other more sinister factors involved
Join Date: Oct 2006
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Well said sickofwxbashers. I like yourself have been there quite a while and am happy and agree with all you said. The guys slating WX are most likely guys who failed commmand assesments or are passed up for other promotions and usually with good reason. So to those out there looking at WX don't listen to a word on prune and just talk to some of the guys in there if you can and make up your own mind because 99% of the stuff said here is Bull****.
It is what you make it and it is a good place to work if you want it to be.
It is what you make it and it is a good place to work if you want it to be.
Join Date: Dec 2007
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Well said Sickof the WX bashers
I have watched this thread for quite a while, with a growing sense of frustration. The vast majority of what is posted, is, in most cases completely incorrect. In many others there is a shread of truth manipulated by some bitter, ill-informed and depressed individual who has nothing better to do than moan. I have looked at many of the posts on other threads by these same individuals, and I would seriously suggest counseling for you. If you are not pilots in CItyjet,then you know F. all about Cityjet. If you are, time for a career change, this one does not suit you.
Cityjet like all airlines is far from perfect, but it is still a great place to work. I know I work there, and have done for quite a while, and intend to for the forseeable future. I wont gratify the moaners to explain why it is, because they wont accept what I say even though I am here, and have first hand experience right up to date, they would prefer to whine and whinge some more, and tell you something someone said to them somewhere, which is about as useful and insightful as they are.
Sickof the WXbashers said it far more elequently than I could.
Regards to all of my fine colleagues at cityjet.
Cityjet like all airlines is far from perfect, but it is still a great place to work. I know I work there, and have done for quite a while, and intend to for the forseeable future. I wont gratify the moaners to explain why it is, because they wont accept what I say even though I am here, and have first hand experience right up to date, they would prefer to whine and whinge some more, and tell you something someone said to them somewhere, which is about as useful and insightful as they are.
Sickof the WXbashers said it far more elequently than I could.
Regards to all of my fine colleagues at cityjet.
Join Date: Nov 2007
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I think it is fair to say that not everyone shares the same point of view. Most of the flight crew are a pleasure to work with "regardless of nationality or base" and before november 07 many people were reasonably happy.
I have also been here a long time "more than 4 years", the money is quite good but is it the only thing to consider ?
Why couldn't things be changed to improve things instead of hitting the road?
You don't expect a thank you from anyone even though you work hard and you would appreciate it.
Even if you're well paid when your bosses denigrate what you do on a regular basis it generally doesn't make you happy.
What happens when you're of a certain nationality and you hear "f...ing ....." tell me how would you feel about it ?
Why have people from the different bases been so divided ?
Here's a few explanations : different wages, different rosters, different treatment.
Unfortunately ignorance and cultural missunderstandings have done the rest!
Unless you're blind and even if you're not directly concerned by the problem you can't ignore what others are going through, or have been through.
Isn't it true to say that there is an urgent need for change within CityJet. Instead of Management telling people they can leave, if problems occur, wouldn't be more professional to listen to what people have to say and act accordingly or at least try ?
In Paris the feeling is that everyone will be kicked out by the end of the year.
A few of us believe that CityJet is worth fighting for, it can become a better company in which to work!
Regardless of what you think is true, we do love CityJet, our jobs and our colleagues.
Here is a tract handed out by the CGT "a french union" to CityJet employees" I think it speaks for itself :
PROTECT YOUR EMPLOYMENT IN PARIS
Following the many means of pressure that the management of CITYJET wholly owned subsidiary of AIR FRANCE-KLM and the dismissal of our two colleagues who are now without any social protection, it is time for us to fight and to stop accepting harassment from our managers.
For a little bit of added humor during an announcement, our two colleagues were chosen as an exemple to remind us that at some point our Paris base will be coming to an end one way or an other.
Presently, our colleagues are left on their own with no unemployment benefits and no basic health coverage, leaving them with limited means to pay their bills and provide themselves with their basic needs.
It is a reminder that anyone can suffer from this type of abuse, and whatever the reason!
CITYJET will use any excuse to get rid of their Paris based employees.
STOP THE UNFAIR TREATMENTS, TIME TO FIGHT!!!
It is urgent that we unite to create a strong union branch within CITYJET. Together let's join the CGT which is the only union which supports us.
In the past, this union questioned several times our unacceptable conditions. It is up to each and everyone one of us to claim back our professional future and our basic rights.
The membership to the union is anonymous and can be made through CGT 6, Route des Anniversaires _Zone technique Bât 7595 BP 11113 _ 95701 Roissy CDG Cedex Tel 01 48 62 10 28. Union Locale CGT de l'aéroport Roissy-CDG
Thanks to everyone's membership we will elect a union representative in order to get a CE (Commité d'Entreprise), and elect staff representatives. Together we will improve our individual and collective rights.
Our goals are clear :
• Maintain our CITYJET base at the Paris CDG airport.
• Make sure that AIR FRANCE-KLM President Mr Jean-Cyril SPINETTA's word about getting our French contract is adhered too.
• Make sure that our most basic rights are applied by CITYJET's management (maternity leave, sick leave, profit share, social and retirement coverage, union protection and better work conditions).
• Stop the harassment and put an end to unfair disciplinary measures.
TOGETHER WE WILL BE RESPECTED
I have also been here a long time "more than 4 years", the money is quite good but is it the only thing to consider ?
Why couldn't things be changed to improve things instead of hitting the road?
You don't expect a thank you from anyone even though you work hard and you would appreciate it.
Even if you're well paid when your bosses denigrate what you do on a regular basis it generally doesn't make you happy.
What happens when you're of a certain nationality and you hear "f...ing ....." tell me how would you feel about it ?
Why have people from the different bases been so divided ?
Here's a few explanations : different wages, different rosters, different treatment.
Unfortunately ignorance and cultural missunderstandings have done the rest!
Unless you're blind and even if you're not directly concerned by the problem you can't ignore what others are going through, or have been through.
Isn't it true to say that there is an urgent need for change within CityJet. Instead of Management telling people they can leave, if problems occur, wouldn't be more professional to listen to what people have to say and act accordingly or at least try ?
In Paris the feeling is that everyone will be kicked out by the end of the year.
A few of us believe that CityJet is worth fighting for, it can become a better company in which to work!
Regardless of what you think is true, we do love CityJet, our jobs and our colleagues.
Here is a tract handed out by the CGT "a french union" to CityJet employees" I think it speaks for itself :
PROTECT YOUR EMPLOYMENT IN PARIS
Following the many means of pressure that the management of CITYJET wholly owned subsidiary of AIR FRANCE-KLM and the dismissal of our two colleagues who are now without any social protection, it is time for us to fight and to stop accepting harassment from our managers.
For a little bit of added humor during an announcement, our two colleagues were chosen as an exemple to remind us that at some point our Paris base will be coming to an end one way or an other.
Presently, our colleagues are left on their own with no unemployment benefits and no basic health coverage, leaving them with limited means to pay their bills and provide themselves with their basic needs.
It is a reminder that anyone can suffer from this type of abuse, and whatever the reason!
CITYJET will use any excuse to get rid of their Paris based employees.
STOP THE UNFAIR TREATMENTS, TIME TO FIGHT!!!
It is urgent that we unite to create a strong union branch within CITYJET. Together let's join the CGT which is the only union which supports us.
In the past, this union questioned several times our unacceptable conditions. It is up to each and everyone one of us to claim back our professional future and our basic rights.
The membership to the union is anonymous and can be made through CGT 6, Route des Anniversaires _Zone technique Bât 7595 BP 11113 _ 95701 Roissy CDG Cedex Tel 01 48 62 10 28. Union Locale CGT de l'aéroport Roissy-CDG
Thanks to everyone's membership we will elect a union representative in order to get a CE (Commité d'Entreprise), and elect staff representatives. Together we will improve our individual and collective rights.
Our goals are clear :
• Maintain our CITYJET base at the Paris CDG airport.
• Make sure that AIR FRANCE-KLM President Mr Jean-Cyril SPINETTA's word about getting our French contract is adhered too.
• Make sure that our most basic rights are applied by CITYJET's management (maternity leave, sick leave, profit share, social and retirement coverage, union protection and better work conditions).
• Stop the harassment and put an end to unfair disciplinary measures.
TOGETHER WE WILL BE RESPECTED
Join Date: Feb 2008
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Any Cityjet Fo's Out There?
Hi there, was hoping to get some info from Cityjet FO's regarding typical rosters, nightstops, disruptions, salary etc. if you are based at LCY? Feel free to pm me.
Look forward to hearing from you,
145
Look forward to hearing from you,
145
Join Date: Jul 2008
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Contract Pilots at Cityjet
Not wishing to open a new can worms but has anyone any feedback good or bad on contract pilots.
I know this is often an emotive point but i am considering the possibility of putting my self forward through an agent to work for CJ
How are contractors treated ? and do they get the same rosters etc. I would like to hear from existing contractors
Obviously no-one makes a descision based on what is said here but........it is good to hear from others
I know this is often an emotive point but i am considering the possibility of putting my self forward through an agent to work for CJ
How are contractors treated ? and do they get the same rosters etc. I would like to hear from existing contractors
Obviously no-one makes a descision based on what is said here but........it is good to hear from others
Join Date: Jul 2007
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May i ask if you are a contract pilot with Cityjet as i have colleague also a Cpt in your company who works equally as hard but has yet to earn anything close to 9000euro/month. 
Join Date: Dec 2003
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Any ideas on where /who to submit cv for WX?
I'm renewing my MEIR at the moment and I'll defo be applying to WX once I'm done. No idea where to send cv though. I'd give my right arm to work for them. Actually, that may not be a good idea.
As for those guys bashing companies that told them to foxtrot oscar, move on. Next! There's a job out there for you somewhere and it's going to happen sometime.
As for those guys bashing companies that told them to foxtrot oscar, move on. Next! There's a job out there for you somewhere and it's going to happen sometime.
Join Date: May 2007
Location: france
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we will see when you will be in (cityjet or any other companies) !! have fun...
9000 for a contractor is true but no staff travel, no fix 6/3 roster, no loss of licence, no almost nothing ! As normal captain with no housing allowance between 6500 and 8000 maximun I would say.
9000 for a contractor is true but no staff travel, no fix 6/3 roster, no loss of licence, no almost nothing ! As normal captain with no housing allowance between 6500 and 8000 maximun I would say.
Join Date: Jan 2003
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hi guys,
i see a lot of ye have been called for sim assesments at the moment ,a bit confused ,are they still recruiting first officers ? i have seen ads for dec captains .i did send my cv (me/cpl/ir/250 hours) in and was told that they didnt have any positions for my experiance only then to see a week later they are recruiting self sponsored students through sigmar and fte.i know several guys that got same response.any thoughts?
cheers macflea
i see a lot of ye have been called for sim assesments at the moment ,a bit confused ,are they still recruiting first officers ? i have seen ads for dec captains .i did send my cv (me/cpl/ir/250 hours) in and was told that they didnt have any positions for my experiance only then to see a week later they are recruiting self sponsored students through sigmar and fte.i know several guys that got same response.any thoughts?
cheers macflea
Join Date: May 2008
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Sim assesments and FO recruitment
Hi there,
to those waiting for the sim assesment what u can expect is a rather straight forward session (45 mins) with a cap that won't help u much but at least tells u so in advance. He'll be looking for CRM attitude, basic flying skills and radionav. You'll be given some sid and approach plates (LGW in my case) to have a look for about 15 min. prior to the session, then you'll have'em back when your turn comes. Normal sid, basic manouvers once reaching 4000' then dct to a vor, holding, n-1 but just to see how you control the plane (no qrh, drills whatsoever) ils and landing. No secrets nor misteries, just do the work. He wants u to mantain speed, bank angle, vert speed but he'll take into account your previous experience (jet, type, ...)
I passed although I consider I made some mistakes!
Wish u good luck!
Regarding the recruiting what I can say is that I applied for a FO position, have >1500 TT and >500 jet, I passed the selection process and I'm in, so I guess that they might be choosing the candidates, and as long as they have people with this sort of profile they won't take less. I don't really know if they've been recruiting low houred FOs (<1000TT)
Good luck to u too!
to those waiting for the sim assesment what u can expect is a rather straight forward session (45 mins) with a cap that won't help u much but at least tells u so in advance. He'll be looking for CRM attitude, basic flying skills and radionav. You'll be given some sid and approach plates (LGW in my case) to have a look for about 15 min. prior to the session, then you'll have'em back when your turn comes. Normal sid, basic manouvers once reaching 4000' then dct to a vor, holding, n-1 but just to see how you control the plane (no qrh, drills whatsoever) ils and landing. No secrets nor misteries, just do the work. He wants u to mantain speed, bank angle, vert speed but he'll take into account your previous experience (jet, type, ...)
I passed although I consider I made some mistakes!
Wish u good luck!
Regarding the recruiting what I can say is that I applied for a FO position, have >1500 TT and >500 jet, I passed the selection process and I'm in, so I guess that they might be choosing the candidates, and as long as they have people with this sort of profile they won't take less. I don't really know if they've been recruiting low houred FOs (<1000TT)
Good luck to u too!
Join Date: Oct 2006
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Thanks for info..
Just to let all of you know I have 1000 TT (300 Turbo Prop) so maybe they are not looking for very low experience pilots.
I hope to do it well in the SIM.
Cheers.
Dinocraft9 when are you going to start your training??
Just to let all of you know I have 1000 TT (300 Turbo Prop) so maybe they are not looking for very low experience pilots.
I hope to do it well in the SIM.
Cheers.
Dinocraft9 when are you going to start your training??
Join Date: Mar 2008
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Assessments for Direct entry Captains
What is the process for DEC at present, Is it Interview and Sim or is there also Aptitude testing. Also what sim are they now using RG or 737 in Dublin ?
Many Thanks
Many Thanks